Some historical photos taken in 1945

Discussion in 'ex-Rag Chew Central' started by G0GQK, Feb 23, 2012.

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  1. G0GQK

    G0GQK Ham Member QRZ Page

    These are photo's taken by an American photographer at the fall of Berlin. i believe some of the photo's were published in TIME magazine but apparently not all of them. One can only say, my god, those RAF and USAAF air raids made a mess of the city, and what was gained ? And one has to be amazed at how the Germans with American assistance of the Marshall Plan rebuilt Berlin and Germany from this hell on earth
  2. K8ERV

    K8ERV Ham Member QRZ Page

    WoW, I copied most of them.

    TOM K8ERV Montrose Colo
  3. W4HAY

    W4HAY Ham Member QRZ Page

    If you want to see the post war ruins of Vienna used as the backdrop of a very good mystery drama, rent The Third Man, with Joseph Cotton and Orson Wells. The chase sequence filmed in the sewers of Vienna is a classic.
  4. N0SYA

    N0SYA Ham Member QRZ Page

  5. K7KWN

    K7KWN Ham Member QRZ Page

    Very interesting pictures, and so sharp and clear. I love the small details that are visible.
  6. G8ADD

    G8ADD Ham Member QRZ Page

    Yes, the RAF and USAAF made a mess of the "Big City", and they paid a terrible price doing it: roughly 50% of the aircrew trained for the RAF Bomber Command finished up as dead or prisoners of war, I don't know off-hand the figures for the USAAF but I imagine they were similar. What was gained? Disruption of German war industries and communications leading eventually to paralysis. Note also that in the end Berlin was fought over on the ground, great damage was done by artillery and Soviet tactical air operations in those final hours.

    Berlin was eventually rebuilt, but ordinary Berliners spent literally years living in basements and heavily damaged buildings: in 1948 they were just barely kept from starvation for several months by the Berlin Air Lift after the Soviets cut off road, rail and canal access to the American, British and French sectors, and at that time, three years after the end of hostilities, there had been little reconstruction. Come to think of it, reconstruction in the UK started very slowly, too, though it accelerated considerably with the introduction of pre-fabricated housing, the good old "pre-fabs", some of which are still in use today not too far from where I live.


    Brian G8ADD
  7. K8ERV

    K8ERV Ham Member QRZ Page

    WIKI has an interesting article on it, but it is spelled Teufelsberg by WIKI.

    TOM K8ERV Montrose Colo
  8. N2EY

    N2EY Ham Member QRZ Page

    Victory, for one thing. At a lower price and a shorter time, too.

    The more the RAF and USAAF could disrupt the Jerries, the faster the ground forces could advance, and with fewer losses. The flyboys paid a heavy price, though.

    D-Day was bad enough as it was. Had the Luftwaffe been able to mount an effective defense, Allied losses would have been staggering, and the whole thing might have failed.

    Look up a place called "Ploesti" and the date August 1, 1943.

    In the Pacific war, the disruption of shipping by submarines and air power over both land and sea avoided the need for an invasion.

    73 de Jim, N2EY
  9. 2E0OZI

    2E0OZI Ham Member QRZ Page

    And the use of 2 atomic bombs. I once read that a aide of the Emperor said that as these weapons were completely outside the experience of the Japanese armed forces, they "allowed" a surrender to take place. In other words it was OK to be defeated by "otherworldly forces" but not by stuff they could understand.
  10. N2EY

    N2EY Ham Member QRZ Page

    Even after The Bomb, there were those in the Japanese leadership who did not want to give up. Had they known that the USA did not have any more bombs after Nagasaki, and that it would be months before more were ready, they might have held out.

    Firebombs killed more than A-bombs, too.

    btw, it was air power that delivered The Bomb. The B-29 program actually cost more than the Manhattan Project.

    73 de Jim, N2EY
  11. 2E0OZI

    2E0OZI Ham Member QRZ Page

    Yes sure was air power Jim - the B29 was a huge leap forward in so many ways and in others was the last gasp of a dying technology.

    I cant remember what book it was but as you say there were "mad" elements that were quite prepared to sacrifice every single person in Japan. Whatever he was - the Emperor was not mad.

