The Email Robots are coming to the phone bands!

Email Robots are coming to the phone bands!

ARRL now wants to let Email Robots cover the phone bands!

In the ARRL "bandwidth" petition, RM-11306, Pactor-III Email robots, 2.4 KHz wide (requiring a channel width of 2.5 KHz), are allowed everywhere phone is allowed, which on 20m is 14100 to 14350 KHz.

The current practice of Winlink 2000, where Pactor-II is allowed, which is anywhere in the RTTY/Data/CW segment of the bands, is to scan two or more channels by each fully automatic Pactor-II Email robot.

THIS IS DONE JUST SO THE MOBILE STATIONS WILL NOT HAVE TO WAIT AS LONG AS 4 MINUTES FOR A FREQUENCY THAT IS BEING USED BY ANOTHER EMAIL ROBOT, and so they can go to another frequency where there is no Email robot, even if there is a already a CW or SSB station there, and let an Email robot just take over the frequency.

If a single Pactor-III Email robot requires a 2.5 KHz channel, then a fully automatic Email robot scanning two channels will use 5 kHz.

There are currently 25 Winlink Email robots in the US and another 25 overseas, some of which can still interfere with communications in the US. There are another, perhaps 25, Email Robots assigned for Emcomm use by Winlink.

Assuming an average of 40 Winlink Email robots can be heard worldwide on 20 meters, and each one automatically scans only two frequencies, then 40 Email robots will take up 40 x 5 = 200 kHz of the 20 meter phone band, which is 80% of the phone band!

ARRL claims that the operator triggering the Email robot to transmit should not allow it to transmit on a busy frequency, but of course, it usually does anyway, or it just may not hear stations in QSO local to the robot but remote to itself, so the Email robot can just wipe out the local QSO, as is so often the practice now for CW and PSK31 QSO's, AND THIS WILL BECOME A REALITY FOR ALL PHONE OPERATORS IF RM-11306 is adopted.

If you think that sacrificing 80% of the 20 meter phone band to be used for Email messaging for Winlink's less than 1% of the US ham population is a good idea, you should file comments with the FCC stating that you agree with the ARRL rewording of Part 97.221.

BUT, IF YOU THINK THAT EMAIL ROBOTS SHOULD BE CONFINED TO A SEPARATE SPACE ON THE BANDS, THEN YOU ALSO NEED TO FILE COMMENTS TO THE FCC AND LET THEM KNOW YOUR POSITION!

It is as easy as 1-2-3-4 to file a comment!

1. Go to http://gullfoss2.fcc.gov/prod/ecfs/upload_v2.cgi

2. Fill in RM-11306 (in all caps) where it says "1. Proceeding"

3. Fill in the rest of the spaces with your name and address where indicated

4. Type a brief comment to the FCC where it says "Send a Brief Comment to FCC (typed-in)

Please make an effort to file a comment on RM-11306 before February 5!

 

How does this belong in the "News" section?
Just another rant...........
Mark   AD5CA

 

the last thing we need in amateur radio is a bot, look at the chat rooms on yahoo they are so full of bots you can not even chat with someone else without a bot popping up bots are useless plus 20m is great voice band and it does not need to be destroyed. winlink2000 needs to be destroyed it has caused more trouble than any other software that has been devolped in amateur radio.

 

Mark,

It is news because the FCC has asked for comments on the ARRL bandwidth petition, RM-11306, and the comment period closes February 5. Did you know that?

If adopted, the ARRL petition will now let Pactor-III Email robots go anywhere they wish in the phone bands, which means they will pop up unannounced at random on top of your phone QSO if you are accidentally on one of their published frequencies and they want to download their email.

This has never been allowed before, and phone operators have no idea how disruptive Email robots are. To date, only digital and CW operators have suffered this.

My explanation was never intended to be a "rant", but a detailed explanation of what may happen so you and everyone else can make an informed decision and comment on RM-11306 before it is too late.

Do you think a 30% duty cycle phone signal can possibly compete with an 90% duty cycle Pactor-III Email robot that automatically keeps trying to punch through your phone QSO until you lose contact with the other person and it dominates the freqeuency?

The Pactor-III signal looks like this:



Please file comments on RM-11306 before February 5.

73, Skip KH6TY

 

THE SKY IS FALLING! THE SKY IS FALLING!

{yawn}

I, for one, welcome our new Winlink using overlords.

 

ROFL!!!!

Have you passed your General test yet?

Have you had a psk31 qso wiped out yet by a Winlink station?

Have you had an Olivia qso wiped out by a Winlink station on 40m or 20m yet?

You don't need to answer. We know you haven't.

tim ab0wr

 

Down with the Bots! I filed my comments earlier this morning.

Also, check out the ARRL Letter, Volume 25, No. 4, that just came out. The League Directors now have a goal of having wideband, high-throughput multimedia on the ham bands by 2010!

3.5kHz won't be nearly enough.

Just think, HF of the future will be limited to a couple of QSOs per band, with that kind of objective.

And, away we go.......

Lee
W6EM

 

down with the arrl....they are useless.

