Vertical Antenna Placement

Discussion in 'Antennas, Feedlines, Towers & Rotors' started by W4ZWA, Nov 13, 2017.

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  1. N0TZU

    N0TZU Premium Subscriber QRZ Page

    IMO the biggest reason to put the antenna as far from the house as is reasonable is all the RFI from devices inside the house. Almost everything electrical these days will make some noise on HF.

    It would be a good idea to place the antenna at various distances from the house, then tune around and see how much RFI there is. Make sure all the TVs, computers, LED lights, phone chargers, etc. are turned on when you do the tests. I would also use at least one counterpoise (i.e., radial) wire laying on the ground for the tests.
    KD6RF and NH7RO like this.
  2. W4ZWA

    W4ZWA Ham Member QRZ Page

    At the last house it was ground mounted so I made a point to never operate if the wife or kid were in the back yard. Of course they were told to never mess with it to begin with.
  3. K9STH

    K9STH Ham Member Staff Member QRZ Page

    If there are no antenna restrictions at present, then you should be "grandfathered" any time in the future even if the HOA establishes some restrictions and could erect new antennas even if such restrictions are enacted at a later date.

    Your purchase contract predates any restrictions and you should be protected against such in the future.

    In Texas, and I would imagine in most, if not every, other state, until any CC&Rs are recorded with the county, anyone who purchases land within the area covered by the HOA are exempt from those restrictions. Of course, any governmental zoning restrictions do apply but no CC&Rs until they are recorded. Those purchasing land after the CC&Rs are recorded do have to abide by those regulations.

    Within a couple of miles of my house, there were all sorts of CC&Rs that were very restrictive including a prohibition of antenna towers, etc. However, the developer never recorded those CC&Rs. A number of amateur radio operators discovered this fact and bought houses in the development and started putting up towers. A number of others tried to sue those operators to force them to take down their towers. Unfortunately, for them, since the CC&Rs were not recorded, there was nothing that could be legally done to prevent the towers.

    Some people did try to get the CC&Rs recorded. However, it would have taken a 2/3rds majority of the homeowners to agree to this and, even then, those who had already owned property would not be affected. There were a number of the original proposed regulations that were not popular with the vast majority of homeowners so the idea of actually getting the CC&Rs recorded died on the vine.

    Glen, K9STH
    NH7RO and K3UJ like this.
  4. AI0K

    AI0K Ham Member QRZ Page

    That was very sloppy on the developer's part. Around the DC area, developers record the CC&R's before the first shovel is turned. Failure to do so could result in serious legal repercussions for negligence.

    Also, in most jurisdictions HOAs do not have to grandfather anything. They generally do - but are not required to do so. That's one of the problems with HOAs - they can change the rules almost at will.

    We had a case here in Maryland where an HOA tried to get everyone to install the same curbside mailboxes. The problem was these boxes cost around $500 each. One guy refused and the HOA sued him. He spent over $30K in legal fees but won the case. It's one of the few times an HOA has been limited in their actions - but it proves the are not as omnipotent as they think.
  5. AI0K

    AI0K Ham Member QRZ Page

    Also - hopefully Congress will be some help. The bill before them is not great for hams, but it's better than nothing.
  6. K9STH

    K9STH Ham Member Staff Member QRZ Page


    Generally, developers do record CC&Rs before selling any building sites. However, there have been, maybe still are, those who don't get around to recording the CC&Rs until after the development is, basically, "built out". Those developers definitely can cause problems because, at least in Texas, the CC&Rs do not apply to those who purchased property before they were recorded. Most people do not realize that, if they purchased property before the recording took place, only zoning laws apply and not the CC&Rs.

    An HOA does not have to be a bad thing and there are, at least around here, a number of HOA that do not have any CC&Rs to enforce. My neighborhood, when I purchased my house, was "the" neighborhood in the Dallas, Texas, area and it is still a very desirable area to live. Politicians, sports figures, television personalities, and so forth, lived, in fact still live, in this development of almost 5000 houses. When I bought my house, Rodger Staubach, the Dallas Cowboy's quarterback, lived down the hill and around the corner. A major television personality lived across the street (his wife wanted a house nearer the country club and they moved a few blocks away, they still live there). There is a nationally syndicated cartoonist who lives in the next block, on my street, down the hill. A major country club is less than 2-blocks from my house.

    There is an HOA that has yearly dues of $15.00. Although there are no CC&Rs, the HOA does sponsor things like a 4th of July parade; purchases all sorts of landscaping materials, in bulk, and then sells them to the members (and anyone else in the area) at cost; has a flag program where U.S. flags are posted at the curb for every major holiday; sponsors a citizens patrol that works with the local police department to curb crime; assists the elderly and disabled with maintaining their property; and a number of other things.

    The only restrictions for antennas are zoning laws and there are quite a few amateur radio towers in my neighborhood. When I put up my main tower, the zoning restrictions were no towers over 100-feet above ground, in a residential area, without getting a variance. Frankly, safely guying a tower over 100-feet above ground is very difficult on the average residential lot in this city. My towers have been "up" for years and I have had only a single complaint about them. That neighbor moved in quite a while after they were erected and then complained about them. Right now, there are no persons on the entire street (not just in my block) that were here before the towers were erected.

    K5CQ lives less than 100-yards straight north of me and his tower is slightly over 30-feet higher than my tower (above ground) right at 100-feet. However, he is "downhill" and his top antenna is a couple of feet lower A.M.S.L. than my main tower.

    Here are my antennas:

    Instead of complaining about my antennas, I have neighbors who tell me that, if I ever move, I have to leave my main tower in place! It seems the tower is the landmark by which they tell people how to find their houses! Frankly, most people just do not even realize that there are towers in my neighborhood.

    Glen, K9STH
  7. WB2WIK

    WB2WIK Premium Subscriber QRZ Page

    See attached. Street view of K6SMF's house here in L.A.

    Neil has five towers on a 1/2-acre lot. Hard to tell in the picture (Google street view thingie) but they're pretty big. Neil doesn't believe in tribanders, multibanders, etc. so he has all monobanders for the HF bands from 40m to 10m, plus beams for 6m and 2m. His 17m/40m stack (left-most tower) has the antennas sitting at 72' and 85' above ground (70' telescoping tower) and his 17m monobander is on a 40 foot boom.

    He's been there a long time. I've spoken with some of his neighbors and asked them about the towers.

    "What towers?" is the typical response.

    Who goes around looking up at towers?:p

    Attached Files:

  8. W2AAT

    W2AAT XML Subscriber QRZ Page

    I wouldn't count on the "us" siding with you. Often the "owners" want rules that are stricter than those outlined in the CC&R's or/and ARC guidelines. My recommendation is that you get on the ARC board and try to tweak the ARC Guidelines to accommodate your needs without drawing community attention.
  9. WB6BUM

    WB6BUM Ham Member QRZ Page

    KW1K Ham Member QRZ Page
    I had a similar issue.

    "There is a US Statute which prohibits an HOA from allowing you to have a flagpole to display the US flag"
    I once had an attorney that made these sort of mistakes. He is no longer my attorney.....
    NH7RO likes this.
  10. W2AAT

    W2AAT XML Subscriber QRZ Page

    They can tell you where you can and cannot locate your "flagpole". Also, the height.... They can tell you to fly your flag on a flagpole that is attached to your house.

    Another thing... When you take on the HOA Board, you are also taking on your neighbors. PO'd neighbors can make your life miserable. Especially if they are from New Jersey :)
    Last edited: Nov 14, 2017

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