Modems, codes, and the future of Digital Voice: 2017 DCC on HamRadioNow

Discussion in 'Amateur Radio News' started by KN4AQ, Oct 19, 2017.

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  1. KN4AQ

    KN4AQ Subscriber QRZ Page

    HRN 355 POSTER - Brady 250.jpg HRN 356 POSTER - Bruce 250.jpg
    Brady O'Brien KC9TPA is a young ham who has been working with David Rowe VK5DGR, the creator of the open source CODEC2 low bitrate voice codec. In this TAPR presentation he talks modem tech in SDR.

    Then Bruce Perens K6BP ... Do we really need to say any more?

    OK, Bruce's main point is one he's been making for several years: The major manufacturers have been screwing up Digital Voice with mediocre implementation and their incompatible walled gardens. And we're slowly getting closer to VHF+SDR radios that can do better.

    He is especially critical of Yaesu, but actually compliments Kenwood for introducing a radio that is actually compatible with at least one other line of radios (ICOM/D-STAR).

    N5OCO likes this.
  2. KK5JY

    KK5JY Ham Member QRZ Page

    I can relate to that sentiment. ;)

    I would like to see DV make some substantial inroads into HF operations. As in, it would be nice if the performance gets to the point that DV can run alongside SSB for contesting, DXing, etc.
    W1DFC likes this.
  3. K8XG

    K8XG XML Subscriber QRZ Page

    Realy? Fusion sounds the best of GMSK , DMR, and 4FSK duh...the whole thing about R2D2 is that original D-star before they upgraded their AMBE chips is that is had sharp sounds like the R2 robot that would make you turn the radio off..

    Bad implementations of DMR , like older md-380s make DMR sound bad but no moto radio sounds bad they all sound good.

    Early Fusion radios had a few squeaks that were bad, but with the last few years of good firmware and DSP , Fusion sounds the cleanest of them all...
    K2WH likes this.
  4. KQ6XA

    KQ6XA Ham Member QRZ Page

    See a demo of amazingly clear mobile HF Digital Voice in a very noisy SSB situation, on this youtube video.
    skip to 4:40 (4 minutes 40 seconds) for the live demo.

    W8COP, N8WXT, K8XG and 1 other person like this.
  5. M0REU

    M0REU Ham Member QRZ Page

    Very impressive Bonnie. Thanks for sharing it
  6. NK9Y

    NK9Y Ham Member QRZ Page

    Today's Fusion may, or may not, be the "cleanest of them all". The simple fact remains: Does Fusion sound like the real voice of the person on the other end of the QSO? My personal answer is no. I do NOT care to waste any more of MY money on various manufacturers R & D.
    W2THC and VK6APZ like this.
  7. KY5U

    KY5U Subscriber QRZ Page

    Is the bearded guy in the picture Richard Stallman? ;)

    On the demo, sounded good. BUT: Bandwidth? Base power? I could have gotten rid of that noise with DSP on SSB. What digital method?
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2017
  8. KY5U

    KY5U Subscriber QRZ Page

    BTW, I listened to Bruce and the older he gets the more he sounds like Mr. Mackey from South Park m'kay?

    He omits some intersting items like 9600BPS data over analog cellular, and plenty room for digital voice over analog telco lines. The digital technology during that time was not sophisticated enough to use the bandwidth properly, and during TDMA days, variations that allowed 10 conversations on an "analog" data channel bandwidth were available but ultimately not needed.

    Regulation By Bandwidth

    Free DV is VERY GOOD because of it's optimal use of bandwidth. Regulation by bandwidth should be tried on the digital data sub bands first. Let's face it, regulation by bandwidth universally favors automatic data stations AKA Winkink which uses specturally hoggish modems at 2.5 khz and wants BIGGER bandwidths. 2.5kHz is PLENTY of bandwidth for digital voice why not email? Allow Free DV on the data sub bands.

    Then one has to ask WHY RBB is so important when it benefits data stations when data mode use of amateurs is less than 10%? Why restructure amateur radio for 10% of users? The answer: They use digital and the hell with the rest of us.

    SSB may be long in the tooth, but digital "advantages" are presently not wanted by most hams and should not be forced on them. After they try it on the digital sub bands, maybe this will change.
  9. MW0SBX

    MW0SBX Ham Member QRZ Page

    Personally i think digital voice is the death of the Amateur repeater systems no one in their right mind would spend a fortune on a handheld to access a digital system that no one is on, and i certainly think it would be a rubbish system to go digital on HF and as for digital why the push for digital is all about control they want to know what your doing kind why what, when and where. I'm not buying anything digital I'm sticking with the old stuff.
    KD9ARD, W2THC, SV4NLA and 5 others like this.
  10. N0KEW

    N0KEW Ham Member QRZ Page

    I don’t understand the voice quality argument. Analog sounds like narrowband FM, digital sounds like narrowband, low bitrate digital. This is ham radio not professional broadcast... voice quality is pretty crappy no matter what mode we use.

    I’ve have both Dstar and fusion and fusion sounds like 10% better. Certainly not enough to make it a bragging point imo. The thing that is interesting about digital to me is the stuff that you cannot do on analog. I have been highly critical of fusion over the past few years but it is what it is and some people are using it.
    AA8GK, KA3YAN and VE7DXW like this.

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