Really bad Slow Scan TV Pictures

[ke0vh]

Again the other night I was monitoring Slow Scan TV on 14.230 mhz. #I went away from the computer for a little while and when I came back, as I was scrolling through the history file, there was a picture that had been transmitted of a girl doing the limbo, full frontal shot with no underwear on. #

I cannot understand why people will transmit this over the bands for all to see. #Many monitor our frequencies and will be very negative of what we do as amatuers just by a single incident. #THERE IS ABSOLUTELY no excuse for this kind of matter on the ham bands. #Don't give me "free speach", "turn it off if you don't like it", and "you are a prude" garbage. #I have a beautiful wife and 8 children, I don't believe that I could be classified as a prude. #

I would like to be able to enjoy amatuer radio and show slow scan pictures and the mode to my children and wife without having to be embarrassed or make excuses for what I see as just not a hobby, but a really important part of my life. #I was priveleged to teach my 9 year old how to send his name in morse code last night and would like to help him get excited about ham radio if he so choses. #I wouldn't want to have to restrict him from the SSTV part of the hobby until he turns 18 or 21. #

Why does the ARRL or the amatuer community as a whole not want to do something about this kind of behavior when it has the opportunity to really offend so many? #There is plenty of subject matter to transmit without having to be obscene and just plain in bad taste. #I know, there are too many who just don't give a darn and have no moral character for what is just plain right and wrong. #I am not one of them. #

Jack
KE0VH

I have said the same thing for over a year now and I don't like it myself. What can you do it? Most of the nasty stuff comes from South America. So I just tune down the dial...Jim

[kb3fkj]

thats worse than bad operaters on 10 meters. im not able to operate there yet, but i have listened to it and its pretty bad. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif I thought Ham radio was supposed to be a fun, clean hobby and not some kind of pornographic slut thing. i love this hobby and i would be greatly saddened if it turned in to that kind of thing. Is there not a law banning profanity on the voice bands? it should go for all other modes too.

[kc0idi]

I believe Part 97 has something in it about indecent content and language. #Which should make transmitting pictures like that ILLEGAL! #You might want to check in to reporting that to the FCC the next time you see something like that happen. #Some software programs actually have a time and date feature which tells you when the pictures were recorded. #I do not appreciate this stuff over the air either. #It give amateur radio a bad name. #If you are sending this type of material over the air PLEASE STOP. #Remember it not only reflects on you but the entire amateur community.

Thats just what I think.

73 -Reid KCØIDI

[K6UO]

Yeh, Jack I agree, that type of stuff will give Hams a bad name.
But having 8 kids does not show that you are upright,
a good citizen, honest or anything. It just shows you
don't give a fig about world overpopulation and don't care aabut
birth control.
Anyway. thanks for letting us know what's on slow scan.

[K3BM]

I believe FCC rules prohibit such pictures from being transmitted, but remember, other countries are not
so sexually repressed #as ours is, calling anything with nudity "pornography".

[ut1yv]

................

[tkinney]

Agree Jack, but what disturbes me more is why you think you are entitled to breed 8 children...you should get out of your hamshack and take a look at the real world.
Tom ke9ue

http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif I agree with you. I like SSTV and participate regularly. When the pics of the girls come up, I just go ahead and delete them. There are a lot of good pictures out there, and I enjoy seeing those of other ham's shacks, motorcycles, cars, vacation pics, etc. Why "trash" up the band with this garbage? And further more, they are probably pushing the envelope as far as what's legal. Yea, it's time we police ourselves!! http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif

[N5OZQ]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (tkinney @ Mar. 24 2002,13:40)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">...you should get out of your hamshack and take a look at the real world.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
Sounds to me as though he does.
While I agree that this 'sort of material' falls into the realm of questionable to bad taste to some, and I think that this sort of display is unnecessary, we DO all share the same planet, and are not all subject to the same laws and such. BUT by the same token, others might consider that privacy as well . . .
Tom, N5OZQ

[W5HTW]

Amateur radio has changed, like the society it is in. #It's that simple, though for most of us, it isn't that pleasant. # There seems to be little recourse other than being responsible for our own lives, and setting our own standards within our families. # Reporting the transmission of such material is not likely to draw much response from the FCC, if any at all. #Of course, it's worth a try, but I would not expect much in the way of results. #That, too, is disappointing, for once we hams feared the mighty hand of the FCC, and it kept us in line with the rules of the road. #Many would disagree, but I think that was a better ham radio.

Listening to ham radio I now hear jokes I would never have heard in public 30 years ago. #The so-called "Seven Prohibited Words" are in common use on ham radio fone frequencies, throughout the spectrum. # I am certain, though, that the only change we are going to see is more of this "freedom to offend," so we may as well adapt. #One way is to go CW only. #Another is to find another hobby that is more suitable to solitude. #Such as model railroading, done in the privacy of your home, without outside contact. #

As an atheist, I am sometimes asked why I have moral codes. #Morals have nothing at all to do with an unseen deity. #They have to do with respect for other people. #We have lost that, and it doesn't look like it's coming back anytime soon, and that, sadly, includes ham radio. #

As to the overpopulation, I wholeheartedly agree, though it was obviously not the intent of the post. #But 8 kids, in a generation, becomes 60 or so, as they meet someone else's 8 and multiply. #Which is why we've added 5 billion people to the planet in 100 years, and most of that in the last 30 years. #And a whole bunch of them want to get on 20 meters SSB, "right now." #

73
Ed W5HTW

[AB7RG]

Man, I sure hope that this isn't a sign of things to come... I haven't tried out SSTV yet. It's about the one mode that I haven't ever messed with. Hate to think that SSTV will turn into another version of 75 meter SSB. Perhaps we should think about getting on and operating with good amateur practice, rather than just tuning down the bands... Although I must admit that I too am guilty of this. I haven't been on 75 meters in almost two years due to the crap that goes on down there. 80 meters is another story though, lots of fun to be had down there. We just have to fight and take the bands back from those who will abuse it. Like the old cliche goes, use it or lose it.



73 Clinton AB7RG

[W7LGK]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (tkinney @ Mar. 24 2002,13:40)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Agree Jack, but what disturbes me more is why you think you are entitled to breed 8 children...you should get out of your hamshack and take a look at the real world.
Tom ke9ue[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif Are you brain dead or are you really that stupid? #What gives YOU the right to even ask a question like that. #If this man can feed them, cloth them, and can provide for their educations....he has no problem....can YOU say the same? #If your attention span can handle it, go back to the subject at hand.....smut on the air waves.

# # # # # # # # # # #Have a nice day.....Lonny http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[KE4MOB]

Fred, better get some more space on the ol' hard drives..this one's going to be a barn burner!!!

A note to posters: be very, very, careful what information you volunteer in your posts...people can use the most insignificant fact to bash you over the head!!

What, pray tell, is the "correct" number of children to have? Am I OK having two, or am I out of line? And who sets and enforces these limits, anyway?? Shouldn't we look to the government to do this--like in, say, CHINA?!

To all the wannabe social engineers out there "YOU--OFF MY PLANET!!"

Steve, KE4MOB

[n7xei]

I saw that same image a few years ago when someone emailed it to me. I no longer accept email from that person. As for the legality of the image, the FCC already has laws against it being transmitted. The sender is in violation by transmitting pornography over the armature bands. Report them!

Steve, I have to agree with your comments on the 8 kids. I got to thinking; I know a number of families with more than 3 kids. 1 with 5 and 1 with 10. All 15 kids in those 2 families are 100% great kids (and a few adults now). 100%. I know a number of 1 and 2 kid families that cannot claim 100%. Drug addicts, Juvenal delinquents, bad grades in school, talk back to parents and so on. It seems to me the larger families provide better citizens to the world. At least from my observations…

73's
Sheldon, N7XEI

[N2RJ]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (ke0vh @ Mar. 18 2002,08:52)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Again the other night I was monitoring Slow Scan TV on 14.230 mhz. #I went away from the computer for a little while and when I came back, as I was scrolling through the history file, there was a picture that had been transmitted of a girl doing the limbo, full frontal shot with no underwear on. #

I cannot understand why people will transmit this over the bands for all to see. #Many monitor our frequencies and will be very negative of what we do as amatuers just by a single incident. #THERE IS ABSOLUTELY no excuse for this kind of matter on the ham bands. #Don't give me "free speach", "turn it off if you don't like it", and "you are a prude" garbage. #I have a beautiful wife and 8 children, I don't believe that I could be classified as a prude. #

I would like to be able to enjoy amatuer radio and show slow scan pictures and the mode to my children and wife without having to be embarrassed or make excuses for what I see as just not a hobby, but a really important part of my life. #I was priveleged to teach my 9 year old how to send his name in morse code last night and would like to help him get excited about ham radio if he so choses. #I wouldn't want to have to restrict him from the SSTV part of the hobby until he turns 18 or 21. #

Why does the ARRL or the amatuer community as a whole not want to do something about this kind of behavior when it has the opportunity to really offend so many? #There is plenty of subject matter to transmit without having to be obscene and just plain in bad taste. #I know, there are too many who just don't give a darn and have no moral character for what is just plain right and wrong. #I am not one of them. #

Jack
KE0VH[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
Isn't this sort of thing illegal? Did you report it, along with a copy of the picture and the sender's callsign? If not, then there's the reason stuff like that is going on unhindered. I'm not saying anyone should play radio police, but reporting any illegal activity you see does help keep the bands clean.

