Unbuilt TX-1

[W0LC]

Saw this on eScam er....eBay....

Thought it was interesting....
TX-1" target="_blank">http://cgi.ebay.com/ws....RL=http (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=9724706177&ssPageName=MERC_VIC_ReBay_Pr4_PcY_BID_IT<a href=) Apache</a>

[W4HAY]

Looks like it's getting some action. To a Heathophile, it's a rare find. I'd like to find an in-the-box AT-1 and VF-1.

[K9STH]

The unbuilt Heathkit AT-1 went for over $14,000 a couple of years ago. I have not seen an unbuilt VF-1 of either type.

There were 2 versions of the VF-1. The circuitry is the same but the front panels are very different. I have one of each. The earlier model is no where near as common as the later model but the earlier version "looks better", at least in my opinion.

Glen, K9STH

[w8cbc]

I hope whoever buys it, will build it.

[KA4DPO]

What a rare find that is. It should be donated to the Smithsonian.

[W0LC]

I always wonder, when someone buys something like that, do they assemble it?

I am sure many of the caps are bad by now (maybe not) but it would be a hoot to get something like that.

I like my TX-1 but even if I had the money, I wouldn't buy that one on eBay. What would be the point.

I guess I see the interest, but it doesn't interest me a lot. Nice to see "finds" like that pop up now and then.

[ab8ma]

Looks like a good business case for Heathkit to re-open it's doors. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[ko0m]

.....speaking of "finds" on eBay; in the Ham Radio --->Meter section, I found this. (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7764820470&rd=1&sspagename=STRK%3AMESE%3AIT&rd=1) #I wonder if it will end up in the Smithsonian also?

.

[w8znx]

it's crazy
so much money
for unbuilt heathkit

what the heck can you do with it
if you like building
it's too expensive
might as well home brew
or build a K-2

build it, now just another Apache
worth far less money
so
does one just put it on a shelf
and look at it now and then
sounds like a big waste of money

or is it like some kind of
investment you realy don't care
one whit about the thing
you are just beting
it will go up in price

check this guys rating
funny how some dealers
have such poor feedback numbers

and
other dealers like KE9PQ
can have thousands of sales
with zero neg feedback

mac

[wa3vjb]

Anyone considering making a bid on the ebay TX-1 should know the following:

The main box had already been opened, for a long time, by the time it was put on display at the Hosstraders (New Hampshire) hamfest last weekend for $650.

The seller did not have the factory assembly manual, and we could not find the front panel. The parts were loose and repackaged, i.e., not bagged in what was known to be the Heathkit manner.

When we saw the box was later gone, the seller Friday afternoon said he had gotten his asking price.

http://www.wa3vjb.com/pics/DSC07794.JPG

[WA9SVD]

Quote[/b] (K9STH @ May 12 2006,08:17)]The unbuilt Heathkit AT-1 went for over $14,000 a couple of years ago. I have not seen an unbuilt VF-1 of either type.

There were 2 versions of the VF-1. The circuitry is the same but the front panels are very different. I have one of each. The earlier model is no where near as common as the later model but the earlier version "looks better", at least in my opinion.

Glen, K9STH
Glen,

Are you SERIOUS? $14K for an unbuilt HeathKit of ANY kind? That's almost enough to buy a car! (Well, maybe a Yugo...)
I know collectors sometimes go crazy, paying exorbitant or outrageous amounts for items they desire, but did you maybe add an extra zero there?

[K9STH]

The unbuilt Heathkit AT-1 actually sold for, if I remember correctly, $14,400.

[WA9SVD]

Quote[/b] (K9STH @ May 12 2006,13:11)]The unbuilt Heathkit AT-1 actually sold for, if I remember correctly, $14,400.
Well, I guess if somebody was willing to pay that price, the seller was in no position to refuse the offer... Just seems pretty crazy. No explaining those addicted to collecting, though.

[K9STH]

How many unbuilt Heathkit AT-1 transmitter kits are there around? Not very many. In fact, the kit that was sold is very likely to be the only one that still exists.

