Taxing by the Mile

[k4kyv]

Instead of taxing you on every gallon of gas pumped into your vehicle, the government is considering charging you for every mile you drive. With fuel efficiency on the rise and more cars that run on alternative fuels, states are worried that tax revenues will shrink.

The idea is about to be tested in Oregon, and congress has proposed spending millions to try it in several other states. It works like this: an onboard computer would record how far it travelled. A GPS receiver would tell the car's computer when it crosses state lines, allowing each state to charge its own mileage fee.

Periodically, every driver would be required to visit a service station to have the data downloaded and be charged the mileage fee.

From an article in our local newspaper, by Ledyard King of the Gannett News Service.

[ad5qb]

I seem to remember hearing about a program like this being tried or proposed a few years ago in the Boulder CO area, I think it was, but it was the local govt, not federal. Never heard any more about it. Anyone in that area that remembers this, or am I remembering incorrectly?

[WA5KRP]

I can't see them forgoing a revenue stream from fuel taxes that get "paid as you go" so to speak. With higher fuel prices looking to be with us from here on, no doubt there will be a shift to more fuel efficient cars. That's happened back in the 70's. So they raised the gas tax to compensate.

If they adopt this new method, you just KNOW the chips that provide the data will be studied by a few thousand hackers that'll sell workarounds on eBay. What are they going to do about drivers who run up a big road tax they can't pay for? Are off-road vehicles and boats going to get a free ride?

I think it's a fool's errand.



WA5KRP
Texas

[k6pme]

The State of California has been talking that for a while now also.

So this is the Governments answer to fuel economy and alternative fuels? No wonder it doesn't work.

[N2ACX]

http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif I'll bet the new DMV director will get this bill passed and begin taxes califronia residents by the miles driven.

Why? because what I have seen this happening for years, watching politicians pass these idiotic bills while the citizens sit around and do nothing because they are too busy with their personal lives and TV, and other entertainment to stop this crap.

The politicians DON"T run our lives unless we LET THEM. Unfortunantly we are too comfortable in our zones of hi tech toys and vehicles and the politicians have know this for years and that we have short memories.

Oh well, we get everything we allow them to do and what "THEY" love is seeing us vent our frustrations in blogs such as this when we should be venting with hundreds and thousands of others in person and your mail and in front of their offices, both washington DC and their home states.

Some areas in the United Kingdom already are testing the "tax by the Mile" using GPS so it is coming folks, so open up your wallets and give them the routing numbers to your checking and savings accounts.

And of course it opens up a whole new way for government intrusion in to you personal lives using GPS tracking and many other "justified" methods, all in the name of our security. In fact one senator already proposing the NATIONAL ID CARD has others saying that it won't be long after that where he can see citizens required to show that ID when crossing state lines.

WHO.....will be the ultimate prisoner of the future, those in other countries or the citizens of the USA?

73 Gary N2ACX

[w6ez]

heat up the soldering irons...

gps jammer (http://www.phrack.org/show.php?p=60&a=13)

[N0KLT]

This whole plan sounds like the same kind of rumor that went around a few years ago about the supposed upcome (take your pick) federal tax on or USPS postage on each and every email sent in the US. This 'plan' sounds like a 1st cousin to the email postage 'plan' http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif

[wd0ct]

How about taxing by how fat your vehicle is? Heavy suvs and pickups pay more. Of course this leads me to my next suggestion. If you are fat you pay more tax. Takes more fuel to haul your fat a%% around. heh heh

If you think none of this makes any sense that is okay too. This is the qrz forum after all!

[k6pme]

Quote[/b] (N2ACX @ May 07 2005,12:01)]WHO.....will be the ultimate prisoner of the future, those in #other countries or the #citizens of the USA?

# #73 #Gary #N2ACX
Perhaps Khrushchev won after all?

[k9kxq]

Quote[/b] (N2ACX @ May 07 2005,14:01)]http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif #I'll bet the new DMV director will get this bill passed and begin taxes califronia residents by the miles driven.

# Why? because what I have seen this happening for years, watching politicians pass these idiotic bills while the citizens sit around and do nothing because they are too busy with their personal lives and TV, and other entertainment to stop this crap.
#
# The politicians DON"T run our lives unless we LET THEM. Unfortunantly we are too comfortable in our zones of hi tech toys and vehicles #and the politicians have know this for years and that we have short memories.
#
# #Oh well, we get everything we allow them to do and what "THEY" love is seeing us vent our frustrations in blogs such as this when we should be venting with hundreds and thousands of others in person and your mail and #in front of their offices, both washington DC and their home states.

# Some areas in the United Kingdom already are testing the "tax by the Mile" using GPS so it is coming folks, so open up your wallets and give them the routing numbers to your checking and savings accounts.

# And of course it opens up a whole new way for government intrusion in to you personal lives using GPS tracking and many other "justified" methods, all in the name of our security. In fact one senator already proposing the NATIONAL ID CARD has others saying that it won't be long after that where he can see citizens required to show that ID when crossing state lines.

# WHO.....will be the ultimate prisoner of the future, those in #other countries or the #citizens of the USA?

# #73 #Gary #N2ACX
Looks like Gary hit on something here. #ID Card (http://www.rense.com/general65/id.htm)

kxq

[k4kyv]

Quote[/b] (k9kxq @ May 07 2005,19:11)]Looks like Gary hit on something here. ID Card (http://www.rense.com/general65/id.htm)
What about people who choose not to drive? Or people who lose their licence because of DUI or some other violation of traffic laws?

But it looks like the trend is certainly in that direction. At the supermarket where I have been shopping for the past 25 years they recently started carding me (at age 62) before they will sell me beer. The clerk told me he knows I am old enough to buy beer, but he is required to "card everyone, even if they are 90."

The law says he can't sell beer to anyone under 21 (it used to be 18 until the federal gov't blackmailed all 50 states to change it to 21 or risk losing federal highway funds, a law signed by "conservative", "get the gov't off your back" President Reagan). For his own protection, the clerk would be wise to card anyone who appears even remotely possible to be underage. But why is it his business to have access to my name, address or date of birth when there is no conceivable doubt that I am old enough to buy the beer?

Besides, it would be much, much easier for a 17-year-old to acquire fake identification papers than for him to convincingly disguise himself to look like someone over age 30, let alone 60.

Just one more little freedom lost - for someone to be able to wander into a store on foot, cash in hand but no "papers", and be able to purchase a six pack of beer.

[W2ILP]

The initial idea is rediculus as mentioned.

If you had a very fuel efficient car and drove many miles on a small amount of gas you would be taxed more than a person who had a car that could only go a few miles on the same amount of gas. In what way does this promote conservation?

This reminds me of another mathmaticaly ignorant situation.
A service manager was asked "How come you charge $75.00
per hour for labor on Rolls Royses and only $50.00 for labor on a Chevvy?".
His answer was "That's because working on Rolls Royces takes longer".

This is as bad as the guy who felt that he had no brakes , so he sped home before he could have an accident.

All of these are examples of the kind of thinkers that our schools now produce.

w2ilp (Ignorant Levy Proportions?)

[K8ERV]

Lets start a short (very short) list of things our beloved governments WON'T tax---- http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif

TOM K8ERV Montrose Colo

[KF0RT]

Quote[/b] (k4kyv @ May 07 2005,22:07)]But it looks like the trend is certainly in that direction. At the supermarket where I have been shopping for the past 25 years they recently started carding me (at age 62) before they will sell me beer. The clerk told me he knows I am old enough to buy beer, but he is required to "card everyone, even if they are 90."
Several months ago, I walked into a sporting goods store and bought a box of 9mm handgun ammo. Paid cash, no ID required.

Leaving the store, I remember thinking... "That was wierd."

And that's the problem. We are now so conditioned to this, that we've forgotten the meaning of "freedom." We're starting to take it for granted that every little thing will involve taxes and three forms of ID. The more we take it for granted, the more bending over we'll be doing.

The lowest common denominator now defines America. Sad.

73, Rob

[KB3MFB]

Quote[/b] (W2ILP @ May 08 2005,02:59)]If you had a very fuel efficient car and drove many miles on a small amount of gas you would be taxed more than a person who had a car that could only go a few miles on the same amount of gas. In what way does this promote conservation?
Sounds to me as if it's meant to put a burden on people who don't want to pay their fair share to big energy... Damn them! http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[k6pme]

Quote[/b] (K8ERV @ May 08 2005,04:32)]Lets start a short (very short) list of things our beloved governments WON'T tax---- #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif

TOM K8ERV #Montrose Colo
Things the Government won't tax:

1.) .....



Ok, I give up.

[k6pme]

Quote[/b] (KF0RT @ May 08 2005,05:25)]Several months ago, I walked into a sporting goods store and bought a box of 9mm handgun ammo. #Paid cash, no ID required.

Leaving the store, I remember thinking... "That was wierd."
I find it interesting that with all the murders and what not that fully loaded ammunition doesn't require ID. But if you try to buy the gunpowder to handload your own, (I do) which takes some knowledge and effort, ID is required.

More misguided efforts of the Feinstein crowd.

[nx6d]

Taxing by the mile will never happen.

The business interests would oppose it.

Do you think my employer would want to pay tax on the 35K plus miles I drive a year in my company car?

