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Thread: RACES vs. ARES.....

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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    Beaumont, California
    Posts
    260

    Default RACES vs. ARES.....

    I'm watching a situation in which the Riverside County, California RACES organization is
    apparently being threatened by a new ARES group, "Riverside County ARES", that is rapidly growing in the low desert area.

    Emails are going out from county officials "demanding" information about the organization and stating that "all such organizations must be coordinated and operate under the County umbrella".

    I remember a ham, with his accompanying halitosis, scream in my face that the RACES group has jurisdiction over "ALL" emergency communications in the county, and stating "IT'S THE LAW"!! Naturally, no such law exists, nor could it.

    When the local Salvation Army SATERN group began in the area, they were paid a visit by RACES members, telling them that they could not operate in an emergency, so they must join RACES, and abandon SATERN.

    This is a far cry from the recent Mexicali Earthquake activity in which the local RACES group, ARES, SATERN, Red Cross, and Mexican Hams all worked together. In the words of that great philosopher Rodney King, "Can't we all get along?"

    Emails and anger are flying back and forth!

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Apr 2001
    Location
    Wantage, NJ, USA FN21qf
    Posts
    18,557

    Default

    That's what you call a whackeriffic fight!

    ARES is an ARRL organization run by the ARRL field organization.

    RACES is a civil defense protocol recognized by the Federal Govt. A RACES organization has to have a club license and certified by a civil defense organization (47cfr97.407)

    RACES and ARES are often the same people but often they are not.

    I don't see WHY they should be fighting and WHAT they are fighting for.

  3. #3
    W4AFB Guest

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by AE6JM View Post
    I'm watching a situation in which the Riverside County, California RACES organization is
    apparently being threatened by a new ARES group, "Riverside County ARES", that is rapidly growing in the low desert area.

    Emails are going out from county officials "demanding" information about the organization and stating that "all such organizations must be coordinated and operate under the County umbrella".

    I remember a ham, with his accompanying halitosis, scream in my face that the RACES group has jurisdiction over "ALL" emergency communications in the county, and stating "IT'S THE LAW"!! Naturally, no such law exists, nor could it.

    When the local Salvation Army SATERN group began in the area, they were paid a visit by RACES members, telling them that they could not operate in an emergency, so they must join RACES, and abandon SATERN.

    This is a far cry from the recent Mexicali Earthquake activity in which the local RACES group, ARES, SATERN, Red Cross, and Mexican Hams all worked together. In the words of that great philosopher Rodney King, "Can't we all get along?"

    Emails and anger are flying back and forth!

    Break out the orange vests and the H/T's for a fun filled whacker fest!

  4. #4
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    Crest, Ca (just East of El Cajon)
    Posts
    30,515

    Default

    The roles of RACES and ARES are clearly defined in San Diego county, and the 2 entities get along quite well. No squabbling whatsoever, and, in fact, dual membership is encouraged when possible.

    RACES takes care of Official police and Fire comms. Very strict criteria and training required, very formalized and a chain of command that must be adhered to. They are sponsored by the Sherriffs dept and work out of the main EOC for the County.

    ARES does Hospital Emcomm, SATERN. and, sometimes, Red Cross, though they pretty well have their own Hams and comms. Health and Welfare, Churches, and NON- Governmental agenicies except for CAL FIRE, which they Serve. They have an EOC in the CAL FIRE Station at Rancho San Diego, and also work out of the EMS EOC up in Grantville.

    SO no problems here. Everyone works in complete harmony and peace, cross helping where needed, especially at the Miramar Air Show.

    Must be an Ego deal up there in the Inland Empire.
    I love my cats!
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  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    GONE
    Posts
    5,458

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    Quote Originally Posted by WA6MHZ View Post
    The roles of RACES and ARES are clearly defined in San Diego county, and the 2 entities get along quite well. No squabbling whatsoever, and, in fact, dual membership is encouraged when possible.

    RACES takes care of Official police and Fire comms. Very strict criteria and training required, very formalized and a chain of command that must be adhered to. They are sponsored by the Sherriffs dept and work out of the main EOC for the County.

    ARES does Hospital Emcomm, SATERN. and, sometimes, Red Cross, though they pretty well have their own Hams and comms. Health and Welfare, Churches, and NON- Governmental agenicies except for CAL FIRE, which they Serve. They have an EOC in the CAL FIRE Station at Rancho San Diego, and also work out of the EMS EOC up in Grantville.

    SO no problems here. Everyone works in complete harmony and peace, cross helping where needed, especially at the Miramar Air Show.

    Must be an Ego deal up there in the Inland Empire.
    Same here. Our group works very well together and we get along with all local agencies. All members are NIMS compliant and then some. The local organization is frequently featured in QST. Check out May 2010 QST page 13 (lower left).

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    Rochester, MN
    Posts
    20,107

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by WA6MHZ View Post
    The roles of RACES and ARES are clearly defined in San Diego county, and the 2 entities get along quite well. No squabbling whatsoever, and, in fact, dual membership is encouraged when possible.

    RACES takes care of Official police and Fire comms. Very strict criteria and training required, very formalized and a chain of command that must be adhered to. They are sponsored by the Sherriffs dept and work out of the main EOC for the County.