It is like stamp collecting. Now why is a certain British Guinea 1/2 cent stamp worth tens of thousands of dollars? Because there are so few left.

Same thing with coin collecting and the 1913 Liberty Head nickel. Only 5 or 6 were minted (depends on which authority is stating the mint figure). Those go for tens of thousands of dollars to coin collectors.

Now for someone to buy an unbuilt kit and then build it the rarity goes from very rare to extremely common. The value is usually decreased by a factor of between 10 and 50. An unbuilt kit is MUCH more valuable than a "run of the mill" boat anchor piece of equipment.

Glen, K9STH

[w8cbc]

Well, I would build it. *&^% the collector "status".

Reading through the other thread on the subject though, I gather the parts for this one aren't even all there. Huh.

[WA5VQM]

Quote[/b] (kd8bsr @ May 13 2006,09:07)]Well, I would build it. *&^% the collector "status".
http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif Me too!

As for the VF-1, I have one and it only drifts half as much as rumors would have it. Any decent spread-spectrum receiver can tune it in. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[K9STH]

There are a couple of no soldering modifications that will stabilize virtually any VF-1.

Replace the 6AU6 with a 6AH6. Heath made this change when the early Apache transmitters sometimes had stability problems. Works like a charm.

Next, replace the 0A2 voltage regulator (which regulates the screen of the oscillator tube) with an 0B2. This drops the screen voltage from 150 volts to 108 volts.

Then run the VF-1 from a separate regulated power supply wlith 150 volts regulated (you can use the 0A2 removed from the VF-1 to accomplish this). It doesn't take much of a supply to accomplish this.

NEVER run a VF-1 "robbing" power from either a DX-35 or DX-40. Both of those transmitters have a very under rated power transformer and you will cause it to burn out rapidly in at least 9 times out of 10 cases. The DX-60 series is another matter, the power transformer can handle a VFO. However, when you run the VFO using the transmitter power supply it will often drift and chirp badly.

The VF-1 is one of the more stable VFOs of the 1950s. However, you need to make the changes listed above AND run it from a separate, regulated, power supply. Also, do NOT try to key any separate VFO including the VF-1 when operating on CW. Let the VFO run for the entire time that you are transmitting. This will eliminate a "chirp" on the signal.

Glen, K9STH

[WA2ZDY]

I wish I had known those tricks back around 1975!

[WA5VQM]

Quote[/b] (K9STH @ May 13 2006,15:55)]There are a couple of no soldering modifications that will stabilize virtually any VF-1.

Replace the 6AU6 with a 6AH6. Heath made this change when the early Apache transmitters sometimes had stability problems. Works like a charm.

Next, replace the 0A2 voltage regulator (which regulates the screen of the oscillator tube) with an 0B2. This drops the screen voltage from 150 volts to 108 volts.

Then run the VF-1 from a separate regulated power supply wlith 150 volts regulated (you can use the 0A2 removed from the VF-1 to accomplish this). It doesn't take much of a supply to accomplish this.

NEVER run a VF-1 "robbing" power from either a DX-35 or DX-40. Both of those transmitters have a very under rated power transformer and you will cause it to burn out rapidly in at least 9 times out of 10 cases. The DX-60 series is another matter, the power transformer can handle a VFO. However, when you run the VFO using the transmitter power supply it will often drift and chirp badly.

The VF-1 is one of the more stable VFOs of the 1950s. However, you need to make the changes listed above AND run it from a separate, regulated, power supply. Also, do NOT try to key any separate VFO including the VF-1 when operating on CW. Let the VFO run for the entire time that you are transmitting. This will eliminate a "chirp" on the signal.

Glen, K9STH
I'll have to try the 6AH6, thanks for the tip.

To be honest I did stabilize the supply (I cheated and used a high voltage linear regulator circuit) and it did tighten things up considerably.

You're right about the keying as well.

I ran my DX-40 during straight key night without complaint.

The VF-1 does have a "rep" but you're right, a few minor mods and it's fairly decent.

