PROPOSED: Only 2 Amateur Radio License Classes -- A Response to the FCC and an Invitation to Discuss

Or just call existing technicians "general" and let them run 1500 watts across the bands. They already have a 1500 watt limit above 50MHz, so it's not like you are adding any new privilege, except where they can run 1500 watts.

If you rolled tech into general, then the tech license would cease to exist, and everyone would have general privileges. Then, any general would take the standard 50 question test to upgrade to extra. New generals would have a 50 question test, so both tests would be 50 questions each.

I don't think anyone in the general public would care one way or the other. The only reason the FCC cares is because they are basing tests and privileges on "incentive licensing", which came about more than 50 years ago. A new philosophy could be called "two step licensing", to replace "incentive licensing". Once you get past the idea that there has to be an incentive in amateur licensing, then it's really easy to think in terms of a single or dual step license. Hams are the only people I know that get "hung up" on tests and license steps. You don't hear people with driver's licenses worry about which test the other driver took, or if I had to pass more questions, or how difficult the exam was, etc. But that seems to be a thing that hams tend to worry about; when they took the test, whether it was a VE or the FCC office, what level of code speed they had to master, and how long they had to wait for the license to arrive. Really, who cares, and why does that matter?

Most hams are going to forget almost everything on the test within days, months, or years. Especially if they are not using that knowledge on a semi-regular basis.

 

How is that distinct from me pointing out that the added privileges created a place where experienced operators could go and the newcomers could not follow? Wasn't the value in upgrading in part about this separation? If not in whole about this separation?

I guess you worded it more "politely" but it was still rewarding operators with a place that lesser experienced operators could not be heard.

How can this be anything but segregation? You can call this some easier way to enforce frequency limits but for the FCC but, at least in a time closer to today, it appears they don't much care what kind of Amateur license an operator holds so long as they are on some Amateur frequency than drifting off into an aircraft band or something.

If we want to make things easier to enforce then reduce the number of license classes, and reduce or eliminate the sub-bands by license class. If that reduces the incentives in "incentive licensing" then I'd have to ask if the FCC much cares any more. It's a license not a trophy.

 

I asked because I saw more than one way to interpret what was proposed. You gave one interpretation. I'm taking an educated guess that the FCC would not be pleased with any petition that reduces the testing requirements for Extra as measured in total test questions for the license.

The reason to restrict power on HF is because the potential for injury from RF differs by frequency, and on HF we get into the realm of international communications and there's different rules there. I don't know if there's any breaking of the rules by doing this but I suspect the FCC would know, and if they don't they'd rather not find out by unleashing half of American Amateurs on the world overnight.

Not only would they not care, a good portion of them do not know we exist.

I don't know how much the FCC cares about "incentive licensing", I suspect any mention of it they made recently was just because they thought it would play well to the crowd. If they do care then it's not like "incentive licensing" would be dead with a two-tier licensing, it would just be different in the incentives.

 

I'm damn PROUD of being a Ham OP for 63 years and counting. Climbed my way up the proverbial ladder to ADVANCED in 1968 and am satisfied with that!!! Besides ULTIMATELY it's up to the FCC either way!!!

 

Nope. Wrong.

There were license tests "by mail" even before the FCC/FRC existed.

There are many, many ARRL Handbooks online, free for the download, at worldradiohistory.com, including the first edition, from 1926. Also every QST from Vol. 1 No. 1 to 1969.

If you're going to recount history, do some research first.

Nope, nope, and nope.

Not going to waste any more keystrokes.

73 de Jim, N2EY

 

I am ok with this idea. New to Amateur radio, the testing is a lot. People can get the understanding of proper use of radio transmitting and such. However understanding the complexities of what the Extra class super complex things might be more than most of us can ever understand. That, keeping us from experiencing those privileges. It's not dumbing down, but maybe getting more practical. kf0qym

 

Bull shit

 

Here's the reality of US HF allocations:

Technicians and Novices have the same CW privileges as Generals and Advanceds on 80, 40, and 15 meters, plus some CW, data and SSB on 10 meters.

