Loop On Ground Antenna

Discussion in 'Amateur Radio News' started by KD5W, Jul 18, 2021.

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  1. N1IPU

    N1IPU Ham Member QRZ Page

    I guess if you cannot get wire in the air . I loaded up an abandoned rail line and it played pretty well but it was a few miles long.
     
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  2. W1YW

    W1YW Ham Member QRZ Page

    Correct.

    Why are we celebrating poorly performing antennas?
     
    M1WML and W2TH like this.
  3. WN1MB

    WN1MB Ham Member QRZ Page

    I see discussion; not celebration.
     
    GM4JPZ, M1WML, AA4MB and 1 other person like this.
  4. W5CJA

    W5CJA Ham Member QRZ Page

    Sometimes, you do the best with the budget, housing and other restraints within which you operate.
     
    W2CPD, M1WML, W8LGZ and 4 others like this.
  5. WA7ARK

    WA7ARK Ham Member QRZ Page

    I really, really doubt that a LOG has a better receive SNR than any above-ground horizontal wire antenna. The physics just does not support it.

    Now it is possible that when comparing SNR by switching between two receiving antennas, the coax feedlines from the receiver to the respective antennas have a different degree of suppression of Common-Mode currents on the feedlines. Since it is CM current on the coax shield that likely conducts RFI from your house's electrical wiring to the antenna feedpoint, the antenna with the higher degree of CM suppression on its feedline will appear to have a better SNR.
     
    KR3DX, M1WML, KA0HCP and 1 other person like this.
  6. W1YW

    W1YW Ham Member QRZ Page

    Physics first--then cost.

    I disagree: this is a poor antenna (when viewed electromagnetically) and as such should not be considered. An antenna resting above a mediocre ground has a substantial transmission line effect, which means it phase cancels substantially in the far field.

    Simply stated, your loop, on the (mediocre) ground, excites an out of phase RF current (from the ground) and the two add up to close to zero.

    It hears very little as a result.

    I have seen the many claims of 'buried' (or resting) antennas thru the years. On the rare occison that they work, it is a function of the ground characteristics and conductivity, not resting on the ground as placement. IOW, on some grounds it may work in a mediocre fashion, on others it will work poorly.

    Now there are interesting studies showing if you rest an antenna on a glacier (ice) it works. Sure, somewhat: pure ice is a dielectric and not (per se) 'ground conductive'.

    A wire running across the room--and off the floor-- likely has better performance and would be cheaper than a loop on grass.

    73
    Chip W1YW
     
    Last edited: Jul 21, 2021
    KR3DX, M1WML, UT7UX and 1 other person like this.
  7. W9RAC

    W9RAC Platinum Subscriber Platinum Subscriber QRZ Page

    I have worked quite a few dipoles, loops, and more that have been located low with poor results on their receiving end. Also same goes for attic antennas I have conversed with. Now if the situation only provides for this Id take it over nothing. 73 Rich
     
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  8. WN1MB

    WN1MB Ham Member QRZ Page

    ...yet be in much closer proximity to a plethora of modern day noise generators.
     
  9. K0UO

    K0UO Platinum Subscriber Platinum Subscriber QRZ Page

    The problem is they don't have anything to compare to. So it is kinda like people that think their 40 meter mobile antenna is working great, then they put a real antenna on it and signals are up 3 S units, wow 18DB of loss on the first antenna. HI
     
    KR3DX and W1YW like this.
  10. KD5W

    KD5W Ham Member QRZ Page


    We're not. I'm having fun and experimenting while documenting for others to see. Now does anyone know how to connect spaghetti noodles together haha
     
    KE6MAK, M1WML and WN1MB like this.

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