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HF Doppler RADAR Signal Examination

Discussion in 'Amateur Radio News' started by KA0KA, Feb 4, 2019.

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  1. N1SZ

    N1SZ QRZ Lifetime Member #233 Platinum Subscriber Life Member QRZ Page

    Tyler,

    As a note, the radar that is the subject of your first video is the CMOR - Canadian Meteor Orbit Radar operated by the University of Western Ontario. It uses a 5 receive site phase interferometer for geo-locating meteors. You can learn more about the radar here: http://meteor.uwo.ca/research/radar/cmor_basics.html

    73,

    Jim, N1SZ
     
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2019
    KA0KA and WA1ZMS like this.
  2. W2MYA

    W2MYA Ham Member QRZ Page

    Chip:Most of us who have been around for some number of years do certainly remember that
    damned "Woodpecker". do you happen to know what physical area of the Soviet Union
    it originated? ( City & Province etc. ) As you remember they denied that anything was going
    on! Even after the band went to bed here in New Jersey it could still be heard fairly strong.
    Thanks for the information. Greg Mitchell W2MYA
    West Caldwell, N.J.
     
  3. W1YW

    W1YW Ham Member QRZ Page

    Hi Greg,

    The Woodpecker (Duga) was in the Ukraine. It was one of three planned bistatic high powered radars, in which the OTHR aspect was designed to target and correct , in a conjugate fashion, for the propagation factors, essentially tailoring the waveform for a lens-like action at the target. Its true purpose was to act as a high powered artificial electromagnetic pulse weapon that could zap electronics , especially (but not only)on missiles. Although the EMP was artificial and a lot less than the Compton component seen with nuclear weapon EMP, it, in principle was a dangerous asymmetric warfare device.

    The Chernobyl nuclear power plant complex was specifically built to power the Duga TX system. Not to provide power for the towns built to house the Duga personnel. The Duga was about 50 km from the power plants. I could be wrong on the distance--likely closer.

    Aurora f***** the Duga something awful and they did not successfully have the ability to do real-time waveform corrections to deal with it. IOW, the 'lensed' waveform was underpowered in most practical scenarios. I am not aware of any US device shut down by the Duga.

    Ooops!

    It was more than 'early warning'... it was 'real-time kill'.

    Basically the 'search' OTHR mode of the Duga is what we heard and what annoyed us. The 'kill' mode---no one talks about it over in that part of the world. Would you?:)

    Some people speculate it was meant to fry brains. That's silly.

    Hope that helps. Its time the truth was more widely known.

    73
    Chip W1YW
     
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2019
    KA0HCP and N1SZ like this.
  4. W1YW

    W1YW Ham Member QRZ Page

    I found this on the web: a view of the Chernobyl power plant from one of the cage antennas on Duga -3.

    [​IMG]
     
  5. W8AAZ

    W8AAZ Ham Member QRZ Page

    I used to think those sounders were jerks swishing their VFOs or something till I got one of the new rigs with the spectral display. Then I puzzled out what they were.
     
  6. W1YW

    W1YW Ham Member QRZ Page

    Dang! Looks like the Russians censored it:)!

    You can easily find it with a search.
     
  7. KA0KA

    KA0KA Ham Member QRZ Page

    Jim- This is FANTASIC and one reason I am so happy to be able to share these videos. As you can imagine, trying to find info on the majority of the signals is nearly IMPOSSIBLE and why there was no 'ID' on the video, just 'technically' what the signature was...
    I will add this to the description of the video and title accordingly when I find out more!!! I am finishing up a 100kC CODAR in the 11-14MHz range video now, should be posting shortly, then on to the strange OTH RADARs again, hard to ID. Thanks again for the ID of the Doppler too much appreciated!!!
    I did reach out to the founder of the RADAR system, I will ask him again specifically as well. All documents so far said they were CODAR?!?. I hope to stay in touch with you, maybe you can offer assistance in IDing some very odd signals I can find zero info on...
    Thanks so much!
     
    Last edited: Feb 6, 2019
  8. KA0KA

    KA0KA Ham Member QRZ Page

    I have a video of what I believe to be the new Woodpecker and it is from 9 to 19 MHz and fairly narrow, only 14 to 20kC. Still no idea what the FMCW and FMOP OTH signatures are both were 50kC and very low around 5,6,7 MHz I have not made the final edits on these videos yet, so any ideas I am open...
     
    W1YW likes this.
  9. KA0KA

    KA0KA Ham Member QRZ Page

    Thanks Chip, ya having the ability to make these videos to share I think helps everyone who is interested in such things. But as you can see here anyway, it is like a focused 'beam' of interest!!!
    Thanks again for you support, I had not really planned on publishing any of these on QRZ, but glad I did for this video anyway.
    ~Tyler
     
    W1YW likes this.
  10. KA0KA

    KA0KA Ham Member QRZ Page

    Both CODAR videos are posted, demonstrating the 25kHz and 100kHz long range and mid range sweeps, the 25kHz video has a nice CW 25kHz square wave IDer at the end, really great to capture that...
    I will be posting more on the main channel for review as well. https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCOPyqu-ly3yAWd5BQn2Sojg


     
  11. N1SZ

    N1SZ QRZ Lifetime Member #233 Platinum Subscriber Life Member QRZ Page

    Tyler,

    Glad to help.

    73,
    Jim, N1SZ
     
    KA0KA likes this.
  12. KX0DW

    KX0DW QRZ Lifetime Member #212 Platinum Subscriber Life Member QRZ Page



    You mislabeled a US Navy ROTHR as a Long-Range CODAR (video now taken down). So, you did provide an an ID there, albeit an incorrect one.

    The "doppler radar" on 17.450 (along with two other frequencies which it is active on) can be found by simply doing a google search. Again, a basic mistake.

    The CW ID in your new long-range CODAR video is easily decoded and can be looked up to identify the power levels and locations (hint: it is 40w, not 80w).

    There actually is a LOT of information available out there if you expand your horizons beyond the amateur radio community. Google searches can be surprisingly productive if you approach them without a presumption of knowledge. My suggestion would be that if you're going to try and build an audience based upon your expertise, you at least get the little things right.
     
    WA1ZMS likes this.
  13. W1YW

    W1YW Ham Member QRZ Page

    Of course, this too is helpful.

    IMO, the rank and file reading this news piece will not have understood the full capabilities of a decent SDR radio in capturing these waveforms. ID'ing them and discussing their type is critical, and Tyler is one of the few to get the ball rolling publicly on this.

    IOW I imagine he and others are grateful for all the corrections and info on who the TX's are, and what waveforms they use.

    73
    Chip W1YW
     
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  14. KX0DW

    KX0DW QRZ Lifetime Member #212 Platinum Subscriber Life Member QRZ Page

    Yes, of course, Chip. And it is easy to forgive mistakes on the really hard stuff if you get the simple stuff right.

    To give Tyler some credit (I'm not all critical), he is using his ANAN to look both in and out of the amateur bands: something too few amateurs do,. The increasing use of panadapters opens up the possibility of erroneous speculation and misinformation for those who fail to understand what is going on outside of the 4.5MHz +/- of spectrum our hobby enjoys on HF. The more you look outside of the amateur bands, the more you realize that the amateur bands are downright "simple" compared to some of the things going on.
     
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  15. WA1ZMS

    WA1ZMS Ham Member QRZ Page

    After reading the comments…we need to get W1YW, N1SZ, K3DCW, WC2XQG & Google to make the videos!
     

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