Judge forces chemotherapy on a kid

[KC0VWU]

What this judge did is abominable. Since when did we become the property of the state? I suppose the Republicans around here will love this.

Quote[/b] ]NORFOLK, Virginia (AP) -- A judge ruled Friday that a 16-year-old boy fighting to use alternative treatment for his cancer must report to a hospital by Tuesday and accept treatment that doctors deem necessary, the family's attorney said.

CNN article. (http://www.cnn.com/2006/HEALTH/07/21/sick.teen.ap/index.html)

[KF0RT]

Part of the Terry Shiavo clan, no doubt. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif

73, Rob

[al2i]

The property could be better tracked for processing if it was marked for easy and accurate identification. It is for his own good.

[KC0VWU]

Quote[/b] (al2i @ July 20 2006,20:19)]The property could be better tracked for processing if it was marked for easy and accurate identification. It is for his own good.
Yeah, they ought to microchip him.

[al2i]

Quote[/b] (KC0VWU @ July 21 2006,17:20)]Quote[/b] (al2i @ July 20 2006,20:19)]The property could be better tracked for processing if it was marked for easy and accurate identification. It is for his own good.
Yeah, they ought to microchip him.
http://www.davemcgraw.com/Images/TattooJew.jpg

[KC0VWU]

Quote[/b] (al2i @ July 20 2006,20:31)]Quote[/b] (KC0VWU @ July 21 2006,17:20)]Quote[/b] (al2i @ July 20 2006,20:19)]The property could be better tracked for processing if it was marked for easy and accurate identification. It is for his own good.
Yeah, they ought to microchip him.
http://www.davemcgraw.com/Images/TattooJew.jpg
I don't know if I'd go that far.

[WD8OQX]

I'M republican and I say "what gives him the right"? - Where is our God given freedom of choice - where are our constitutional rights (pertaining to worship & faith)?

[KC0VWU]

Quote[/b] (WD8OQX @ July 20 2006,20:44)]I'M republican and I say "what give him the right"? - Where is our God given freedom of choice - where are our constitutional rights (pertaining to worship & faith)?
Then you are one of the good Republicans. Those values are what conservatism used to reflect.

[KF0RT]

Quote[/b] (WD8OQX @ July 21 2006,19:44)]I'M republican and I say "what gives him the right"? - Where is our God given freedom of choice - where are our constitutional rights (pertaining to worship & faith)?
They don't exist until you hit the magic age of 18 (or have the state's approval).

73, Rob

[KC0VWU]

Quote[/b] (KF0RT @ July 20 2006,20:46)]Quote[/b] (WD8OQX @ July 21 2006,19:44)]I'M republican and I say "what gives him the right"? - Where is our God given freedom of choice - where are our constitutional rights (pertaining to worship & faith)?
They don't exist until you hit the magic age of 18 (or have the state's approval).

73, Rob
But what about his parents? The judge ignored them too.

[KF0RT]

Quote[/b] (KC0VWU @ July 21 2006,19:47)]Quote[/b] (KF0RT @ July 20 2006,20:46)]Quote[/b] (WD8OQX @ July 21 2006,19:44)]I'M republican and I say "what gives him the right"? - Where is our God given freedom of choice - where are our constitutional rights (pertaining to worship & faith)?
They don't exist until you hit the magic age of 18 (or have the state's approval).

73, Rob
But what about his parents? The judge ignored them too.
Parents only count until "Social Services" gets involved. Parents are obligated to "do their best" for the children, and the state dictates what "best" means.

There have been cases where parents have put their "faith in the Lord" in similar situations and have been charged with manslaughter/murder when it didn't work out. It's part of being a legal guardian -- until the age of majority, it's the parents who are responsible. Herbal and/or religious treatments are generally seen as being irresponsible. It's okay if you do this to yourself of your own free will, but legally kids have no free will (except in some criminal cases), so this is what we wind up with.

The kid isn't old enough and the parents are doing the wrong thing. Case dismissed. If the kid was 18, the story would likely be different unless he was in a coma, in which case Jeb and his ilk would jump in to keep him "alive" for another decade or so.

73, Rob

[KC0VWU]

Ah okay gotcha.

[ai4ep]

http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif yea...what he said.

I think ?