Not likely.

Dave WX7B

[KF0RT]

Quote[/b] (KG6QQL @ May 08 2005,11:07)]I find it interesting that with all the murders and what not that fully loaded ammunition doesn't require ID. But if you try to buy the gunpowder to handload your own, (I do) which takes some knowledge and effort, ID is required.

More misguided efforts of the Feinstein crowd.
I haven't purchased any "components" lately, but last I checked, no ID was required for that either -- here in CO at least. Maybe in CA they're worried about people building bombs or something. It's very rare that anyone commits a crime with handloaded ammo. Uh, of course, "if it only saves one life." http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif

73, Rob

[K8ERV]

Quote[/b] (KG6QQL @ May 08 2005,09:52)]Quote[/b] (K8ERV @ May 08 2005,04:32)]Lets start a short (very short) list of things our beloved governments WON'T tax---- #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif

TOM K8ERV #Montrose Colo
Things the Government won't tax:

1.) .....



Ok, I give up.
Wrong, they will find a way to tax giving up too---

TOM K8ERV Montrose Colo

[n0jaa]

Quote[/b] (k4kyv @ May 07 2005,02:36)]Instead of taxing you on every gallon of gas pumped into your vehicle, the government is considering charging you for every mile you drive. #With fuel efficiency on the rise and more cars that run on alternative fuels, states are worried that tax revenues will shrink.
This is yet another prime example of taxation without representation.

Paul, N0JAA

[n0jaa]

Quote[/b] (KG6QQL @ May 08 2005,05:52)]TOM K8ERV #Montrose Colo
Things the Government won't tax:

1.) .....[/QUOTE]
Politicians.

[W2ILP]

10 Things the government won't tax (We hope):

1) Free love.
2) The moon belongs to everyone...
3) The best thing in life are free...
4) The flowers that bloom...
5) Juno...If you don't use it for access to the Internet and have another ISP.
6) Ham Band Frequencies, if you hold the appropriate license and don't make any permanent claims.
7) The right to post here if you don't get banned.
8) The right to plead the 5th.
9) Life , Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness (if non-profit).
10) Insect bites.

Bob w2ilp (Intrinsic Libertarian Provisions)

[KG4CGC]

Quote[/b] (K8ERV @ May 08 2005,12:40)]Quote[/b] (KG6QQL @ May 08 2005,09:52)]Quote[/b] (K8ERV @ May 08 2005,04:32)]Lets start a short (very short) list of things our beloved governments WON'T tax---- #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif

TOM K8ERV #Montrose Colo
Things the Government won't tax:

1.) .....



Ok, I give up.
Wrong, they will find a way to tax giving up too---

TOM K8ERV #Montrose Colo
Toilets with volume sensors and satellite uplink.

[K8ERV]

Quote[/b] (KG4CGC @ May 09 2005,00:06)]Toilets with volume sensors and satellite uplink.
Not a problem, just bypass the toilet---

TOM K8ERV Montrose Colo

[K7JBQ]

This is the dumbest idea since...

Since...

Hmmm.

Fortunately, both California and Oregon are Initiative and Referendum states, which means this puppy ain't gonna fly.

Hell, Oregon politicians have tried to get a SALES tax passed since Hitler was a private, but since it has to go directly to the voters, it's never come close to passing.

73,
Bill

[k4kyv]

Quote[/b] (K8ERV @ May 09 2005,04:59)]Quote[/b] (KG4CGC @ May 09 2005,00:06)]Toilets with volume sensors and satellite uplink.
Not a problem, just bypass the toilet---

TOM K8ERV Montrose Colo
http://www.beijingtraveltips.com/sights/squat_toilet/squat_toilet1.jpg

[wa4brl]

Quote[/b] ]I can't see them forgoing a revenue stream from fuel taxes that get "paid as you go"
You guys just don't understand government sensibilities these days. #Thy NEVER forgo any revenue stream, they only add new ones. #Tax by the mile WILL pass -- and it will be IN ADDITION to the gas tax, not in place of it.

Sad to say, this is neither a Republican nor Democrat issue. #It's a POLITICIAN issue. #

Business as usual.

"Help, Help, I'm being repressed!"

[KC2KFC]

Quote[/b] (WX7B @ May 08 2005,10:26)]Taxing by the mile will never happen.

The business interests would oppose it.

Do you think my employer would want to pay tax on the 35K plus miles I drive a year in my company car?

Not likely.

Dave WX7B
They'll just find a way to twist the tax code, make it more complex by giving a tax credit to business. If the lawmakers can figure out a way to get more of YOUR money, to spend any way they like, they'll do it.

[k6bbc]

We received notice from our waste water company that they are now taxing by the poop.