I.R.L.P. or The Weather Channel?

Discussion in 'Ham Radio Discussions' started by N7DJK, Aug 25, 2002.

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  1. DocRF

    DocRF Banned

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (WF7I @ Aug. 27 2002,14:47)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">I don't have any problem with IRLP -- whatever floats your boat.  But I do want to repeat one thing that keeps popping up -- it is NOT that expensive to get into HF as a newcomer!

    KD7ONC wrote:
    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">What you have said is probably true for a lot of adults, but for teens and young people getting into the ham side of things that can be prohibitively expensive. I have a 2M HT and a few antenna's, but that's all I can afford. I am a teen that has a no-code tech license. [/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>

    The HT and the computer used for IRLP cost more than a beginning HF station, I will guarantee you.  Go to your local ham club.  Go to a swap meet.  Heck, try e-bay.  You can find good, cheap used HF gear for $100.  If people know you are young, they will often GIVE you some of their older gear.  

    I started at age 13.  I had a donated tube type rig.  The antennas were dipoles.  Sure I had to read up and talk to people about how to build the dipole, but isn't that part of the fun?  You can't tell me some speaker wire and a chassis connector from radio shack is going to break the bank!  Add a run of coax and you're done.  Total cost should be in range of $0 to $100.

    People living in apartments or housing associations have additional challenges, but there are articles in the magazines about how to come up with creative solutions.  Many a ham has their antenna in their attic.  It CAN be done.

    A lot of the fun of the hobby to me came from CREATING the antennas and soldering the connectors and repairing and operating the old boatanchor donated equipment.  Then when you do work the DX, you feel you have really accomplished something.  It's also very rewarding to learn how to get on HF in the cheap.  Lots of guys doing QRP CW can attest to that.  Some of the rigs literally cost nothing to build (once you have a collection of junk box parts) and they can work the world.

    Not trying to be critical, just helpful & encouraging.  If you need any additional tips and/or help getting on HF, feel free to email me.

    Have fun es 73, WF7I[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    WF7I, I agree with much of what you wrote except one thing - you do NOT need a PC for IRLP. You only need the HT. A used full-featured HT costs around $50. You really can't do that with HF. And I'm one of the ones who says HF can be cheap - because people like you and me are willing to help the newbies fix a hamfest "bargain" for free. I do it all the time.

    Get the newbie a used HF rig with tube finals. Then, use 10 cent per foot consumer-grade TV twinlead fed to a folded dipole, or a random length double made out of 6 cent per foor 14 gauge THHN wire from the local home building supply store. Using a $150 Kenwood TS-520 or a $200 Yaesu FT-101B, since the rig has a pi network, you don't need a tuner. Just tune the mismatched twinlead, which has far less loss than RG-8 anyway. On the air on HF for less than $200 with a MUCH better station than the guy who bought an IC756 for $2500, and a horribly lossy trapped dipole kit with horribly lossy RG-8 feeders, and paid $200 for the privelege of all that loss.

    Doc
     
  2. Guest

    Guest Guest

    [​IMG]1--></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (kd7nqb @ Aug. 26 2002,16[​IMG]1)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">OK I currently am waiting for K9OX one of my personal friends to get his IRLP node running but from what I have heard it seams like it is a cool idea that allows people like me who have trouple with code to talk to people all over the world.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>

    I wonder when they will get a 2m repeater with IRLP setup on some dx like Samwitch Island? Would that be a cool pileup.
    [​IMG]
     
  3. KB2KAB

    KB2KAB Ham Member QRZ Page

    [​IMG] The idea is this. As Ham Radio Operators we should be doing everything possible to keep the radio freq's that we have ACTIVE. If you remember what happen in AUSTRALIA, a few yrs. ago. This is a very easy way to get DX. But the true way, BY USING THE RADIO AND ONLY THE RADIO. Not all freq's are covered, and if they are not used they certinley be taken away. So use the radio, it's the fun and only way to get a true DX.
    THANKS
    HAVE A GREAT DAY 73'S KB2KAB [​IMG]
     
  4. Guest

    Guest Guest

    hopefully my post was better read by others.

    i never mentioned satellite TVRO as part of my ham radio hobby =] .. that's a whole other mess.

    i personally am active in operating as well as promoting hf and compact ways of doing it.

    elmering is elmering, i never applied for the job here in my neck of the woods. noone, yes i mean noone else wanted the job. i don't have a cheat sheet i work from with every kid knocking on my door. i'm an all mode/band elmer. probably not the best, but i am in there. the example given was of course to show my support for irlp, not my lack of support for hf.

    i really tried to show my love for hf and my enthusiasm to pass it on to a younger crowd while supporting irlp as a way to link repeaters.

