Power Limits?

Discussion in 'General Technical Questions and Answers' started by KB1RRU, Nov 17, 2009.

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  1. KB1RRU

    KB1RRU Ham Member QRZ Page

    I'm kind of unclear on the rules. I can't find any specification for 2m, so I'm assuming you can use up to 1,500w PEP. 70cm says there are geographical restrictions? Where do I find them, I've been googling for about an hour now and I give up. :confused:
     
  2. KF7AYS

    KF7AYS Ham Member QRZ Page

    Pull out the Part 97 rulebook that you are supposed to have in your shack and look it up. :) Part 97.313 specifically says:


     
    Last edited: Nov 17, 2009
  3. WA9SVD

    WA9SVD Ham Member QRZ Page

    Unfortunately, you have quoted OLD FCC rules. Technician Class licensees now have the same HF privileges as Novice license holders; it doesn't matter if they have passed a Morse proficiency Element or not.

    Novices and Techs ARE limited to 200 Watts on the HF (80, 40, 15, and 10 Meters) bands; Novices are limited to 25 Watts PEP on 222-225 MHz, and 5 Watts on 23 cm . Techs have legal limit (1500 Watts) on all Amateur bands above 30 MHz, meaning 6 Meters and above.

    There are some limitations on 70 cm, based on geographical location; and a few other exceptionn on other bands. Check §Part 97.313
     
  4. W9GB

    W9GB Ham Member QRZ Page

    SEE below for your specific state restriction.

    Amateur radio is under Part 97 of the Federal Communications Commission (FCC) Rules.
    Here is 1998 version, on FCC web site:
    http://www.fcc.gov/Bureaus/Engineering_Technology/Documents/cfr/1998/47cfr97.pdf

    The ARRL tries to keep an on-line copy "up-to-date" with FCC amendments and Rule Making --
    their update version as of February 2007.
    http://www.arrl.org/FandES/field/regulations/news/part97/

    Regarding the usage of the 70 cm (420 - 450 MHz allocation), here is band plan.
    http://www.arrl.org/FandES/field/regulations/bandplan.html#70cm

    The ARRL FCC Rule Book outlines the grographical areas of USA (10 specific regions listed)
    that have power restrictions on 70 cm, 33 cm and 23 cm bands. Pages 4-16, 4-17, 4-18.
    These areas are along the Canadian/US border and near DoD, NORAD or AFB operational areas.

    50 W PEP output power restriction apply to amateurs operating within circles centered
    on designated military installations in the USA.

    Exception exists for earth telecommand stations from 433-438 MHz, for 611 W ERP pointed 10 degrees above horizon ... without prior DoD permission.
    #5 For the state of Massachusetts within a 150 kilometer (100-mile) radius around the locations at Otis AFB, MA (LAT. 41 deg, 45 min N; LONG. 70 deg, 32 min W)

    In addition, the Department of Defense (DoD) usage of the PAVE PAWS radar (PPR) system has caused additional restrictions of US 70 cm repeater operations in portions of the USA (e.g. portions of MA).
    ===
    w9gb
     
    Last edited: Nov 17, 2009
  5. WA9SVD

    WA9SVD Ham Member QRZ Page


    Thanks Greg.

    Also, PAVE-PAWS has wreaked havac on 70 cm repeater operations in Northern (and Central) California. I believe the DoD, ARRL, and many repeater trustees are still negotiating the situation to prevent absolute shutdown of repeaters in that area.
     
  6. W6VPS

    W6VPS Ham Member QRZ Page

  7. KF7AYS

    KF7AYS Ham Member QRZ Page

    Then the FCC needs to update their own website in a more timely fashion as that is where I got the rules from.

