Moonbounce

[kl7aj]

I've heard it's easier to work moonbounce during a full moon, because it's a bigger target then. However, if I use single sideband, my signal should be able to fit on a half moon, right? I guess yer sposta use upper sideband on a waxing moon and lower sideband on a waning moon. This is all so confusing, my head is about to explode.

http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

Eric

[K9STH]

How much light is showing on the moon doesn't affect how close it is to the Earth. That is what makes the difference.

Now as to your observations as to SSB, etc.:

Grooooooooooooooooooooooooan

Glen, K9STH

[w8cbc]

The obvious suggestion would be to use full DSB AM, thereby covering the entire body.

If everyone uses SSB, we'll heat up one side of the moon disporportionately and the reaction after several thousand million years of this could alter its orbit. Our ancestors, whatever they may be, will curse us for it.

As for CW - well, would you like someone on the moon burning a hole in the earth?

So I suggest that we use FM to keep the energy density down and distribute it evenly.

[ve2nsm]

Quote[/b] (kl7aj @ Feb. 10 2006,11:49)]I've heard it's easier to work moonbounce during a full moon, because it's a bigger target then. However, if I use single sideband, my signal should be able to fit on a half moon, right? I guess yer sposta use upper sideband on a waxing moon and lower sideband on a waning moon. This is all so confusing, my head is about to explode.

http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

Eric
Really you have to use variable polarization for the array to be always polarized in line with the shadow.

Also you need variable bandwidth filters, you have to use 1.8KHz SSB on quarter crescent, and can go up to full 2.8KHz SSB on half crescent.
Of course when full moon, one can use AM or even ESSB
http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[kl7aj]

Quote[/b] (ve2nsm @ Feb. 10 2006,09:02)]Quote[/b] (kl7aj @ Feb. 10 2006,11:49)]I've heard it's easier to work moonbounce during a full moon, because it's a bigger target then. #However, if I use single sideband, my signal should be able to fit on a half moon, right? #I guess yer sposta use upper sideband on a waxing moon and lower sideband on a waning moon. #This is all so confusing, my head is about to explode.

http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

Eric
Really you have to use variable polarization for the array to be always polarized in line with the shadow.

Also you need variable bandwidth filters, you have to use 1.8KHz SSB on quarter crescent, and can go up to full 2.8KHz SSB on half crescent.
Of course when full moon, one can use AM or even ESSB
http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif
Ahh....good. My Ten Tec Jupiter has all those filters. Speaking of Jupiter.........

http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[KD6NIG]

If you'd quit mooning the neighbors, maybe they would complain less about your antennas in your yard.......

[kr2d]

Quote[/b] (kl7aj @ Feb. 10 2006,11:22)]Ahh....good. # My Ten Tec Jupiter has all those filters. # Speaking of Jupiter.........

http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif
Jupiterbounce?

Maybe you've discovered the cause of LDEs!

Or is that just what happens when you knock your Ten-Tec off of the operating desk?

http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[K9STH]

BSR:

We should be cursing our ancestors.

Now our descendents may curse us.

http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

Glen, K9STH

[n6vmo]

I find there is less QRM if you operate moonbounce just after the moon has set.
This way you will not be interfering with other QSOs and they will not interfere with your QSO.

Also, if you CQ in RTTY (USB) or Packet (LSB) more poeple will likely hear you.

[w8cbc]

Quote[/b] (K9STH @ Feb. 10 2006,10:46)]BSR:

We should be cursing our ancestors.

Now our descendents may curse us.

http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

Glen, K9STH
If time is cyclical the way so many believe, our ancestors will be our descendants. It's no wonder we're so screwed up as a species. All those cycles of inbreeding are telling.

[WA2ZDY]

I'm still waiting for the QSL from Jupiter. I sent an SWL card out for reception on 18MHz, but I understand Jupiter is worse than Box 88 . . .

[kl7aj]

Quote[/b] (WA2ZDY @ Feb. 10 2006,14:31)]I'm still waiting for the QSL from Jupiter. #I sent an SWL card out for reception on 18MHz, but I understand Jupiter is worse than Box 88 . . .
Box 88 always worked well for me!

[kg4kww]

Can you people give the guy a straight answer and cut the crap!! http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif If you don't know, just say so.

[K9STH]

Eric:

You need to go back and read the original questions.

Then relax, take your medicines, and realize that this whole thread has been in jest starting with the original post.

By the way, take a look at the K9STH thread on the Q&A forum (towards the end). The thread has been hijacked to include some radios that you might be interested in obtaining.

Glen, K9STH

[WB2WIK]

Moonbounce is cliche.

I've been working ememe, which is a double-bounce (earth-moon-earth-moon-earth). I calculated it takes exactly umpteen jillion Watts to pull it off, and anything that gets in the way of the uplink will vaporize.

So, I'm hoping Osama flies by during one of my tests.

