Police Question Ham Radio Use

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (diamowj @ May 24 2002,12:36)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Just try and carry an HT into an airport, large public building or shopping mall today.  You will be luckey if your not forced to the ground, cuffed and questioned by the FBI.  The old "I am a licensed ham" don't cut it anymore. I dumped my HT on Ebay cause I have seen it happen..... [/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
I do it all the time; the YL and I don't go to malls without either the FRSs or the 2m HTs. Nobody even seems to notice. I carried my D7A in at D/FW airport last time I went to pick her up so I could hear when her flight was directed to the gate. No problems at all in a major international airport. Nothing 'official' looking on me, either. Just my usual khakis and button-down.

 

I travelled to Tampa from Newark in April 2002 with a plane change in Cincinnati going and a change in Atlanta returning. I had my cell phone and TWO HTs with me and had ZERO problems. And at all the airports I went through, I saw state troopers, soldiers, airport police, etc. Some folks just draw problems, others don't. I can't imagine why; maybe some of us need to listen to ourselves and watch ourselves on video . . . it could be educational.

By the way, to the poster who commented about the cops not having callbooks in their cars, you're right. But if you have a rig with you, you are required to have your license or a copy of it in your possession. How many of you knew that?

Good luck

 

Some things never change.

About 20 years, I was standing in front of a supermarket waiting for the bus to work one morning. I was talking to some of the guys on the local repeater using my Tempo FMH-2, when a police car pulled up to me, lights flashing. The officer got out, came up to me, stuck one hand on his gun, stuck the other one in my face and said "Let me see your radio." A little shocked, I replied simply "Sure. Why?" He scowled at me, raised his voice and said (but not politely) "Let me see your radio NOW. PLEASE." Intimidated, I started to state to the guys I was talking to what was going on when he grabbed it out of my hand, got in his car, and pulled away. Five minutes later he came back and silently handed the HT back to me. I asked "Excuse me, what's going on?" His reply: "None of your business and I don't want to see you using that again." With that, he got back in his car and left. No request to see my license (I had it on me) or who I was or what I was doing.

I found out hours later, from an officer (and a fellow ham) in the community I worked in, that a police HT had been stolen the day before, and some teenage or college kids were playing "CB" and cursing at the police and so on. When I told him what happened, he was surprised; turns out that the officer who had confronted me just assumed that it was obviously me and was ready to arrest me, until he discovered that my radio (obviously) wasn't the stolen one. Part of the delay was that he was trying to find a reason to put me under arrest for questioning in the theft, or at least confiscate the radio!

My friend offered to contact the officer's chief. I later got a phone call at work from that chief informing me that I should be glad that his officer was "diligent" in "protecting" me and should quit making trouble; next time I might not get off so lucky. And I shouldn't use my "CB" radio in public or make up stuff about "Federal Licenses" when talking to other police officers.

Some things never change.

 

Like I said.. Police state..your papers or else.. Soon you'll have to stop every few miles at they're check points.

 

I have been approached by security guards and police officers. At a local mall, we have been asked to not use the radios. This was years ago, I obliged the security guard and put away my radio, and explained to him what it was. I did not challenge him, I did what was asked. The mall is a privately owned business, I was requested by an employee to stop what I was doing. I did. I called the management, explained who I was, what happened and was told that I could use my radio. Why do we have to take on such a defensive posture? On watch point during a storm a policeman approached the car, he was very curt, but not rude, the question was "What are you doing here?" I explained it. He said the neighbors had called. I offered to move to a new location. He said no, he went and told the caller who I was and what I was doing. He was never "polite", but I was, the entire time. The use of my amateur radio license is not a right, it is a privlege. I show my ID to the officer along with my license (not a copy, the real thing!!!! ) and always offer to remedy the situation. Don't let another person's attitude force you into reacting the same way.... smile and be polite. Is that so hard??

 

someone mentioned in a message here that if your at
a mall or someother like place and a security guard asks
you to quit talking on your HT you must stop per fcc rules.
does anyone now which rule that is. 97.what?

 

W5ATX, no license is required to carry or posses an Amateur Radio handy talky or other device, to carry one, to listen to one, or anything else with one but to transmit.

Some states may try to regulate the possesion of handy-talkies under scanner regulations, but they can't (not that they and the locals won't try too) regulate them to any extent other than the scannner stuff more than regular broadcast radios.

They do not even have the jurisdiction to arrest someone for transmitting on one without a license!  If you are transmitting you must have your license in your possesion.  Remember that to local police our Ham licenses are not "official."  They are not tamper proof!  They look like and are printed on someones laser printer!  To the law they all look like so much bogus paper.

Until we get "real" licenses with good anti-forgery properties, Ham licenses and their owners will be under suspicion.

For another discussion sometime:  How long would it take someone to forge a Ham license?

 

I just doubled checked my license, ans it says Amateur Radio.  I didn't see "ham" anywhere on it.

To me, it sounds like the local group doesn't do much public service work.  The vast majority of the general public think that CB and amateur radio are one in the same.

"Rome wasn't built in a day...." and I doubt if a lecture form an out-of-town person will "educate" anyone.  It takes some time to show people what amateur radio can do for them.  You'll catch more flies with honey than with vinager.


73
WB8TCT

 

KF7CG, you're absolutely correct. Having the license in one's possession is required only if operating the radio station - transmitting. But as I recall, that was what the original post was about.

Sorry for not being as clear as I should have been, but that was the original subject matter, and that was what I was referring to.

But on the subject of not needing a license to transmit, once upon a time, Part 97 stated that the licensed amateur was to keep his station from easy access to unlicensed persons who might illegally transmit. The ARRL Handbook used to give tips in the "Building a Station" chapter on exactly how to do just that. I remember odd interlock plugs described, etc. Two concepts, so 180 degrees from each other don't add up, but then again, it's a bureaucracy we're talking about too.

Yes, our licenses are probably easily forged and not highly secure documents. But I'd still be willing to bet it might mean more to an officer than saying "I'm a ham, that's why."

Good luck,

Chris

 

I like the Un-knowing public being supicious. I bet they all wonder what all that is on the roof of my house. Most of the neighborhood kids know. I was discouraged by one of their fathers that use to be a Ham not to teach his son. All the other neighbors ever come over and say anything. One of the kids said one that one of them thought I was 'CIA'.LOL

 

Hmmmm,

Looks like lots of folks are all heated up about this one.... Some general points I have noted about the whole thing:

1) Police must have probable cause to question or otherwise obstruct or cause others to modify their behavior through overt or direct action -- non-existent in this case. Hey most burglars use automobiles so we should check all people who are driving a vehicle out as possible burglary suspects, courts have held that this is insufficient cause to allow a traffic stop, use of a readily available personal communication device is likewise insufficient cause.

2) You do not "educate" the police as a citizen, you file a complaint and allow their chain of command to educate them for you. Calling your elected representative is likewise a great way of getting law enforcement personnel's attention.

3) Why should you even bother responding to an abusive officer? Duress? If you do not wish to speak with him just ask him to leave you alone and go away. He'll be left with the decision as to whether or not to trump up something or stay and harass you -- neither is a really defensible position in front of an IRB or IAB review let alone a Judge.... Of course he could leave.....

Of course, and I could be wrong, but it sort of sounds like everyone involved had a bad day that day and perhaps the best response would have been to just say "I'm giving my wife a kiss, don't you dare try it too!"

Have fun,

Grover Larkins

 

To describe a Pakastani, Indian, or Bangalideshi (Bengali) as an East Indian is simply distinguishing them from Native Americans (which the British call "Red Indians").

The proper way to deal with a hard case uncivil civil servant cop is to suggest that maybe you and your lawyer and he and his chief could work out whether he was violating your rights. Most cops are more scared of being sued than being shot.

Minnesota also has a no scanners in cars (except HAMS) law. Can you give a better reference on that FCC override of anti-scanner laws?