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25 APRIL .... the day of the father of the radio : MARCONI

Discussion in 'Amateur Radio News' started by IW2BSF, Apr 24, 2018.

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  1. W1YW

    W1YW Ham Member QRZ Page

    1) You can't patent 'ideas';

    2) Invented...patented. In radio these two are the same. Why? Because the inventors used the patent system, at least in the US, to get priority and recognition for invention, using the monopoly of temporary grant of property rights by the US government.

    IOW, patents.
     
  2. W1YW

    W1YW Ham Member QRZ Page

    RE: The OP headline...

    This should answer the question about the 'father of radio'....

    Don't let regurgitations of 'Empire of the Air' totally bias you....

    ;->


    [​IMG]
     
    KY5U likes this.
  3. KY5U

    KY5U Ham Member QRZ Page

    Yes, I taught broadcast history (albeit in a community college) and the "History of Radio" referred to broadcast voice radio. Dr. deForest's audion tube was the big deal that kicked it off.

    David Sarnoff was a schmuck. :)
     
    Last edited: May 5, 2018
  4. W1YW

    W1YW Ham Member QRZ Page

    At least you know your Yiddish... ;-)
     
  5. KY5U

    KY5U Ham Member QRZ Page

    A dank!
     
  6. WN1MB

    WN1MB Ham Member QRZ Page

    http://alienjeff.net/iprights.html
     
    KK5R likes this.
  7. WN1MB

    WN1MB Ham Member QRZ Page

    Father of wireles?

    wireles.jpeg
     
  8. WF1A

    WF1A XML Subscriber QRZ Page

    Before Tesla invented principles of radio, there were great giants such as Maxwell and Hertz. There were significant experiments by Fessenden as well.
    But as people pointed here, we are talking about INVENTION of radio. However, even if we focus on patents, Tesla's patent is valid and gives him the rights to invention of
    radio. (here I do not want to pretend to be greater expert than the US Supreme Court and all the row of experts involved in this decision. Case closed.)

    Please look at Tesla demonstrating remote-controlled boat in 1882: https://www.engadget.com/2014/01/19/nikola-teslas-remote-control-boat/
    Nikola Tesla, Columbia lecture in 1881.
    Experiments with Alternate Currents of High Potential and High Frequency- A lecture delivered before the IEE, London, February 1892.
    Tesla's Colorado Springs Laboratory 1899-1900 where he clearly experimented with radio: https://teslaresearch.jimdo.com/colorado-springs-lab-1899-1900/
    Tesla's Wardenclyff Laboratory - which someone conveniently set on fire (guess who was behind that!?): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wardenclyffe_Tower

    and then 10 years later in 1901 Marconi invents radio!

    (70 years after 1882, as a child, I tried to build a his 1882 remote control boat - with all the technology existing in 1962, tubes, etc, and I could not. This was a remarkable achievement,
    not only as an invention, but an application of the invention. Then someone tells me that 9 years after 1882 Marconi invents radio! To me this sounds like a joke.)

    This is just an absence of common sense ......
    (Chip, I do not clam to be the smart guy, I do not claim to be knowledgeable, but I claim my common sense. btw: I do work with patents as an expert and (thank you for
    posting claims from Tesla's patent on radio), as an expert I can tell you right away that the language in claim 5. has no mention of conduction - thus there is no limitation to the claim.
    Invention of radio - is Tesla's)

    To make claims about invention, you have to place yourself back into history and what was known to the "practitioner of the ordinary skill in the art" (POSITA) at the time.
    Herz just demonstrated / invented Electro-Magnetic waves - postulated by Maxwell. This was in the same year Tesla delivers lecture on AC:
    A New System of Alternate Current Motors and Transformers- A lecture delivered before the AIEE, May 16, 1888.

    Tesla was obsessed with resonance. Tuning the two resonant circuits together is a fundamental principle of radio invention. But, he was always looking for larger things.
    E.g. he postulated that the entire Earth can resonate.
    He was also postulating wireless transmission of energy. This is the point where various Tesla enemies jump in to say "aha" - "not signals". But signals do carry energy -
    every ham knows that, thus they are a subset of his larger dream.
    I have recently learned that there are people experimenting of elevating the voltage to millions of volts or more which can get close to the point of wireless energy transmission.
    After all, ionosphere is conducting when you reach voltages that high. It may have been a dream, perhaps dream still today, but I would not be surprised if in not so distant future
    we see something of that sort.
    After all, great inventors are dreamers, and Tesla was a dreamer and true inventor.

