Max Legal Power

Discussion in 'Ham Radio Discussions' started by W0DZ, Oct 30, 2002.

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  1. KC5NYO

    KC5NYO Ham Member QRZ Page

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (KQ6IK @ Nov. 01 2002,20<!--emo&amp;[​IMG])</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">I hope not! KD6BNG is only a technician. If he's operating on the HF bands... Well... Not a good thing. I live not far from there. I can drive by and see if I see any antennas but does it really matter?[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    So much for the personal privacy of whoever this poor guy is. Is that why everyone here insists on a posters identity? So they can locate them and &quot;drive by&quot; to check them out? I rest my case.  &lt;sigh&gt;
     
  2. K9STH

    K9STH Platinum Subscriber Volunteer Moderator Platinum Subscriber QRZ Page

    For NYO:

    Does he operate on the bands using a pseudocall? If so, then he is in violation of FCC regulations.

    I definitely think that someone should be willing to identify him/herself on this type of board. If you are operating legally on the air, you have to identify yourself properly. The same protocol should apply on this site. But, as long as the owner allows the practice of pseudonyms, I have no absolute power to make someone properly identify. However, it does bother me!

    Glen, K9STH
     
  3. N0PU

    N0PU Guest

    Anyone want to do a drive-by on me, just call first so I can have a brewski ready for ya...

    Maybe drive-by is a bad term to use... gives me pictures of 37 guys hanging out the windows of a Volkswagen with M-16s at the ready...

    Harry N0PU
     
  4. KC5NYO

    KC5NYO Ham Member QRZ Page

    Glen, this ain't &quot;on the air.&quot; It's &quot;on the Internet.&quot; There is no requirement to identify here. I'd love to stay and hammer it out with ya, but I'm off to work. Besides, we'd only end up agreeing to disagree.   [​IMG]

    73, Mike
    kc5nyo
     
  5. Guest

    Guest Guest

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">
    Actually, it really does matter to know that you are &quot;conversing&quot; with a real person and not with a pseudonym that could be anyone.  I don't care if he has a valid amateur license or not.  But, the fact that he is making out like he does have a license, then he should be willing to post what it is.  If he doesn't, then he needs to admit the fact and carry on from there.
    [/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>


    My point is, that he could easily throw out a callsign and no one here would be the wiser.  In fact, it would placate the wolves and the matter would be dropped.  It seems like a moot point.

    There's many reasons that he doesn't want to post his real callsign.  I'm not jazzed about my personal information being posted on the Internet with my callsign.  It's not that I am afraid to make myself known on QRZ with my opinions, it's the fact that my address is hanging out there, searchable by zipcode, for all with good and bad intentions to use.

    While this is horribly off-topic, I do want to rant about the fact that I think the display of &quot;public&quot; information on the Internet needs to be tempered with the fact that it used to require someone going to the representative government office and presenting themselves to get the information.  While this doesn't really apply to amateur calls, it applies for most other records.  Now, it's searchable online for anyone anonymously and I'm not sure our government officials have thought this one through very well.  Having information like this hanging out on the Internet is a great tool for identity theft.

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">
    Frankly, it is my personal opinion that everyone who posts on this site should use their actual amateur radio call if they have one and their real name if they are not licensed.
    [/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>


    I view these forums as an off-air discussion point to talk about things that would be inappropriate or too spirited to discuss on the air.  If people want to remain anonymous, I see no harm in it.  Obviously you have to walk the fine line between heavy moderation that eschews participation, or the anarchy that has besieged rec.radio.amateur.*  

    As far as Mr. Beers goes though, I really see no need to demand that he cough up his call sign if he doesn't feel the need.  Of course, he does this at the risk of some credibility, and I think he knows that.
     
  6. K9STH

    K9STH Platinum Subscriber Volunteer Moderator Platinum Subscriber QRZ Page

    For NYO:

    I agree that we would probably mainly agree to disagree! I definitely respect your opinion, even if I don't agree with it.

    However, the idea of pseudonyms, anonymous postings, etc., are an outgrowth of the Internet mentality. Basically, no where else has this become an accepted method of communication. In the past, simple manners called for one to identify themselves whenever entering into a conversation if that person was unknown to those already engaged. But, through the Internet, people now can have multiple personalities and be responsible for none of them. This, in turn, can result in flame wars, personal attacks, profanity, and obscenity. Even newspapers and magazines that publish &quot;letters to the editor&quot; that are published as &quot;unsigned&quot; do require a real name and address before they will publish the letter. This places the responsibility for the contents of the letter on the real author.