Generals have the same privileges as Extras EXCEPT the following:

3500-3525 and 3600-3800 kHz
7000-7025 and 7125-7175 kHz
14000-14025 and 14150-14225 kHz
21000-21025 and 21200-21275 kHz

Hardly "tiny slices". More like "practically everything".

But there's more!

There is NO requirement for newcomers to stay in any license class. Since 1978, it has been possible to go from no license to Extra in one test session. If someone wants full privileges, all they have to do is pass the required tests. And those tests are quite basic.

And here's something too many folks ignore: In 2000 - 25 years ago! - FCC didn't just reduce code testing. They also reduced WRITTEN testing. Prior to April 15 2000, the WRITTEN testing for full privileges was 5 tests (Novice/Technician/General/Advanced/Extra), but on that date the WRITTEN testing was reduced to 3 tests (Technician/General/Extra). When that was done, the Technician and General tests stayed the same size but the Extra was expanded from 40 to 50 questions.

Once upon a time, there were time-in-grade requirements for Advanced and Extra, but the Advanced requirement was 1 year and went away in 1953, while the 2 year Extra requirement was reduced to a year in the early 1970s and eliminated in 1978.

The idea that "newcomers are segregated" is simply not supported by the facts.

73 de Jim, N2EY

 

But - is the General really such a "big jump"? Or is the General test just "more of the same"?

The pre-1987 Technician written test was the same as the General written test, and we had lots of growth back then. The repeater boom caused most newcomers to start with Technician rather than Novice back then.

The Novice and Advanced are going away by attrition. There are now fewer than 6000 Novices and 30,000 Advanceds, and the numbers are shrinking every day. It costs nothing to just let them fade away.

73 de Jim, N2EY

 

The ARRL wants to keep three classes.

Sec FCC public records
https://www.arrl.org/files/file/Adv...m=Email&utm_campaign=ARRL&_zs=uLtxl&_zl=iE1J3

But they want to to update and they call it the "modernize of the Technician Class License Privileges"

They the ARRL reiterated its earlier proposal for extending additional limited privileges for Technician class operators. Giving the Tehnician licensees an introductory window to HF data and phone communications

Delete the LF and VHF/UHF Symbol (Baud) Rate and Bandwidth Limitations

They ARRL support the deletion of these restrictions as proposed by the Commission in late 2023. Doing so would enhance Amateur experimentation with digital technologies.

The ARRL also requested action on an earlier proposal that would take away part of the 80 meter band from Extra class.


The the ARRL also asked the FCC remove provisions that refer to digital codes that today are obsolete and permit Radio Amateurs to experiment freely with new digital codes, so long as such codes are publicly documented and decodable over the air.

 

The point of power limits in my view (pretty much the norm everywhere but the US) is that power, rather than sub-bands or modes, should be the primary distinction between the license classes. So a Basic or New Novice or Tech-on-HF or whatever you want to call it would have lower power than a General, which would both give them a modest incentive to upgrade (not my #1 priority, good old IL) and reduce the interference in band caused by neophytes with big signals and insufficient skills. The old Novice was 75 in, so maybe 50 out, CW. Then PEP output replaced input and it became 100 out, and then in 1987 they passed "enhancement" to 200, at ARRL's request, as if somehow that would get more people interested. I think that higher power was a mistake and mistakes should be corrected. Especially in context of this thread, where the OP proposes two license classes, again largely distinguished by power (though again think 100 for Basic is a bit high, maybe by 3-6 dB).

The "art of the possible" is that the FCC right now has a lot on their plate, Part 97 is a distraction, but they know that eventually somebody there has to be told to set aside higher-priority work and take a look at it and the related stuff in ECFS. Just as every decade or whatever, somebody from the government visits Baker Island to see that the birds are okay and to renew the US claim on the surrounding waters. We've seen benign neglect for the past few decades but once in a while they peek their nose in. And an effective ex parte operation can sometimes prompt action.

