Calif. hams face thousands of dollars in state fees for repeater sites in the midst of wildfire emer

I do care about ham radio. What I don't care for is the "sky is falling" and worse attitudes that "lives are in danger". It doesn't paint ham radio in a very good light - trust me on this. There are a LOT of hams who work in this business, and we do our best to paint ham radio in a positive light inside the PS/LMR world.

Yes, I am pro LMR - that's my job! The system we manage and run does a very good job delivering the services needed. Ham radio is something very different. That's just reality - there is no ham radio equivalent to a system with over 100,000 radios, 1,000's of consoles, 200+ sites.

I work together with agencies across my State - no lone wolf here!

 

Fair enough. I’m with you there. The information on operating an amateur repeater on the sites in question is available on the State’s web site. It speaks for itself. I perused the application and it seemed pretty boilerplate. The requirements didn’t seem terribly unreasonable to me, especially considering it’s California we’re talking about. Certainly not unreasonable enough to warrant some of the hysterics I’ve seen over this issue on the political sites. I just don’t get why this is getting so many people’s panties in a twist, aside from the fact that the most angry commenters seem to have no knowledge about ham radio.

 

I just read your post again. And something struck me... "In my opinion, you're a Pro LMR advocate that doesn't seem to care much for ham radio.." Where should I be? I care deeply for ham radio, but I think this speaks volumes about where you're coming from. Aren't you a "Pro LMR advocate"? Don't you want to see the system that dispatches 911 calls to your community work well and be reliable? Or is "Big Government" just always wrong? Yes, I work for the government, yes, the systems we run are complex and expensive - way more so than any linked ham repeater system. But they are also very reliable. There are redundancies built in, the equipment we use runs for YEARS, sometimes a DECADE plus - without interruption. We have Alcatel MDR-8000 microwave radios that run non-stop except for yearly preventative maintenance, and have done so for nearly 20 years. I have Nokia carrier grade routers that have been running 7/24/365 for years. Motorola repeaters providing P25 control channel data since the early part of last decade - 100W continuous duty 7/24/365 (outside a 5-6 hour yearly PM). That level of reliability and dependability doesn't just happen - that takes design, testing, and money. These systems are not cheap. But these systems actually do save lives - every day.

So yes, I am an Pro LMR advocate. And you should be too.

 

The ARRL has chimed in on this and made the same statement, "WAY Overblown"...

I believe the biggest problem is the CA DGS letter to the repeater group/owner.. The DGS letter strays from the issue at hand by making a comment and conclusion about amateur radio's usefulness. She should have stuck to the fact that the repeater was NOT on her inventory sheet. Additionally, she should have advised the repeater group/owner to contact the property owner (CAL FIRE) if a mistake had been made by omitting the repeater from the inventory sheet. END of STORY, her commentary stirred a lot of S**T unnecessarily...

 

Maybe she was speaking for herself, or maybe she was speaking on behalf of people who sincerely believe hams have no utility.

I'm a retired 20 year LEO who was in the heart of hurricane alley, just north of Miami, and I was a first responder, in each and every natural disaster.

Too be very honest, I never saw much 'utility' in the ham community either.

Matter of fact, during Andrew, my power was out. Roofs were blown off. Everything was flooded. I got on the air and heard nothing from the 'utility' community.

Who answered my call to pass messages to my loved ones? Not ARES/RACES/REACT or any of that crew on repeaters or HF.

It was the wideband audio guys on 14.178 who were experimenting with sounding better on SSB.

So, yes, in my opinion, the modern utility of hams in emergencies has been overblown by a club in Newington who raise prestige and capital from the labor of volunteers.

Not saying hams can't be useful in the present day, but their utility has diminished over time, and I'd be wary of employing many of them in the field, because their training is just not adequate.

 

If you're a retired LEO, then you know when it comes to communicating with the public, you keep your personal opinions to yourself.. The DGS letter was an official communication from the State of California to the repeater owner/group, that communication should have stuck to the Real Estate issues not personal opinion(s).

As far as your experiences with ham radio are concerned.. May be people hear you on the air and don't want to communicate with you, I really don't know????????

 

Thank you. As a retired Air Force Communications Officer, I functionally had way more than 50% say on all communications systems on my base. After all, if any of them didn't work, I was the one who had to fix it. And to tell you the truth, if any ham club tried to go through the approval process to get some space on one of my towers and in the equipment room below it, I wouldn't even think about the answer. "No."

Even my wing commander's antenna was always the lowest spot on any tower. It was a flip of the coin which got the top position-fire or police. Below that, civil engineering. And below my wing commander's antenna, any other LMR service that was approved by my wing commander (after I said I didn't see anything wrong with it on the approval form). My flight line folks always had their own totally separate systems from the support folks and even more restrictions from the FAA, so that was a "no brainer" for me also.

Hams? They'd only get in the way if the feces hit the fan. Of course, I'm talking about a military unit. The military plans and practices emergency action plans regularly. I would imagine there are some sheriff's departments who do the same (if they're good at what they do.) And if you're not in their Emergency Action Plans, well then, whose fault is that?