    ARES does Hospital Emcomm, SATERN. and, sometimes, Red Cross, though they pretty well have their own Hams and comms. Health and Welfare, Churches, and NON- Governmental agenicies except for CAL FIRE, which they Serve. They have an EOC in the CAL FIRE Station at Rancho San Diego, and also work out of the EMS EOC up in Grantville.

    SO no problems here. Everyone works in complete harmony and peace, cross helping where needed, especially at the Miramar Air Show.
    Yep, and that's the way it ought to be, in my humble opinion.

    The RACES rules have changed dramatically. There are no RACES licenses anymore, and RACES personnel operating on the ham bands must have ham tickets. In the past, that was not the case. Indeed, when I was involved in RACES in San Jose, the public safety dispatchers and hams were all cross-trained, so in a disaster they could do each other's jobs. I'm aware of one major county here where that is still done.

    When I was in RACES we met every week, and we drilled a lot. We all had city ID cards so we could get into the EOC. It was a pretty small but very dedicated group.

    This sounds like a big misunderstanding to me.
    Last edited by K0RGR; 04-28-2010 at 03:12 AM.
    EchoLink, IRLP, Allstar and DSTAR linking - adding interest to repeaters worldwide 24X7

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Frederick, Maryland
    Posts
    2,252

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by WA6MHZ View Post
    The roles of RACES and ARES are clearly defined in San Diego county, and the 2 entities get along quite well. No squabbling whatsoever, and, in fact, dual membership is encouraged when possible.

    RACES takes care of Official police and Fire comms. Very strict criteria and training required, very formalized and a chain of command that must be adhered to. They are sponsored by the Sherriffs dept and work out of the main EOC for the County.

    ARES does Hospital Emcomm, SATERN. and, sometimes, Red Cross, though they pretty well have their own Hams and comms. Health and Welfare, Churches, and NON- Governmental agenicies except for CAL FIRE, which they Serve. They have an EOC in the CAL FIRE Station at Rancho San Diego, and also work out of the EMS EOC up in Grantville.

    SO no problems here. Everyone works in complete harmony and peace, cross helping where needed, especially at the Miramar Air Show.

    Must be an Ego deal up there in the Inland Empire.
    Pretty much the same here in my area. Although when I'm on the statewide monthly RACES drill, I feel like these guys couldn't pass traffic to save their lives, but on the statewide ARES nets, it works so well.

    But to the real issue, RACES, ARES, SATERN, etc. are pointless without 'customers' aka, served entities. In my county, RACES works with the Red Cross and the Hospital, we also do all the walk-a-thons etc. Where RACES provides communications for the EOC & fire department. But then again, we have an ARES station in one fire station, which happens to be where the local radio club meets.

    73 de Joseph Durnal NE3R
    Joseph Durnal - [callsign]NE3R[/callsign] ex N3PAQ
    [URL="http://cryptojoe.blogspot.com"]http://cryptojoe.blogspot.com[/URL]

  8. #8

    Default

    I would search the local laws to see if there really is any such thing. I am amazed at what gets passed at the county and city levels -- some of the most crazy stuff. However, in this case, I doubt that any such "law" exists.

    Other than that, I have seen situations where the local public service official wants to keep a tight thumb on their "emcomm" activities. However, this applies to the local government's activities, and I have not seen such an aggressive attituted towards other groups.

    I know of instances where local Hams, who want to control everything and think they can, pull stuff like this. I know of one instance where a local ham club was operating emcomm for a local hospital, and the local ARES guy came in and announced that they were taking over. Well, that went over like a lead ballon, and that particular ARES group so alienated everyone, it had to be broken up and started up from scratch again.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    Rochester, MN
    Posts
    20,107

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by NE3R View Post

    But to the real issue, RACES, ARES, SATERN, etc. are pointless without 'customers' aka, served entities. In my county, RACES works with the Red Cross and the Hospital, we also do all the walk-a-thons etc. Where RACES provides communications for the EOC & fire department. But then again, we have an ARES station in one fire station, which happens to be where the local radio club meets.

    73 de Joseph Durnal NE3R
    That's a big issue, isn't it?

    I was delighted a week or so ago when I retook the Red Cross Emergency Comms class. The last time I took this class, I was a bit upset over their insistence that ham radio wasn't really needed anymore. That philosophy has obviously changed. They now recognize outside ham groups as they do other VOADs, and more importantly, they recognize that in a disaster where normal communications are disrupted, it may take up to 72 hours before they can get their own comm equipment in place, so they will need to interface with local ham groups. And, after Red Cross doesn't need the hams, other VOADs and the general public might.

    If you haven't already, you can go to http://training.fema.gov and take the three online courses that everybody who will be involved in disasters is being asked to take - ICS100,200 and 700. As you go through it, you will figure out where ham radio fits into the whole picture.

    Yes, more and more we are working in non-emergency situations, but that's what keeps people involved and keeps their gear working. In many cases, it attracts newcomers. Throw in SKYWARN, CERT, S+R, and other groups that utilize ham radio, and there's lots to keep people busy. We should not overlook allied groups like REACT and MARS, either.

    Probably the biggest thing is to be sure that the EOC can find the hams if they are needed. We are useless to them if they can't count on us.
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  10. #10
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Posts
    1

    Default

    AE6JM your last sentance is the whole issue. The new ARES group refused to coordinate or cooperate with the existing RACES group in the area. Hopefully that has been resolved. Time will tell. They all must work together.

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