I've been reading some comments. I am not a regular to reply to such, but I'll bite today. "I'm not into just filling logbooks and I don't enjoy this because that seems to be what is going on here." My Reply: I am into filling logbooks and if I wanted a conversation, I'd be on phone. "But having two computers slam at each other in almost full automation for hours on end until the log book fills is just not amateur radio - it's logbook automation." This person has not spent time with FT-8 and it's obvious. If you have spent time with FT-8, you will notice that a) it isn't fully automated b) there is a distinct technique to getting a station to here you (running split, alternating your TX freq to they will more than likely see you, etc), c) FT-8 can be run in a near automated mode, but there is still a lot of attention a person must give to be successful. "We are here to have fun with ham radio. Contesting is not fun for us" Just go away. Do something else you enjoy in this amazing hobby and leave others alone. I don't enjoy rag chewing on a HT, but others find great joy in that and I would never criticize it. "As far as we are concerned, it (contesting) serves no useful purpose. So, we don't participate" Our EMComm Association uses contesting to practice for setup and breakdown of Field Days and in the field operating. It keeps us sharp and it also keeps us familiar with one another to the point where we know what each other need in the field when we need it and we know how to assist one another. Contesting is good practice.