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Incentive Licensing Retrospective

Discussion in 'Amateur Radio News' started by K3UD, Dec 21, 2005.

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  1. K6FAF

    K6FAF Guest

    Just for the fun of it and for the absolute last time:

    The ocean at the East, South and West is public property, where so proclaimed. Somebody with a disability (cannot swim out of what reason soever) wants to be accomodated to have access to the water. Very well. Needs the help of others, very well.
    Can he execute the same on private property? Only if allowed. Is that discrimination?
    He has to follow the rules like anybody else!

    Same person wants to go in the water alone. We don't let him because he will drown and the lifeguard has to jeopardize his own life to get him out. Is that discrimination?

    Amateur Radio Service is a part of society, where people with similar attitudes have joined in a hobby made possible by Government decision. The hobby underlies rules and regulations given by Government
    and partly by the people themselves. Access to the frequencies is controlled. All existing amateurs abide (should, LOL) by the rules and accept the control.
    Now some people want to join the club, but want to make new rules, because they do not like the existing or do not want to meet the requirements.
    So who is discriminating whom here?

    If you want access to the publicly owned but Government controlled frequencies, you have the right to do so by fulfilling the requirements and then abiding by the rules and regulations. Full stop. Easy to understand! But tough luck!

    You want to swim in the ocean, ok, fine with me. But the access is controlled and regulated. When the red ball is up, you can't go in. Easy to understand! But tough luck! You are not discriminated, you just have to follow the rules like everybody else. If you go anyway and half drowned accuse me, I should have warned you, that's the new American way, another reason for a class action suit. H... cow!

    Keith, now do not come up with oranges and apples. If it looks like BS, smells like it, and is still warm, there is a great chance that it is.

    Wanting the same others already have, but not under the same conditions to MHO smells , of what I let you decide. Maybe discrimination of the majority?  
    :blush:

    I just can't take this seriously any more [​IMG]

    Gotta go, have a life beside hamradio.

    73 to Y'ALL c u on the bands (in phone parts, mostly) [​IMG]

    ...and I agree, nobody is discriminated on CB....and in 6 years we all can work DX again on 27 or on 28 Mhz...
     
  2. KB1SF

    KB1SF Premium Subscriber QRZ Page

    That's a very good question.  

    My hunch is that there probably aren't enough Hams who care (and probably even less who are so affected and have the right contacts (and/or enough resources)) to mount an effective legal challenge to such things.

    Rather, they are probably like most of the rest of us who, when confronted with such revelations, will merely shrug our shoulders and say, "That's just the way it is"… because, that's precisely the way it HAS been...for far too long.  I just don't happen to subscribe to the "go along to get along" approach to institutionalized bigotry.  

    My OTHER hunch is that, if one or more of the bureaucrats in authority at the FCC are now also reading these posts (as I’m sure they are) they probably now wish I'd stop rocking this boat and go away.  That's because they've KNOWN for at least 10 years that their entire incentive licensing system was legally discriminatory against persons with disabilities and have been hoping against hope that nobody else outside Washington with enough legal clout to mount an effective challenge has noticed.  

    But, mark my words, George, someday, somewhere, someone WILL mount an effective legal challenge against the FCC for contuing to perpetuate such blatant and systemically discriminatory practices.  And they will win.

    That is, of course, unless the FCC continues taking action to fix their highly discriminatory licensing system first, which, as I've said, they now seem to be in the process of doing.  

    In closing, I hope I've at least given everyone here something besides technical issues to now think seriously about.  

    And, in light of these discussions, my hope is that more than one Ham has now come to the sobering conclusion that maybe all those "badges of honor", "rites of passage” and assorted other arbitrary licensing rituals that they’ve so blindly subscribed to over the years are as blatantly discriminatory toward persons with disabilities as they are useless in keeping the dreaded “riff raff” out.  

    73,

    Keith
    KB1SF / VA3KSF
     
  3. AB9LZ

    AB9LZ Ham Member QRZ Page

    Good lord...

    It's obvious (at least to me) that this thread has outlived it's original intent. I've learned a lot from the posts of George, Tim, and Hans; to name of few of the many excellent contributors.

    I'm going to go back to having fun "meeping" (how my three year old describes morse code) folks in distant places, and continuing to discover all that Ham radio has to offer. If find this "caste" thing I've been hearing about, I'll be sure to let you all know!

    Thanks Everyone!

    73,
    Mark.
     
  4. W0GI

    W0GI Ham Member QRZ Page

    Hey Mark,

    Meepers are the worst offenders at the top of the "CASTE SYSTEM".

    I know, as my neighbors once heard me meeping, and now will not talk to me.

    They acused me of being behind the Asian production of those Nike sneakers that Keith wears.

    They are convinced that meeping is the secret code for all that brings evil to the world.