[tkinney]

Sorry Lonny, I am not dumb or stupid, prehaps just more careing than people like you with your narrow religionist selfish views.
Have a nice day
Tom

[VE6BUD]

Well, gentlemen... we are being faced with a few things:

1. The tests required to get onto the air are getting easier.
2. The CW requirement, one of the biggest things
preventing prospective hams from getting on the
airwaves is slowly being eliminated. I'm not saying that
CW stops lids, but it does make them "Work" towards
getting a license. Maybe if they felt they had worked
towards something, they'll behave themselves a little
better knowing that they could lose it.
3. Equipment is getting cheaper to purchase and is
becoming much more readily available than it used to
be. It's cheaper to buy a Transciever than a reciever
these days!
4. Enforcement is getting lax. The RAC can't stop rouge
hams and the ISC (The Canadian version of the FCC)
will not get involved in Ham-Related matters, unless
they cause interference with other services. What are
we supposed to do? Throw a brick through a window?

All of these things are a recipie for disaster.

Ever heard W6NUT? (www.w6nut.com) This web page has
a realaudio stream of the repeater on there. I listened to
this for about 30 mins at work and I could not believe my
ears.

I'm not even going to mention a complete disregard for
operating procedure, operating courtesy and so on that
happens there.

What I also heard on there (When they weren't swearing)
was a considerable amount of ignorance. They like talking
about the radios they own but they have no clue how they
work electrically. I bet none of those lids could even build
a simple dipole.

It's getting to the point where THIS will be the future of
our hobby if we do not make life miserable for these lids.
What are we supposed to do? If we jammed them, we
would be no better than the lid themselves. The only thing
we can do is rely on other hams to locally enforce the
laws in their country.

I remember a while back hearing about a CB'er who
enjoyed jamming other CB'ers in the city he was in. A few
angry CB'ers tracked the guy down and gave his radio the
automobile tire treatment.

I'm not advocating that we do the same but sometimes I
wonder if that's what's going to happen when things finally
come to a head.

[NF2C]

I also agree that this crap does not belong on the bands. I have been off since about 1992 and to tell the truth as I slowly come back, I am not sure if I want to!! It was a great hobby and hope it can still be. Now any jerk can get a license and FCC enforcement is apparently nil, if any! Oh well, I guess I will find a decent place and hide out. I imagine in a few more years you will be able to fill out your own license and just keep it at your home (like CB became). D'ont send it to anyone, just file it somewhere (God knows why!http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif. I guess I really shouldn't go there, but that's my thoughts.
Murph (NF2C)

[ke0vh]

To all, I had to laugh at the comments about me "overpopulating" the planet. When you consider that if you stood everyone in the world next to each other, with a square foot of space to stand in, it would barely take up the room that the state of Rhode Island takes up and a square acre the state of Texas.. But I digress......... http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

Here is a copy of an email sent to me by the amatuer who transmitted the photo that got me on this subject, and my reply to him. At this time, I have omitted his call and name:

From the Amatuer to KE0VH:
i feel nude is not dirty or nasty unless some one makes it so
we all come in to this world nude
butt I'm talking about tasteful nude pics not ones showing how baby's come
to be
and if you don't like it it should not be rubbed in your face or any ones
face that is not of age and or feeling that it is tasteful
but every one has a right to there own feelings !!!!!!!
and
i hope this dont offend you i would not send any thing like that i
know and i dont know any one that would in the small group of hams i know
good luck
and 73/s
*****

My reply to him:


***, nude is not dirty or nasty, that is not my point, BUT THE HAM BANDS and a PUBLIC forum IS NOT THE PLACE FOR IT. I should be able to give a demo of SSTV to prospective hams or show things to my wife and children that have to do with our hobby that I don't have to make excuses for or not be able to show them. You are right, you have the right to your own feelings, but the ham bands are not the place to "display" those types of feelings. And, while your email was great and I appreciate your reply and wasn't offended by the email, the attitude that doesn't care about what is right and proper on the Amatuer Radio bands is offending. I would appeal to your sense of what is right, wrong, proper and in its proper PLACE. What you enjoy and admire in the privacy of your own life is certainly not my business and I would never even attempt to interfere. BUT when you put it on my computer screen it becomes my business. I have as much right to be able to copy SSTV on the amatuer bands and not have to treat it like a cable TV channel that I have to "lock out" for my childrens sake. Remember, that there are hams under the age of 21 as well, and hopefully we will have more of an influx of them into the hobby. What are we going to teach them?

Respectfully, but pointedly. 73' to you as well.

Jack KE0VH

[W5KRM]

The FCC defines obscene or indecent material as follows:

The Commission's rules prohibit Amateur stations from transmitting obscene or indecent words or language. You are advised that, for indecency purposes, the Commission treats Amateur transmissions the same as commercial broadcasts. Utterances of "any obscene, indecent or profane language by means of radio communications" are prohibited by Title 18, U.S.C. Section 1464. Under the Communications Act of 1934, as amended, the Commission may revoke any station license for violation of Section 1464 of Title 18. See 47 U.S.C. Section 312(a)(6).

Obscene speech is not protected by the First Amendment and cannot be broadcast at any time. To be obscene, material must meet a three point test: (1) an average person, applying contemporary community standards, must find that the material, as a whole, appeals to the prurient interest; (2) the material must depict or describe, in a patently offensive way, sexual conduct specifically defined by applicable law; and (3) the material, taken as a whole, must lack serious literary, artistic, political or scientific value. See Miller v. California, 413 U.S. 15 (1973).

The Commission defines indecency as language or material that, in context, depicts or describes, in terms patently offensive as measured by contemporary community standards, sexual or excretory activities or organs. The Supreme Court has repeatedly rejected arguments that this definition is unconstitutionally vague. See Action for Children's Television v. F.C.C., 58 F.3d. 654 (D.C. Cir. 1995), FCC v. Pacifica Foundation, 438 U.S. 726 (1977).

Sounds pretty clear cut to me, but then again, anyone with any hint of common sense, would already know this.

As to the stupid comments about one's family size, etc., I really don't see the connection with the posted topic. But then again, with that sort of attitude expressed here, that is probably why one sees this kind of slow scan trash on the air.

[If this trash is from outside the CONUS, then it will be harder to block; becomes a US State Dept issue].

[aa1mn]

Offensive materials are much like insults, you can't help being offered them but you don't have to accept them. Neither are you required to share it with your family or friends. #It is that simple.

Being such a diverse world, most everyone has their own personal standards of what is deemed "offensive". #It is quite easy to change the channel, turn off the radio ... should the equipment you are operating not come equipped with a channel selector or on-off switch this can easily be remedied by disconnecting the plug from the outlet.

It is hoped that all will take this suggestion to heart. Believe it or not, it works...I know it does because I've tried it myself!!!

73s and best wishes to all.

Chuck
AA1MN

[ke0vh]

To Chuck who wrote in, "just turn the radio off", I SHOULDN'T have to. I have just as much right to recieve SSTV within legal limits without the sludge on the air. That is way too liberal for me. How about amatuers just doing what is right and proper? I truly do not believe that it is too much to ask.

As for the bad language, as stated by KA2HZO, he is very right. The ARRL and FCC are not doing their jobs in either enforcing the rules or coming up with some way to penalize those who don't obey the rules. Again, it is too bad as well that just "blowing off steam" is just that. Goes to show how permissive and liberal our society is becoming. "Your rights to have rights are trampling on my right to have rights." What about rules, decency, morality, and yes, just what is proper and honorable". Even within the ranks of our wonderful hobby and pasttime. Maybe I will compile all of this and send it to the ARRL.

Wishing for the best, and excellence. What is wrong with that?

KE0VH

>Again the other night I was monitoring Slow Scan TV >on 14.230 mhz. #I went away from the computer for a >little while and when I came back, as I was scrolling >through the history file, there was a picture that had >been transmitted of a girl doing the limbo, full frontal >shot with no underwear on. #

IF you have been in direct QSO with the ham that sent this, you would have had the right to ask that you don't want to receive images of this nature. #Since you were just monitoring, or to look at it in another light, you were listening in on other peoples communications, you really don't have a say unless the image is blatantly illegal. #A nude shot in a non-sexual pose can hardly be called blatantly illegal.

I agree with the position that the ham that sent the pic had in his EMAIL to you, nude does not equal lewd. #If the station he was in QSO with wanted the pic, so be it, it's legal.

What's scary is that the next logical step would be live, nude ops on SSTV. #It's bad enought to see hams at meetings, seeing them nude could make a guy go blind. #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif

[ke0vh]

N0LID,
Unbelievable!!! You missed the entire point! The amatuer bands are public media and ANYONE can be monitoring or listening in. You miss the point of decorum, proper operating, and just plain what is right (to use the phrase again). There is material being transmitted (and according to part 97 as previously mentioned that is illegal). Your comments about not being in QSO with the ham that sent it is purely ludicrous! I cannot believe that you would believe that you would sanction nudity on the airwaves, public and amatuer regardless of "lewdness" or not. Amatuer communications ARE NOT PRIVATE. That is what land lines and cell phones are phone. BTW, the email back from the ham to me I posted (without id'ing him I might add) refers to another posting here at QRZ.com that I posted a month or so ago. Should have differentiated that. But the matter still is valid and the same as then regardless. Leave the nudie garage calendar material in the garage where it belongs, and OFF THE AIR.

ke0vh

Never said that communications on the ham bands were private. #The ham bands are very public, but so is talking in public. #You could never dream of interupting a conversation going on between two people telling them that you don't approve of what they are saying because they could be heard by children, females, or those with narrow minds, would you? #The only difference is the voices or images have been upconverted to 14 Mhz.

The FCC has made it clear that we are held to the same standards as the broadcast media. #Good or bad, that is the law. #

Have I seen nudity on the PBS station? Yep. #Have I heard F*** and S*** on CBS recently? Yep. #Has the "N" word been used recently on FOX? Yep.