 

All you farmboys out there (of which I *am* one),
If you don't understand Skip's plot of the Pactor-III emission, just climb down off'n that tractor and backhand ten adjacent corn stalks real fast to get an idea of what you'd hear on your favorite phone frequency if ARRL had its way. Talk about "rough as a cob"!

Humans...GOOD

Robots...BAD

"NO" to RM-11306...NO to RM-11305 too!

 

You already know what SSB sounds like, but
just turn up the volume on your computer speakers and click on this link to find what out you would hear instead of your QSO partner or that DX station you are trying to snag:

http://rover.wiesbaden.netsurf.de/~signals/WAV/PACTOR-III_16.WAV

73, Skip KH6TY

 

What is funny, is the previous paragraph where the board has adopted the ARRL Education Mission and Vision Statement.

The board better get some people that understand digital and bandwidth, to educate the board first.

They really don't have a clue. State of the art on HF in 2006 is sending characters very slowly, and SSTV. Yet in 2010, we will be downloading HDTV on 20 meters.

Well that is if we can use the entire band for around 35 years for the download.

The ARRL board's technical knowledge, seems to be non-existent at this point.

They don't have a technical clue, yet ham radio should be completely changed to make room for their unproven pipe dreams.

Unreal.

73 - Bob

 

Regarding this discussion, have the ARRL had discussions with other amateur radio organisations around the world ? It would be hard to believe that those who control the thinking behind this proposed roving Winlink e mail BBS, or whatever they choose to call it, would be unaware of its effects internationally, or do they not care ?

I suffered the effects of the Pactor BBS years ago, and it caused great anger to those who were using Pactor 12 years ago. The bloody thing would just drop on a frequency, and completely wipe out any QSO's in an instant.

If this is the way forward in American amateur radio then every device possible needs to be used to prevent what the ARRL believes will be an asset to amateur radio.

I fail to understand why mobile stations need to send e mails from their cars, is it a case of finding something of little importance to send in an e mail so that the Winlink system can be used.? As in Britain 95 % of the stuff that is sent by Packet is just clutter and rubbish which need not be sent. Are there not enough mobile phones and other methods of transmitting messages available without causing a hindrance to users of the amateur radio frequencies outside the USA

Has anybody at the ARRL fully explained why this communication system is so badly needed ? Are people writiing to QST demanding such a system, are they writing to newspapers ? Are people asking questions on TV ? Of course they aren't because its a stupid ill thought out idea. Unless of course the US Home Security government department is demanding that such a system is devised, naturally of course to defend the American homeland.

G0GQK

 

ARRL or the writer of this posting has been watching way too much Battle Star Galactica episodes.  The bots were built to serve man and there are many copies.  They have a plan.

Oh brother, relax.

K2WH

 

Sounds like a gentleman's agreement for a sub band just for this is in order. May not help with "across the pond" stuff but would for here, anyway.

 

The ARRL intentionally completely disregarded the published IARU restrictions on "digimode" transmissions, even though they were well aware of them.

This was because the basis of the ARRL plan was drafted by the same people who bring us Winlink, and they just did not want any restrictions on where they can spread out. As far as ARRL is concerned, IARU Region 1's published bandplan apparently is not worthy of any consideration.


You might want to read this link:

http://www.zerobeat.net/bandplan-dissent.html

which explains where the basis of the ARRL petition came from, as ARRL  states in the petition itself.

This Email communications system primarily serves just over 5000 Winlink clients, mostly yachtsmen sailing the seven seas, so they can get email without having to pay for a commercial service. The connection with ARRL is that they have decided to use the Winlink network for the ARRL traffic system, so they sorta "made a bargain with the devil" in order to get access to Winlink, and in return are trying to get FCC rules changed to let Winlink operate anywhere they wish, including all over the phone bands.

If Region 1 hams oppose such a plan, it would do no harm to also send in comments to our FCC to let them know the problems it would cause across the ocean. You do not have to be a US amateur or even a ham operator to comment. The FCC always includes references to IARU Region 1 in their regulations anyway, We need all the help we can get to get the ARRL petition denied so our ham bands can continue to be used for communications between two persons instead of mainly for Email for the Internet.

In fact, the most recent ARRL Letter states the following, "The FCC has ordered several rule revisions to implement changes agreed to at
the international level during World Radiocommunication Conference 2003
(WRC-03). Acting Wireless Telecommunications Bureau Chief Catherine W.
Seidel signed the Order, released January 19. The changes affect §97.111,
Authorized transmissions; §97.113, Prohibited transmissions; §97.115, Third
party communications, and §97.117, International communications.

"These amendments will ensure that the Commission's Amateur Radio Service
rules conform to Article 25 of the international Radio Regulations adopted
at the 2003 World Radiocommunication Conference, and will further the
Commission's ongoing efforts to streamline its Amateur Service Rules," the
FCC said. "The overall effect of this action is to update the Part 97
Amateur Radio Service rules in the Code of Federal Regulations to conform to
now-effective international agreements."

Just click on this link to file comments and use RM-11306 (all caps) for the Proceeding number:

http://gullfoss2.fcc.gov/prod/ecfs/upload_v2.cgi

Please have as many hams as you can file comments, but hurry, because the comment period ends February 5.

73, Skip KH6TY