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Thread: Astatic D104 Rebuild with Modern Parts

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  1. #1

    Default Astatic D104 Rebuild with Modern Parts

    My elmer and my dad both had Astatics in their HamShacks, so needless to say, when my deskmike went to an early grave, I started looking into finding an Astatic D104, and there is a WEALTH of info here and I am grateful for it all!

    I have one question that I haven't found an answer to yet, why could I not take an unused ICOM HM-36 handmike, gut it, and install all components into a gutted D104?

    Has anyone here attemtped such a radical rebuild? I know that the Icoms have that powered pin I need to take care of, I know that I need to take care of the LowZ to HighZ, after thinking about this, why couldn't I just take the cuircit board and mike cord, resolder all the connections, put that elect-mike in the D104 head with modifications, etc?

    Anyone see any issues that I have missed?

    THANKS A MILLION! 73's, KB8WOQ, Scott

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jul 2001
    Posts
    21,474

    Default

    There might be some frequency response problems with a hand mic element in a desk mic body. But I can't see where it would hurt to try it . Whatever floats your boat- - - go for it !

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Location
    Wise, Virginia
    Posts
    4,309

    Default

    I've got a D104 with a Heil element in it. Works fine.
    Audie
    SKCC #927
    Virginia Fone Net #72

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Nov 2001
    Location
    Santa Cruz, CA
    Posts
    115

    Default

    I, too, have an older D104 that had a bad crystal element which was replaced with a Heil element. This was before Heil created a retrofit kit for their elements for the D104, though.

    One thing I found was that the active preamp needed to be bypassed with the Heil given its lower output impedance. The old crystal elements definitely need it to drive today's typical rig.

    As mentioned, the cavity of the D104 head unit, the element you choose to use and the way that it is mounted will affect the sound quality and frequency range you ultimately get from the retrofit.

    Hope that helps and good luck preserving those old mics for another generation!

    Cheers and 73s,

    David

  5. #5

    Thumbs up

    Why could I not take an unused ICOM HM-36 handmike, gut it, and install all components into a gutted D-104
    Scott -

    You could .. BUT ..
    WHY GUT a GOOD Icom hand microphone (This is Dumb approach -- the Icom HM-36 microphone is worth more $$$, by NOT hacking)?

    1. IF you are using this with an Icom transceiver, then go to Radio Shack.
    What is the radio (mfg, model) that you will be wiring this to??

    2. Get out a $5 bill, and purchase a 2-wire or 3-wire elecret mic element (they are less than $5 USD).
    THIS is what is inside that Icom microphone, BTW

    3. Wire up properly for your radio -- Elecret elements require DC Voltage, which the Icom radios supply via their MIC cables.

    4. Schematic Diagram on how to wire on back of Radio Shack card (for elecret element).
    Here is the Icom HM-36 microphone schematic (uses 3-wire elecret element)
    http://www.qsl.net/icom/download/mics.zip

    5. It will sound GOOD -- best $5 you ever spent -- AND you still have a functional Icom hand microphone (VALUE).
    Nullius in verba

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    St. Mary's County Md since 2000
    Posts
    8,285

    Default

    Mouser has a Kobitone crystal element for about $5 that should be a direct replacement for the the original element. Steve 'WIK has used them and recommends them.

  7. #7

    Default

    QAA:

    I don't think that WIK has used the Kobitone elements. I may be wrong, but I definitely recommend them!

    The Mouser part number is 25LM022.

    Glen, K9STH

  8. #8

    Default

    Clearly, there are issues I have missed!!!

    For starters, I have an Icom IC-746... I have an extra hand mike and that I got with the RIG (aftermarket along with the original ICOM handmike, that one I am leaving alone) BTW, thank you for that schematic W9GB, it will definately help out... I do have to make a run to the local Shack, however the guys there ain't like they used to be... sometimes I have to elucidate them on things...

    Currently, I am waiting to bid snipe on a decent D104 on ebay...

    The one thing that I have not located, other than an old pic of some styrofoam that was cut to accept the Heil HC104 conversion kit (no longer being sold via Bob Heil's website), was any solid points on remounting the element in that huge cavity (in order to avoid any freq resp probs).... The best research I could find had the cavity filled but not touching the element, some cover the element but not touching the element... so many tips... I guess it is all dependent on WHAT goes into that cavity...

    I have seen some decent postings on the Kobitone replacements, I gather I would still need a TUG-9 base (with the pre-amp, right?) and still find a way to decouple the voltage from the mike line (the ICOM problem)?

    I will be posting pics of whatever I start to do, ever since the rule change (i am no longer a tech plus) i've been itching to get my general, that narrow 10M band hasn't been so good (since 2002 really)... and since my desk mike is no longer functioning, I thought this would be a great project to keep idle hands busy... I AM TAKING NOTES!!! So please, keep 'em coming!!!

    Happy New Year, 73's... Scott

  9. #9

    Thumbs up

    I have seen some decent postings on the Kobitone replacements,
    I gather I would still need a TUG-9 base (with the pre-amp, right?) and still find a way to decouple the voltage from the mike line (the ICOM problem)?
    CORRECT, A Kobitone (Japanese) crystal mic element is Hi-Z ..
    so the mic amplifier in the Astatic TUG-9 base is required for impedance (Z) matching to the low-Z (~ 150 to 600 ohms) output required by your Icom radio.
    The mic pre-amp should also address the Icom phantom power issue.
    The one thing that I have not located, other than an old picture of some styrofoam that was cut to accept the Heil HC104 conversion kit (no longer being sold via Bob Heil's website), was any solid points on remounting the element in that huge cavity (in order to avoid any freq resp probs) .... The best research I could find had the cavity filled but not touching the element, some cover the element but not touching the element ... so many tips ...
    I guess it is all dependent on WHAT goes into that cavity ...
    Scott -

    The Key concept for retrofitting a smaller element inside the D-104 is the usage of a Baffle (for example, a solid piece of cardboard).

    Bob, K0FR, at RB Micro sells the MC320 Direct Replacement Element (crystal mic element) and Mounting Kit.
    http://www.rbmicro.com/index.php?pag...cat=6&group=11

    Instructions and photos of installation of replacement element in a D-104.
    http://www.rbmicro.com/prodgfx/XTLKinstall.pdf

    w9gb
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Nullius in verba

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Sugar Hill, Georgia
    Posts
    75

    Default HC104 D104 replacement cartridge

    HC104 D104 replacement cartridge by Heil upgrades the D104 to a better sound

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