    Cheers and 73,

     
  8. WA9SVD

    WA9SVD Ham Member QRZ Page

    Probably very true. The code requirement for any or all classes of Amateur licenses were eliminated over two years ago. (February, 2007 if I'm correct.) For the latest, greatest copy of §Part 97, the best bet is to get it (ironically) from the ARRL website:

    www.arrl.org/FandES/field/regulations/news/part97/


    The CURRENT rules state:

    §97.313 (a) An Amateur station must use the minimum transmitter power necessary to carry out the desired communications.
    (b) No station may transmit with a tranmsitter power exceeding 1.5 kW PEP
    ( C ) No station may transmit with a power exceeding 200 W PEP:
    (1) On the 10.1-10.15 MHz segment; or
    (2) When the control operator is a Novice Class operator or a Technician Class operator...


    NOTE: The above is deemed an error in the rules, and Techs have ALWAYS had maximum legal limit on 6 Meters and above. The 200 Watt limit was intended to apply to the "grandfathering" to Novice privileges on HF (80, 40, 15, and 10 Meters) but not meant to affect the power level allowed Technician Class licensees on the traditional Tech frequencies. A clarification is "in the works," but hasn't had priority with the FCC, apparently not until the next substantive change in §Part 97 comes about.
     
  9. W0IS

    W0IS Ham Member QRZ Page

    I went to look at the rules to prove you wrong, but it looks like you're right! I wasn't aware that they had made that change, and it does sound like it was unintentional with regard to technicians above 50 MHz.

    Until somewhere around 1975, the power limit for novices as 75 watts. At that time, the limit was increased to 200 watts. However, they also made another change, that the limitation no longer applied merely to novice licensees. It applied to anyone on the novice bands. Nobody ever did so, but when I was first licensed, it would have been perfectly legal for a general or higher to run 1 kW on the novice bands.

    So until a few years ago, when there were dedicated novice (and technician) bands on HF, this limitation remained in effect. Now, the "novice bands" are essentially the same as the bands for general and higher, so it makes sense that general and higher can use full power on those bands, but novice and technician need to use lower power. It looks like that's what the FCC was trying to do, but as you point out, they should have also included that technicians can use full power above 50 MHz, as they've always been allowed to do.
     
  10. WA9SVD

    WA9SVD Ham Member QRZ Page


    Actually, the original Novice Class licensee was limited to 75 Watts INPUT power, (which typically resulted in 40-60 watts output,) and crystal control was required. When synthesized transmitters (or transceivers) became available, the requirement for Xtal control was removed. And originally, the Novice ticket was good for only ONE year, non-renewable. You either had to upgrade after a year, or you were no longer a ham.
     
  11. KB1RRU

    KB1RRU Ham Member QRZ Page

    What I don't understand now is why are repeaters only being targetted in this whole PAVE PAWS issue? I'm kind of thinking it's not even worth getting a dual band mobile radio if I may be running the risk of interfering with this system. Wouldn't simplex have an equally likely probability of causing interference? I'd rather get a really nice 2M mobile rig, instead of a cheaper dual bander.
     
  12. K9STH

    K9STH Ham Member QRZ Page

    RRU:

    Repeaters are at a fixed location and generally have much better antennas than mobiles. Therefore, they put out stronger signals. Also, repeaters are operating a lot more time than most mobiles or base stations. That is why repeaters are "targeted" and not base stations and mobiles.

    Glen, K9STH
     
  13. W9GB

    W9GB Ham Member QRZ Page

    For 70 cm ... Amateur radio is a SECONDARY allocation -- DoD RadioLocation has the PRIMARY allocation.
    National Defense has been a high priority (budget and policy) since WW2.

    w9gb
     
  14. KB1RRU

    KB1RRU Ham Member QRZ Page

    I know we are secondary users. That questions was more about why is it just the repeaters and not anyone using the band simplex.
     
  15. KI6ZIF

    KI6ZIF Ham Member QRZ Page

    Here's the deal. As a secondary user, if you are causing interference with a primary user, you will end up with a FCC visit for sure.

    The Repeaters location, antenna height, power output, and duty cycle. Are what cause them to be more of an issue to the Pave Paws sites, then a mobile operator.

    The mobile operators, could be more of a minor annoyance, however I think most operators, are wise enough to "steer clear" of causing unnecessary problems for themselves.
     
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