Blasted HoA CC&Rs

Discussion in 'Antennas, Feedlines, Towers & Rotors' started by K3RW, Mar 21, 2016.

ad: L-HROutlet
ad: l-rl
ad: Left-2
ad: Subscribe
ad: abrind-2
ad: QSOToday-1
ad: L-MFJ
ad: Left-3
  1. K3RW

    K3RW Ham Member QRZ Page

    Basically, another thread about how to work around CC&Rs--if you have any ideas.

    No sooner that I acquired a Hustler 6BTV vertical then we look to move to a new subdivision and I get the CC&R docs from it. Current setup was a long end-fed that I used for 160 on down, and a 80-10m trap dipole. Now radio silent in this apartment for the time being but will change that soon. I really enjoyed DXing on 40, 20 and the WARC bands.

    My reading of it is--you can't do anything--no antennas, etc.

    I'm going to do something within the ability that I have--whether it be a stealth dipole in the attic, a dipole just under a non-metal gutter, use a wire end-fed as a stealth vertical, spiral dipole, mag loop, etc. But I'm not happy as you can imagine. A problem that many are having.

    Not looking for legal advice, but perhaps some reasonable workarounds. The 'antenna' narrative is short.

    I was thinking I could somehow disguise the vertical as a flagpole and still use it--if that's how you read the 'flagpole' narrative. Gives no guidance on the particular limitations--front or backyard, height, etc., except it sounds like To Be Determined. So I won't know on that one for a long time. I should just fly a white 'surrender' flag or a Soviet flag to express my displeasure.

    160 is probably out unless I go NVIS around the backyard fence about 6-7' off the ground--definitely not DXing that way. Dipole 40-10 might fit in the attic or top of the roofline somehow but wouldn't be very straight that way. Run an end-fed over the roof and down both sides of the house like a mod'ed inverted V. A screwdriver vertical would work but basically forget DXing I'm thinking. Mag loops seem doable but are very spendy and I'd need a spendy tuner for them. I guess I'll be heading to the hills and rolling mobile--tossing out a dipole in the hilltops, until I find a better solution. RF limits with kids bedrooms upstairs and me being amp-happy on RTTY will be an issue.

    I won't have a neighbor to the back, which will give East-West orientation to any dipole, etc. The short sides of the house are North-South but probably too short for anything except 6-20, if that.


    Attached Files:

    • 1a.jpg
      File size:
      13.5 KB
    • 1b.jpg
      File size:
      36.2 KB
    Last edited: Mar 21, 2016
  2. W1VT

    W1VT Ham Member QRZ Page

  3. N0TZU

    N0TZU Platinum Subscriber Platinum Subscriber QRZ Page

    Some additional info would help.

    Are the rules enforced? Any other non TV antennas visible in the neighborhood? Any TV antennas or dishes?

    What is the property like - any trees, vegetation that could hide antennas and act as supports?

    What is the house construction - wood frame, brick, or stucco?

    What is the roof material? Hopefully not metal.

    Do you want to do HF only or also VHF or higher?
  4. K3RW

    K3RW Ham Member QRZ Page

    Its not finished being built so I don't know.about how active the board is on enforcement.

    I don't see any satellite dishes or TV antennas when I drive around.

    House is a two-story wood exterior with an asphalt shingle roof. I havent seen inside a roof to see if there is metal in it.

    Not one tree or plant anywhere. Typical of the slash and burn construction here, unfortunately.

    I like to work all HF though I'm looking ahead at satellites, VHF/UHF/SHF and ATV. I like 160 when its open but usually work 40 on down. Especially WARC ones.
  5. WA4SIX

    WA4SIX Ham Member QRZ Page

    I think, by federal decree, you can have a Dish antenna. The Small Transmitting Loops are really good. Yeah, they are small, but the difference between a low 80M dipole & an STL is neglidgable.

  6. AF7ON

    AF7ON Ham Member QRZ Page

    My HOA restrictions are pretty much the same as yours. My fixed antennas are currently a 3-foot MFJ loop that I painted Dish Network grey and a 6-meter 3-element beam in place of my old TV antenna. I deploy a portable doublet on a 40' push-up fiberglass mast from time-to time. (The HOA says that antennas may not be "erected" - a general interpretation that this has to be a fixed installation). So far no problems.