    !!there is no pc software you can dl to 'get on' irlp!!

    evidently my post was not clear enough or i'm doing it wrong. my apologies to the thread.
     
  5. VA7KBH

    VA7KBH Ham Member QRZ Page

    k6ntl:


    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"> (KBØWLF @ Aug. 28 2002,06:58)
    !!there is no pc software you can dl to 'get on' irlp!! [/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>

    Sure there is. You don't even need a radio to get on IRLP.
    Computer to computer communication is possible.

    Try this:
    http://www.synergenics.com/

    It's called echo link.

    I've never keyed a radio to use IRLP.

    But I did use it.
    [/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>

    Echolink and Ilink ARE NOT IRLP. Go to www.irlp.net and take a look. Or dial up Node 100 and ask Dave Cameron to explain it to you.

    Personally I do not like Echolink and IRLP. It is not the same as IRLP. While IRLP does use the internet, it requires the use of a radio. There is no way to use a simple computer to access the system. The designers had that in mind.

    I like IRLP. I like CW. I like 20M. I want to try Packet and I will probably like it. I am very interested in ATV, and if I get a chance to get into it I am sure I will like it.

    OT's seem to like blasting the new modes, and even the higher bands. Heaven forbid if some new licensees were to hear the grumpiness of everyone here and get scared off.

    IRLP may not be "real radio" to everyone. I use it for some fun chats around the globe on my HT. I have to go down to the local fire hall where our HF rig is set up and borrow someone's callsign to access those bands. Until I get my CW endorsement and an HF rig, I will continue using IRLP for fun.

    IRLP has come in useful to me on my vacations; sometimes it was the only way I could get my 5W QRP signal back home. Other times I used a 3el yagi to bounce the signal off of Mt Baker in Washington State. That was a lot of fun and some real radio!

    However, while I was studying for my license, and waiting for my callsign to become active, I dreamed of making a contact to Honolulu, Hawaii the first day I could.
    I did later, and I had the biggest smile on my face!

    Nowadays, I'm happy to use IRLP to seek out a few friends in different places. There is a IRLP for Kids net active, which is a great chance to meet other young hams around the world!!!

    I understand that all of these options exist on HF. But for now I'm happy with IRLP.

    Once again, IRLP is NOT Echolink and ILINK. It's a lot closer to real radio than those fake systems that even allow non-hams access (by simply making up a call).

    So, for once and for all, please be nice to the young hams that enjoy IRLP. It is a mode. While it is not REAL DX it may be a taste enough to convince amateurs to study and get their CW. It did for me! And when I get my code you will be able to find me on 20m as often as possible!!!!!!

    But please, please, please, leave IRLP alone, it is a very nice way of meeting other active amateurs!!!

    73
    VA7KBH
     
  6. AH6LE

    AH6LE Ham Member QRZ Page

    [​IMG]3--></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (k6ntl @ Aug. 28 2002,08[​IMG]3)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (KBØWLF @ Aug. 28 2002,06:58)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">!!there is no pc software you can dl to 'get on' irlp!![/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    Sure there is. You don't even need a radio to get on IRLP.
    Computer to computer communication is possible.

    Try this:
    http://www.synergenics.com/

    It's called echo link.

    I've never keyed a radio in a conventional manner to use IRLP.

    I could have activated the PTT with my left nostril.

    But I did use it. (but not with my left nostril)


    73, Kevin[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    I'm afraid you are sorely mistaken. IRLP is a completely different system from echo link and one cannot be used with the other.

    As has been repeated over and over and over again (for some reason, either some posters have reading comprehension problems or simply aren't willing to listen), you can NOT access to IRLP by simply downloading software for your PC (as a matter of fact, IRLP ONLY runs on Linux, not Windows and not MAC).

    Furthermore, IRLP is specifically designed NOT for plugging a mic into your computer, but rather to be interfaced to a radio. As has also been pointed out over and over and over again, IRLP is simply a replacement for wireless links by using the internet to move audio between nodes.

