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"Aiming" the dipoles

Discussion in 'Antennas, Feedlines, Towers & Rotors' started by N1VAU, Apr 11, 2012.

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  1. N0SYA

    N0SYA Ham Member QRZ Page

    I have a loop that runs around the eaves of the house, max height is less than 20ft. I worked EI the other evening on 100w 40m ssb from Indiana. Point being that even low antennas with insane lobes get out, mostly due to Gooch's paradox; RF gatta go somewhere!

    If the dye poe antennas were higher, aiming them might make a diff, especially at the higher freqs, but for 40 and 80 low height makes foir an omnidirectional.
  2. N1VAU

    N1VAU XML Subscriber QRZ Page

    I love those replies! :) hehehe!
    I've been know to get too "ANALytical".
  3. KC9TNH

    KC9TNH Ham Member QRZ Page

    If you have the land and simply must put up another wire just put up another one perpendicular to the other and see what hatches. Higher bands in the morning you can still go a long way; just have to figure out who in particular you're interested in focusing on, or just enjoy it all.

    The angst-a-lictical version of git 'er done.
  4. KM1H

    KM1H Ham Member QRZ Page

    With 100W its easy to have 2 antennas at right angles and a relay at the top with voltage fed up the coax; its done all the time even at 1500W.
    Then the question of directivity would be answered and no amount of showing computer plots will predict what the real world enviroment will produce.

    It requires absolutely no scientific knowledge to work DX on any band. Simply read an antenna manual, toss up a couple of wires at somewhat optimum heights, learn how to use the free real time propagation charts and predictions on the Internet. Then watch the various DX spotting websites. The most skill is in how well you can use your radios features and timing your calls to be effective....dont be an alligator....all mouth and no ears which holds for CW also.

    DXing to me is a sport and Im rather good at it having worked just about every country I could on bands that had just a trace of propagation; Im over 300 countries on 9 bands. Then I decided to try it at a QRP 5W on CW where it took almost 2 years to work DXCC on 8 of the 9 HF bands, I need 3 more on 160. Ive also worked 17 countries on 160 with 100 milliwatts. Another accomplishment was confirming DXCC on 80M CW last year with a PP 211 1929 oscillator breadboard clone of about 70W and a 1930's receiver; took a bit over 18 months of casual operation to a simple low dipole as that setup was in the bedroom and not the basement.

    I'll run 1200W to crack a huge pileup for a new one and then at the end of the DXpedition or whatever I'll try it with 5W.

    A couple of my friends and I took up a challenge to work 9BDXCC in one year with 100W and no yagis; all of us have fairly extensive antenna "farms" that will not be used. Its moving right along for all of us and hopefully 10 and 12M will cooperate, 160 and 80 have been outstanding so far. The rig is a 28 year old Kenwood TS-940 loaded with filters and a few mods.

    Next year the plan is to compete in the CQ and ARRL CW DX contests with my 1960 CE-100V to a 1963 NCL-2000 amp, and a 1955 75A4 as a single band 80M entry. Anybody want to predict where I'll place?

  5. K1DNR

    K1DNR Ham Member QRZ Page

    Ever see a clover leaf pattern? That happens. You can look it up in a book. I'm not telling Carl anything. He knows that.

    But he's not thinking from the perspective of most of us. He's thinking from the perspective of an old timer who has been doing it a long time - he forgot he learned it.

    You can be a ham who looks on the paper next to you, or constantly asks others for help - or you can be the kind of ham who learns it for themselves.

    Carl already learned it. I'm not sure why he thinks you shouldn't learn it too.

    Turning the dipole 90 degrees will give the exact same pattern in many cases. You replace one lobe with another. Unless you are using half wave dipoles cut for every band. You can be systematic and improve your odds. Or you can be random. Sometimes you get lucky. That can be fun, but I'm too old to climb trees every other day and I really don't like ladders.

    I believe Carl uses dedicated antennas for each band since he dislikes tuners so much. (or traps or stubs etc)

    Where does the information in the book come from? The ARRL?

    No, it comes from people with names like Maxwell, Hertz and Faraday... And even some hams here on QRZ.

    Some of us like sport. Some of us like theory. Some of us like both.

    Nobody said you needed scientific knowledge to work DX. I've worked DX from the car with a Radio Shack magnet mount, and an antenna tuner on the other end, on 20 Meters. Yes, 20 meters tuning a CB antenna on a magnet, through 12 feet of RG58 in a car moving at 60mph. No, you don't need to know anything or have anything special to work DX.

    There are enough imbeciles on the air to prove that statement correct. Tune certain repeaters, or portions of 75m and even 20m any given night.

    I like science. My station is very, very modest - I only have a half acre and before that we were living in Manhattan with a wire thrown out the window.

    He must have liked learning radio theory at some point, because he knows a lot about it. Not just antennas either.

    If you are looking things up in a book, and understanding that you have a pattern influenced by ground, and by frequency - and that it is the height in wavelengths, not in FEET - that IS SCIENCE.

    I got a thrill getting my station on 160m and making my first QSOs ever this past month.

    It was like Christmas Day working my first VK on top band. I've got a 33 foot vertical for 160m. I read a book and a bunch of articles by Duffy and Rauch, and a good bit of info from ON4UN and others.

    I got the other vertical working on three bands. That took a little research too. Why did I keep destroying those relays? How did I figure out how to tune it?

    I read books. I got some help. Ultimately I had to understand how it all worked to solve the problems, and ultimately have some success and fun with it.

    I could have bought something I guess. Unfortunately we don't have a lot of money right now.

    If I can't make it out of scrap, it pretty much isn't going to happen at this QTH. That's my challenge. I made my own capacitor for the 80m tuning. I didn't have the money or access to anything capable of doing the job at 800W and the resulting voltage into that impedance.

    You've imposed a challenge on yourself with the low power. That's the spirit. Congratulations on your achievements and good luck OM Carl.
    Last edited: Apr 14, 2012
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