How we use the law is another matter. #As an example, I look at the idiots #on the W6NUT repeater as trailer trash. #I hold my own operations to a much higher standard than the law requires and hold the station that I am in QSO with to those standards. #If I get a QSO with a LID, I'll sign off on go on to another frequency. #It's real simple, I keep my part of the sandbox clean, but I'm not going to police everyone else. #I try to show by example.

Jack,

I agree with your overall message.

There are so many positive things that can be gained by "prudent" use of our airwaves.

There was a comment regarding how our standards vary internationally (anyone who has traveled knows this first hand), but as an INTERNATIONAL COMMUNITY OF HAM RADIO OPERATORS don't we have an obligation to not offend our neighbors?

The "prudent" #answer is of course, YES !

We are all in a position to lead and put forth positive examples that stimulate the mind in a positive evolutionary direction, yet...

SSTV is an excellent media to catch the attention of young people. #If more of us would transmit personal pictures that tell a good story, I suspect our community would grow larger and certainly more enriched!

Good job Jack!

KG4MUR - Bruce Cressler

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (ke0vh @ Mar. 25 2002,11:57)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Unbelievable!!! #I cannot believe that you would believe that you would sanction nudity on the airwaves, public and amatuer regardless of "lewdness" or not.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>

Perhaps you need to tune in some daytime soap operas. Public airwaves broadcast some rather blue-gray material everyday & no one complains like this. But put a naked woman on a SSTV (FAX) picture & OMG, the world is coming to an end according to the "Moral-Legal Minority"!

If you are so sick of looking at women after 8 kids, perhaps you can shake off your sheltered life & get some real world exposure for a change by leaving the house. I am sure you are the type to attempt at following your kids around at school & make sure not an ill word or image is ever uttered? Some parents think they are helping when they are really doing the direct opposite...

You puritans kill me with laughter!

Much like the language issue, all you do is cause more attention to the frequencies you mention & exacerbate the "problem". Then the unidentified mayhem begins...

I happen operate on HF quite a bit & on our frequencies you had better ID properly with your little comments injected into our QSO's about "language", tape recording, "Riley is gonna get you", etc. or else you will be abused. No "fine business" operators need apply any RF & interject moronic comments. Nothing is as easy or more fun than sending unidentified commenters & PW jammers packing on down the band! Nothing like looking down your nose citing illegality when you are just as much if not more illegal yourselves!

Somehow just using 1970 FAX technology to send any pictures is quite laughable to begin with... which illustrates just how bad ham radio has become such a time warp & now resides on the falling edge of technology for the most part.

This leads to too much excess time on your hands to complain about inane subjects such as "lewdness" & language.

Get a life & mind your own "fine business"!

RM
"Loving that limbo"

[KD7NBH]

KE0VH, you can act or not. If you have a call sign for the transmission, and it is issued in the US, forward your issue to the FCC. Right or wrong, it is their decision to follow up or not. You will have done your part. If you do not contact the FCC with info, you have no right to complain, because you are part of the problem.

N0LID, as far as interfering with a verbal conversation, if I were with my grandchildren, and two people were using language next to us that should not be used in the presence of children, you bet I would interrupt them and let them know I considered it inappropriate. My opinion only, but I do have the right to hold that opinion, just as you have the right to hold yours.

Ed

[K2UP]

By some random chance, I happened to see the first half of that very same photo. #It was either the same broadcast or the same operator sending the same photo at another time. #I had no idea it was so explicit because local QRM ripped up the lower half of the picture. #Even if such images are OK in other countries, the airwaves are international. #Since we all share the same resource, I would welcome some international consensus about ham radio manners. #I don't think it's unreasonable to have a ban on cursing (any language) and nudity. #I know this is a slippery slope, but a tenuous grip on a skippery slope is better than no grip at all. #I would like to have guests visit my shack and see a demo without fear of alienating potential new hams. #As for the eight kids.... #I don't see how this relates to anything. #No one knows the how or why of this fellow's family. #Let's not beat the guy up for making a good point.

Thanks for the bandwidth

Rob, WW2RG

Yo, HZO.

I think if you spent as much time trying to find out why you're so hung up about sex (believe it or not, there's nothing bad about it) and so called obscene words that are very common in the 'community' these days, as you spend posting whining comments about how you can't turn the VFO knob and patting yourself and your boyfriend on the back for your net, you'd be a lot better off. Get a life! According to the 'Rules', we can mention the same stuff that appears on Howard Stern's show and still be 'legal.' Amateur Radio has a long way to go before we get to that level. By far, most ops stay away from the really funky stuff. However, there are those 'Speech Police' hams out there that will barge right into a QSO and lecture someone for using words like 'hell', as in "Joe Schmoe blew his amp to hell." There are enough Jerry Fallwells out there already. Loosen up your chastity belt, OM, and skip the next book burning.

[w8ob]

Christ and crackers! How come every damn post on this forum ends up like the jerry
springer show? One man states his thoughts, the next one brings up total crap that
has no bearing on the subject. I myself am not offended by a naked woman (seen more than
one in my lifetime) but don't think radio is the place to send it. Of course if some of you
guys ever get out of your shacks and check out the TV thats all you see on the big
tube anymore. Yes I seem to remember this type of transmission is not allowed under
part 97 but if it is coming from outside the good ole U.S. not much you can do about\
it other than delete it or tune on up the band

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (w8ob @ Mar. 25 2002,13:43)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Christ and crackers! How come every damn post on this forum...[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>

Oh the offensive language!

Is this cussing & swearing really necessary?

The Content Police have been notified & will be responding,

RM

[W7WIK]

If the pictures are coming from South America, I don't really think the FCC can, or should, do anything about it. #In most countries, a picture of a nude woman doesn't constitute pornography. #The HF bands are international by nature and I don't think we as Americans can control everything... and we shouldn't. #The American way is not necessarily best way (despite most American's beliefs). #

I've been in the USAF for over 20 years and have traveled the World extensively. #There are a lot of differing values and ways of thinking out there. #I don't think any one of them is right or wrong, and we as Americans should not force our beliefs or values on other cultures. #It breeds nothing but contempt. # It's no wonder there is so much "anti-Americanism" out there. #

Don't get me wrong, I love our country, but I don't think we should be telling other countries how to do their business unless it's downright criminal.

[KA2QFX]

After reading the various responses I am compelled to add my 2 cents... which may be overvaluing my words but...

I consider myself a member of the 3.910 group and I spend a fair amount of listening time on 3.950 and 3.898 as well as some other frequencies which I can surmise many of the negative commentors would find objectionable. # I have two opinions on such matters.

First: I find vulgar lanquage, on air or in public, repugnant when used incessantly by people who are niether cognizant or considerate of their audience or subject. Which is not to say that I am offended when colorful and emotive lanquage is used in the company of adult (usually male) individuals in an evening round table. #I find such lanquage, rather, far less offensive than any of the following:
Sexual promiscuity being broadcast as acceptable behavior to pre-teens. Have you seen some of the shows on "the WB"?!
The idea that gay men are good people to have lead young boys on scouting trips. So much so that the United Way and others now ban any tax defferred funding going to the Scouts through them.
The idea that it's OK to kill your unborn/unwanted child because "it's legal."
The media's portrayal of anyone that owns a firearm as a raving lunatic destined to commit mass murder eventually. And worse, castigating us as favoring such behavior in lieu of trashing the Constitution.
You get the idea.

Second: I find the humor, commradery and generally excellent radio skills and knowledge common on several of the frequencies mentioned (14.313 exlcuded) much more appealing than some of the technically inept nonsense that more lax licensing has presented us with. # Or for that matter, the mind numbing "CQ ... 59 OM Good luck in the contest" chatter and splatter that some of the socially awkward tend to favor. Have you listened to two meter repeaters in an urban area lately? "OK Joe, I got's the big battery on now with the stubby duck in the commode. Am I quieting now? Back to you, QSL?"
PLEASE, SPARE ME! #I'll trade a good four letter word in context over that anyday.

I guess the bottom line is it's all relative. And relative to the status quo of our current media borne culture, correcting the adult lanquage on 75 meters wouldn't be high on my to-do list as opposed to say keeping 2-way radios out of the hands of third world terrorists. Remember when you needed to show a General Radiotelephone to make repairs and needed a license to operate land mobile equipment? Yeah, enforcement went the way of knowing how to operate a radio along with good manners and code requirements. So much for the ARRL and the FCC. The bands are what they are because that's what was deemed "good for the hobby". #We got what we paid for, which is why the ARRL hasn't seen a dime from me since "Tech-plus".

Later,

Mark
KA2QFX

[w8ob]

Ok RM maybe someone will spring bail for me when the contentinos come. everybody
knows such language is written in the bible, Jesus Christ, damnation etc.....
I don,t go to church every sunday but geez (better) I know that much.. h i.
If that was the extent of the content on 75m WOW!!!!

[kc5exm]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (tkinney @ Mar. 24 2002,13:40)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Agree Jack, but what disturbes me more is why you think you are entitled to breed 8 children...you should get out of your hamshack and take a look at the real world.
Tom ke9ue[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
I hate to get in on something that is not of my concern but it looks as Tom felt he needed to. As I recall, both Tom and Jack's call letters are of US issue, and last time I checked, it was a free country and it was legal for a family to have several children in the US. While I do not think I could handle and provide for 8 children, if Jack can, more power to him--he has my blessing! Tom, if you don't want to have 8 children, then don't--but dont whine if someone else decides to. It is not your concern or your business maybe Tom needs to take a look at the real world.

[wb8wor]

Without judging anyone's repression or taste, I have to ask where was this problem 25 years ago?

I remember Field Day, 1977, and we were messing around with SSTV (Robot Scan Digital Converter. Way cool) After midnight, nude photos started coming across. The reaction was this: http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

As a teenage kid, this was okay with me. Now, I'm more discerning, but I realize that the problem is the FCC never really defined what obscene really was, other than "the seven dirty words".