    I'm almost beginning to think there is some sort of deliberate misinformation agenda being propagated by some as to what IRLP is NOT. If it's not deliberate, then it seems a lot of people who are quite misinformed about IRLP are pretending they know more than they do. I'd prefer to believe the latter..

    Reminds me of a quote:



    Never attribute to malice that which can be satisfactorily explained by stupidity.
     
  7. VA7KBH

    VA7KBH Ham Member QRZ Page

    k6ntl and all:

    Apologies if I sounded angry at you all. I was just defending a part of ham radio that I enjoy. Just as I would 2m, 440MHz, or 20m!

    I agree with you on many points, but it's true we have our own opinions.

    Once again, apologies, and thanks for the interesting chat.

    VA7KBH
     
  8. NX4Y

    NX4Y Ham Member QRZ Page

    To those implying that Echolink is somehow "inferior" to IRLP- It can be just as secure as IRLP if you want it to. Even more so, with "accept only" lists, which IRLP does NOT do!
     
  9. N2CKH

    N2CKH Ham Member QRZ Page

    Amateurs worldwide discuss the weather and just about anything else that is current or of interest via all our allocations and modes, so what's the point ?

    Regarding IRLP, just like other innovations before, after and to come that enhance the quality and capability of Amateur Radio communications, they are the future of Amateur Radio. Furthermore, with IRLP, unlike other VoIP linking methods, a radio MUST be used on both ends of the connection !

    The application of wide area repeater linking via the Internet in daily and Emergency Communications is not only a wonderful innovation, it is for most new licensees a driving factor to upgrade after tasting a bit of long distance communications. Today unlike when I was a kid, the FM scanner or Internet is more likely the first experience with ham radio, rather than the shortwave receiver. I know of many youngsters that now have their license due to the excitment of hearing an IRLP or other VoIP QSO on their scanner.

    Speaking of the new possibilites that IRLP brings to Amateur Radio and Emergency Communications, which in my opinion is the why Amateur Radio continues to exist, read the draft white paper on IRLP and Emergency Communications at http://www.qsl.net/aerials and learn more about the possbile applications of IRLP.

    With 23 years under my belt and holding an Extra Class license, I have experience in many areas of the hobby and I have seen many changes take place within Amateur Radio, some good and some not good, IRLP
    is the best repeater linking options to come along so
    far.

    HF is NOT obsolete and will not be replaced by IRLP or anything else in my opinion. At least not until the commercial interests see to to that we loose our access
    to teh bands below 50Mhz or to the RF spectrum in general, which I personally hope never happens. However, HF is NOT the only game in town and IRLP and other forms of long range VoIP repeater linking not only have there place, they are a prime factor for the growth and evolution of the Amateur Radio Service.

    If anyone would like to discuss this issue via a CW QSO on 160 meters or elsewhere send me an e-mail. You can
    also contact me via IRLP nodes 4040 and 7280.

    Sincerely,

    /s/ Steve, N2CKH
    n2ckh@arrl.net
    http://www.qsl.net/n2ckh
    [​IMG]
     
  10. AB0KB

    AB0KB Ham Member QRZ Page

    This whole thread really makes me sad. In many ways the "discussion" sounds just like many others I have heard from some in the ham radio community and it appears to me to contain a lot of anger by one sub-group over an apparent threat to thier bragging rights for some accomplishment (be it code, dx contacts whatever) by some new and different application or operation in ham radio.

    Unfortunately, it often appears that people from both sides are guilty of attacking and defending without doing the needed homework and so the facts also get lost. I think ham radio, and it's purpose, is much bigger than these kinds of arguments.

    Getting computers and the internet more involved in ham radio is clearly an expression of our mission to keep advancing techniques and methods of communication. With every advance something always gets easier but that doesn't lesson the accomplishment associated with the old way. You can bet that people getting their license today don't have to have the knowlege or skills you did. But that was the same situation when you got your license too. You can't have progress without change.

    Let's try to support and respect both those who's interest lies in new ways and those who's interest lies in the established ways. Let's save our anger and energy for threats to our ham radio mission. For example threats to our radio spectrum.

    Best wishes to all,
    Steve, AB0KB
     
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