73, Mark

[w8cbc]

I tried a 6AH6 in the Apache and the darn thing spit spurs all over the place. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif

[KG6YTZ]

Quote[/b] (KB8ANN @ May 12 2006,08:25)].....speaking of "finds" on eBay; in the Ham Radio --->Meter section, I found this. (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7764820470&rd=1&sspagename=STRK%3AMESE%3AIT&rd=1) #I wonder if it will end up in the Smithsonian also?

.
"LOOK AT HIM GO!!! #OJ's ON THE 15... THE 10... THE 5... #The 405!!!" http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[WA7KKP]

I have yet to comprehend what all that hoopoola is over an unbuilt Heathkit. All I see is a box of parts, that when assembled, becomes worth less than what one paid for it.

Isn't that why we buy kits in the first place?

And if your soldering/building skills aren't very good in the first place, it probably won't work either.

Back when Heathkit was still in operation, we used to call them Heath__its, or Griefkits, and most of the time they deserved both monikers. Back in 1978 I lived in Salt Lake City, UT and went to the Heathkit store there -- of all the "kits" on display, only ONE worked!!!

Maybe that is one of the major reasons they don't make kits anymore.

Gary WA7KKP

[K9STH]

Actually, the Heath Company is still very much in business, just not building electronic kits anymore. They did move from the "H" shaped building in St. Joseph, Michigan, to an office complex in Benton Harbor. Now their mailing address always was in Benton Harbor but the actual plant location was in St. Joseph. Since I was "born and raised" 35 miles from the Heath plant I visited the plant on numerous occasions (there was a showroom, sales department, and a parts department all open to the public in the building).

As for the design of the equipment, Heath equipment generally was pretty well designed. However, the quality of construction depended on the individual who put the kit together. Some people shouldn't have even gotten near a hot soldering iron while others wired the kits as well as any professional. Most were somewhere inbetween.

I have seen quite a few Heathkits over the years (since I work on boat anchors for others) and most of them are fairly well assembled and, when repaired and/or aligned, work quite well.

As for the 6AH6, only the very first Apache transmitters came from the factory with the 6AU6 (like the VF-1, DX-100, DX-100B). Heath changed to the 6AH6 very early in the production run. Of course this was only a change in what tube was sent with the kit because the 6AU6 and 6AH6 have the same base connections.

Frankly, if substituting a 6AH6 for a 6AU6 causes problems then there is something terribly wrong with the transmitter! Actually, the very first thing that I would do is to tighten EVERY machine screw, sheet metal screw, nut, etc., that there is in the transmitter. These do work their way loose over the years and every ground in the unit is made through one of these screws. They also build up corrosion. Just turning them a few degrees can make the difference between getting a good ground and having all sorts of problems.

Doing this "little thing" cures all sorts of "screwy" problems in the boat anchors that I work on for others. For example, my Collins 75S-3A receiver has been on my main console for over 30 years. Several weeks ago the performance started getting really squirrely. I brought it to the work bench and discovered that over 30 of the screws that go through the chassis and hold the tube sockets, terminal strips, etc., in place making the ground connections had worked their way loose. It took less than 5 minutes to tighten all of them down and the receiver is again working fine.

Anyway, I have owned a lot of Heath equipment (as well as Collins equipment) over the years. Various items of the Heath equipment actually performs better than certain items manufactured by Collins. For example, starting with the bottom and going to the top I rate the Heath versus Collins receivers thusly:

Heathkit SB-300, Collins 75S-1, Collins 75S-2, Heathkit SB-301, Collins 75S-3B, Collins 75S-3C, Collins 75S-3, Collins 75S-3A.

For transmitters:

Collins 32S-1, Collins 32S-2, Heathkit SB-400, Heathkit SB-401, Collins 32S-3, Collins 32S-3A.

For transceivers it is a "toss up". The Collins KWM-2 series has a slightly better receiver than the Heathkit SB series. For SSB transmitting the KWM-2 series is slightly better than the Heathkit SB series. But, for CW, the Heathkit SB series beats the KWM-2 series "hands down".