    I tried in vain to convince them otherwise, but they are sure that meeping is from the pit of hell.

    Indeed there are other meepers, flooding our shores with Evil devices.

    Icom, Yaesu, and Kenwood continue to include meeping functions on their transceivers. We all know that meeping is dead, so what reason, other then the spread of evil, drives these manufacturers to include functions to enhance this evil?

    As Henry Ford once said. "You will be a weeper, when the world is taken over by meepers".

    The shame is intense, and I am considering a mass destruction of my Bencher and Vibroplex stuff.

    But I fear that the evil of meeping, has indeed taken control of my soul. Yes, I am only millimeters away from joining the dark side, which is the source of meeping.

    Only God and the Equal Opportunities Act can save me now.

    I now must leave, and do some meeping on 40 meters. Forgive me, but I just can't help myself.

    Please, throw your key in the fire. Save youself before you end up as myself, a meepoholic.

    Save the world from the meepers, before it is to late.

    73 - Bob
     
  5. kd4mxe

    kd4mxe QRZ Member QRZ Page

    k3ud-Perhaps we should consider a one license system which grants all privileges with just a comprehensive written exam to be passed, sir I believe this will work , and some day the fcc just may do this ,and I hope they do this in my time on this earth ,they need to look at this it would Be a lot less work for them to do ,73 Bill
     
  6. NL7W

    NL7W Ham Member QRZ Page

    Well, W6NJ pretty well sums up the incentive Morse and unpublished written exams of years gone by. We all know the meepers ARE/WERE the culprits -- mucking up the works for EVERYONE. Meepers are the worst offenders. We should all go to jail and not collect $200.00 for wanting to perpetuate 75 or so years of radio knowledge, comprehension, skill requirements, and tradition. We, the "conservatives" who are the young and old alike -- the silent majority -- are the enemy. Radio prison for all meepers!

    George, K3UD, had it right with the title of this thread -- Incentive Licensing Retrospective. We can only look back regarding this subject -- for it's over. Oh, we now all know the incentive licensing school of thought is outmoded, old-fashioned, and (most importantly) politically incorrect.

    Incentive licensing is gone, or very close to it. We can only look back at it and say how wonderful it was for the forty-something’s and older. It challenged folks; it shaped special young industrious people of that time (like me). We can only look back and say how it helped decide the careers of young men and women. Good-bye to you - the logical path.

    It is unfortunate that it ticked off so many in the early days; those who had expansive General Class privileges when it was implemented.

    Boy, do I look forward to the road being paved for a watered-down, meaningless, one-world license. I can see it now, this end all-be all, universal, world license that will be available to anyone who asks it -- just sign on the dotted line. Only then will all be well and good in the world. Only then will it be available to EVERYONE, not just the measured, quantified, and qualified few.

    Does anyone deny the direction we are headed?

    BTW, this has been a great thread.

    Long live CW and the ham radio hobby I and the silent majority, including those SK's before us, have known and experienced going on a century.

    Catch me on the low ends of 80, 40, 20 and 17 meters - when the bands are open - for most of us Alaskans are above the 60th parallel you know. You think DX'ing in the lower-48 states is tough during this part of the cycle -- think again! Just move to Alaska...

    73 de Steve, NL7W
    Palmer, Alaska

    P.S. Yes - Alaska is DX, but does happen to be one of the two better states in the Union. From our perspective up yonder, the continental U.S. is considered the "lesser-48." Again, so much for political correctness...
     
  7. K4JF

    K4JF Ham Member QRZ Page

    No, sorry, they haven't known that, because it is NOT. It's really that simple. The ham radio system is a posterchild to other areas in how to do it the right way. You have a system that specifies the right way to do it so that it is not discriminatory.

    (And by the way, before I retired, my job - occupational safety - was heavily involved in ADA and other aspects of disability accomodation, so I know whereof I speak.)
     
  8. W0GI

    W0GI Ham Member QRZ Page

    You are kidding right?

    The FCC bureaucrats in authority are reading these posts and what [​IMG]??

    Yep, the person that can't pass 5WPM is really the biggest problem in our world. The FCC is really worried about the coverage on CNN.

    I like others, come on here and stir the pot, but to be honest my friend, you are getting delusional.

    You should take a break.

    Really.

    Bob
     
  9. W0GI

    W0GI Ham Member QRZ Page

    Hello,

    Hans was born in Communist East Germany. They didn't have tests. Everyone was the same. Well except for the USSR and the USSR Cronies in the E. German government. To compare the hell of refugees trapped in their own country, controlled by the USSR, to someone that can't seem to learn 5wpm CW is amazing to me.

    I don't think Hans understands a damn thing you are saying, because it is the same BS the party was spewing. "You are the same, and we will protect you from the arogant scientists (Extra Class?) that think they are better then you".

