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Need a replacement for 2N4416

Discussion in 'Homebrew and Kit Projects' started by KB3KSA, May 27, 2013.

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  1. KB3KSA

    KB3KSA Ham Member

    I have a radio project book that uses the 2N4416, saying that it's only a few cents. Must be old information, because they're now several dollars each.

    Is 2N3819 a suitable replacement? At 84 cents from Mouser it's still a little high if I want to get a bunch for experimenting.

    Thoughts?

    Mike
     
  2. KE3WD

    KE3WD Ham Member

    Do a Bing search for the datasheets for each of the two part numbers, find a free .pdf download for each and check the two against each other.

    Bipolar transistors, the substitute should meet or exceed the VCBo specs of the target, also check the hFe gain figure to make sure that the sub has the same or better gain spec. and ignore the rest of the data.

    Those two parameters are 90% or more of what's needed to know in order to substitute, the only other parameter to check is the Frequency in MHz spec, although these days it is not quite the problem it once was, just make sure that the sub can handle the freq of the orig - or higher - something likely to be of importance if it is in an RF circuit, not so important in other circuits such as AF or Switching, etc.


    73
     
  3. N2VWW

    N2VWW Ham Member

    According to NTE's software http://nte01.nteinc.com/webforms.nsf/qcsignin?openform
    both transistors sub to NTE312, so it should work.

    Note that the pinout may be different than the original so check the data sheets. Also the case is a TO-92.


    "Industry Number : 2N3819
    NTE Device Number: NTE312
    JFET-N-CH,VHF AMP/MIX,TO-92

    Lead configuration may vary from the original device. Consult technical section for device outline."
     
  4. KA9JLM

    KA9JLM Platinum Subscriber

    If noise is not a big concern then the sub should work.

    If low noise is needed, then the metal can or surface mount may be better.


    Have Fun.
     
  5. KB3KSA

    KB3KSA Ham Member

    I don't know, they're just oscillator projects.
     
  6. W9GB

    W9GB Ham Member

    Mike -

    Good exercise in reviewing component specifications/characteristics.
    In some applications, the 2N4416 package is desired (sealed case) such as military or harsh environments.

    Vishay Siliconix 2N4416/2N4416A/SST4416 datasheet : N-Channel J-FET, sealed TO-72 case
    http://www.micropik.com/PDF/2N4416.pdf

    Fairchild 2N3819 datasheet : N-Channel JFET, TO-92 case
    This device is designed for RF amplifier and mixer applications operating up to 450MHz,
    and for analog switching requiring low capacitance.

    http://www.ee.buffalo.edu/courses/elab/2N3819.pdf
     
    Last edited: May 27, 2013
  7. K9STH

    K9STH Ham Member

  8. KE3WD

    KE3WD Ham Member

    Sorry for assuming the transistor is a bipolar above.

    Yes, with FETs you can get away with quite a bit in the way of subbing, those MPF trannies are good to have in the parts drawer.

    The four-lead in metal case types may need a bit more though.

    When subbing small sig FETs, I look at the Gain figure after ascertaining that I've got the polarity right. Have been bitten by trying to sub one with a lower Gain in a Hi-Gain hole.


    73
     
  9. KA9JLM

    KA9JLM Platinum Subscriber


    Not sure I would waste my money on a part that just has NTE as a marking.

    If I went to Radio Shack I would have to wait for Cell Phone buyers, before I could pay.

    You can probably buy 10 of the correct parts for the price of 1 unmarked RS blank.

    I have seen many junk parts in RS. You need to have your tit in the wringer to buy semiconductors there.


    Maybe it is just me.
     
  10. K9STH

    K9STH Ham Member

    JLM:

    Actually, Radio Shack is in financial trouble because people are not "lining up" to purchase cellular telephones!

    Glen, K9STH
     
  11. KA9JLM

    KA9JLM Platinum Subscriber


    That may be True for good reason.

    You can go to Wal-M and eat free Grapes while you get your Free Cell Phone setup. And put it on a credit card that you can not pay for.


    I don't look for them to last long, Unless they start providing Popcorn, and changing their ways.
     
  12. KM1H

    KM1H Ham Member

    .


    The MPF-102 specs are all over the map and basically floor sweepings, I wouldnt use them for anything even semi critical. The selected version with a narrow range of pinch off specs are the 2N5484, 5485, and 5486 and ones that dont meet any of the specs becomes a MPF102. The 2N4416 is quite different and an above average device especially for an oscillator, it never was really cheap.

    Carl
     
  13. KB3KSA

    KB3KSA Ham Member

    The Radio Shack JFETS are Web only. Which is kind of silly since, if you're going to buy from the Web, why buy from RS?

    Anyway, I found some JFETS here: http://www.danssmallpartsandkits.net/

    I may also try the suggested replacements when I order next time from Mouser. Thanks.
     
  14. KE3WD

    KE3WD Ham Member

    Dan's small parts website supplies nice stuff, I think you'll be happy.
     
  15. K5UOS

    K5UOS Premium Subscriber

    The J310 is a great workhorse JFet. It will work for your oscillator circuits. I use them for oscillators, buffers and switches. I buy them by the 100’s.

    From Mouser they are .21 in lots of 25 each or .30 each.


    http://www.mouser.com/Search/Refine.aspx?Keyword=j-310

    Data Sheet:

    http://www.mouser.com/ds/2/308/J309-D-109346.pdf


    Experimenting with oscillator circuits is fun.

    These are some standard VXO and VFO circuits I use: The oscillator can be almost any active device either a bipolar or fet.
    I used a 2N4416 in one circuit because a I have a bunch. It was really a waste noting how expensive they are these days.

    I prefer Colpitts circuits using bipolar transistors like the 2n3904, an FET buffer and a bipolar feedback amp. I match most everything to 50ohms.
    Hartley circuits seem to be the easiest to get working...most fun, too. I don't use the Hartley much though.

    The bottom circuit uses J310's and 2N3904's in a hetrodyne oscillator for a 15M receiver.



    100_0255.jpg

    100_1685.jpg
    100_1420.jpg

    Hope you have fun with your experimenting! Once you are comfortable with oscillator and matching circuits there is almost no RF project you cannot tackle.

    I do suggest you try the J310 is some of your experiments.


    Another source for J310 (other parts): http://www.kitsandparts.com/parts.php



    Don K5UOS

     
  16. KA9JLM

    KA9JLM Platinum Subscriber

    If I could afford, Then I would go with a metal case. Depends on the App.

    I think it would help with the OSC stability.

    Temperature stability can be important.

    When swapping Parts that will work, how well is another story.


    Where is a drawing of what is being built ?
     
  17. K7ELP

    K7ELP Ham Member

    Mike I have 17 ea of the 2n3819 in my personal stock. I will sell any or all for 25 cents each plus postaqe. My email and address is good in the callsign data base.
    Ned
    K7ELP
     
  18. KK4DKE

    KK4DKE Ham Member

    lol at the concern for the price of parts. you are in the WRONG hobby if you think this hobby is cheap.
     
  19. KE0ZU

    KE0ZU Ham Member

    The metal can versions are plentiful on ebay, do a search.
     
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