When I first acquired my Collins 75S-3A (in my opinion the best of the 75S-3 series - the 75S-3B and 75S-3C were "cheapened up" for manufacturing cost reduction) I was using the Heathkit SB-301 / SB-401 combination. I ran the 75S-3A in parallel with the SB-301 for several weeks before even thinking of buying the 32S-3 transmitter to match the 75S-3A. In 9 situations out of 10 the Heath receiver would do anything that the Collins receiver would do. However, it was that 10th time that convinced me that I wanted the full Collins station. That was back in the mid 1970s.

Since that time I have again acquired a SB-301 and a SB-401 that I normally use as the i.f. for my 2-meter transverter (Hallicrafters HA-2). However, I sometimes use the Heath equipment on HF just to "play around".

Anyway, I have attached a photo of my original Heathkit "twins" which work VERY well. I do have the SB-10 SSB adapter but normally use the Apache / Mohawk on AM. The Warrior is available for CW and SSB.

Glen, K9STH

[wa9cwx]

Glen,
Have you checked the foundation under that corner of the house lately......

[M3KCK]

Nice looking Box’s
73
Regards,
Andrew M3KCK.

[K9STH]

There is less than 400 pounds in the entire stack.

Now if you are worried about the weight, take a look at

http://home.comcast.net/~k9sth/webnewphotos.JPG

This is out in my main shack.

Glen, K9STH

[KD7WHQ]

That's one green shack there, Glen ;)

Looks good to me http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[W0LC]

Glen has special permits for his house to accept that load bearing floor it sits on...hi!

Love that old stuff but never fun to have to move it around much!

Glad you don't have to deal with a T-368 or larger....

Talk about weight issues!

[k4lem]

I understand why its valuable. Its like bringing history alive again. As if the DNA of a sabertoothed tiger could give us a kitten.

I wonder why seller is not fully disclosing identity. That's a danger sign. Also stating east coast as opposed to exactly where seller is located.

That said, there are those who can and will buy this item and I hope its not a scam. In fact, what a project for a retired technician who is good with the iron.

If its real, its worth 1,700. But, I'd like to find a boxed unbuilt DX40, my very first rig in 1959.
Now, what would I pay for it? It cost 69.95 in 1959. Figure what it would be worth today?

[k4kyv]

Quote[/b] (k4lem @ May 15 2006,12:23)]I wonder why seller is not fully disclosing identity. That's a danger sign. Also stating east coast as opposed to exactly where seller is located.

That said, there are those who can and will buy this item and I hope its not a scam.
For a better idea, check out the other thread.

Beware of unbuilt Heathkit Apache TX-1 (http://www.qrz.com/ib-bin/ikonboard.cgi?act=ST;f=7;t=121842)

[kf6rdn]

Quote[/b] (K9STH @ May 14 2006,19:20)]There is less than 400 pounds in the entire stack.

Now if you are worried about the weight, take a look at

http://home.comcast.net/~k9sth/webnewphotos.JPG

This is out in my main shack.

Glen, K9STH
I'm betting your heating bill is... Nill.. But your cooling bill? http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[w8cbc]

I'd be willing to bet same.

My Apache and R392 keep the bedroom nice and warm in the winter.

[K9STH]

Actually, very seldom do I have more than 2 receivers (75S-3A and the 75S-1 on the lower level), the 32S-3 transmitter, and the Tempo 2001 linear turned on. If I am using another set of equipment then I typically turn off the other equipment.

Even though there is a 60 amp 240 volt breaker feeding the main shack (and it is only about 3 feet from the main breaker panel to the shack) I don't want to even think of coming close to blowing that breaker! The 120 outlets are divided between the 2 legs of the 240 volt so that the load is at least somewhat balanced.

Actually, my ambient line voltage runs right at 127 / 254 volts. Most electric companies these days try to maintain 125 volts +/- 2 volts and TXU runs on the "+" side most of the time. They have been running that voltage since back in the 1980s (well before I went to work for them in 1989).