    Another very little known sidelight to the war on Japan was the final gasp of expansion stopped by Australian troops at Ioribaiwa and Milne Bay. Major General Horii could see Port Moresby.....but with his men dying and practically walking skeletons the order to "advance to the rear" seemed to "come as no suprise to a man who suddenly looked much older than his 55 years" said journalist Seizo Okada who happened to be in the commanders tent when the order arrived.

    Beaten by men for the very first time. And the hellish jungle.
  12. G0GQK

    G0GQK Ham Member QRZ Page

    What surprised me reading an article about Germany after 1946 was that the British government shared quite a large percentage of the food and coal available in Britain with the destitute and homeless Germans. This seems to me to be extremely generous gesture on the part of the Labour government at the time, they didn't ask the British people who would most probably have refused.! The winter of 1947 was treacherous, I remember as a kid the snowdrifts up the sides of houses covering windows, it was far below freezing for two months, and it would be even colder in Germany. Of course the Berlin Airlift kept people just about from freezing and starving.

    Another thing the British Army of the Rhine did was to get Germany being democratic and the Federal system they have in Germany was devised by the British, and yet..... a few years ago British MP's were set dead against the federal system in the EU ! Many may recall it was a British army officer who got VW into production again. He was perhaps a better soldier than business man he said that the VW heap of junk wouldn't sell, look at VW now ! Same with Skoda who made engines for the Messerschmitt 109 and Heinkel, it was a joke on every comedians menu, now look at Skoda, one of the best cars on the road. And who owns it..... VW !

    This is what irritates me about the EUSSR, all those big shots in that organisation regard Britain as bad Europeans, what short memories those people in mainland Europe have. The number of times we've dragged 'em out of the brown stuff, including the Russians who were our allies.

    I'm off to post some US army vehicle photo's taken in a Russian museum leftovers from the US war help to Russia. They were all supposed to be returned after the war (!) but some got lost and they look better now than they day they arrived in Murmansk
  13. N2EY

    N2EY Ham Member QRZ Page

    What "dying technology" do you mean?

    There are all sorts of madness. Intentional war is one kind, unquestioning belief in a human leader is another.

    Admiral Yamamoto is reported to have said, after Pearl Harbor, "I fear that all we have done is to awaken a sleeping giant and fill him with a terrible resolve". He did not live to see how right he was.

    As horrible as the air war was, an invasion of Japan would have been far worse. I have been told it was scheduled to start Nov. 1, 1945. Fortunately for all, it did not happen.

    73 de Jim, N2EY
  14. W4HAY

    W4HAY Ham Member QRZ Page

    While the B-29 did see limited service in Europe, the B-17 was the workhorse in that theater. Supposedly a B-29 was sent to fly around Europe to mislead Hitler and Hirohito into thinking it was a preview of coming attractions there instead of its intended service in the Pacific.

    One of the most appreciated improvements was dispensing with that under-slung ball turret gun. Partial fuselage pressurization and a remotely operated fire control system were other big improvements. Engine reliability was a lingering problem.
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2012
  15. WA4KCN

    WA4KCN XML Subscriber QRZ Page

    piston engines in military aircraft
  16. 2E0OZI

    2E0OZI Ham Member QRZ Page

    Indeed - piston engines. The RAF workhorse was the Lancaster - not as advanced by any means as the B29, but just as effective, and could carry up to 22,000lbs bombs......but the Arado 234 showed the way of the future, then the Canberra and the B47........massed bomber fleets were a thing of the past.

    I am particularly fascinated by aircraft at the ned of the piston engine days like the A2J Savage, the Shackleton, the P5M Marlin......
  17. W4HAY

    W4HAY Ham Member QRZ Page

  18. G8ADD

    G8ADD Ham Member QRZ Page

    I am interested in the Typhoon and Tempest, they followed the Spitfire and Hurricane and gave good service but somehow never caught the public attention .

    Massed bomber fleets may have been a thing of the past, but in 1959 or 60 (I can't remember which) I saw a procession of B47s high fly over my house: I watched over a dozen with an astronomical telescope, there may have been more. I've often wondered what they were doing!


    Brian G8ADD
  19. KL7AJ

    KL7AJ Ham Member QRZ Page

    Inglourious #######s!

  20. 2E0OZI

    2E0OZI Ham Member QRZ Page

    I was at Duxford RAF base about 10 years ago when I was lucky enough to see a very intimate display by a old fellow flying a Spitfire Mk IX - the one said to be the best of the breed. The sound was magic.
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