    Some people claim that their rights of privacy would be compromised if they revealed their true identity. This is balderdash as far as I am concerned. If that person really wanted privacy, then he/she wouldn't be engaged in discussions on the Internet. Some people say that they &quot;fear&quot; that they will be physically accosted if they reveal their true name. The chances of this happening are almost the same as being hit by a meteor. What they really want is to be able to have multiple personalities without being responsible for any of them. By using a pseudonym that person can say anthing that they want to say without any of their friends knowing the source. They can attack at will, yet appearing to be as innocent as &quot;church mice&quot; to their friends and neighbors.

    It is possible to trace these individuals, but it is not usually worth the effort. Think a moment. Most people do not condone jammers, unidentified comments on repeaters (or just on the air in general), people who make profane or obscene comments, and others who just make a nuisance of themselves while not identifying themselves while operating on any amateur band. Well, this is the same, at least in my opinion, on Internet forums where identification is the norm. On those &quot;chat rooms&quot; and other sites that thrive on the anonymous posts, I have no problem at all. That is &quot;normal&quot; thereon and such conduct that comes from this type of posting is quite acceptable on those sites.

    To me the idea of anonymous and pseudonym postings is juvinile. It reeks of &quot;role playing&quot;, like when a group of children play &quot;cops and robbers&quot; or &quot;cowboys and Indians&quot; (yes, I know, such games are no longer &quot;politically correct&quot;, but I am not always &quot;politically correct&quot;!). You &quot;pretend&quot; to be someone else. Then, when the game is finished, you revert to your true identity. In the case of children, no one is hurt. But, when adults do this on the Internet and elsewhere, then there can be trouble.

    I definitely don't think that the type of posting that I am going to describe would happen on QRZ.com, but, unfortunately, there are adults out there who &quot;role play&quot; on chat rooms and forums frequented by children as a child or young-adult with sinister actions in mind. They lure children to meet them with obvious deviant things in mind. The same thing goes for meeting gullible adults. These persons are using pseudonyms to hide their true identity. Of course, I am going to extremes with such examples. But, I think that you get the idea. There are definitely &quot;degrees&quot; of inappropriate conduct, but, black is black and white is white. What is being condoned, even encouraged by some, at one end of the spectrum can result in severe consequences at the other end. Just where does one draw the line? I don't think any two people would agree just where to draw it. To me, the best approach is not to allow pseudonyms at all.

    Again, I only have the power to suggest rules on this site. If I had the power, I definitely would require a true identity (either real call sign or real name) in order to post. This also would require a valid E-Mail address (not one of the &quot;free&quot; sites like yahoo, but one from your ISP) which would be verified. But, since I don't make the rules, only try to enforce them, pseudonyms are allowed on this site. However, as I said in another post on this thread, it really bothers me when someone doesn't truly identify themselves. It makes me think that they have something to hide.

    Boy, this thread has definitely deviated from its original topic!

    Glen, K9STH
     
  7. K9STH

    K9STH Platinum Subscriber Volunteer Moderator Platinum Subscriber QRZ Page

    For NCR:

    If he just &quot;threw out any call sign&quot; this would be immediately verified by any number of people. It would have to be his correct call sign.

    Now, I definitely agree with you about the availability of information on the Internet. It is most certainly a &quot;two edged&quot; sword. As for identity theft: Most of this still happens from sources other than the Internet. Primarily, these days, credit card theft starts with a &quot;not so honest&quot; store clerk who records your credit card information. There have been expose' on TV showing very small readers that read and record all of your credit card information that quite a number of clerks are using. Every night after work, this information (hundred of cards having been possibly read at a busy store) is delivered to those who then duplicate the information for bogus cards. The clerk who provided the information is paid very well for his/her efforts. Then, the next day, they do it all over again.

    Then, there are those people who either check your mailbox or your trash for any information about your financial dealings. It depends on the location of your office or residence, but the trash is easier to get to and obtain the information in most cases. This is why my wife shreds everything that goes into our trash that has any account numbers or other financial information on it. Of course, a potential thief could tape the shreds back together. But, it is much more easy to just go to the house next door or across the alley where they don't shred the information. The chances of someone coming down our alley and checking for this information is slim, but it definitely could happen. Besides, the shredder cost less than $20 on sale several years ago and it makes my wife feel much safer.