Not that I was completely against ham radio. When ever someone wanted to get approval to set up his station in base housing, I'd ask two questions: what make and model of radio, how much power (FCC type accepted equipment and low power)(100 watts is low power in the military). Then I'd explain to him if I find any interference with base systems, I'd revoke it. They always understood and were always appreciative and compliant. After all, they were talking to an extra class ham who was set up in base housing also. Then I'd help him with the drawings to submit to civil engineering and help him get it approved.

Never had a MARS station on any base I was responsible for all communications on, but I'm sure that's not a problem at the bases who do. Ft. Huachuca's MARS station was down by the flight line, and I'm sure they kept their bandwidths tight and any interference issues were dealt with expediently.

 

You're welcome, and thanks for your service. My dad served the United States Army for 20 years and retired as Sergeant First Class. He was a member of the 101st Airborne Division and the "Hell on Wheels" 2nd Armored Division. His Overseas Assignments were in Panama, Vietnam, and Germany. His Occupational Specialties were Field Artillery Crewman, HAWK Missile System Crewman, and Pershing Missile Guidance & Control Repairman. He was also a Senior Drill Sergeant & Instructor. He always said (expletive deleted) volunteers belong off the field and behind a desk.

I have friends on the radio who are retired and active law enforcement, military, fire, hostage negotiation and rescue, firearms instruction, border protection, but I don't know any whackers. I surveyed my friends and they agree with me.

I'm sure volunteers are competent to pass health and welfare traffic and some could perform flagger duty, it's just that I never actually encountered any 'ham volunteers' while on the job during an emergency.

The woman who sent the email to the repeater group was just expressing her opinion, and she's probably authorized to do so. If I were a facilities manager, I would want to make sure any non-state group with property on-site provided real benefits and was also paying it's fair share, and had proper insurance, in order to earn a place on/in the tower/vault, etc. Tax-payers shouldn't fund hams unless hams provide a real benefit. Bottom line: Provide real benefits to the taxpayers, or pay your fair share on property they own.

I was on the news all the time when I was an active law enforcement officer. CNN, CBS, NBC, ABC, NPR, NEWSMAX, you name it. Everything I said was my opinion, and the department never had an issue with it.

Matter of fact it led to an interesting post-career gig as a much older and larger (hi) law enforcement commentator.

 

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

 

Yup. $$$$$$$$$$$ And it's all right here in black and white:

Application Fees

Application fees for standard processing costs appear in the checklist on page 1 for each type of user. If any unusual additional costs are identified, such as the need for on-site testing, pre-payment will be required.

Lease Rates

The California Constitution prohibits the gift of state funds, therefore, unless a radio vault lease is for public emergency services, lease rates will be established based on current market rates determined by the Real Property Services Section (RPSS) of the California Department of General Services (DGS). The lease format will be the RPSS/CAL FIRE standard telecommunication lease.


PRIOR TO ADDITION OR DELETION of any transmitting or receiving frequencies, antennas or equipment, submittal of this application and all related fees is required for ALL non-State users (including new, pending, previous and current tenancy/occupancy). Approval is required by CAL FIRE prior to the proposed changes taking place in the facility.

In cooperation with the applicant, the State will attempt to meet all users’ operational requirements. Any subsequent labor time or material costs required for site engineering, antenna or combining system upgrades, or technician labor will be borne by the applicant at the PSCO current rates. Applicants will be notified by CAL FIRE of the amount due prior to work being performed.

No further processing of the application will take place until a written approval of these expenses, and payment, is received from the applicant.

And that's why ARRL said to negotiate with the site owner for a relaxation in requirements.

"Negotiation has resulted in considerable easing of the original requirements and a modification of terms to help mitigate the short-term financial impact on those repeater owners."

http://www.arrl.org/Groups/view/sacramento-valley

https://cdt.ca.gov/wp-content/uploads/2017/02/TD312-Revised-20131001.pdf

 

Oh bolony.....This is total BS. Cal Fire just wants this particular repeater owner to pay for rack space....... Many many many repeater owners across the country are paying big time to be on commercially owned towers.

 

That's what it sounds like, although, they do have a point about community service...

 

As well all should pay, it is biz, not entitlement.

 

I'm surprised we depend on The State. We need to remove government dependency from every aspect of communication. As The State completes the natural and inevitable transition from the Republic to Empire we will continue to lose individual freedoms, first and foremost is freedom of speech. Until The State is deposed, we need to focus on private property, and to a lesser extent Federal resources. Historically speaking, the biggest threat to our mutual safety is the The State itself. Look at the silver lining here -- divesting ourselves of the California Imperial Senate is a positive direction for the community.

 

I think this case might be the tip of the iceberg. As the federal gov't and California gov't face increasing deficits, they will be looking to raise cash everywhere. It's probably just a matter of time before more facility managers ask for lease money as they seek to raise revenue in the face of funding shortfalls. There is only so much entitlement money available, so governments either need to cut spending, or raise taxes and additional revenue in the form of fees, forfeitures, fines, taxes, levies, and other methods of squeezing an ever shrinking lemon.