[al2i]

A Ham friend of mine has been given 30 days to live, 90 days to live and again 30 days to live repeatedly for about 8 years now. He has stubbornly refused chemo and just keeps living, taking radiation treatments and practicing bizzarre nutritional regimens.

When the boy dies for the forced chemo will the judge be tried for manslaughter?

[al2i]

Those parents should be ashamed for naming him "Starchild" though. Sheesh!

[KC0VWU]

Quote[/b] (al2i @ July 20 2006,21:23)]Those parents should be ashamed for naming him "Starchild" though. Sheesh!
Yeah, I wonder how they thought up that name.

*coughs, reaches for a bag of Doritos*

The kid seems rational though and he's been through chemo before so I think he ought to be the one to decide.

[al2i]

Cure rates using traditional medicine for some childhood cancers are quite excellent.

Still, initiating State force rather than simple persuasion crosses a line that many good men have fought and died to establish.

[KF0RT]

An ex-cow-orker of mine was once seated on a jury that involved one of these cases. The family belonged to a religion that forbade any sort of medical treatment for anything (the name of that religion escapes me just now - science something, but not the Scientologists, I don't think). Prayer was their medicine. When their son died, the parents were charged with manslaughter.

This was a long time ago, I don't recall the outcome of the trial. You can bet there are laws on the books, though. Otherwise, no charges would have been possible.

To my "morality," it all depends on the maturity and ability of the kid to decide. A 16 year-old might be in a gray area. The law generally says 18. What if it was a 5 year-old?

73, Rob

[WD8OQX]

There ARE times when someone must step in & protect a child but it usually is obvious when. Other than that the parents should always have the final say so. The sooner BIG BROTHER gets that through his thick head the better. Been through similar myself & it's NO FUN. Falsely accused of improper care my daughter but a trip to children's hospital prove them wrong. - Bluntly told them (big brother) I didn't want to ever see or hear from them - didn't even want to know they even exist! - put an end to that <censored>!

[al2i]

Quote[/b] (KF0RT @ July 21 2006,18:37)]An ex-cow-orker of mine...
I've never orked a cow. Is that dangerous?

[KF0RT]

Quote[/b] (al2i @ July 21 2006,22:32)]Quote[/b] (KF0RT @ July 21 2006,18:37)]An ex-cow-orker of mine...
I've never orked a cow. Is that dangerous?
Where's Tom when you need him? http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

73, Rob

[w4rot]

Most of these chemo-cell bombs are designed to bust processes, not specifics. I would imagine most of the data on drug efficacy comes from the 40 to 60 year old age group. These are the people involved in the trials.
The young and old respond different. First dose is a crap shoot.
I can sympathatize with a parent whose kid has been loaded by weight calculations using these compounds. It is your child..off base and ugly unless you happen across an oncologist with these type of patients.
A judge with no understanding or sympathy is just a piece of furniture,IMHO.
If Judge Roy wants to play science, he should be held accountable for the distance.
If it was my kid, I'd be crusin' Tibet looking for the Sherpa's advice as well.
k3stx would have insight on this stuff.
w4rot

[VE7NOT]

Quote[/b] (al2i @ July 21 2006,19:23)]Those parents should be ashamed for naming him "Starchild" though. Sheesh!
Got a sister-in-law named Starshine http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[KC2ESD]

Oh yea chemotherapy works.... BS both my parents had cancer, got chemotherapy, and both suffered and DIED. This kid has nothing left to lose so let him take a shot at Alt. Treatments. For me its Alt treatments or the Firing squad. There will be no cure for cancer because the drug companies don't want to loose money and the Government wants to control population growth. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif

[KF0RT]

Quote[/b] (KC2ESD @ July 22 2006,02:17)]There will be no cure for cancer because the drug companies don't want to loose money and the Government wants to control population growth. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif
Say what? ? ?

First drug company with a cure gets to be a "Wall Street darling" for a decade or more. They'll be so rich, they won't be able to spend it all.

Please show me ANY proof that the government wants to control population. More people = more taxpayers. I have never heard of a government in the U.S. that was anything BUT pro-growth.

73, Rob

[al2i]

Quote[/b] (KC2ESD @ July 22 2006,00:17)]Oh yea chemotherapy works.... BS both my parents had cancer, got chemotherapy, and both suffered and DIED.
I am terribly sorry to hear that OM.

Good people ARE trying to find ways to help, but progress has been slow, and someday I think our current process of poisoning people with cancer will be seen as the dark ages of medicine -- much like we view the former practice of "bleeding" the patient.

