Are we all being fooled about baluns?

[VK4FUQ]

G'day all, I'm sure that many will disagree with me on this, but last night night I spend a couple of hours (of torture) on the internet reading and re-reading all the well written articles on baluns that I could find.

Yes I know current mode baluns are supposed to be superior, yet when I think back to the years when I was only aware of (and built) only voltage mode baluns, signal reports were much better than they are now using current mode baluns.

So despite all the supposed advantages of current mode baluns, are we all being fooled about that? I'm really starting to wonder about that. Regards, Felix vk4fuq.

[G3TXQ]

Yes - signal reports used to be much better than they are now. My wife had blond hair at the time. I'm pretty sure it's all down to her hair colouring rather than the type of balun

Steve G3TXQ

[KL7AJ]

G'day all, I'm sure that many will disagree with me on this, but last night night I spend a couple of hours (of torture) on the internet reading and re-reading all the well written articles on baluns that I could find.

Yes I know current mode baluns are supposed to be superior, yet when I think back to the years when I was only aware of (and built) only voltage mode baluns, signal reports were much better than they are now using current mode baluns.

So despite all the supposed advantages of current mode baluns, are we all being fooled about that? I'm really starting to wonder about that. Regards, Felix vk4fuq.

As I state in Radio Science for the Radio Amateur....."An hour of measurement trumps a decade of debate".

Case closed

[VK4FUQ]

G'day all, I really am starting to wonder about all this. I've never had any 'common mode' related issues when using voltage baluns and such, and in the end I am primarily concerned about
(balun) loss.

I've never detected even the slightest amount of core/ winding heating with a voltage balun but I have detected 'slight' heating with a current mode balun (despite being properly constructed). Does this mean lower overall efficiency? Maybe we just can't see the forest for the trees? Regards, Felix vk4fuq.

[WB2WIK]

Yes - signal reports used to be much better than they are now. My wife had blond hair at the time. I'm pretty sure it's all down to her hair colouring rather than the type of balun

Steve G3TXQ

Steve, you might reconsider. Try "balunless" for a while and see if she goes blonde again.

[WB2WIK]

G'day all, I really am starting to wonder about all this. I've never had any 'common mode' related issues when using voltage baluns and such, and in the end I am primarily concerned about
(balun) loss.

I've never detected even the slightest amount of core/ winding heating with a voltage balun but I have detected 'slight' heating with a current mode balun (despite being properly constructed). Does this mean lower overall efficiency? Maybe we just can't see the forest for the trees? Regards, Felix vk4fuq.

I've worked the world on several bands without using any sort of balun, at all.

Could this just be a conspiracy?

The "propagationists" will claim it's just propagation, but I like conspiracy theories.

[W4OP]

Do you think it might just be possible that the lack of heating (assuming the experiment was well contrived and conducted) could be because the voltage balun was doing nothing to very little to impede common mode currents?

Dale W4OP

[VK4FUQ]

G'day all, in the end I just want something that works well and with low loss! I discovered the Moxon 4:1 voltage balun through his 'HF Antennas For All Locations' book and I happily used it with great results and no issues for many years until I discovered these mysterious new 'current mode' baluns.

Yet practical results wise, they are both about equivalent and in fact the voltage baluns seem to be slightly better in practice! Years ago I had a friend test two of my 4:1 baluns (one voltage mode and one current mode wound on two separate ferrite cores) on his professional network analyser at work (before the days of the mini VNA's), and the voltage balun came out quite superior in every measurement. Regards, Felix vk4fuq.

[KC8VWM]

the voltage balun came out quite superior in every measurement. Regards, Felix vk4fuq.

Curiously interesting thread. Can you elaborate?

[VK4FUQ]

G'day mate, sadly I've lost the paperwork now but in discussion with my friend, he thought that the 4:1 voltage balun than a wide operational bandwidth (from well below 2 MHz to greater than 50 MHz), and an almost perfect and constant 4:1 impedance transformation ratio, and an almost immeasurable insertion loss.

The 4:1 current balun was ok, but had measurably higher insertion loss (about .6 to .8 db), a narrower bandwidth (down to about 7 MHz on the low side, with about 12 turns on each ferrite former when grounded at the midpoint on the output), but a good high frequency response, and a slightly varying impedance transformation over its operational bandwidth.

He thought that the 4:1 voltage balun was close to a 'perfect' balun, and that the current balun was 'ordinary' but probably adequate if only used beyond 10 MHz. Regards, Regards, Felix vk4fuq.

Addition: Please let's not get too contentious about this, but although I concede that common mode chokes (aka 1:1 current mode baluns), can do some interesting things, I'm just not convinced that they are the superior balun in practice.