Basically, if no one complains, it is okay, right?

Looked at another way, how do nude SSTV transmissions fit in with the Basis and Purpose?

73,

Tom WB8WOR

[tkinney]

Sorry EXM, but overpopulation is all of our business...where do you think all the food and care is going to come from as we increase populations by the billions ? Thats your right ?..well go get yourself cut as we do not need anymore fools like yourself breeding.

[kc5exm]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (tkinney @ Mar. 25 2002,15:53)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Sorry EXM, but overpopulation is all of our business...where do you think all the food and care is going to come from as we increase populations by the billions ? #Thats your right ?..well go get yourself cut as we do not need anymore fools like yourself breeding.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
Well, this thread has digressed to the point of being no longer useful to the amateur radio community utilizing this forum and has become more a place for some LIDs with nothing better to do but hurl insults at individul free Americans who have differing viewpoints and ideals. I will not glorify Tom's response with another reply such as, "Out of my country, communist." or the like. Additionally, I will refrain from calling Tom a fool for lack of anything intelligent to say. As for "increasing our populations by the billions," I will let you look at the math regarding the contributions of the United States to the global issue of overpopulation. A figure of 6,213,823,480 human beings are living in the world as of today. Of those, the US represents 286,697,489 of them. Data provided as of is projected by the US Census Bureau as of 1834 EST 25 Mar, 2002. Therefore, the US represents about 4.6% of the total world population. I don't think Jack's 8 children are going to throw the US (which produces more food each year than we can consume as a country) into a famine. AR SK

[w6th]

We are not talking about the ouside world as we have been well informed. #Now it is the Amateur Radio we are talking about and do not want to get off the subject. #When I took my exam for Ham radio and passed, we did not have that sort of thing. Looks like we are getting down to the bottom of the barrel. You know, like the outside world, the rotten ones. Just a few maybe? No, many more than a few and keeps adding or shall I say multiplying. #God bless America and the hopes of ham radio. # # # #73,
# # # # # # # # Vito W6th

[n9wx]

Hey Everyone,

I agree about the SSTV stuff but last time I checked, it's not illegal to have 8 children as long as they are being taken care of. As far as world overpopulation is concerned, that's a crock. I mean come on, have you ever spent anytime in Idaho, or Montana? Just because everyone tends to crowd in together in certain areas doesn't mean we have a world population problem. As Forrest Gump said, "That's all I have to say about that."
73,
N9WX http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif

[M3SAL]

I too use 14.230 among other frequencies, and have been subjected to these pictures, it seems to happen late at night, and even though I am pretty broad-minded, I was horrified to see them appearing on-screen.
Also, as a female, I really do not want to see this sort of thing, and I find it offensive and degrading to us girls, I wonder how these idiots who send these pics would feel if I replied with pictures of naked men flashing everything, I bet they would soon moan about it (don't worry, I wont do that) http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif
If anyone wants, maybe we can try to arrange regular SSTV nets, maybe you can all reply on here and we can arrange this.
Ok, I wont drone on any longer, take care guys, Love and wishes, Sally-Ann (M3SAL), QTH Crawley, West Sussex. (You can contact me via packet with my other callsign G7UCL)
XXXXXXXX

[N5BRY]

Right on about the 14230 sstv mess. Really some brain damaged people there. Notice they send two or three at a time, talk while sending, and off frequency a good part of the time. This sort of junk should be reported to Riley. Pitiful group will ruin sstv in three or four years.

[aa1mn]

The only "idiots" disceranable in this situation are those griping and groaning about material they deem "objectionable" but insist upon viewing anyway.

If it's so "offensive" why do these birds bother ogling it to begin with. #Now, I'm not the sharpest tool in the shed, but anyone who's gonna sit and stare at stuff that they don't like looking at to begin with have to be three quarters short of a dollar to start with.

Bring on the pics of the naked men -- I won't find 'em offensive 'cause I ain't gonna be looking at 'em when they come on the screen. #Say...brilliant idea that, don't look at things you don't like to look at!!! So where's my Nobel Peace Prize for this sudden revelation for helping out my fellow human beings? # http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

Why not complain to the offending operator(s)?

[NF8W]

Ya know what the problem is with free speech??? Ya gotta listen to idiots. But then, they think you're an idiot too, huh? Give each person the right to respond according to his/her conscience. But remember, your rights end where theirs begin, and so on. think about it.

KC8RNN http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[tkinney]

Intresting..just got my first hate mail from a ham on this topic, Red W5RUF like threats. Whoever said some of our hams are from the bottom of the barrel must have know Red.

[n3ikq]

Sadly, this thread has degenerated into a pretty realistic snapshot of our current spoiled society. A long time ago these words were written concerning OUR hobby. Feel free to print this out and put it in plain view while operating. Anyone who finds these words to be old fashioned or trite just doesn't get it. It's not always about ME or what is MINE. It never was. When we key up it's about US.

THE RADIO AMATEUR CODE

The Amateur is Considerate

And never knowingly uses the air in such a way as to lessen the pleasure of others.

The Amateur is Loyal

And offers loyalty, encouragement and support to fellow radio amateurs, local radio club...

The Amateur is Progressive

Keeping the station abreast of science.
It is well-built and efficient, and ALL operating practice is above reproach.

The Amateur is Friendly

Slow and patient sending when requested,
friendly advice and counsel to the beginner,
kindly assistance, co-operation and consideration for the interests of others; these are marks of the amateur spirit.

The Amateur is Balanced

Radio is a hobby, never allowing it to interfere with any
of the duties one owes to home, job, school, or community.

The Amateur is Patriotic

The acquired knowledge and station equipment are
always ready for the service of country and community.


It's really that simple............73

To M3SAL,

Good luck on your 'transition', girlfriend. Great to have an opinion on this subject from someone who's been on both sides of the fence. However, as a man, I can tell you that a nude female is not lewd, crude or indecent. Organized religion has taught us that it is, hence the reactions in this forum. Frankly, I expected more of an enlightened response from you, especially since you are a woman now. Hey, by the way...where do you hang out on HF? I'd love to work you. That would be one for the logbook, OM!

[WA0KNP]

This looks more like a teen chat room than qrz.com.
Let's lighten up! #Ham radio is a hobby, it's fun!! #Let's use this forum to exchange stories, ideas and thoughts on topics which will make us all better operators. #There are plenty of sites where you can get into super discussions on religion, overpopulation, etc...but this is not supposed to be one of them.

73,

WAØKNP

[wb0nni]

I'm with you 100% Jack - I devote a lot of time each year working to bring young people to ham radio. #Interestingly, it's exposure to the kind of thing that you wrote about that most parents are concerned with. Most will agree that the future of the hobby depends upon our ability to spark an interest in young people. #Yet, the more ham radio begins to look like the internet, the fewer seriously interested young people we will attract.

Even more troubling, however, are those that chose to attack you rather than address the problem. #In doing so, they detract from your message and by default appear to condone the transmission of that kind of trash.

I applaud your writeup. #Please know that most hams are as offended by that sort of thing as you are. #Best 73s - Bob

[DL3WKG]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (W5HTW @ Mar. 24 2002,14:12)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Amateur radio has changed, like the society it is in. #It's that simple, though for most of us, it isn't that pleasant. # There seems to be little recourse other than being responsible for our own lives, and setting our own standards within our families. # Reporting the transmission of such material is not likely to draw much response from the FCC, if any at all. #Of course, it's worth a try, but I would not expect much in the way of results. #That, too, is disappointing, for once we hams feared the mighty hand of the FCC, and it kept us in line with the rules of the road. #Many would disagree, but I think that was a better ham radio.

Listening to ham radio I now hear jokes I would never have heard in public 30 years ago. #The so-called "Seven Prohibited Words" are in common use on ham radio fone frequencies, throughout the spectrum. # I am certain, though, that the only change we are going to see is more of this "freedom to offend," so we may as well adapt. #One way is to go CW only. #Another is to find another hobby that is more suitable to solitude. #Such as model railroading, done in the privacy of your home, without outside contact. #

As an atheist, I am sometimes asked why I have moral codes. #Morals have nothing at all to do with an unseen deity. #They have to do with respect for other people. #We have lost that, and it doesn't look like it's coming back anytime soon, and that, sadly, includes ham radio. #

As to the overpopulation, I wholeheartedly agree, though it was obviously not the intent of the post. #But 8 kids, in a generation, becomes 60 or so, as they meet someone else's 8 and multiply. #Which is why we've added 5 billion people to the planet in 100 years, and most of that in the last 30 years. #And a whole bunch of them want to get on 20 meters SSB, "right now." #

73
Ed W5HTW[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif
I absolutly agree with what you say Ed and I hope some-
one else will care about it.
Thanks for your contribution!
Best regards, 73
Rudie, DL3WKG

[ke0vh]

When I stated the original problem at the beginning of this topic, my hope is that "even if I changed one mind" it would be worth it. The only reason I even mentioned the number of children I have was to show I have no problem http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif with things in private. So, with that being said, LEAVE THAT DISCUSSION out of it. The problem is improper use of the hambands for pictures of nudity and pornography. I certainly apologize to QRZ.com for the in-appropriateness of people in my hobby that are of the fortitude of NOT be able to stay on the subject. I certainly hope to stir up a hornets nest. Maybe if enough people contact congress, the ARRL, and other appropriate authorities, the FCC will do somthing about the problems associated with transmissions on the amatuer bands.

[wu3d]

Hello to all.
I have read the threads here and I believe I will get to the heart of this and to the facts.
To all out there there is a God. Nude photos are more than illegal on the ham bands their illegal to Gods laws of morality. Only the foolish do not believe in Him. We have removed Him from all aspects of our Government and our schools not to mention that most have removed Him from their lives. To those who think nudity is "ok" as long as it does not show sexual acts they are just as wrong as the porno king who makes x rated movies.
Well, I'm finished. Will I get ripped for this reply?.....If I don't I'll be surprised ...but then the truth is never easy to swallow.