[W0UZR]

Quote[/b] (al2i @ July 21 2006,20:23)]Those parents should be ashamed for naming him "Starchild" though. #Sheesh!
HuH !!?

That's his REAL name? and not a nick name?

[W0UZR]

Quote[/b] (WD8OQX @ July 21 2006,19:44)]I'M republican and I say "what gives him the right"? - Where is our God given freedom of choice - where are our constitutional rights (pertaining to worship & faith)?
It's a whole lot easier to understand when you realize that the gvmnt owns us. They do. They literally own us.
Don't believe it, then don't pay your taxes for your house. What will happen? The blipin gvmnt is going to take their house after they kick you out. If the gvmnt can make you pay them taxes or they will kick you out, then it's THEIR house, Land. Not yours.
Same thing with our kids. If we raise our,,,er,,,I mean THEIR kids the way THEY want, then we get to keep our kids. If we DON'T raise them the way they approve, then they will take your (their) kids. Like this subject for example. If the gvmnt doesn't OWN us, or our kids, then they wouldn't be able to do this.

UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES

[KD8COO]

Quote[/b] (KF0RT @ July 22 2006,04:08)][quote=KC2ESD,July 22 2006,02:17]
Please show me ANY proof that the government wants to control population. #More people = more taxpayers. #I have never heard of a government in the U.S. that was anything BUT pro-growth.
Our entire model depends on continued population growth. The system as it stands struggles when population growth slows. If it stops or reverses, the system (if left in current state) will collapse.

[KA8NCR]

Quote[/b] (KF0RT @ July 21 2006,18:46)]Quote[/b] (WD8OQX @ July 21 2006,19:44)]I'M republican and I say "what gives him the right"? - Where is our God given freedom of choice - where are our constitutional rights (pertaining to worship & faith)?
They don't exist until you hit the magic age of 18 (or have the state's approval).

73, Rob
No. The issue is that this kid owes the government $29,000 in taxes as part of the federal debt. No one gets to die until they've paid their share -- even though he has never had the right to vote and the burden was placed upon him at birth.

The government is looking out for their asset.

[ka5s]

The flip side of this is the (unstated) right of parents to forbid kids from getting medical care -- and brainwash them into refusing it if given the choice.

This comes up every so often.

Cortland
KA5S

[w7lpn]

They don't want the truth out about alternative medacine's success rate and want to protect the monopoly held so long by the established medical monster. Billions would be lost from Pharmaceuticals to hospital room charges. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif

[KC0VWU]

Good news, it sounds like the kid found another judge to stay the first judge's order and for the moment he has slipped loose from the tyranny of an oppressive government.

http://wcbstv.com/topstories/local_story_206164252.html

[ac3p]

Quote[/b] ]The government is looking out for their asset.

I believe it. How many times have we heard that this or that activity costs the economy billions of $ in lost productivity.

We are all slaves of the economy. Most of us just don't know it.

[KD6NIG]

Quote[/b] (KC0VWU @ July 25 2006,23:29)]Good news, it sounds like the kid found another judge to stay the first judge's order and for the moment he has slipped loose from the tyranny of an oppressive government.

http://wcbstv.com/topstories/local_story_206164252.html
They also took away control from the government agency temporarily.

Of course, this will all be appealed, but for now the child's parents actually have full control over his medical status.

[n0jaa]

Quote[/b] (KC0VWU @ July 26 2006,02:29)]Good news, it sounds like the kid found another judge to stay the first judge's order and for the moment he has slipped loose from the tyranny of an oppressive government.

http://wcbstv.com/topstories/local_story_206164252.html
At least someone saw the light! Probably someone saw that this boy's rights as described in the Fourteenth Amendment were being violated.

[w7lpn]

Quote[/b] (ac3p @ July 26 2006,05:28)]Quote[/b] ]The government is looking out for their asset.

I believe it. How many times have we heard that this or that activity costs the economy billions of $ in lost productivity.

We are all slaves of the economy. Most of us just don't know it.
The same reason they quit making cars that got 35-40 MPG routinely, with false claims of how expensive it is. The Ford Escort was replaced by the Focus 21 MPG in a nearly compact car? Get real! They're in bed with big Oil getting kick backs for making gas guzzlers. But that's a different story....or is it? http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif