ARRL Proposes New Entry Level License Class w/ HF

Hahahaha I figured someone would have said that a long time ago. I wasn't referring to you though. I was referring to a certain someone else. And I was calling that, the 'Point" that I had.

And congratulations. So if that's the case that you already passed the written, then why were you working that hard on that post that had me check mated? You should have been agreeing with me. And it doesn't take that much work to get the code enough to pass 5wpm. I didn't even learn the punctuations until after I took the 5wpm. And I still passed.

 

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (K3DAV @ Mar. 06 2004,03:50)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (ke6irp @ Mar. 05 2004,13:12)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Dave--Wrong again---at least you're consistant....

40,80 and even vhf while surely going downhill are nothing like what cb is like and all of this will one day be as we lower our standards to zero------by the way----I'm blaming no one----but the arrl leadership...not the techs as a group --hell--I was one for a long time-------there are good and bad in every group---I think many techs in fact have the personal pride to want to advance with a little effort....adios amigo[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
You're pretty consistant yourself.

No one is saying that 40/80 meters is as bad as CB.  It is just a point that proves that the CW requirement does not work to keep them out.  They are there, and they passed the CW requirement.  2+2=4  Very obvious and simple.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
Dave--Problem is it's hard to prove a negative---vis---that hf will go in the toilet withpout a good gatekeeper test......however--I think it's just intuitive that the cw test is a hurdle that keeps out all but the dedicated because it is a skill to learn that does not happen overnight....I also think that the skill , while old   , is at a very basic level part of the fundimental nature of radio and of course the hobby. Like --cable cars in San Francisco---sure--there is better transportation but why on earth remove the soul of the city?  Same for code---keep it alive for the soul of the hobby and its intrinsic gatekeeper value------let the no coders have a band or two ---if that does not make you all happy then to be honest you are showing your true colors----Best--Chris

 

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (ke6irp @ Mar. 08 2004,13:11)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Dave--Problem is it's hard to prove a negative---vis---that hf will go in the toilet withpout a good gatekeeper test......however--I think it's just intuitive that the cw test is a hurdle that keeps out all but the dedicated because it is a skill to learn that does not happen overnight....I also think that the skill , while old   , is at a very basic level part of the fundimental nature of radio and of course the hobby. Like --cable cars in San Francisco---sure--there is better transportation but why on earth remove the soul of the city?  Same for code---keep it alive for the soul of the hobby and its intrinsic gatekeeper value[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
OK Chris, I will concede to one of your major points. The CW requirement has kept SOME of the bad boys from the HF bands. Bad boys that would have been on the HF bands without, what you call, "The Gatekeeper". The written exams have also kept many bad boys out of amateur radio completely, but that part is fair to everyone. Learning knowledge is possible for those who want to just read the text. But learning CW is like learning Chinese. It is not based on what you already know. It is something brand new to the mind. And not everyone can do that. You can say it is easy, but that's because it was easy for YOU.

Now look at it from the other side of the coin. I am one of many thousands of people, that is a dedicated, good operator with a high respect and love for radio. I can NOT hear the difference between a "di" or a "Da". They all sound the same to me. While your "Gatekeeper" is keeping out a few bad boys, it is also preventing the thousands of good guys from advancing in their license.

If the cable cars in San Francisco were hampering the way of life for the majority, I will bet you a weeks pay, that they would become history. But they are not doing that, so they are kept as a historical, and traditional part of the city.

The CW requirement has outlived it's purpose. It is no longer a "Gatekeeper". Times and attitudes have changed, with those who are already on HF. Your "Gatekeeper" is no longer keeping out bad boys, but it IS keeping out the good guys.</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">------let the no coders have a band or two ---if that does not make you all happy then to be honest you are showing your true colors----Best--Chris[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>That statement, and the use of the word, "Gatekeeper", only gives the tone a flavor of someone who's personal opinion should be the rule. It sounds as if we should need your permission, and what the rest of the world thinks on the matter, has no meaning. That was not meant as an attack, rather a perception.

CW is not a "Gatekeeper". It is a mode of transmission, a language, and a long time wonderful tradition that many enjoy. That part never has to change. But as a requirement to advance ones license, just to talk on a different part of the amateur frequency spectrum, makes no sense. That's like saying, anyone can get a drivers license and operate a car. But you must become a mechanic to drive at night. In other words, one has nothing to do with the other.

Take care Chris.

 

oh my god!!!!!! this crap is still going on? well i went back on my words but i just had to say that. no more posting for me,dont worry guys i will still be reading from time to time.

 

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (K3DAV @ Mar. 08 2004,16:20)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Now look at it from the other side of the coin.  I am one of many thousands of people, that is a dedicated, good operator with a high respect and love for radio.  I can NOT hear the difference between a "di" or a "Da".  They all sound the same to me.  While your "Gatekeeper" is keeping out a few bad boys, it is also preventing the thousands of good guys from advancing in their license.

 It sounds as if we should need your permission, and what the rest of the world thinks on the matter, has no meaning.  That was not meant as an attack, rather a perception.

CW is not a "Gatekeeper".  It is a mode of transmission, a language, and a long time wonderful tradition that many enjoy.  [/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
dave---This isn't personal friend--relax---You do need to ask someone's permission to enter hf--although not mine--welcome to the world--like driving, flying a plane, diving etc--it's a privlege------it was not easy for me to learn cw as you suggest--but I did it----As for guys like you who claim they can't learn it---cool--no sweat--welcome to hf---have a band or two but to give it all away is dumbing down the hobbty to the detriment of all of us---you guys can never respond to that point that makes any sense??? God Bless you Dave---you say the same thing in every post!---Best of luck to you--either with your basically easy no code license or--if you can ever conquer cw!---see ya out there----it's a great hobby isn't it?

 

This is the first time I'm posting something on this issue.  Even though I'm fairly sure that there isn't anything I'm going to say that hasn't been said already, I'm going to post my opinion anyway.
-----------------------------
The Good:

For the most part, I like the new ARRL proposal.  I have heard novice opperators of some years ago talk about how being given some opportunities to talk voice on 10 meters not only energized a dead band, but it also motivated some people's interest in sticking with amateur radio.  An entry level licence (without code) with a taste of HF could be a very good thing.  

The Good?:

Ahhhh, what to do with all those no code techs and tech plus people?  Even the techs and tech pluses disagree.  A friend of mine (at least initially) thought no codes should be bumped to the new entry level class but the tech plus people should be bumped up to General.  (Uhh sorry.  If code is being eliminated, as in not important, then both techs and tech pluses can be treated the same way.  ah-ha!  Techs, at least from ten years ago, had to take the novice portion of the license requirements and know something about how to opperate on HF, in theory.)  Yeah, what do ya do, eh?

Not so good?

I'm willing to give techs and tech pluses the benefit of assuming that they will become a valuable addition to the HF community.  I think flooding the HF bands with some new opperators can be a good thing.  (I don't think it will be a "flood" either.)  

BUT:  Hey! What HF bands can I transmit on?

Someone at the ARRL must be out of his/her mind in thinking that bumping current tech/ tech pluses up to General without taking at least the written test is a good idea.  That question up there, 'What band can I opperate on?' is going to be a common one.  Put simply, without some study, people simply don't know.  And there's a lot more that could be useful.  (Pssst!  The band plans are included in the ARRL study book for General.)

I can just see this one comming too:  'Hey!  Why can't people hear me on 20 meters???  My *lower* side band is working just fine!'  

Yeah.  I can see that one coming a mile away.  Where do you learn that there are such things as upper and lower side band?  Why, the General theory for that exam is where you find that necessary bit of information!!!

People Should learn what to do on HF:

In case I haven't been 100% clear, before opperating on HF, it is important to know the theory behind how to opperate.  It's that simple.  

Some techs and tech pluses may already know a great deal about working HF.  (I'm sure of this.)  Okay, then it probably would not be very difficult to study for the written portion of the test to make sure that they and everyone else is on the same page.  

What to do?  What to do!

Everyone should take the General theory exam.  It is in everyone's best interest that everyone working HF have a decent idea of what they are supposed to do before being granted a license.