[ke0vh]

Amen to N3IKQ, and thank you.

THE RADIO AMATEUR CODE

The Amateur is Considerate

And never knowingly uses the air in such a way as to lessen the pleasure of others.

The Amateur is Loyal

And offers loyalty, encouragement and support to fellow radio amateurs, local radio club...

The Amateur is Progressive

Keeping the station abreast of science.
It is well-built and efficient, and ALL operating practice is above reproach.

The Amateur is Friendly

Slow and patient sending when requested,
friendly advice and counsel to the beginner,
kindly assistance, co-operation and consideration for the interests of others; these are marks of the amateur spirit.

The Amateur is Balanced

Radio is a hobby, never allowing it to interfere with any
of the duties one owes to home, job, school, or community.

The Amateur is Patriotic

The acquired knowledge and station equipment are
always ready for the service of country and community.


It's really is that simple.

[N8VB]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (wu3d @ Mar. 26 2002,08:21)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Hello to all.
I have read the threads here and I believe I will get to the heart of this and to the facts.
To all out there there is a God. Nude photos are more than illegal on the ham bands their illegal to Gods laws of morality. Only the foolish do not believe in Him. We have removed Him from all aspects of our Government and our schools not to mention that most have removed Him from their lives. To those who think nudity is "ok" as long as it does not show sexual acts they are just as wrong as the porno king who makes x rated movies.
Well, I'm finished. Will I get ripped for this reply?.....If I don't I'll be surprised ...but then the truth is never easy to swallow.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>

The facts, LOL! Please go preach somewhere else!

[KA2YBP_Jim]

I see this KA2HZO boy cruisin the postings, taking shots behind his keyboard. Fact about many of the frequencies he mentions are generally a bunch of guys having a good time. Maybe a little rough language at times (as in the real world), but radio fun.

Take for example 3910 and your reference..... We like to have fun, if you took the time to listen there long enough you'de probably learn a thing or two. Instead, you one of those crums that has an apartment antenna you took out of the box from MFJ and expect to be 60 over everywhere cause you paid good money for it. You probably stopped by as many do and thought you'de throw something in. When you got rejected for not being close to our frequency and were told to get a signal, you resorted to this internet bashing. This is the only chance you'll be heard on 75 meters is here on QRZ.

Lets get the fun back in radio and leave your snipes in your locker sonny.

[n8ick]

I read through these postings a lot, but this is the forst time i ever thought there was a need to reply to one. #If you see one of these "pornography" pictures coming over the air and the call sign starts with AA - AL, K, N, or W please call the FCC, ARRL, police, or your god(s). #But unless you know the amateur radio laws of all the countries in the world and all their cultural belifes I dont see how you can get all upset about this stuff coming over the air. #Not everyone belives in god, some dont, some belive in other gods. #Take a trip to an art museum, would you call the paintings in there "pornography"? #Do we need to make sure everyone in the museum is over 18? #All I am asking is that you try to look at things from somebody's point of view other than yours. #We are not the only country in the world that uses 20 meters. #So if your kid walks into the room and sees that on your computer why dont you try and explain to him why someone else might not be offended.

73's # #Nick

"A mind is like a parachute, it only works when it is open."

[ke0vh]

N8ICk, and others, it doesn't belong on the public amatuer bands.

[ke5rs]

I personally would like to hear more females on the air. #They are nice to talk to and these "Porn-Pictures" as you might call them are not going to encourage them to get their license and join us. (Most of them anyway) I think that may be true in most countries as well because statistically I have not met anyone yet (0, ZERO People) who think these pictures are good to send over the amateur bands. #The best you can do is ignoring it and they may go away. #It is not any different in my opinion than what is going on 2 meters now days. #More people, more garbage. #We all have to deal with it and we may all have to suffer the consequences such as loosing the hobby all together. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (ke0vh @ Mar. 26 2002,10:48)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">...it doesn't belong on the public amatuer bands.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>

Just who are you to decide for me? You make this assumption based according to your perceived community standard. This is a personal watermark because the law is NOT absolute as you want to argue. I have the exact picture in question ("Limbo") & it is not obscene or hardcore at all but rather quite funny. I am a man who enjoys humor & a woman's unclad body doesn't offend me either including my wife who even laughed when I showed her the picture in question! I am also religious but have adopted my beliefs to "modern times of tolerance". Besides, public & "readily accessable" are not even issues here, it ISN"T readily available! Something about the word "decoder" ring a bell too?

I think this whole thing revolves around some rather frustrated men who lack a sense of humor & take the world way too seriously in all aspects. This is supposed to be a "hobby" once a "service", a source of relaxation. The radio police aren't hiring. Get over it!

Relax, E-N-J-O-Y?

RM

[WF0H]

Well, since this is a discussion of Amateur Radio, I will try to abide by the rules I follow when operating.

The amateur bands are very much like a public park. #Perhaps you would happily run naked in a local public park. #Somehow, I doubt that the local authorities would approve, but the legality of the situation is not the issue. The issue is your willingness to do things that are offensive in a public place.

I am not arguing against what some perceive as an immoral act. The morality is highly relative. #In many countries that consider themselves much more civilized than the U.S., #hardcore pornography that even you might find offensive is openly sold on gas station magazine racks, where children can see it. There is no effort to hide the contents - it is all previewed on the front covers. Apparently, this has not caused hellfire and brimstone to issue forth yet (time will tell...). #

But I AM criticizing the lack of judgement, #self-awareness, and adult perspective that would compel you to romp naked through your local park, or display naked photos in a public place

I do watch SSTV when I can, and I like to share it with my family and visitors . #I would be extemely offended if one of these photos came through at one of these times. And I might not be terribly civilized in my response! #If you think it is my fault for 'easvesdropping on a private conversation' as one poster put it here, you are seriously delusional. #The 20 meter hamband is a very public forum - there is absolutely no suggestion of privacy there! # #

Where do you draw the line? #There are surely pedophiles among us as there appear to be all over society. Do we wait until they start swapping their fantasies on 14.230? Perhaps, they already are? #

I believe that you should avoid discussing anything on the air that you would not discuss during a church coffee. #Would you walk around a public park showing that picture to anyone you found there? If you did, how long would it be before you were arrested on some pretty serious charges?

Freedom of speech also includes the freedom to avoid speech that offends you, and the freedom to condemn those whose speech offends you.

[KD5NCO]

The overall issue is STANDARDS. Many here have tryed to imply that the origin
may have some bearing as to the nudity standard for that external country...

That tends to prove the point that HERE our standard is higher and valid.

But none of the authors of the external( non united states) thesis are willing to
check and see if the LICENSED amateurs of those external origin emmissions are
in fact BROADCASTING within the standards of their country of origin.( I doubt it)

For a fact, if the person sending the photo of a female partially nude were from
any of several countries I "visited" during '90-'91, then the happless ham would be
tried and executed, as they have no humor at all about female nudity where
Hussain or Usama or Yasir come from.

Just because WE have allowed the schools to fill our kids heads with mush
and the advertising folks have learned that trash sells
and howard stern can get laughs from farts
and prim time anything would make Linda Lovelace choke
and Rosie is really a stupid Dyke
and Al Gore is considered a sex symbol
and Janet Reno is the hero of WACO
and some idiot can freely berate a man for having 8 childern (sheesh lighten up!http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif
and "everwhere I look I see stupid people, they are just walking around and they don't even know they are stupid" oops I meant "dead"

Yep I got up every day for twenty five years to defend this insane "freedom" thing, and still
wounder if some of you folks really get it. Ideas are free, speech is free, images are free,
life is free, our constitution acknowledges that God endowed us with these freedoms.....

The point of standards and laws is to preserve the freedoms and accept the notion the in the
exerciseing of these "rights" we do not infringe on the rights of others. Rules, Laws, Standards
are a good thing, we should not triviealize the importance of this discussion by shouting
" Billy's mom lets him see porno" or other dumb ass ideas such as what part 97 means. I can read
english (tho I don't write it too well) and seems to me the profanity, vulgarity, and other emmissions
that MAY be construed to be in BAD TASTE are specifically prohibited and we acknowleded these rules
when we applied for our LICSENCE.

OK I'm from the Modern Army so I have Nomex and Kevlar...... FLAME ON !!!

73

[KC8TCQ]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (tkinney @ Mar. 25 2002,15:53)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Sorry EXM, but overpopulation is all of our business...where do you think all the food and care is going to come from as we increase populations by the billions ? #Thats your right ?..well go get yourself cut as we do not need anymore fools like yourself breeding.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
Living in the middle of farming communities, and seeing how things arew going. Your comment is somewhat off kilter. The farmers have the ability to grow enough food to feed the world over with plenty to spare. and what happens? The government uses OUR tax dollars to pay the farmers to not grow anything. Same with the gas prices, the technology has been around for quite a while to produce ethanol. Lets get these farmers something productive to do, and let them make a decent living as well.

Like someone else said if the gentleman has the ability to support his family, then more power to him. If everyone would pay more attention to their own backyard, the neighborhood would be a whole lot cleaner.

73 de Keith

[k9mhz]

I wouldn't worry about it...... it's not worth it. #So often we lose sleep over stupid people........ in this case your indignation is perfectly justified, but I've also seen lots of hams get silly in their disgust for 11 meter operators, for example. #Sometimes, setting a dignified, positive example and ignoring silliness goes much further than anything else.... #
IMHO, Brad, N6KYS http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[KD5NRH]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (n0lid @ Mar. 25 2002,12:48)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">ke0vh

Has the "N" word been used recently on FOX? Yep.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
Oh great, so now we're comparing ourselves to FOX. I guess next we'll have to preempt the traffic nets so we can ignore some braindead has-been can giving us a blow-by-blow of the hockey game we've already spent two hours ignoring.

[Gene475]

I'm an American expat living in a Muslim country. Here those images would be considered illegal. This is a perfect reason for other countries not to allow ham radio to continue or move forward (broadcast and even cable TV here is VERY censored and a kiss is rarely shown. It's great feeling free to turn on the TV and not worry about what my daughter might see). When you transmit information over ham radio you're sharing it with the entire world. Your "Constitutional Rights" do not extend beyond the boarders of America. Sending this sort of garbage out shows little consideration for the standards in other countries. Isn't one of the purposes of ham radio to facilitate international goodwill? Do you think this kind of garbage promotes positive impressions and feelings about American hams or America in general?

As for your "rights" in America I agree that sending images like that is no different than posting them in public view (and no, there's no such thing as a "private QSO"). If you don't think public nudity is a problem, try showing up to your next hamfest nude and see what kind of reception you get. Freedom of speech comes with responsibility. Sadly enough some people think they can say whatever they want, wherever they want, and whenever they want.

If you want to use obscene language or share obscene pictures you're free to make a phone call or e-mail pictures privately. If I see or hear anything being sent out by a US callsign that is in violation of the FCC I might be polite enough to tell you I believe you're in violation and I will be reporting you whether it does any good or not. If enough of us do the same we might see some results.

gene475@aol.com
KG4ENL

"The ham bands are very public, but so is talking in public. You could never dream of interupting a conversation going on between two people telling them that you don't approve of what they are saying because they could be heard by children, females, or those with narrow minds, would you? "

I have interrupted this type of behavior in the past and will continue to do so in the future if it affects children in my charge. In this country, children are our first priority.

I watch TV. There is no frontal nudity broadcast over the air waves by the networks. It's just not there.

The transmission described in this forum is clearly a violation of part 97 regardless of the "artistic merit" or
lack of same.

Instead of insulting someone on the size of their family (you're really out of line there, unless you pay his bills)
why don't you be man enough to admit you're violating the rules. Then, maybe, you can explain why you need to engage in this behavior. Just save us the free speech, artistic merit bs.

[ke0vh]

JohnJ, Gene475,Fredvon4, WF0H, and KE5RS, nicely said. You are right. Posting such pictures is for private use (which the amatuer bands are not), are not of the "purient" interest, are expressly not within the rules, and are not in good taste. Those with excuses to do so on the ham bands such as "humor" are just showing what this issue is really all about. And unfortunately, what the issue is about here is one of Character. Not "free speech", not "modern tolerances", not frustrated men (what a joke), or "objectionable" or "obsene" (although I believe that making a joke out of a picture of a woman like the one in reference is highly disrespectable and downright reprehensible as a "humoristic" item) and I don't care what your perception of community standards are, it again, is simply not right for TRANSMISSION ON THE HAM BANDS. A character issue. Simple as that. Do you follow the rules your employer sets for you at work? Do you obey the rules of the road when driving? (These are examples don't go off on getting a parking ticket) What you do and set for rules or common behavoir at your home is YOUR business. The rules state it IS NOT allowable use of the amatuer radio service. LOOK, answer this, do you care about what the "community standard is" for the Amatuer Radio Service? Sure, you can disobey and ignore whatever you want, but does that make you right? I AM NOT deciding nothing for those of you who simply want to wallow in a lack of disregard for what you committed to if you spent the time, hard work, and energy to obtain a FCC licsense to have the PRIVELEGE to operate an Amatuer Radio Station.

BTW, I would like to thank the operators of QRZ.com for allowing this forum. Maybe it will make some think about what they believe is right and proper use of a wonderful Privelege. The Amatuer Radio Service.

[FMCCARTER]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (ke0vh @ Mar. 19 2002,07:52)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Again the other night I was monitoring Slow Scan TV on 14.230 mhz. #I went away from the computer for a little while and when I came back, as I was scrolling through the history file, there was a picture that had been transmitted of a girl doing the limbo, full frontal shot with no underwear on. #

I cannot understand why people will transmit this over the bands for all to see. #Many monitor our frequencies and will be very negative of what we do as amatuers just by a single incident. #THERE IS ABSOLUTELY no excuse for this kind of matter on the ham bands. #Don't give me "free speach", "turn it off if you don't like it", and "you are a prude" garbage. #I have a beautiful wife and 8 children, I don't believe that I could be classified as a prude. #

I would like to be able to enjoy amatuer radio and show slow scan pictures and the mode to my children and wife without having to be embarrassed or make excuses for what I see as just not a hobby, but a really important part of my life. #I was priveleged to teach my 9 year old how to send his name in morse code last night and would like to help him get excited about ham radio if he so choses. #I wouldn't want to have to restrict him from the SSTV part of the hobby until he turns 18 or 21. #

Why does the ARRL or the amatuer community as a whole not want to do something about this kind of behavior when it has the opportunity to really offend so many? #There is plenty of subject matter to transmit without having to be obscene and just plain in bad taste. #I know, there are too many who just don't give a darn and have no moral character for what is just plain right and wrong. #I am not one of them. #

Jack
KE0VH[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
Perhaps the transmission did not come from a HAM at all.
Seems like there are lots of wannabes on APRS.
It is probably the same with SSTV.

[KC0MHQ]

If I remember correctly, isn't pornography illegal in most U.S. states anyway?

However, it is an international thing, so I suppose their laws aren't as strict as ours.

[n7nmd]

Actually, I appreciate this post. I remember seeing that picture on the internet (in my sysadmin job I see everything) and I am ASTOUNDED it made it on 20 meters.

You got a record of the image, did you get a record of the callsign? The FCC and ARRL have made themselves willing to eradicate this if we provide them with enough information.

And as for number of kids, I live overseas, and according to the UN, 8 children is the world *average*. In fact, many people have more, and prosper. UN research also showed that the world can feed around 2 times the current population. (something like 14 Billion?)

Don't worry about kids. Worry about our bands!

-Dan n7nmd

[M1AZF]

im sure the guys doing this are quite aware what there doing and its slightly illegal it happens quite often and have said to the wife about that i dont know how they get away with it i dont transmit only recieve but i just rigged something up out of someold earphone peices it probably isant any where near the quallity of pic that you guy get a bit snowy but it didnt cost me and it works kinda but you can still see what your talking about
got real bad lately what i recieve in the uk.....

[M3SAL]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (JoeHam @ Mar. 25 2002,21:18)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">To M3SAL,

Good luck on your 'transition', girlfriend. Great to have an opinion on this subject from someone who's been on both sides of the fence. However, as a man, I can tell you that a nude female is not lewd, crude or indecent. Organized religion has taught us that it is, hence the reactions in this forum. Frankly, I expected more of an enlightened response from you, especially since you are a woman now. Hey, by the way...where do you hang out on HF? I'd love to work you. That would be one for the logbook, OM![/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
Well, what a reply http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif
Thanks for the wishes of good luck on the transistion, it has been a long time coming now, (been waiting for 3 years for the "op")
I can see that you men dont object to seeing pictures of women scantilly dressed, but what I was saying is that I for one dont really like to see it appearing on my screen while I am sitting on the other side of the room, leaving the PC on and monitoring sstv, while sitting with my partner (who, incedentally, is a woman), and often my daughters are in the room, and I really do not like them to be exposed to that sort of thing, at least with the I.net you have a choice whether or not you want this sort of content, but on amateur radio, is there really any need for that ?
Well, I`m off my soapbox now, and have put it away in the cupboard for a later date http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif
I usually monitor\work 14.230 sstv, and 14.080\3.580 RTTY, so maybe we might meet up on there sometime and can exchange QSL`s.

[AE4JO]

Why the personal attacks on Jack? Any one who doesn't understand the lack of respect for others are probably the one who are sending this trash on slow-scan. Having 8 kids is somewhat admirable as long as you instill good values in them. Way to go Jack!! I don't appreciate the trash either and I feel if you can't show it or say it in church then the radio is no place for it. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (littlebit @ Mar. 27 2002)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">I feel if you can't show it or say it in church then the radio is no place for it.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
Well pass the plate quickly,
Puritan views make me ill...

RM

[Gene475]

This has nothing to do with religous views although there are plenty of us "religous people" that do not believe sex is dirty and believe the human form is beautiful. If a guy has 8 kids he obviously doesn't view sex as dirty and can't be spending too much time out in his shack. Ah, but I digress...

In America there are laws. Some of those laws enforce morality. If you don't like it, work within the system to change them. Until they change you need to live within the laws. The FCC says this kind of transmission is illegal. It wouldn't pass for broadcast TV and because of that wouldn't pass on amateur SSTV.

And to those of you preaching "tolerance" it seems that tolerant people can tolerate any view as long as it's a view of tolerance. You have no tolerance for intolerance. Basically you're willing to agree with someone as long as their view is the same as yours. That doesn't sound very tolerant to me.

Instead of tolerance (the current political definition is a far cry from the dictionary definition) try respect. Illustration: In some areas around where I live showing the bottom of your foot is considered offensive. As an American it means nothing to me. However, it pretty much means that I can't cross my legs in public if I want to avoid offending people. I find this uncomfortable and I have to make a conscious effort not to do it, but I'm willing to change the way I sit in public to get along a little better with my neighbors. I go home and sit any way I please. Is that so difficult?