    My other solution is to take my camper van out at weekends into remote sites and deploy wire antennas. The bonus there is I can go to electrically quiet sites and get away from all the RFI.

    Don't despair - you can still have plenty of fun. In my case, working around the restrictions has been part of the challenge!

    K3RW, KM4OYP and AK5B like this.
  7. WB5YUZ

    WB5YUZ Ham Member QRZ Page

    I don't have this problem yet, but as an Elderly American, who will probably someday be forced off the farm into a subdivision, I have given it a bit of thought. This is my favorite solution so far.

    Steve, WB2BIK, pointed out in a different thread the other day that frequently raising and lowering an antenna can draw attention, something I hadn't thought about.

    Even so, I don't think most HOAs can do anything about something that is sometimes there and sometimes not. It's like the dogcatchers who concentrate on taking friendly family pets and ignore animals that are real threats to safety until someone forces their hand; the neighbor who insists on his right to paint his house paisley or let his lawn go uncut is a much easier target than someone whose violation is sometimes there and sometimes not.

    (And, such a dipole on a tall mast will almost certainly work better than a low attic dip0le or end-fed wire.)

    Don't do that!

    In fact, you want to take the opposite approach. Only fly flags which will not draw attention! Make sure everything else on your property complies with the HOA restrictions.

    Always be smiling and co-operative in all your interactions with the HOA. This sometimes makes them feel bad about bothering you and can help make them give up. Of course, it depends on the individuals involved; be prepared to change you tactics accordingly.

    Above all else, don't try to argue with them if they are lawyers (and, many HOA activists are).
    KM4OYP and AK5B like this.
  8. VE3DXK

    VE3DXK XML Subscriber QRZ Page

    Here's your opportunity - become a board member and you'll have your say...
    K3RW likes this.
  9. N0TZU

    N0TZU Platinum Subscriber Platinum Subscriber QRZ Page

    Your situation is very similar to what I had once at a new two story house with severe restrictions. It's good that the house construction is more or less transparent for RF.

    I made a multiband fan dipole in the attic for 40m and my favorite bands above that. I had to use a weird zigzag shape because there wasn't enough length in a straight line in the attic. I also had VHF/UHF antennas there. It worked reasonably well, and I used a manual tuner at the radio end for bands it wasn't cut for. It takes a lot of time in the attic (fiberglass sucks!) to get the antenna setup and tuned, so I recommend using plywood to make some catwalks on top of the rafters.

    The biggest issues were noise level from electronics in the house and RFI to the wired phones and the security system. It took a lot of time and ferrite beads to get that down to acceptable levels. Today a lot of folks don't used wired phones, so that may not be a concern for you. If you can, run the antenna at right angles to any power lines or phone / TV cables to reduce coupling. That is often impossible though.

    Another option is a full wave horizontal loop, either around the perimeter of the attic, or just under the eaves. They are reasonant on even harmonics and a tuner can be used (with some loss) on the rest. The exact shape is not important as long as the loop is as open as possible without narrow sections. Depending on the size of your house you can probably get a 40m loop installed. You could also use the loop as a top hat and drive both sides of the coax against ground for 80m or possibly even 160m if you can get even a few ground "radials" installed anywhere. Even a couple of wires wrapped around the house a little below ground level (for safety) will be far far better than a single ground rod.

    Any attic antenna needs extra attention to make sure there can be no arcing which could possibly lead to a house fire. So use insulators at wire ends and keep away from power cables or metal things like flues that they could arc to. Also use good construction practices so things don't loosen up over time with the temperature cycles that occur in attics.

    I never did try a magnetic loop. It would be a good choice in the attic as well, obviously with a remote tuning capability.

    I didn't seriously consider a vertical disguised as a flagpole because in my situation I could not readily get enough radials of a significant length in the ground to make an efficient antenna

    Good luck and have fun.
    Last edited: Mar 21, 2016
    K3RW likes this.
  10. KE0CAA

    KE0CAA Ham Member QRZ Page

    You should be fine to tie a flag to the top of the hustler 6btv and call it a flag pole according to the rules. Also join the board and propose the adoption of prb1 rules to allow reasonable accommodation of antennas. I also encourage writing your congress members to support the Amateur Radio Parity Act H.R.1301
    N0TZU and AK5B like this.

Share This Page