US Packet Network

KV4CA: You start some of your statements with the word "probably" which indicates pure speculation on your part. I'm sticking with documented facts. Now, I'm not saying that Army guys are losers but we (Navy) beat you last year 34-17. Fact. Ham Emergency Service dose have a place. Where as it allows thoughs who may not have been able to join into the Military, Police Force, Fire Dept, etc, due to physical,mental, or educational limitations to get involved. All I know is that if I was the one in need of help, I'd prefer the varsity team. But as long as it gives thoughs who otherwise wouldn't be to participate due to the aboved mentioned reasons a chance to fetch coffee, lay down some flares or direct cars in some parking lot, who am I to deny them this pleasure. Get real man. Ever see a Ham Club with their own Mountain Rescue Team with ATV's, Repelling gear, their own EMT's, etc? THAT'S emergency service. You guys are happy to do emergency service...as long as all you have to do is key a mic. That's not emergency service, that's some hobbiest with nothing better to do that day.

 

Perfect example of how Packet Radio could be used in an emergency -

Here in Texas, let's say a hurricane causes an evacuation of millions of residents.  Folks are scattered around the area in Red Cross shelters, and all normal communications are down.

Packet radio can transfer lists of evacuees that have checked in, and which shelter they are located in.  Within minutes, we can check the location of an individual, and even relay messages to them.

A few weeks ago, our county-wide Public Service communications 800Mhz system was knocked offline by a severe storm.  The system would not boot.  Suddenly, none of the Police officers could communicate with their dispatcher.  The local Director called the head of our local ARES group, and activated the Net.  Within 60 minutes, we had 15 hams with handhelds and Magmounts riding with the officers, Fire trucks, and City utility trucks and dispatching calls.  We provided this service for approximately 3 hours, until their techs could get the system working again.  We received HUGE thanks from the local Gov't, and have earned a LOT of respect from our professionalism and versatility.

Each year, over 200+ Hams provide much needed communications for the MS-150 bike ride from Houston to Austin.  Over 10,000 bikers raise money for MS research.  This type of event would not be possible without the use of Hams to provide communications.  Coordinating 70+ medical vehicles, ambulances, supply trucks, logistics, and SAG wagons is impossible without Ham Radio. All this across terrain where cellular coverage is available but unable to handle the capacity of 10,000+ pocket phones in a condensed area. Fast-Busy is all you'd get otherwise.

These are just some examples.

Scott
ki5dr

 

If I am not grossly mistaken there are many Search and Rescue teams which require their members to have Ham licenses.  There are also many such teams which "strongly encourage" such licenses.  

I don't know the current emphasis, but just a couple of years ago meterology students were strongly encouraged to become licensed hams.  

I just returned from a visit to the Norman Ok, NWS office and had the pleasure to visit with the ham whose main job during severe weather is to stay in contact with the ham community for what they term "very valuable input" from the field.  And yes I think a tornado in the ground is an emergency.

 

I am new to Amateur radio.  Living in the lowcountry of South Carolina, I am acutely aware of the potential for disasters we have in our area.  Hurricanes (remember Hugo), Tornadoes, and even Earthquakes!  We get it all!  Hugo knocked out landlines, cell towers and internet nodes.

I am currently getting training to be a Red Cross Shelter operator and emergency communicator.  I am also setting up a portable Packet installation for disaster use.  Disasters will happen and Packet will serve well in those times.  

Dennis - KG4RUL

 

n6wlg: CD (Civil Defence) dose not exsist anymore. It was scrapped by the federal government in 1987. And yes, that's exactly why I got my Ham radio, to talk to my buds. But I prefer Scotch over beer... I'm not a CBer. If I see you at the next natural disaster please keep in mind: it's two sugars and one cream in my Coffee. I'll be the guy standing in the back, shaking my head saying "I told you so."

 

Hi, All.

I was referred to this discussion and found it interesting. While I agree that ham radio has a horrible image (KD7RHE even buys into the pocket protector/HT-tumor perception of the hobby), I really don't hink it is as useless for emergency communications as he apparently thinks.

I was insulted at the glib remarks and arrogant assertions he made. Especially since last night. We had a severe weather outbreak here in Northeastern Wisconsin and I was the Skywarn Net Control operator who took many, many reports of severe weather and dispatched critical information to a Boy Scout camp in an isolated area of the northwoods. The nearest phone is at least inconvenient and possibly hazardous to reach under the wrong circumstances. They thank me every time and express their appreciation frequently.

Our spotters are trained and do not fetch coffee. Oh, wait, I did bring one of the meteorologists a cup of coffee once, when getting my own. I was proud to do so, by the way, as I respect the people who I work with.

I also take part in annual drills at two nuclear power plants that neighbor us. We are not treated like appendages with no purpose, we are welcomed, given real responsibility, and appreciated when the job is done.

Yes, ham radio has some real problems. We stick to old fashioned methods and our packet system is the envy of no one. However, this can be fixed. It will take some time, but it can be fixed and made more useful. Packet should be able to handle an internet outage affecting a limited area, but it's nowhere near that stage now.

Even so, it is a key part of our nuclear emergency operations, as well as for weather spotting. It also is a key link to our state Department of Emergency Management. Oh, they seem to think we are valuable as a communications resource.

I agree that we should not be a militaristic counter-terrorism strike force. That's not what we are good at. However, KD7RHE's assertion that we are not needed or wanted is just plain inaccurate in most areas of the country. Yes, I am sure that some ARES/RACES units are poorly run and not accepted by their local emergency manager. But not all.