[kl7aj]

Quote[/b] (WB2WIK @ Feb. 10 2006,14:56)]Moonbounce is cliche.

I've been working ememe, which is a double-bounce (earth-moon-earth-moon-earth). #I calculated it takes exactly umpteen jillion Watts to pull it off, and anything that gets in the way of the uplink will vaporize.

So, I'm hoping Osama flies by during one of my tests.
Last time I was up there, I did a little Earthbounce. (MEM). 40 meters really sucks there, though. Really hard to get a good ground in that stuff.

http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

eric

[WA5KRP]

Quote[/b] (kg4kww @ Feb. 10 2006,15:39)]Can you people give the guy a straight answer and cut the crap!! # http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif #If you don't know, just say so.
http://heustess.com/pictures/gang33.jpg


WA5KRP
Texas

[kr2d]

I've been trying ESE (earth-sun-earth) as described in QST (April, 2004). So far, no replies to my CQs. Maybe I need to wait for the sunspots to pick up again.

[W1RKW]

Actually, there are times when the moon is closer to the earth and times when it is further away. The moon's orbit around earth is slightly elliptical and off center. Whether or not it will make a difference in EME, who knows. I certainly don't. Though I would think that it's position relative to the earth and sun might make a difference in effective EME communication.

[KC0W]

Several amateurs on the Gighertz bands have made EAE (earth aircraft earth) QSO's by reflecting their signal off of a moving aircraft.

I have personaly made contest QSO's on 1.2 Gig by reflecting my signal off of the second largest building (the IDS building) in downtown Minneapolis.


Tom kcØw

[WB2WIK]

Quote[/b] (W1RKW @ Feb. 10 2006,15:44)]Actually, there are times when the moon is closer to the earth and times when it is further away. The moon's orbit around earth is slightly elliptical and off center. Whether or not it will make a difference in EME, who knows. I certainly don't. Though I would think that it's position relative to the earth and sun might make a difference in effective EME communication.
Of course it does. (Okay, no joke this time.)

At perigee the eme path has less loss than at apogee, and the difference is large enough that it matters.

[WB2WIK]

Quote[/b] (kc0w @ Feb. 10 2006,15:47)]Several amateurs on the Gighertz bands have made EAE (earth aircraft earth) QSO's by reflecting their signal off of a moving aircraft.

I have personaly made contest QSO's on 1.2 Gig by reflecting my signal off of the second largest building (the IDS building) in downtown Minneapolis.


Tom kcØw
Very well known phenomenon, hams have been doing this for a long time.

NASA launched an ionized gas cloud over Wallops Island, VA many years ago (seems to me it was back in about 1980 or so) which was highly reflective for RF and we used to to work from where I lived in NJ (at the time) to Miami on 2m SSB with strong signals that lasted several hours, until the cloud dissipated.

That was really cool. I wanted to know who to call to ask them to do it again.

[KC0W]

Quote[/b] (WB2WIK @ Feb. 10 2006,22:59)]That was really cool. #I wanted to know who to call to ask them to do it again.
Try some people based out of Fort Meade, MD.....Better yet, check out the nonfiction book, Body Of Secrets. You will not sleep for a week after reading what "they" are capable of.


Tom kcØw

[n2nh]

Quote[/b] (n2jso @ Feb. 10 2006,17:37)]I've been trying ESE (earth-sun-earth) as described in QST (April, 2004). So far, no replies to my CQs. Maybe I need to wait for the sunspots to pick up again.
I saw that article too, but their work was done as the cycle wound down. If you wait for the cycle to pick up, those sunspots will send SWRs down your radiator. Then you'll have to ask a local CB'er (or post here) how to get them back out.

http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[WA9SVD]

Quote[/b] (K9STH @ Feb. 10 2006,10:46)]BSR:

We should be cursing our ancestors.

Now our descendents may curse us.

http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

Glen, K9STH
Curses! Foiled again.

OOPS, sorry, that's for hats, not EME antennas.

Sorry, Kokopelli made me say that!

[ve2nsm]

Quote[/b] (WB2WIK @ Feb. 10 2006,18:59)]Quote[/b] (kc0w @ Feb. 10 2006,15:47)]Several amateurs on the Gighertz bands have made EAE (earth aircraft earth) QSO's by reflecting their signal off of a moving aircraft.

I have personaly made contest QSO's on 1.2 Gig by reflecting my signal off of the second largest building (the IDS building) in downtown Minneapolis.


Tom kcØw
Very well known phenomenon, hams have been doing this for a long time.

NASA launched an ionized gas cloud over Wallops Island, VA many years ago (seems to me it was back in about 1980 or so) which was highly reflective for RF and we used to to work from where I lived in NJ (at the time) to Miami on 2m SSB with strong signals that lasted several hours, until the cloud dissipated.

