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FCC asked to allow digital AM.

Discussion in 'Amateur Radio News' started by KD7YVV, Apr 28, 2019.

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  1. KD7YVV

    KD7YVV Ham Member QRZ Page

    https://www.radioworld.com/news-and...broadcasting-asks-fcc-to-allow-all-digital-am

    I found this on Eham originally and posted the following comment there.
    I believe that digital AM would definitely ruin the broadcast band DX hobby.
    Thoughts anyone?

    I'm quite satisfied with the AM broadcast band the way it is.
    I do like messing with broadcast band DX at night and I believe this would ruin that pastime for me.
    I've used D-Star and if the signal isn't optimal, you get digital artifacts that make the audio
    sound like R2D2 on crack. Look at OTA digital TV.
    If the signal isn't just right, you don't get the station.
    At least back in the days of analog, you got SOMETHING.
    (Remembering receiving Alfred Hitchcock Presents in Union City New Jersey on WHYY Philadelphia
    when I was a kid). Also, when I was a kid, I picked up WKDW Buffalo during the Blizzard of '77 on a
    transistor radio late at night.

    Switch AM to digital and the BCBDX hobby goes away.
    If a petition comes up to vote on this, my vote will be a definite NO.
     
    WQ4G likes this.
  2. AC0GT

    AC0GT Ham Member QRZ Page

    And if the signal is "just right" I get 1080i lines of resolution, incredible surround sound, and just generally a very enjoyable experience. I would like to know more about what is proposed here before I can give a definitive up or down vote.

    Does it? People can still try to pick out the signal from great distances. Even if broadcast DX does go away what's the real loss here? So what if people can't on occasion pick out a weak and noisy AM broadcast station from far away. Go try listening for the transoceanic aircraft traffic, or the marine SSB traffic, or numerous other MF and HF stations out there yet.

    Or go get an Amateur radio license and participate more actively. <snark>I hear the FCC is giving them out on cereal box tops now. Just fill out the form and mail it in with a $10 bill attached.</snark>
     
  3. AG6QR

    AG6QR Premium Subscriber QRZ Page

    I believe the AM BCB is not being run for the benefit of hobbyist DXers. Neither the commercial interests who run the stations, nor the FCC which regulates those stations really cares about keeping the DX hobby vibrant. Keeping the stations profitable is king. For that you need advertising revenue, and that's driven by mostly local listeners.

    So if you want to defeat this petition, don't attack it because of what it will do to the hobby DXer. But if you can make a valid case that it will reduce the commercial viability of the stations, you may sway some minds that matter.
     
    WU8Y and AC0GT like this.
  4. KD7YVV

    KD7YVV Ham Member QRZ Page

    Here's what's going on. If the AM broadcast band goes digital, then the hobby of broadcast band DX will cease to exist.
    Yes there are times you can pick up a DX digital TV signal and you'll get the station, but it's all or nothing.
    I've shared my experience as a kid picking up broadcast band DX and DX TV.
    Was it a crystal clear picture? Nope. Was the AM signal perfect? Nope, but that was my first experience with DX'ing.
    While I DO participate in amateur radio, TV DX and broadcast band DX are also fun. It would be a shame for a hobby like this to go away.
     
  5. KD7YVV

    KD7YVV Ham Member QRZ Page

    I agree, a station's prime concern is profitablity, but in a lot of cities, you have tall buildings which can cause signal multipath.
    Even going under an overpass on the highway can somewhat disrupt an analog AM signal. If digital also gets disrupted this way,
    I believe the station would blank out completely instead of having some static for a few moments while you go under an overpass.
    AM works, why change it?
     
    WQ4G likes this.
  6. K4RGN

    K4RGN Premium Subscriber QRZ Page

    Technologists have been trying to "save" AM broadcast radio since the AM stereo wars of the 1970s. Nothing has worked, and meanwhile the QRN problem keeps getting worse.

    Nighttime QRM has always been a problem when introducing new technologies on the AM band, even the analog AM stereo systems. The FCC doesn't give a hoot about MW DXers, but they do listen when a licensee complains about increased QRM from other licensees.

    That said, in all but the largest cities it is difficult to turn a profit on an AM station. The crap hits the fan, financially speaking, when the time comes to make a major cash investment such as a new transmitter... or when the owner discovers that the land underneath the antenna(s) is more valuable than the station itself. Licensees are simply walking away. A case can be made that innovation is very much in the public interest at this point and that the FCC should allow it.

    If the FCC were to move all analog stations out of a chunk of spectrum like 1610-1700 -- comparable to the repack currently underway for TV -- the digital signals could be segregated in a sub-band and there would be no QRM with analog stations. But that costs money, and it's also not easy to coordinate the frequency channels to prevent additional QRM below 1610.

    Or to put it differently, from the perspective of the top markets where an AM station can still make money, what's the problem? Those owners don't care if all the medium and small markets eventually lose their AM stations.
     
  7. AC0GT

    AC0GT Ham Member QRZ Page

    Do you know what would also make AM DX listening go away? AM broadcasters losing advertisers, listeners, and therefore money, through competition from other services like FM, satellite, internet streams, etc.

    AM radio is plagued by noise right now. I like listening to the news and opinion shows on AM but I often find myself fighting for a clear signal. If I could get that with digital TV like clarity then I'd simply love it. I've given up on AM listening at home for the most part, there's just too much noise. I listen to the local AM broadcast stations over an internet stream most of the time. If AM stations can't keep listeners over the air then they will simply stop transmitting. They will move their content to satellite, FM, TV, internet, or whatever else makes them money.

    You want to block digital radio over a potential loss of your hobby? I say, be careful what you wish for because you just might get it.
     
  8. WQ4G

    WQ4G Ham Member QRZ Page

    Now there you go getting all snarky about it....

    Yep, the signal has to be 'just right' or you don't get TV reception. IMO the guy who invented digital TV needs his (expletive deleted) kicked. Digital TV, as it currently exists, works great when conditions are good. But, if it's raining, the humidity gets too high or too low, the wind blows too hard, there is fog, smoke in the air, or a Helicopter flies by the Digital TV does not work. When you really need the TV, like during storms (hurricanes) and inclement weather, it does not work. My Digital TV reception even takes a dive when the atmospheric conditions are TOO good.

    And, I would expect that Digital Radio will provide similar results. Which means during times of emergency, when you really need broadcast radio and the information it provides, it won't be there. At least with analog signals the information still gets through. There might be a snowy picture on the TV or there might be a lot of static on the radio but you can usually still hear what you need to hear. Not necessarily so with digital...

    Dan KI4AX
     
  9. N1EN

    N1EN Premium Subscriber QRZ Page

    People still listen to terrestrial broadcast radio?
     
    AC0GT likes this.
  10. KP4SX

    KP4SX Ham Member QRZ Page

    Rendering millions of radios obsolete introduces some problems. Sure, they did it with TV but it was spread over a decade and stations were able to transmit both analog and digital for the duration. Not to mention $40 discount cards for converters :)
    So just HOW can AM radio make a similar transition without going to a completely new band? And is it really worth the bother?
     
  11. KD7YVV

    KD7YVV Ham Member QRZ Page

    Actually, what I want is of no consequence. I didn't want the switch to digital TV either but as I said, what I want is of no consequence.
    Why? Because I"m just one man, not a huge corporation run for profit. There's nothing wrong with me wanting the AM band to remain as it is,
    but people and corporations are going to do what they want so I may as well enjoy BCBDX while I can.
     
  12. KD7YVV

    KD7YVV Ham Member QRZ Page

    That's one reason that I think OTA digital has problems. As I said, if things aren't just right, you have nothing.
    I do have cable, but can't wait to move back to the city so I can try some of the OTA TV stations.
    I know during my experience with D-Star, that there are times the signal is marginal and all you hear is scrambled audio.
    There are also millions of cars that have AM/FM radios in them, and going digital will make those radios obsolete.
     
    WQ4G likes this.
  13. KD7YVV

    KD7YVV Ham Member QRZ Page

    Yes. I especially like "When Radio Was" where they play old radio serials like Superman, The Shadow, My Favorite Husband,
    Our Miss Brooks, Yours Truly Johnny Dollar, and many others.
     
    WQ4G likes this.
  14. AC0GT

    AC0GT Ham Member QRZ Page

    If that's the case then something is wrong with your TV. My TV "antenna" right now is a random length of speaker wire on my kitchen floor, connected to the F-connector on the TV with a balun I got at a hardware store. I learned not to step on the antenna as that seems to interfere with reception, other than that I can watch the local news just fine in any weather. As soon as the weather warms up some more I might climb on the roof to put up a proper antenna.
     
  15. KK5JY

    KK5JY Ham Member QRZ Page

    WQ4G likes this.

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