    Then there have been several large credit card theft rings that involved employees of the credit card companies themselves. Those people have access to millions of records and have had several thousand cards duplicated at a time, but being sent to addresses like &quot;drop boxes&quot; at the mailbox places instead of being mailed to the correct address.

    For decades, if a person wanted to acquire a total identity the procedure has been to vist some local cemeteries and look for the graves of those who died as infants or as a small child (usually under age 5) who's date of birth was very close to theirs. Then it is usually pretty easy to obtain a birth certificate from the county and things &quot;take off&quot; from there.

    It is relatively easy to obtain all sorts of information about anyone due to the &quot;freedom of information&quot; acts that have been enacted by both Federal and state goverments. Bascially, virtually any information about you in any official documents are &quot;fair game&quot;. This includes your property tax, your driver's license, your automobile license, any professional license, your marraige license, even your birth certificate. To get an &quot;official&quot; copy you have to go to the particular office involved. But, there are definitely people out there who will forge any document that you want, using the information that you provide, for a &quot;fee&quot;. Also, with the computer programs available these days, many people can create these &quot;official&quot; documents without any outside help.

    Now, for the &quot;stupid thief trick&quot;: Someone tried to pass a forged cheque on my account at my bank (which was an independent bank at the time with only one small branch away from the main bank) at the drive through when I was sitting in the bank vice-president's office! This person who was pretending to me just happened to be black and the teller at the drive-through did know me. She tried to stall the person long enough to get the police there. But, the person decided that discretion was better than valor and drove off about 30 seconds before the police arrived. Since the bank was only 2 blocks from a freeway entrance, they did get away.

    Again, I definitely think that providing one's true identity is, at the very least, good manners. But, I can't control the actions of others and I definitely don't lose any sleep over it!

    Glen, K9STH
     
  8. K6UEY

    K6UEY Ham Member QRZ Page

    Not to continously beat a dead horse but, I think if one is so concerned for their privacy why would they want to comprimise it by posting on of all places an Internet Forum ?? IMHO there are only 1 of 2 identities,the first being your issued Ham Call sign (it is a Ham Forum ) or your first given name if you havent got a call yet. All other names are treated as typical phoney internut names.That goes for the evaluation of the material in the posting,I place more value on comments from some one who has been there and done that,than on the ramblings of a shouda,coulda,woulda........    73, ORV

    ENJOY!!! Life is too short for QRP.......
     
  9. W8FAX

    W8FAX Ham Member QRZ Page

    Glen sez...However, the idea of pseudonyms, anonymous postings, etc., are an outgrowth of the Internet mentality.  

    Is this like &quot;handle&quot;?? i.e. &quot;Hey GOOD buddy, whats yer HANDLE?&quot;

    NOT to be confused or mistaken for a call sign?[​IMG]???   
     
  10. Guest

    Guest Guest

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">
    Oh, the &quot;credibility&quot; card is drawn again.
    [/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>

    Oh give it a rest.  You're hard pressed not to agree that a fair percentage of the participants on QRZ view posts with monikers and not callsigns as trolls-in-training.  

    As I said before, I do not care and in fact, if you read my posts carefully, tried to put the issue to bed.  Seems to me you enjoy the attention it draws; so have at it.

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">
    I have learned over and over that the ONLY way to make sure that people are focused on the message instead of the messenger, is if the messenger is anonymous.

    Ideas speak for themselves, and I really don't want to hear from people who color the ideas with their prejudicial notions about the messenger who presents them.
    [/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>


    Would you be offended if I rolled my eyes right now?


    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">
    As it happens, I'm a relatively well-known ham, with plenty of publication credits and lots out there on the web attributed to me, generally favourably.  One of the reasons to post anonymously on here is specifically so that I can tell if my ideas are well-considered.  If I used my callsign, I'd never know if it was my idea, or simply my identity, that got people to agree with me.
    [/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>

    Well, good luck.


    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">
    The issue of privacy may be a valid one, but the ham callsign database has been public as long as I can remember.  The web merely makes the search easier.  Before, you had to pick up the phone and call the FCC, but they were willing to give you the info.
    [/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>

    Even then, it was available in callbook format.  I'm not so much against it being being in the callbooks.  Funny how counties will eagerly post the records of property registrations, but they'll eschew against posting court records online for fear of lawsuits.
     
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