That was really cool. I wanted to know who to call to ask them to do it again.
I know some guys that make IMI (International-Mack-International) on 28085 http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[WA2ZDY]

Quote[/b] (kg4kww @ Feb. 10 2006,17:39)]Can you people give the guy a straight answer and cut the crap!! # :angry: #If you don't know, just say so.
I don't know.

[WB2WIK]

Quote[/b] (WA2ZDY @ Feb. 10 2006,17:34)]Quote[/b] (kg4kww @ Feb. 10 2006,17:39)]Can you people give the guy a straight answer and cut the crap!! # http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif #If you don't know, just say so.
I don't know.
I don't know, either.

What was the question? http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[kf6rdn]

Quote[/b] (WB2WIK @ Feb. 10 2006,14:59)]Quote[/b] (kc0w @ Feb. 10 2006,15:47)]Several amateurs on the Gighertz bands have made EAE (earth aircraft earth) QSO's by reflecting their signal off of a moving aircraft.

I have personaly made contest QSO's on 1.2 Gig by reflecting my signal off of the second largest building (the IDS building) in downtown Minneapolis.


# # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # Tom kcØw
Very well known phenomenon, hams have been doing this for a long time.

NASA launched an ionized gas cloud over Wallops Island, VA many years ago (seems to me it was back in about 1980 or so) which was highly reflective for RF and we used to to work from where I lived in NJ (at the time) to Miami on 2m SSB with strong signals that lasted several hours, until the cloud dissipated.

That was really cool. #I wanted to know who to call to ask them to do it again.
Check out the clouds over taco bell when there's a burrito sale. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[ve2nsm]

Quote[/b] (kf6rdn @ Feb. 10 2006,23:41)]Quote[/b] (WB2WIK @ Feb. 10 2006,14:59)]Quote[/b] (kc0w @ Feb. 10 2006,15:47)]Several amateurs on the Gighertz bands have made EAE (earth aircraft earth) QSO's by reflecting their signal off of a moving aircraft.

I have personaly made contest QSO's on 1.2 Gig by reflecting my signal off of the second largest building (the IDS building) in downtown Minneapolis.


Tom kcØw
Very well known phenomenon, hams have been doing this for a long time.

NASA launched an ionized gas cloud over Wallops Island, VA many years ago (seems to me it was back in about 1980 or so) which was highly reflective for RF and we used to to work from where I lived in NJ (at the time) to Miami on 2m SSB with strong signals that lasted several hours, until the cloud dissipated.

That was really cool. I wanted to know who to call to ask them to do it again.
Check out the clouds over taco bell when there's a burrito sale. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif
Oh no!
This could cause a flare!

But not solar http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

[n2nh]

Quote[/b] (WB2WIK @ Feb. 10 2006,20:09)]Quote[/b] (WA2ZDY @ Feb. 10 2006,17:34)]Quote[/b] (kg4kww @ Feb. 10 2006,17:39)]Can you people give the guy a straight answer and cut the crap!! http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif If you don't know, just say so.
I don't know.
I don't know, either.

What was the question? http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif
I know! I know! I know I don't know. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif

[WA2ZDY]

Quote[/b] (kf6rdn @ Feb. 10 2006,23:41)]Check out the clouds over taco bell when there's a burrito sale. :p
If it's that chihuahua getting nuked, it's well worth the price of admission.

(And PETA, SPCA, and other animal rights nuts can just can it. I don't want to hear it.)

[KL7FZ]

Well....actually EME has been misunderstood for a long time now. It is not the result of spectral reflection as common knowledge would dictate. But in fact, is the retransmission of signals by an alien transponder in the old alien refueling base, now buried just under the surface of the moon where it can no longer be seen visably.
This repeater was/is used by long range alien spacecraft to boost signals back to the home planet.
This is also the source of LDEs as the signals from earth are retransmitted to another far distant transponder and repeated back again to us. #Depending on the direction that the earth/moon is facing at the time, the reflection could come from any of several different distant sources. Hence the different time delays experienced with LDEs.

The transponder on the moon is a very wide band unit. It does occasionally repeat some signals from other civilizations and species over a large frequency range. This is what accounts for some of the very strange sounding dialects and languages often heard on 27 Mhz.

Also signals are best relayed when earth sees a full moon as that is when the solar array receives the most power and the repeater operates with the best efficiency.

#If you need any other info, please aim your high-gain array at the moon and give me a call on 241 Ghz any time the moon is opposite the galactic plane. That way the repeater will be facing toward me.
#Just call for: Mgyrshlppys of Grggewataaw and I will get right back to you.
#If I am not around at the time, please leave a message on my machine.
Or you can call me on IRLP node #87535627890266.

#This message passed along to Earth, relayed through the big yagi array at KL7FZ.

[ai4ep]

http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

Rats !!

I guess the secret is out now.

Oh well. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[w8cbc]

We should (convince a large group of international conglomerates to) paint the moon orange and lay down a set of black latitudinal stripes.

Three points for whoever can shoot it through Saturn's rings from earth orbit.