Gene
KG4ENL

[kc4qlp]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (K3BM @ Mar. 24 2002,12:55)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">I believe FCC rules prohibit such pictures from being transmitted, but remember, other countries are not
so sexually repressed #as ours is, calling anything with nudity "pornography".[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
Yes the FCC does prohibit such pictures from being transmitted...and some Hams have been snagged for sending such garbage over the air.
I suppose some folks think..ah its a digital signal..no one will ever know what is being sent....only to have a surprise visit or letter from the FCC.
Its my understanding that many schools that have ham radio classes monitor 14.230mhz.
So..keep it clean and within taste folks.

C U all on the air!

[n7lfl]

8 kids and you are embarrased by female anatomy? What gives? seems that you really find it irresistible.
Get real.

[KG4ABM]

I have to agree. Just a little listening on 20m and who knows what you'll receive. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif

[n3nkc]

ok everyone, read this (i believe this may settle some stuff):
Utterances of "any obscene, indecent or profane language by means of radio communications" are prohibited by Title 18, U.S.C. Section 1464. Under the Communications Act of 1934, as amended, the Commission may revoke any station license for violation of Section 1464 of Title 18. See 47 U.S.C. Section 312(a)(6).

Obscene speech is not protected by the First Amendment and cannot be broadcast at any time. To be obscene, material must meet a three point test: (1) an average person, applying contemporary community standards, must find that the material, as a whole, appeals to the prurient interest; (2) the material must depict or describe, in a patently offensive way, sexual conduct specifically defined by applicable law; and (3) the material, taken as a whole, must lack serious literary, artistic, political or scientific value. See Miller v. California, 413 U.S. 15 (1973).

The Commission defines indecency as language or material that, in context, depicts or describes, in terms patently offensive as measured by contemporary community standards, sexual or excretory activities or organs. The Supreme Court has repeatedly rejected arguments that this definition is unconstitutionally vague. See Action for Children's Television v. F.C.C., 58 F.3d. 654 (D.C. Cir. 1995), FCC v. Pacifica Foundation, 438 U.S. 726 (1977).

This is direct from the FCC regarding Amateur Radio station violations. Notice how "sexual or excretory activities or organs" is noted. Hmm unfortunatly, US law does not apply to international stations, so this may have to be taken up with the ITU and that station's home country. 73 John N3NKC

[W1LC]

Excellent call to attention Jack, KE0VH. #I agree with you and hope those porno-losers are routed from ham radio and everywhere else for that matter. #As it is almost Resurrection Sunday (a.k.a. "Easter") -- the most important Christian Holy Day, indeed for all the world as Christ died and rose again for ALL who would believe and accept him! #The works of darkness are still (unfortunately) plain to see in this world. #The exploitation of children is horrible, and a just God will deal with the exploiters, "whomever" and "wherever" they are...

On a related issue, please forgive the ignorant remarks about your personal family that others have only the stupidity and arrogance to dole out. #"Overpopulation" bolsheviks and other anti-family types who hate the truth and those who are willing to defend decency and dare to be moral. #My hat is off to you Jack. #God Bless and have a great Easter celebration of life with your wonderful and large family.

Vy 73,

Dana G. Reed, W1LC
(Worshipping One Living Christ)

[ledodd]

Well, it is sad commentary to know that some folks don't know what "In good taste" means. Trying to determine what is pornography or not or what is legal or not is out of my league. But I (as we would hope all adult hams) do know what is decent and what is indecent. A full frontal nude shot male or female is not what I'd call decent for family/public viewing. If that person walked down the street nude I am sure they would/should get arrested. Most, but not all streets anyway. Hi! Common sense (maybe lacking in some minds) tells a person that. The only solution as I see it is to record (screenshot) the image transmitted and the station call sign and any other information about the QSO and mail it to the FCC and let them take appropriate action. Same with voice QSO abuse - record it and send the tape to the FCC. Self-policing by use of the authorities is the best way. Let a third party (FCC) decide if it was proper or not. Everyone does not share our personal opinions or morals. Tell the offender on the air you don't like what you see or hear if you want but entering into a verbal fight is counter productive - possibly even dangerous.

[ledodd]

Well, it is sad commentary to know that some folks don't know what "In good taste" means. Trying to determine what is pornography or not or what is legal or not is out of my league. But I (as we would hope all adult hams) do know what is decent and what is indecent. A full frontal nude shot male or female is not what I'd call decent for family/public viewing. If that person walked down the street nude I am sure they would/should get arrested. Most, but not all streets anyway. Hi! Common sense (maybe lacking in some minds) tells a person that. The only solution as I see it is to record (screenshot) the image transmitted and the station call sign and any other information about the QSO and mail it to the FCC and let them take appropriate action. Same with voice QSO abuse - record it and send the tape to the FCC. Self-policing by use of the authorities is the best way. Let a third party (FCC) decide if it was proper or not. Everyone does not share our personal opinions or morals. Tell the offender on the air you don't like what you see or hear if you want but entering into a verbal fight is counter productive - possibly even dangerous.

[wd8aam]

In my life, the TEN COMMANDMENTS are the
FIRST/and LAST word. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

(nowhere does it say"thou shalt always be clothed") http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[observation] http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif

[N1NKM]

Man, have you ever hit the nail on the head! I can't stand that raunchy GARBAGE, either! Like you, I also have a beautiful wife... I do not *NEED* to look at those poor pitiful women who think so little of themselves that they allow those kinds of pictures to be taken!

There *ARE* children "out there" working the bands... some of them very young teens, and pre-teens. Surely, we do NOT need to be exposing them to this kind of smut!

A have all but GIVEN UP on SSTV, because of this disgusting crud. I was seeing most USA Hams' callsigns on the pics, too... and that was REALLY getting my goat! These are people who should know better than to send PG13 and R rated material over the open airwaves! Do their XYL's have any clue what they are doing in that shack! What if their 10 year old daughter walked in, while that kind of picture was on the screen? GIMME A BREAK!

I just upgraded to Extra in November of 2001, and started experimenting with SSTV shortly after that. I gave it up in about a week... after seeing what kind of *TRASH* was being sent. While it's not CONSTANT, it sure is often enough to be a major problem, IMHO. Thus, I will no longer use 14.230 at all. If someone wants to do a one-on-one SSTV QSo, we will need to dial off to some quiet freq (preferably on another band, but 20's OK) and work there.

Sign me DISGUSTED! >:[ Grrrr...

PS: Isn't it interesting how some people (who don't even use callsigns, choosing to hide behind anonymous "handles") use the "AD HOMINEM" method of personal attack?

Rather than posting something INTELLIGENT related to the original ISSUE, they resort to flaming and making personal insults against INDIVIDUALS. I pity them and ignore them. You (all) should, too.

[M3SAL]

Well said to all of you who agree that this sort of thing should NOT be transmitted.
As I said in my previous posting, as a woman Ham operator, I find it VERY offensive to see a picture of a naked woman appearing on my screen, and I feel that it degrades and demoralises what is a very sacred and private part of us, and that`s exactlly where these pictures should be viewed, in private, NOT publically, where god only knows who might be watching.
Don't get me wrong, I am NOT against seeing a naked female body (my partner is also female), but this sort of smut should be kept to the person who is sending it, and NOT be transmitted acros the world, I have not used SSTV for about a week now because of this, on the last occasion that I was on 14.230 an American user actually had the gall to send a picture to me of a naked woman, in a VERY compromising posistion, I`m just glad that none of my young daughters were watching the screen at the time before I had a chance to delete it, suffice to say that I will NOT be exchanging QSL cards with this person, HI.

Ok, enough from me, over to you lot again for any further comments on this.
Regards, Sally-Ann XXXXX

[kb3fkj]

Being 14 Years old, and trying to upgrade to general and then hopefully extra, am disturbed by all of the crud on the ham bands. The last thing i would want is the bands to be filled with crappy operators. is that not what the orginal meaning of "ham" came from? I got my licence because i found a interist in the hobby. it being filled up with nudity, bad language and crud like this just gives more countries a reason to ban it, as said before in this forum. Perhaps they should bring back the 20 wpm morse code requirement because anyone intelligent enough to learn that most likely would not do those kind of things.

Kb3fkj

[KA2QFX]

As stated by a prior respondent...

Being 14 Years old, and trying to upgrade to general and then hopefully extra, am disturbed by all of the crud #on the ham bands. … Perhaps they should bring back the 20 wpm morse code requirement because anyone intelligent enough to learn that most likely would not do those kind of things.