    Strangely, strangely and very strangely ... there is that very large group of people who would do anything to undermine Tesla.
    He is almost absent from the science history in the USA, There is no monument to Tesla, no street named after him, and there is no single sign nor plaque in the places where he lived and worked. There was a long fight to get the plaque at Niagara Falls, where the first AC power plant was built. No sign at Wardenclyff, nothing at Colorado Springs (I belive this is on the top of Pike Peak, known for high-speed car race, - no sign of Tesla).
    For many years I wondered if this is a hate of immigrants, immigrant Slavs, corporate Edison lobby, Italian lobby or else .... I do not know, but surely, any mention of Tesla will trigger
    many emotional reactions such as this one.

    However, there is other side of USA: those that appreciate a small business, a lone inventor struggling against corporate giants, independent minded person, etc.
    In spite of the strong suppression of Tesla from the science history and almost total absence of recognition of significance of his work (AC), there are people in the USA,
    who are discovering Tesla. People like Elon Musk, and more and more recently young people. That makes me happy as it tells me: you can not hide and forge the truth forever.

    This is my 5c tribute to Tesla and his invention of radio.
     
    KK5R likes this.
  9. W1YW

    W1YW Ham Member QRZ Page

    Nope. CLAIM 5 says nothing about anything that could be construed as (tele)communications. Its a claim on WIRELESS POWER transmission.

    We all know he did that. Poorly.

    Read CLAIM 5 again please. CAREFULLY.

    Not radio.

    Sorry.

    IF he had a claim that said something like' communication via ...' with that wording of CLAIM 5, then I agree: that would have been THE claim which clinched 'inventor of radio'. BUT he didn't.

    Looks like this is one of , if not the biggest, blunder of inventing claims in modern times.

    Why do people insist on shoring up Tesla? He simply was wrong about (what would become) radio--and did not invent it.
    73
    Chip W1YW
     
    Last edited: May 5, 2018
  10. KP4SX

    KP4SX Ham Member QRZ Page

    ..
     
    KK5R likes this.
  11. WF1A

    WF1A XML Subscriber QRZ Page

    signals do carry power ... at that time not even a word radio existed, so how could he write a claim for inventing "radio"?
    The only reasonable claims that established something that we later know as "radio" where the ones listed.

    I do not know how many years it took to the court system to grant the invention of radio to Tesla - 30, 40? need to check.
    But during this time there were many experts, many lawyers and many testimonies arguing both sides and it reached the Supreme Court of USA
    which decided in favor of Tesla. (and remember, Tesla was underdog in this process which drained him so he died with 5$ in his pocket - but they
    still ruled in his favor)

    While everything in life may be relevant, certain things we do have to accept in order to move on. Those are laws and court decisions among others.

    However, we have 1888 - Hertz, EM Waves, 3 years later in 1892 Tesla builds and demonstrates radio controlled boat, which functions perfectly even today.
    Things were at that time moving very fast, Tesla gives lectures on his inventions, Marconi attends at least the one in London in 1892. Tesla builds a
    laboratory in Colorado Springs and experiments with radio 1899-1900 (Colorado Springs Diary). Starts building Wardenclyff laboratory in 1901, in
    order to continue experimenting with radio and then: Marconi invents radio in 1901!?

    Sorry that beats me!
     
    KK5R likes this.
  12. W1YW

    W1YW Ham Member QRZ Page

    When I plug my toaster into the wall, there is "energy transmission".

    But my toaster doesn't talk to me, or to some other machine as a result of the "energy transmission".

    In modern times, we would say 'there is no conveyance of information'.

    You shouldn't take this personally; Tesla just messed up!

    Hey-- I dedicated my Ph.D. thesis to Tesla. But he didn't invent radio. He invented a buncha other cool stuff. But not radio.

    Do I WISH he invented radio? You bet!

    73
    Chip W1YW
     
    Last edited: May 5, 2018
  13. W1YW

    W1YW Ham Member QRZ Page

    Not quite true. Tesla has several small pensions granted to him by former employers, which paid ALL his bills. (His bank account was apparently sealed when he died.) And John Hammond took care of the rest. Most people don't know that....

    Where do you think he got the money for all those pigeons:)? And Room 3327 at the Hotel New Yorker?

    Tesla basically gave up on independent invention after his lab burnt down. He became a journeyman inventor for companies like the Waltham Watch Company.

    73
    Chip W1YW
     
    Last edited: May 5, 2018
  14. W1YW

    W1YW Ham Member QRZ Page

    Nothing would please me more than to see Tesla honored more here in the US. Here's hoping that the Wardenclyffe Museum opens someday to better capture Tesla's wonderful genius--and tragic flaws.

    73
    Chip W1YW
     
  15. KK5R

    KK5R Ham Member QRZ Page

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