A NEW FT8 with QSO and Rag Chew capabilities called FT8CALL

Discussion in 'Amateur Radio News' started by NN2X, Aug 12, 2018.

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  1. KE0EYJ

    KE0EYJ Ham Member QRZ Page

    It seems FT8Call is about the same speed as DominoEx Micro. I was chatting with EU6KA (from here in HL Land -- 4400 miles short path) and testing various modes, last night. We were able to work each other down to 10w and still have 75 to 90 percent copy, in DominoEx Micro. He was a 3el yagi, and I was a 2el yagi, though.

    I felt that DominoEX Micro was JUST fast enough for comfort, so I'm excited that FT8Call is about the same speed. I'm guessing FT8Call has a better signal-to-noise ratio.

    Thor Micro was even better than DominoEX Micro, due to error correction, but was maybe 1/2 to 1/3 the speed.... crawling.
     
  2. KN4CRD

    KN4CRD Ham Member QRZ Page

    Let me know how it works for you!
     
  3. KE0EYJ

    KE0EYJ Ham Member QRZ Page

    One more question for you...

    It appears (from watching the gentleman's backpacking video) that FT8Call uses certain symbols to transmit commonly used sentences (signal report, hello phrases, etc). I am wondering if you took that in account to reach the 12wpm average, or if you were basing the 12wpm speed on just the paragraph-long test phrase you used?

    If you didn't take the macros-type phrases into account, then we're really looking at a speed faster than 12wpm, for typical comms, aren't we?
     
  4. KN4CRD

    KN4CRD Ham Member QRZ Page

    There are examples in the documentation. It depends on the type of transmission. Most directed commands can be sent in one tx cycle (frame).

    Once you send a free text message, it depends on the sentence structure. Here's an example:

    "WE HOLD THESE TRUTHS TO BE SELF-EVIDENT THAT ALL MEN ARE CREATED EQUAL THAT THEY ARE ENDOWED BY THEIR CREATOR WITH CERTAIN UNALIENABLE RIGHTS THAT AMONG THESE ARE LIFE LIBERTY AND THE PURSUIT OF HAPPINESS."

    Would transmit in 13-frames, for ~11WPM.

    "A SUCCESSFUL MAN IS ONE WHO CAN LAY A FIRM FOUNDATION WITH THE BRICKS OTHERS HAVE THROWN AT HIM"

    Would transmit in 6-frames, for ~12.66WPM

    CW has a neat way of calculating WPM, timing how long it takes to transmit the word PARIS. In FT8Call, PARIS is encoded into 24 bits (4.8 bits/character). Each transmission cycle can pack up to 69 character bits. That equates to about 11.5 WPM. (69/24=2.875 words / 15 seconds * 4)
     
  5. KE0EYJ

    KE0EYJ Ham Member QRZ Page

    Thanks and I get that, but you're also including a callsign in there (part of the transmission automatically in FT8Call), whereas an op would have to type it manually and add it as part of the WPM of another mode. Also phrases like "Report ..." do not require full send of the text line in FT8Call, correct? If this is true, doesn't it transmit information faster than other modes at 12WPM?

    If an OP is able to type just one character (or nothing) to send the typical phrases we use for a contact, this could be a very substantial increase in overall QSO speed, I'd think? Am I right in saying that's what we're seeing, here? A WPM speed actually better than 12, on a typical QSO? Or did you already factor that speed into it?
     
    Last edited: Aug 16, 2018
  6. K8LL

    K8LL Ham Member QRZ Page

    I haven't read the whole thread, so maybe you already said what clocking program you are talking about, but I was wondering which one you are talking about?

    Thanks!
     
  7. KN4CRD

    KN4CRD Ham Member QRZ Page

    Likely just equivalent because the callsign and such take a whole frame. It would decrease the average density of words per frame.
     
  8. KE0EYJ

    KE0EYJ Ham Member QRZ Page

    Ok, you caught me while posting more about it, but this answers my question.

    Best wishes, this will be a fun experiment!
     
  9. WD4IGX

    WD4IGX Premium Subscriber QRZ Page

    I've heard nothing about WWVB being shut down, though. And a GPS signal and accompanying GPS time source is available virtually everywhere outdoors. Someone should come up with a way to use one or both of those - an inexpensive WWVB linked clock and/or the GPS in a smart phone or inexpensive external GPS - as a time source.

    EDIT: Looks like people are already doing that with a GPS source.
     
    Last edited: Aug 16, 2018
  10. N1AAE

    N1AAE XML Subscriber QRZ Page

    I've skimmed the thread and observed the mixed opinion.

    After trying it out and logging a couple QSOs, I think it's pretty neat. I'm a 'younger' ham (30 years old) and have only been licensed for about a year and a half. I love experimenting with the lesser used modes but find it discouraging when no activity can be found after hours of trying to make a HELLMODE (for example) contact.

    FT8Call is pretty neat.

    With that said, any word on when LOTW and TQSL will supoprt it so I can upload or sync my logs? I upload everything to LOTW and sync with QRZ .
     

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