Believe it or not, I have well under $3000 invested over 47 years in all of my radio equipment! A lot of the equipment I have traded for, gotten as partial payment for working on equipment for others, and so on. Some of the equipment wasn't operational when I bought it so I got it for a VERY good price (like the 75S-1 and 32S-1 on the second shelf that I paid $35 each back in the late 1970s and the equipment was offered to me at that price). I did purchase the 75S-3A for $350 in the mid 1970s and the 32S-3, a 75S-3, and the 516F-4 power supply for $600 a few months after the 75S-3A. I traded off the 75S-3 for my 75A4 about 4 years ago. Other than the Collins I haven't paid more than $75 for anything and that was for the Hammarlund HX-50A.

Some things, like the Globe Champion 350A I got for paying the shipping charges (under $45 from the west coast for the 350A).

I have been around for a long time and I "look out for" equipment that I want yet don't have to pay much to acquire. That is why I say that amateur radio definitely does not have to be expensive. You might not obtain the "latest and greatest" equipment, but if you look around you can find some excellent equipment at a very good price.

I know that I could get someone on the air with around 100 watts output on SSB / CW on 80 through 10 meters (probably not the WARC bands, but, even then "maybe") for no more than $300 and even possibly for under $200. It might take 2 or 3 weeks, but the equipment is out there at very reasonable prices.

I have known people to get on the air with reasonable equipment for around $100, but they definitely were in the "right place at the right time".

Glen, K9STH

[k4kyv]

View this thread

http://www.offshoreonly.com/forums....+dudley (http://www.offshoreonly.com/forums/showthread.php?t=48020&page=7&pp=20&highlight=bruce+dudley)

[wd0ct]

Quote[/b] (wa9svd @ May 12 2006,11:49)]Quote[/b] (K9STH @ May 12 2006,08:17)]The unbuilt Heathkit AT-1 went for over $14,000 a couple of years ago. I have not seen an unbuilt VF-1 of either type.

There were 2 versions of the VF-1. The circuitry is the same but the front panels are very different. I have one of each. The earlier model is no where near as common as the later model but the earlier version "looks better", at least in my opinion.

Glen, K9STH
Glen,

Are you SERIOUS? $14K for an unbuilt HeathKit of ANY kind? That's almost enough to buy a car! (Well, maybe a Yugo...)
I know collectors sometimes go crazy, paying exorbitant or outrageous amounts for items they desire, but did you maybe add an extra zero there?
reminds me that no classic car auction is really no reserve. how many shills were bidding it up?

[K9STH]

CT:

From what I could tell there were no "shills" bidding up the price. About 3 different collectors got VERY interested in having the unbuilt AT-1 kit. When you get that many serious collectors that also have money, the price is definitely going to go "sky high".

Glen, K9STH

[W0LC]

$2100 Glen...

Not in my league...I would love to have it, but I like mine (already built just fine)....

[K9STH]

If the kit is complete, $2100 is not a bad price. But, if it is not, then that is way too much! Now if someone had another partially unbuilt kit that just happened to have the missing parts and could therefore make a complete unbuilt kit then maybe the price would be OK.

However, I definitely am not in the market for anything that cost $2100! That would make a major dent in my disability income for the month. Not take it all, but definitely a major portion. In fact, it would take a hefty bite out of probably 85 percent of those who post on this site monthly income.

Glen, K9STH

[ab8ma]

Quote[/b] (K9STH @ May 17 2006,22:50)]If the kit is complete, $2100 is not a bad price. #But, if it is not, then that is way too much! #Now if someone had another partially unbuilt kit that just happened to have the missing parts and could therefore make a complete unbuilt kit then maybe the price would be OK.

However, I definitely am not in the market for anything that cost $2100! #That would make a major dent in my disability income for the month. #Not take it all, but definitely a major portion. #In fact, it would take a hefty bite out of probably 85 percent of those who post on this site monthly income.

Glen, K9STH
Glen,

I would love to see your house if you had been a Lionel Train enthusiast (darn, new computer and no ms word for spelling. got to fix that.)

Growing up in the 1950's I loved Lionel. Wish I still had what I had then.

[w8cbc]

I've a friend who's a Lionel nut. His house is full of shelves and engines and cars are literally falling off the shelves.

