Buyer wants full "partial" refund and...

Discussion in 'Swapmeet Talk' started by KL5A, Jan 25, 2018.

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  1. NO2Y

    NO2Y Ham Member QRZ Page

    The point is that he had recourse he chose not to follow. That is why he lost his radio.

    I love how you're trying to somehow blame me for things now for some reason... I'm waiting for you to start with your conspiracy theory that I work for paypal again.

    Last edited: Apr 16, 2018
  2. K7JOE

    K7JOE Ham Member QRZ Page

    I have the same issue with John Sickle, KT5OT. Sold him 2 perfectly working sensors and he is claiming they dont work and wants $50 (half the price) back.

    If they were legitimately damaged, any "normal" person would simply send the items back for a full refund.

    this guy is rotten apples. Avoid KT5OT, fort smith arkansas.
    KX4IK and KL5A like this.
  3. WB9YTG

    WB9YTG Ham Member QRZ Page

    One of the downsides to using PayPal is that they will always favor the buyer. As long as there is proof of return they will issue a refund. Good thing? Bad thing? Depends.

    On the whole, I’ve done ok with eBay/PayPal. For me, it’s a hobby.
  4. KJ7WT

    KJ7WT Premium Subscriber QRZ Page

    Sad to hear how so many seem to be unable to treat others with honesty. When I was laid off from my engineering position of 33 years back in 2015 (we were acquired by a competitor), the new owners did not want to support one of our product lines, so I got word out that I would repair those products as a sideline to my consulting/contract work. The very first person who sent in a product for repair stiffed me on the repair cost. I made the mistake of assuming honesty, and sent his part back before receiving payment. I told him that PayPal would be a good way to pay, but he claimed that he couldn't figure out how to set up an account, even after I offered to "walk" him through it. He then said that he would send a check, which never arrived, although he claimed very strongly that it had. At that point, I decided to chalk it up to experience, and developed a rule that has worked well for me - when PayPal shows funds transferred, I ship the product. If the customer wants to send a check, I wait until the check clears. Three years later, with one exception, all have paid with PayPal, and I have had no problems. One thing I also have done in some cases is make a video of the repaired product operating on the bench, which I then email to the customer. This helps avoid the "it didn't work" claim. My purchases on eBay and have used PayPal without problems. I suppose it's like the reviews on various websites. You can always count on a one-star rating that goes something like, "This is a total piece of junk! Don't waste your money buying this!", and the next one will be a five-star, "I loved this product! It is perfect for my needs!". There will always be problems with any system, I suppose.
  5. KL5A

    KL5A Ham Member QRZ Page

    he must have figured out that asking for a full refund was too much so he'll go for half, and if you tell him to send them back as I think you should (but hey that's just me) maybe he won't keep up this nonsense.

    To clarify, as someone else was confused-I got the TS 50 back, repaired the encoder and sold it off again to a guy who was happy to have it.

    Negotiating after the fact is a loser for us, I don't do it.
  6. K7JOE

    K7JOE Ham Member QRZ Page

    I've asked paypal to have him send the item sent back to me and I'll gladly give a full refund.

    This "half refund coz it doesn't work" - calling bullshit on that. Who the heck does that...unless you're trying to cheat someone and keep a good unit.

    I always 'micro dot' the circuit boards for stuff like this, so lets see if they're swapped. ..assuming I get them back shortly.

    When dealing with John Sickles, KT5OT, Ham Radio Parts from Fort Smith Arkansas. Buyer and Seller beware.
    Last edited: May 1, 2018
  7. N7TIN

    N7TIN Ham Member QRZ Page

    For about 10 years back in the 1990s I operated a business that sold new commercially manufactured products to hams thru the hamfest circuit (Comet, Diamond, Maxrad etc). In that time I dealt with many thousands of transactions and 99.99% of them went perfectly with the odd transaction every once in a while that you tend to remember...

    I once spent about ten minutes with an older W7, a farmer who jumped off his tractor during harvest season just in time to make the closing minutes of the hamfest. He selected a fixed station 2m/70cm vertical (about $170?) then reached into his pocket for his checkbook. He left it at home. No problem I say, take the antenna and my business card, send me a check when you get home. His eyes filled with tears but eventually stammered out a "thanks". The check was postmarked that same day.

    Another time a teenage ham bought a mobile antenna, took it out to his vehicle, "tested it" and then claimed that the antenna was defective....shorted. I asked how he knew it was shorted and showed me how he checked it with a DVM. I explained that the meter *should* indicate a short the way he was checking it due to how the matching coil was tapped, that I had sold hundreds of the antenna with no issues. He installed it, it worked perfectly, he came back to my booth and apologized for "bad mouthing you to everyone in the parking lot" . Then he came around the booth again and apologized again. Then he came back yet again and bought two more identical antennas and apologized for the third time for his comments about me he made in the parking lot!

    I think most hams value their reputation and behave accordingly. So many of us older hams have decades of positive experiences with "fellow hams, behaving accordingly" and that experience tends to make us more trusting than is prudent in this day and age where even full-motion video can be convincingly faked (e.g. Deep Fakes etc).

    The moderators here have done some prudent things to lower risk and those efforts should be cheerfully supported. But we can also do things ourselves that reduce risk.

    One way is to try to verify that the person you are dealing with owns the identity that they are asserting. Why? Because one common fraud method is for the bad guys to take over an eBay or Amazon seller account with great feedback then impersonate the trustworthy person.

    Another risk reduction method is to make a contact with the seller at a verifiable work phone number. E.g sellers says he works for XYZ Company, find the number for the XYZ Company and call the seller there during the work day.
    Last edited: May 17, 2018
  8. KL5A

    KL5A Ham Member QRZ Page

    I'm curious, you did get them back, were they microdotted?
  9. K7JOE

    K7JOE Ham Member QRZ Page

    They were received back not working and parts swapped. The micro-dots were not on the sensors received. Paypal refunded him the money he asked for too. So I lose $50 and have 2 broken parts-swapped items. Same Modus Operandi as above. He knows how to game the system and wont stop til Paypal stops him.

    Think about it. You buy something receive it and it does not work.

    What do you do? OF course, You immediately contact the seller and ask for all of your money back, right ? That's what normal people do. And as a seller, I'd immediately ask for the parts back and send you a full and complete refund.

    Why would this guy buy something have it be defective and then ask for "half the refund but let me keep the broken parts" ? Who keeps broken parts ? For what purpose on a low dollar, non-easily repaired item ?

    He wants half his money back as a minimum, and then the ability to keep my good parts - turning his "broken" parts into "good parts" by parts swapping to sell along (that's his business) for a larger profit.

    The items that were sold to him came back as damaged/broken - they were not the same internals that were sent - he knew it - he tried to pull a fast one (parts swapped AND got some of his money back).

    Aside the microdots, one of the sensor SO238 connectors was un-soldered from the internal coax line when it came back, a probable sign of part swapping (he forgot to solder up that connection....when he swapped a good board for a bad sensor board)

    I've got 2 junk parts back and I'm also out $50 bucks.

    Bad news -- what an @5540l3
  10. KD8DEY

    KD8DEY Ham Member QRZ Page

    I wonder if you could file in small claims, Then when nobody shows to represent PayPal, get a default judgement...
    Then when they don't pay, File a lean against their property....
    See how Fast they respond when the powers that be lock them out of their offices...I have heard of it happening to a bank..

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