Can AM mode be used on the ham bands (Region 1)?

Discussion in 'Amplitude Modulation' started by SV3ORA, Mar 7, 2021.

ad: L-HROutlet
ad: l-rl
ad: L-Geochron
ad: MessiPaoloni-1
ad: abrind-2
ad: L-MFJ
ad: Left-3
ad: HRDLLC-2
ad: Left-2
  1. MM0LQF

    MM0LQF Premium Subscriber QRZ Page

    > I would say that this is extremely unlikely.

    My understanding was that the US, for example, does enforce mode restrictions within the bands, in their licence conditions. Whether they of course enforce it in practice is another matter.
  2. G8FXC

    G8FXC XML Subscriber QRZ Page

    Indeed - I see no evidence that any of the first world regulators ever tune below 100MHz unless there is a complaint that they cannot ignore. They will protect VHF and above because it is saleable spectrum and brings in revenue. You could not give away HF spectrum these days, so it is of no interest to them.

  3. SM0AOM

    SM0AOM Ham Member QRZ Page

    Heard from German colleagues during the 80s that
    their SIGINT services, both civilian and military, frequently used the amateur bands as "training grounds" for the operators.

    Infractions of any nature, such as out-of-band, excessive bandwidth, bad signals or operating procedure such as failure to identify properly were collected and sent to the Bundespost for processing and disciplinary action.

    But today the risk of anyone, even in Germany, to be reported to the Authorities for licence condition infractions of almost any kind is very remote. The regulators have completely lost interest.

    Last edited: Mar 11, 2021
  4. G0GSR

    G0GSR Ham Member QRZ Page

    I'm sure that this is true of most/all countries.
    Certainly, in the UK, the main purpose of OFCOM is to maximise revenue from the radio spectrum.
    They have no interest in what goes on within our Amateur bands and it is in our interest NOT to involve them unnecessarily in our affairs.

  5. SM0AOM

    SM0AOM Ham Member QRZ Page

    You certainly have a very good "point" here.
    Man-power at the regulators has become scarce and expensive.

    The Swedish regulators have repeatedly stated that they take absolutely no notice of what is going on inside the band-limits.

    Complaints regarding any interference between or bad behaviour of other radio amateurs will go straight into the "round file".

    They provide a "standard reply" that in essence says:
    "You are licence-exempt, offer no benefit for society and pay no fees. So please shut-up and sort out any problems among yourself".

    Continuing to complain will only worsen the already bad relationship between amateur radio and the regulator.

  6. K4KYV

    K4KYV Premium Subscriber Volunteer Moderator QRZ Page

    Does anyone know how much input the German authorities had from their amateur community to impose a bandwidth limit that precludes AM?
  7. W2VW

    W2VW Ham Member QRZ Page

    Last Germans I heard on AM were on ten meters having a lot of fun during Oktoberfest.

    Late 80s.

    Music and alcohol were involved.

    Shortly after that Arno DL6SX disappeared from 10 meter AM after a lot of great activity there.
  8. K5UJ

    K5UJ Ham Member QRZ Page

    That might have been legal. In the tables on the previous page, which were provided by SM0AOM, a footnote number 4 exists for 10 meters, but SM0AOM did not provide the detail for the bandwidth referenced by note number 4.
  9. K4KYV

    K4KYV Premium Subscriber Volunteer Moderator QRZ Page

    German hams before the war never had a lot of opportunity to operate AM; I read somewhere that under the 3rd Reich hams were mostly limited to low-power CW and that a special licence was required for phone privileges, no doubt limited to a few loyal party members. Then following the war until 1990 a large part of the country made up the GDR. Laws and regulations in Germany have historically been top-down, as opposed to bottom-up. Not surprising that amateur privileges might be more restrictive than elsewhere in Europe.

    German bandwidth regulations may well have been first inspired by Docket 20777 in the US, which had essentially proposed exactly the same thing, and they may not have had a staunchly pro-AM segment in their amateur community to object to it like we had here... Johnny Johnston's wet dream!
    K5UJ likes this.
  10. SM0AOM

    SM0AOM Ham Member QRZ Page

    The note (4) in the German regulations simply states 7 kHz as the bandwidth limit for 1om.

    My memory is slightly "fuzzy" regarding the origins of the German limits, but I believe that they are from early/mid 1990s.

    At this time the DARC was very active in IARU Region 1 matters, and also had some influence at the German government level, mostly due to having quite competent amateurs professionally connected to the Oberpostdirektion in Bonn and Darmstadt as members of high-level working parties.

    Examples were Dr:s Damboldt and Malina who I learned to know in the ITU during the late 80s, and they did not have very warm feelings about AM, which they considered a waste of band-space and outdated.

    The DARC and the German Authorities expected amateur radio to be progressive and forward-looking, and AM did not fit into these expectations. AM:ers were mostly seen as "old geezers loving the sound of their own voices".

    Regarding 'phone privileges in Europe, it was representative of post-WW2 regulations to require an "apprentice year" of low-power Morse only operations for new licences. After showing sufficient interest and determination to continue, they were allowed full privileges, including 'phone, sometimes after an additional examination.

    Pre-WW2 amateur radio in Europe was a very small demographics group, primarily composed of the "educated classes".
    The membership roster of the pre-war Swedish national society had ranks and titles listed, and about 80% of the 1935 amateurs had some form of higher education or were students on Grammar School or University levels. In short, pre-war radio amateurs were an elite.

    It took quite long after WW2 to abandon the practice of being "Mister" with each other, and some people even used titles or military ranks while addressing each other "on the air".

    I have not seen any reliable statistics about the numbers between 'phone and Morse operators for the rest of Europe, but about 60 of the 400 1939 Swedish amateurs regularly operated 'phone and I believe that this was representative of most European countries in the 1930s.

    'Phone operations were long frowned upon, and were not considered "real amateur radio" by quite many. During 1938 and 1939, a debate raged in the pages of the society journal about "bad habits" of 'phone operators, and some advocated the banning of 'phone altogether or relegating it to the parts shared with broadcasting of 40m.

    1930s Germany might have been a special case for many reasons. German regulators (as well as the Soviet) firmly believed in the educational aspects of amateur radio, with Morse training as the prime objective. Second came the electronics and radio training.

    For unknown reasons, this was not carried over in the later war-time treatment of radio amateurs by the Wehrmacht personnel offices, which sent them off to die on the Eastern front without recognising their potential contributions as radio operators, technicians or trainers.

    Due to the rearmament, radio parts were scarce and expensive for the general public, and 'phone transmitters in the hands of private experimenters were seen as a waste of resources and also something that delayed the improvement of the Morse knowledge.

    The actual state of 'phone amateur operations in
    Third Reich Germany is somewhat unclear, there are statements that
    "Telephonie war in Deutschland grundsätzlich verboten!",
    but there also were scattered reports of pre-WW2 D4 'phone operations.

    Party membership was not a prerequisite for getting an amateur licence, but it usually speeded things up considerably.

    Also considering the cost of a 'phone transmitter
    it meant that you needed an income level which mostly was linked to being a member of the "educated classes", such as academics, higher officials or businessmen, which often became Party members for career reasons.


Share This Page