I play with a set of American Flyers and some HO-gauge trains I've gathered over the years. Not lately - the cat is rather disrespectful of them.

Glen - $2100 is a little under twice what I have saved right now. I probably could do it by stretching things a bit for a month but I'd rather use that kind of cash (assuming I wasn't saving it for a set purpose - which I am) for something else. I'm a car nut. That's not what I'm saving it for either - but if I had a choice between, say, a 1970 Newport in decent shape (they tend to go for about $2k in decent shape) and an unbuilt TX-1, I'd get the Newport.

[W0LC]

Well, looks like KB1LMI might be at it yet again. Changed his eBay name yet again to:

rf2tecnologiies

This guy changes eBay IDs faster then anyone I have seen and all of his feedback is "private" so you cannot see the complaints against him.

Ebay ID History:
rf2tecnologiies Jun-12-06 Present


217stufforsale Jul-15-04 Jun-12-06

Sells under his girl friend's e-mail address and cell:
lover86@comcast.net
KELLY NACCARATO
710 HIDDEN LANE
GUILFORD, CT 06437
United States

(203) 640-3415

So if you deal with this guy, be careful. Definitely not any high dollar sales to him to be certain.

Strange the Feds haven't shut him/(and her) down yet.

[w8znx]

Chris thanks for the info

still can not see how
anybody in their right mind
would buy something
from a e bay seller
with such a low pos feed back
along with the private
bidder, and feedback info

should post a stand alone
WARNING #

mac

[W0LC]

More interesting to me is how e-scam allows this individual to continually sell on there and hide the biddings which for all practical purposes, could be the Seller bidding against a sole bidder to jack up the sales price.

E-Scam. What a rip off.

[WD4Lee]

I wonder if anyone has heard any current developments with KB1LMI???

[K7KBN]

[quote=K9STH;565066] Now why is a certain British Guinea 1/2 cent stamp worth tens of thousands of dollars? Because there are so few left.Glen, K9STH/quote]

Glen, if you're referring to "The World's Rarest Stamp", British Guinea #13 (Scott), it's a 1 cent stamp. That series didn't have a 1/2 cent value.

[WA7KKP]

For some stupid reason, unbuilt kits seem to be the Holy Grail, or the unicorn. Why pay big bucks for what really is a box of parts . . . if you want to build it, the value DECREASES. Unless you're a really good builder, and maybe you won't have problems when you first fire it up.

E-bay . . . where there is too many dollars and too little sense. That's why I call it E-pay.

Gary WA7KKP

[WA6MHZ]

Unbuilt kits are one of those things that you can't do anything with. If you build it, it is no longer an unbuilt kit and loses probably 80% of its value. I know a Heathkit HW-101 unbuilt went for around $4000 on Ebay, and built it is worth at most $100-$150. I have gotten them for a little as $20! So build it and you have just flushed thousands down the toilet. All you can do with it is just look at it. Maybe take the parts out of the box, being careful not to disturb them or tear any envelopes. You can look at the new front panel and run your fingers over the dial, but don't DARE scratch it! Then put it back in the box and stash it away figuring your grandchildren will sell it for even more than you paid for it. But that is assuming it is worth that to people of future generations. 50 years from now, the wealthy collectors who value these radios will all be silent keys and from what I see of todays youth, they think all these old radios are just JUNK! Only the baby boomers and older find old radios interesting and desirable. So we may be coming to the end of the era of love for antique radios, and that $4000 unbuilt Heathkit you stashed away will go for $10 in a garage sale as just a box of old electronic parts.

[AG3Y]

I am reminded of a certain commercial that lists a whole lot of things, and names the prices, and then comes up with the stinger "X X X X X - - - PRICELESS!"

Some people cannot put a price on re-capturing a thrill of their youth. If they got a certain thrill out of building Heathkits, and want to re-capture that thrill, if even for a brief time, and could afford to do it, what would hold them back ?

They certainly wouldn't care if the end product was only worth 10% of what they payed for the kit. They re-captured some of the lost thrill by building a Heathkit, and THAT is what they were willing to pay the "big bucks" for !

JMHO 73, Jim