And I am not enamored of  KD7RHE's "Join the military and do some real good" attitude. Not everyone is 20 and in prime physical shape. I'm 48, not in bad condition (I bike and am fairly active), but the military doesn't want me. They are far more interested in younger, stronger and easier to mold (read that as easier to indoctrinate) minds than mine. My contribution to my fellow citizens is my ham radio experience and skills.

KD7RHE, I am insulted that you find my efforts - which I could be using to make myself more affluent - are so readily dismissed by you. Your lack of respect and immature attitude are one reason why I hope you never get into the emergency aspect of ham radio operations. This requires patience, compassion understanding and knowledge. Qualities that you apparently lack, or have trouble showing.

So keep on talking to your "buds". I don't think your local ARES/RACES unit needs another person to make their job harder - it's probably already hard enough.

Take care, everybody.

 

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (radioweenie @ July 23 2002,05:47)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">First, I substantially agree with the article by N5PVL. Terrorism has obviously proved to be a substantial problem and amateurs are certainly posed to play a key part in its resolution. Radios and communication therewith is certainly what we are about.
  But, second, let us not forget that we do need radio equipment in order to be able to play said key part in the first place. We are now at the point where we can no longer afford to buy radio equipment because of the economic disaster that we are now all paying for. I voted for Bush. But his fiscal mismanagement has been more destructiveof of this economy than even the terrorist attacks on NYC. Proof of this fact is inherent in the reality that the stock market has now plunged to a level that is LOWER than that which occurred as a result of the utter decimation of two of the largest buildings in the world. I am concerned that if this government continues its current policies of  "understanding corporate responsibilities" even to the point of winking at corporate chicanery, blinking at demands of reforming same, and nodding to the military and big energy, very few of us will be able to buy any equipment that would be of any value should the unfortunate event of another terrorist attack again come to pass. Just my two cents worth-- edit it as you wish... 73 de
-Radioweenie-[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">We are now at the point where we can no longer afford to buy radio equipment because of the economic disaster that we are now all paying for. I voted for Bush. But his fiscal mismanagement has been more destructiveof of this economy than even the terrorist attacks on NYC. Proof of this fact is inherent in the reality that the stock market has now plunged to a level that is LOWER than that which occurred as a result of the utter decimation of two of the largest buildings in the world. I am concerned that if this government continues its current policies of  "understanding corporate responsibilities" even to the point of winking at corporate chicanery, blinking at demands of reforming same, and nodding to the military and big energy, very few of us will be able to buy any equipment that would be of any value should the unfortunate event of another terrorist attack again come to pass. Just my two cents worth-- edit it as you wish... 73 de
-Radioweenie-[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
What a load of crap....  If you want to blame anyone for the current economic malaise, blame Bill Clinton for going after Microsoft (which does NOT have a monopoly on PC operating systems... consumers can choose OS/2, MacOS, and Linux, among others... but Msft's competitors in CA are worth more electoral votes than in WA).  Blame the Clinton Administration for not monitoring what was going on during its 8 years in office, when the Enron/WorldCom/Tyco/etc. shenanigans were actually happening.  Blame Al Gore's petulant whining over the Florida results, which again put a dent in consumer spending during Q4 '00.  Blame the Dem's constant blaring about the 'recession' which we have NOT had... economic growth has not declined!  Blame the Senate Democrats for blocking Bush Administration appointees and Bush Administration programs, in an effort to screw things up so that they can regain control of the House this year.

Why should CEOs be any more honest than the former President and First Lady (now NY Senator)?  Former Clinton Treasury Secretary Robert Rubin is the person who tried (unsuccessfully) to get the Bush Administration to intercede on behalf of Enron... why won't Joe Lieberman call him to testify?  Have the Clintons actually returned any of the items they stole when they left the White House?  Has DNC Chair Terry McAuliffe offered to return any of the $18 million he was gifted from Global Crossing to its thousands of employees whose pension fund has been erased?  How 'bout that multi-million dollar no-interest loan from WorldCom to House Dem Leader Gephardt in '98... that hasn't been repaid?  And, don't forget that September 11th would never have happened if Clinton had taken advantage of the three separate opportunities offered by foreign governments to have bin Laden delivered to the US giftwrapped.

Bush is dealing with the mess of 8 years of Clinton's sleeping (or sleeping with an intern) at the switch.  You can't clean up 8 years in six months... especially when the opposition party is fighting you at every turn.  Unfortunately, while the Dems delay voting on defense matters (the primary purpose of the government, BTW) and generally screw the country around in an effort to help themselves politically, we'll probably be hit by another devastating attack... then perhaps enough people will 'get it' to send these buttheads packing.

 

Why do people compare packet radio to the internet?
Do they have tunnel vision or something?  The internet should be considered much like a public utility that can fail.  Let's keep packet radio as our "internet" and stop nay-saying that the internet eliminates the need for us.
Even emergency managers know better.  That's why many of them rely on the amateur radio service.
Randy km0d

 

We have brought up a packet network in Minnesota for emergency and keyboard to keyboard traffic.  We are trying to keep automatic message forwarding off the network, and basically support deployed emergency vans and Red Cross evacuation messages, etc.  We are using older 2M FM radios and Kantronics equipment for minimum cost and no computers, TCP/IP, etc to reduce complexity.  The network can provide "instant messaging" type capability.  We have selected 145.67 so as not to interfere with other packet/APRS/DXcluster traffic and users.  This frequency could be used as a national emergency net channel.

http://home.att.net/~mn67pkt/index.html