    Stalin killed a bunch of those arogant scientists.

    What a nice guy he was. Protecting the masses from the evil scientists with their "caste system", having the nerve to think they are smarter then his majesty, Stalin the dirt farmer.  

    And Hitler sure wanted to take care of those folks that had the nerve to make money. Those that had views different then his divine knowledge to lead the world the right way.  

    Social Enginerring, Socialism, Communism. All wonderful goals that don't work with real people that have real sins. Nazis are just assholes, so they don't even count.

    I'm sure Marx had a great idea, but he didn't factor in that humans would occupy the ranks of the KGB and E. German government services. It would be better if God had hired the employees for the KGB, but why would God need the KGB?

    When man plays God, man loses, and God gets pissed at the men that think they know his job. Germany is one country again, and you get a bigger pay check when you do a better job. How horrible?

    How much history does it take to get it through to the thick heads in the world?

    The liberal experiment has had some lab time. People aren't the same. Some people reach lofty goals, and some don't, and to say that we are all the same is without truth. We are not the same.

    The only thing that is equal between us, is how we fall short of God.

    For man to engineer this world and society is quite a task, and I have yet to see it done properly.

    Questions that have been answered, do not need a new answer. Only those that have been blinded by personal arogance, do not see the light.

    That light has been shining for a long time. Open your eyes.

    73 - Bob
     
  10. KB1SF

    KB1SF Premium Subscriber QRZ Page

    You are absolutely correct, Bob.

    The light of truth HAS been shining on this issue for quite some time now.

    But, unfortunately, there are "none so blind as those who will not see".

    73,

    Keith
    KB1SF / VA3KSF
     
  11. kd4mxe

    kd4mxe QRZ Member QRZ Page

    w6nj- sir you got some good points here , you are good at giving advice But how good are you at takeing your own advice this same thing works for you to ,use it you will feel Better,73 Bill
     
  12. AB9LZ

    AB9LZ Ham Member QRZ Page

    Keith, I suspect that there is a technical problem with your tinfoil hat arrangement. I for one prefer the Mirro Colander (http://www.acehardware.com/sm-mirro-and-reg-colander-c-7993--pi-1280103.html)
    with a hank of pantyhose for a chinstrap. I find the holes provide for adequate ventilation, whilst the large overhangs provide superior mind control ray protection.

    Side benefits include...
    1)it makes for a decent hard hat should a wrist rocket launched sinker ricochet off an oak branch.

    2) The nosy neighbors don't "shine" around so much wondering what the in hell all of that wire is doing up in their trees.

    73,
    Mark.
     
  13. KB1SF

    KB1SF Premium Subscriber QRZ Page

    Keith, I suspect that there is a technical problem with your tinfoil hat arrangement. I for one prefer the Mirro Colander (http://www.acehardware.com/sm-mirro-and-reg-colander-c-7993--pi-1280103.html)
    with a hank of pantyhose for a chinstrap. I find the holes provide for adequate ventilation, whilst the large overhangs provide superior mind control ray protection.

    Side benefits include...
    1)it makes for a decent hard hat should a wrist rocket launched sinker ricochet off an oak branch.

    2) The nosy neighbors don't "shine" around so much wondering what the in hell all of that wire is doing up in their trees.  

    73,
    Mark.[/QUOTE]
    I’ve always found it fascinating how the closer one gets to uncovering the truth, the more frequent and boorish the personal attacks become from those who would rather not have that truth ever see the light of day.

    I suggest we all give ourselves 10 or 15 years and THEN see who can best use the new tin hat you have suggested.  From your description (and the Web link you gave) it appears to be a highly advanced, multi-purpose tool.

    In fact, I’m now wondering if such a device might even be useful for preparing “crow” prior to the human consumption of same.

    73,

    Keith
    KB1SF / VA3KSF
     
  14. kd4mxe

    kd4mxe QRZ Member QRZ Page

    I suggest we all give ourselves 10 or 15 years and THEN see who can best use the new tin hat you have suggested.  From your description (and the Web link you gave) it appears to be a highly advanced, multi-purpose tool.

    In fact, I’m now wondering if such a device might even be useful for preparing “crow” prior to the human consumption of same.

    73,

    Keith
    KB1SF / VA3KSF[/QUOTE]
    kb1sf-I’ve always found it fascinating how the closer one gets to uncovering the truth, the more frequent and boorish the personal attacks become from those who would rather not have that truth ever see the light of day.
    keith did you ever hit this one square on the head , thats always the way it is ,ever time ,73 Bill
     
  15. WA4RYW

    WA4RYW XML Subscriber QRZ Page

    I've been saying this is the path we're on for the last 10 years. It won't stop until the testing component is eliminated completely at some point in the future.

    10-4?
     
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