73,

Chris
N3PNB

 

CW is still a good thing and I would like to see it stay somewhere in the amatuer world, But if this is somthing to get the bands used more then Im all for it. We all know what happens to the bands that don't get used.. They get taken away by the FCC to be used in some new gadget like a cordless phone or something. But lets not forget the CW that is a part of the knowledge we have worked so hard to retain. For some of the others that would like to see no regulations at all, Please stay on your CB,and FRS's and leave us alone.

 

First of all, shhh (the fcc isn't going to want the lower bands.) Don't want to say that too loud in case I'm wrong. Because I figure that if the FCC wanted those bands, they would have taken them by now..And MORE news..The FCC has these frequencies now anyway.

How do I know that? Because whose feet do we have to bow down to in order to get our ticket?

And number two,,The frequencies are being used enough now as it is. I'd assoon not have a big influx on people bombard in. There isn't room to talk on 40 and 20 anymore now as it is.

And number three,,The code STAYS!!! It had better. Otherwise get ready for 'BREAKER" "BREAKER" "19" ! ! !

 

The FCC has approved ARRL's recomendations that all techs and tech plus will be upgraded to General Class without any futher testing the code requirement has been dropped.You need 5 wpm to up grade to amature extra and pass the written element.Novices will become the New Communicator class.The FCC Licence will now have only three classe's Extra being the only class requiring morse code testing of 5 wpm.You old codgers will learn to change or be run over! Life is just like that!

 

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (N1OBN @ May 17 2004,17:29)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">The FCC has approved ARRL's recomendations that all techs and tech plus will be upgraded to General Class without any futher testing the code requirement has been dropped.You need 5 wpm to up grade to amature extra and pass the written element.Novices will become the New Communicator class.The FCC Licence will now have only three classe's Extra being the only class requiring morse code testing of 5 wpm.You old codgers will learn to change or be run over! Life is just like that![/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
Rick,
 The FCC is now CONSIDERING the petitions, and looking
 at comments by individuals submitted on their EFCS  
 website,--no decisions have been made as of yet,
 unless you happen to have "inside info" the rest of
 us do not have.
 Its interesting that with all your input on this subject
 on QRZ.com, I did not find any comments to the FCC  
 on the EFCS website from you.
                 73, K1MVP              

 

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (kb0uzr @ Mar. 03 2004,20:20)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Someone else said it,,and now I will.

The ARRL sold us out. Look at that post you quoted.  Those the kind of people they want in amature radio? People that have NO pride?

... The ARRL isn't interested in the quality of ham radio,,Just themselves.  "Line their pockets!"[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>

OK fellas, I've held out long enough on this one.

I have heard this form of comment too often to not make a comment of my own. They (ie. FCC, ARRL, etc.) aren't interested in the quality of ham radio??? C'mon guys, that is a stupid thing to say. In reality, it is some of the hams themselves that don't care about the quality of our hobby! Instead of jumping on the ol' woe is me train why not learn an old trick called 'elmering'.....If our hobby has declined in quality it is not the fault of the FCC, ARRL, or any other organization. It is the majority of hams that have quit carrying the torch because the road took a curve they weren't expecting.....Changes are inevitable, so do we jump up and down and cry for our mommies to change things back, or do we accept the change and the challenges that go along with such changes. Before any OT's jump in about the way things used to be, I suggest that you first go online and take some of the practice exams for your current class of license. I would be interested in knowing what your score is on the first test you take for each class of license. I fully support the recommendations made by ARRL, and prefer the changes proposed by the NCVEC. Rather than telling a prospective ham where to obtain a Q&A quide, how about inviting him\her over to your shack and 'teach' them about proper ham radio operations and operator courtesy by example. Rather than the FCC forcing hams to learn CW, why don't we TEACH CW.....But NO, we don't have the desire or time to do that...It's easier to give\sell them a code tape and yell at them for not learning fast enough....

Dumb Down Ham Radio?  You have already dumbed it down quite enough by being hard-hearted, mean-spirited, and loathesome.

C'mon folks.....Let's welcome them in instead of weedin' them out!

Phil - W4AIN

 

THE ARRL SOLD US ALL OUT--- THAT'S A FACT-----