 

The FCC increased novice power to 250 watts input in 1975. That was fifty years ago. From 1951 to 1975 it was 75 watts input. So the novice had a lower power for 24 years, and has had 200 watts for fifty years. I don't think it makes sense to go backwards in privileges, especially when there is no reason for that, and the lower power was in effect for less than half the time that we have had the higher power limit.

Also, techs have always been allowed 1500 watts (or the maximum limit) except where they had novice privileges. If a tech is "qualified" to run 1500 watts on 51 MHz, what would make us believe he would not be qualified to run 1500 watts on 10M or 15M etc?

 

Going to a 2 license class designation I think would bring more people into the hobby. The current amount of ham we have isn't really growing, it's just replacing the sk's. The reason I'm not an Extra is, I don't have an electrical degree needed for the test. Besides with basically all new radio's being some type of SDR who really cares to "fix or upgrade" their own radio? I use my knowledge for what I do and gain more knowledge when needed.

 

A lot of things about the current license system doesn't make sense. But a lot of things about licensing have never made sense. Consider:

In 1986, when I first got licensed, you had to start with Novice, which required a written test, which was easy, and 5 wpm code, which was not. 5 WPM is nothing if you know code, but most people don't, and it was a huge barrier. Who knows how many people that kept from getting licensed. I know 3 or 4 older guys dropped out of my Novice class, never to return. And code was the main reason.

For all that effort you got tiny slivers of 80, 40, 15 and 10m. Code only. No voice privileges anywhere. I imagine a lot of Novice licenses were just allowed to expire. Mine did. Maybe giving Novices some small areas of phone privileges would have kept their interest; I know I would have been more likely to stick with it.

But the FCC really wanted everyone to upgrade to Technician, which required another written test, and for that you got everything 6m and above. No HF phone privileges though, which made no sense. Why were techs allowed 1500 watts on VHF and UHF, all allowable modes, but still no phone privileges below 6m?

Especially since an upgrade to General required a 13 WPM code test. No additional theory.

So to get phone privileges, all other modes, and full power on probably 80 percent of the HF bands, you had to pass another code test, which made no sense. I never did it. Hell, I couldn't pass a 13 wpm test now. So a lot of new licensees stayed on VHF and UHF where they had full privileges, and never upgraded to discover the wonder that is HF. Or they left the hobby entirely and let their licenses expire. I was one of them.

The FCC went in the right direction in April 87, just a few months after I got my novice, when SSB was allowed for novices and techs on a small portion of 10M. Also a little bit of 220 and 23cm for novices. Very little activity on either band. Phone privileges on small sections of 80, 40, and 15, where they already had code privileges, would have made sense, but it was never done.

So Techs have all privileges above 30 MHz, with almost nothing below. Generals have almost all amateur privileges (probably around 90 percent), while an upgrade to extra gets you almost nothing. When I upgraded to general after re-entering the hobby, I decided to prepare for the extra test while I was at it. If I hadn't passed it, I probably wouldn't even bother trying again. Not much point.

So to the FCC, why bother changing anything if you're not going to do it right? Extras don't get enough privileges to upgrade, except just so you can say you're an Extra and give General tests. Techs get all VHF and UHF, Generals almost all HF. That leaves taking away Extra, which would not be well received. If the FCC would have held back more HF privileges or band space for the higher classes instead of generals getting so much, (for example reserved the WARC bands for extra and/or advanced when they were added) then the incentive licensing would have made sense, but they didn't. And since the FCC doesn't take privileges away from lower license classes to reserve them for higher classes (fortunately), the only thing that makes sense is to just leave it be.

 

I passed the test for Extra, and I couldn't get an electrical engineering degree. I tried, but I had to switch my major.
And I love building antennas and equipment. Isn't that why most of us got into the hobby?