Kb3fkj


Well said!
From the mouths of babes (no offense to Joseph). #The clarity of this supposition could hardly be lost on anybody. #Just in case the point of my rambling defense (page 4 of this thread) of the some of the frequencies defamed in the opening salvo of this thread were missed here's a little clarification. #
The quality of amateur operations continues to decline primarily because of the devaluing of the license. # That devaluation is largely the fault of hams such as some of those whose flames I have read in this thread since my last post. # While hurling adolescent insults at one another you do nothing to affect the problem. No, it's worse, you exacerbate the problem. #
Arguing the definition of pornographic or indecent material transmitted is absurd. #Prurient interest isn't a difficult concept. Get a clue! Move on.
My point is that while some of you argue and whine about the state of amateur radio you permit these little tin Gods in Newington, and their commercial and governmental comrades, to erode your privileges time and again. #You should be ashamed of yourselves for abdicating the protection of your privileges to such obviously inept representation. #Taking a page from the Bible, which some of your are well inclined to rely upon, these people are the "merchants in the temple". # #Each and every time they cry "save the bands" you should be hearing "sell the bands". # #
It's pretty obvious from listening on the bands, and reading on the boards, that most of you don't believe growing the ham population at the expense of quality is working. #It's also pretty clear that as the bar has been lowered so have new ham's respect for their privileges. #Lax operating and poor behavior has become more and more tolerated and nobody seems too incensed about it. #
What the hell was the point of this thread anyway? To simply provide yet another forum to whine?! How many of you respond to the FCC's NPRMs when it affects your privileges, write your congressman, senator, ARRL rep or anyone in a position to change the course of decisions, or just express your outrage at any of this? #From what I've seen over the last twenty years pretty damn few! # You might be surprised at what a few thousand letters can do. I've seen the effect on several occasions in legislative processes.
But you need to be proactive; your self-anointed lobbyists are not necessarily going to alert you to threats that need to be responded to, especially when it's not in their financial interest. #Case in point, remember when no-code was first introduced? The ARRL, advocating the idea, asked for amateur input. #They were swamped nearly 10:1 with vehement opposition and dropped the matter like a hot potato. #About a year or so later they lobbied for it anyway, sans any input from their constituency, saying the tide of opinion had turned. #Yeah, like wine to vinegar. If they don't like the answer they don't ask the question, and you are silenced.
So, as long as you pusillanimous weenies throw flames at each other on these boards you can expect your frequencies to be auctioned off, devalued and degraded at ever increasing rates until you start expressing your outrage at those effecting this failing ideology. # Expect more hams to be technically illiterate, commercial and criminal use of the frequencies and general mayhem. #Lack of enforcement on the air, or across the sales counters readily correlates to the ease of obtaining and memorizing a question pool. # Tell me I'm wrong! # See how fast we got 800 MHz to be illegal on scanners when a senator (committing a crime) had his phone call taped. #Yet we sell transceivers that must be licensed like popcorn as long as your credit is good. How many powerful radios do you think our terrorist enemies have? But I digress. #But it's OK because the booming sale of equipment and license issuance indicates a growing and vigorous hobby. #Yeah, like a cancerous lesion. #The greater rewards of pursuing what used to be a scientifically and ethically governed service has been reduced to a consumer grade hobby.
The last time I looked my license, and yours, it was issued by the US Government to whom we have the right to redress directly. #Our interests should do not be influenced by how many more subscriptions or radios were sold this year vs. last year if the result makes the frequencies unbearable! # I do know there's a lot more boneheads and a lot more trash on the air now than 20 years ago! #What's changed between then and now? #You tell me. #You have earned these privileges and these people work for you, and you don't have to subscribe to anyone's drivel to be heard by them or be entitled to their information. Rather, they must consider your expressed consent as part of their actions. Moreover, they are accountable to report on the reasoning behind their decisions. #It would be difficult to discount the written commentary of several thousand licensees as opposed to the capitulation of a single corrupt lobbyist group.
I fully expect to be flamed myself for this exultation, but that would be preferable to reading this incessant whining about how bad things are. #Maybe if I can incite you to find some testosterone to flame me you can be encouraged to write to the bureaucrats who permitted the bonehead decisions that trashed your privileges in the first place. If not, I guess I'll have some nice equipment for sale soon before the amateur bands are reduced to a few channeled frequencies on 440 like the FRS. #

Mark
KA2QFX

[W4JSI]

Jack, I couldn't agree with you more. This type of material has no place in Amateur Radio. I have seen this type of material many times.

As for the comments made to you about your family, that should have never been brought up. That is a personal matter carried out in the privicy of your own home.

[kc0msq]

All communities have a right to set standards, and if you don't like them, then don't participate. For example, in all the US cities I'm aware of you can't walk around in public in the nude. The Ham community is just as public and it has standards too. When you ask for the privlege to be a Ham operator, you agree to abide by these standards. If you don't like them, then start your own community where you can set your own - the internet can accomodate that.

Paul.

[tkinney]

I really think that if we all had the good sense to let the churches control the content and we all worked on making more babies all of our radio trouble would go away.

[tkinney]

Dear W1lC, would you be willing to be one of our new religious/morals/radio police ? As soon as you were done with 20 meters you could come to our homes and check our books and vidios ? Pass the money basket.

[ve8nsd]

I don't generally add comments, but I must jump on the bandwagon as well as this is something that I feel strongly about.
Like many out there I'm offended by such garbage. I'm no prude; I've led a more colorful life then most. (I played bass in a rock band, how did YOU spend your teenage years?) But my opinion has always been this: unless a woman is being naked for me I'm not really interested in seeing her.
Also, when people ask me why I bacame a ham instead of using the Internet I've always pointed out that the exam necessary to get a licence tends to weed out the garbage. Perhaps that isn't the case anymore...
Garth Carman VE8NSD

[hartdaniel]

I dont understand it either, Im not readily offended by such material, but agree that the airwaves are not the place for it. No Free speech does not apply here, dont even try it. The FCC rules forbid it. Thats the end of the argument.

Will it stop? nope. As long as the children get away with it will continue.

KE3WH
Dan Hart

This thread has collected quite a "me too" section including the "broad-minded" (http://www.g7ucl.fsnet.co.uk/website.htm) (in waiting) claiming to be offended already! Who's kidding who here? This whole "offense masquerade" offends me, OK?

I just wonder how many of the "me toos" have even seen the picture ("Limbo") in question? Get the facts first, I'd post it if I could! However, I do have it (for anyone who wishes it, you must first promise not to be offended). Once viewed, if you take life so seriously that you can't laugh at it, you really need to "mature your tolerance" & stop throwing tantrums over what other adults do or see. Some of us use our controls as adults to avoid offense: ON=OFF, FREQ=VFO. TV is really no different than radio thus the same applies.

Everyone waiting around to be offended eventually gets what they are waiting around for! If the FCC doesn't cite it, keep moving, tell your stories walking!

RM

[kc0msq]

Radiomercenary,
I have not seen the picture, but I'm guessing that if you taped it up somewhere in full public view where a lot of people walk by, you'd be in in trouble. Sending it over the public airwaves is exactly the same thing, so if it does not pass the "tape it up in public" test, you should probably not be sending it over the air either.

Paul.

[N4MVL]

Guess that these guys getting jailed and fined proves the old adage "It's expensive to be stupid!"

73 de N4MVL

Lee

[K1ZC]

If it is the picture I am thinking of, most courts would rule that it is indecent but not obscene. Either way, open broadcast spectrum, be it ham radio or tv, is an inappropirate medium because young eyes should not be viewing such things. I believe adults should have wide discretion in what they choose to view, or not view, and the Internet fills that niche quite nicely.

This is not about what is legal, it is about courtesy. If we think somebody is going to be offended, the picture should get posted elsewhere.

As for family size, I am not sure why that is relevant to the discussion. I would rather see eight (or more) kids in a home with loving parents that think there should be some standards in our society than a family with one child that is unloved. I think those eight are probably pretty lucky.

Decency is fundamental Tom (tkinney), and I'm not looking to be a "policeman" on 20M, or with your "private" reading, etc. #Of course that is not the issue and you well know it! #You sound like an ACLU Leftist-flake who attempts to shift the ground upon which one advancing a moral position stands. #Those who selfishly advance such porno-sin (slow scan pics, etc.) and vulgarity without due regard to the tender eyes, of both children and adults (especially other women whom said pictures demean) who happen to see it, are not worthy of any defense whatsoever...

Our U.S. Founding Fathers NEVER intended "Freedom of Speech" to extend to protect immorality like pornography, and their writings prove it. #Folks were arrested in Colonial days for swearing in public and spitting on the street. #No freedom of speech and expression in that sense, nor should there be! #Of all the causes to take up in Ham Radio Tom, can't you find more worthy things to defend or advance than pornography and population-control extremism? #Think you're the one who needs to emerge from the qth and see the light, ol' chap # http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif

K1ZC, well stated re: eight offspring with a loving family trumping one unloved child. #Be warned though: #The Marxists/Determinists have trouble with that logic http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

W1LC

[kc2hmm]

Gee...reading all these posts has given me an education n Radio, Morality, History, and the law..........I think I'll stick t 20 M QRP CW.......Alex KC2HMM

[kf0hy]

Warning, this post may contain the word profanity.
What is this nudity and profanity thing anyway. It just seams silly that these childish concepts can cause such fear in some people. That said, it still concerns me that some of our fellow hams and families have to see and hear such things that bothers them so much. What do we do to protect these people. #Laws don't work, and this is good, can you imagine having a law that you couldn't say certain words and see certain things. #I'm trying to think of something that I wouldn't like. All the regular cuss words are slang now and no one knows what they really mean anyway. So I'll make one up. Profanity is just words we make up, that we don't want people to say anyway. Let's see, vompoop. This is when some one vomits and poops at the same time. This is the worse thing I can think of. Ok... I promise not to send pictures of mammalary glands and penis', if you promise not to use the word vompoop. So, where do we go from here. Well you say you have a right not to be subjected to certain things you find offensive. So every other ham must have this right also. You now need to study all the thousands of cultures of the world, learn their languages and traditions. To be fair, you would not want to offend them. To help you get started, some cultures think any part of the body, including the face is nudity, so it must be covered. Others find this offensive, so if you want to send a picture of your family, you will have to cut out your wife and daughters.
The guy down the street is a union man, and finds it extremely offensive if someone buys something foreign made. So if you have a radio, car, vcr not made in your country, you may want to sell these or not mention them. Don't mention your 5 children, this will upset some. Don't talk about religion or politics, this has been know to start wars.... When you get done with your studies, this may be what you find. To enjoy ham radio, you must homebrew a crystal set, operate only cw, and only talk about the weather. Hey, we just solved your nudity problem.

Just to let you know how funny we can be in Iowa. We have strip bars where girls are allowed to take off all of their clothes, but a certain patch of curly hair is considered indecent and must be covered. If not they could be arrested. Now this is funny stuff.

When we laugh at others views, we are only laughing at ourselves.

[tkinney]

And I do know KD1CW you would be at the head of the mob wanting to come into our homes and carry off anything you and your moralpolice kind would find offensive. You are nothing better than the Taliban REligious Police. It is people with steel trap minds like yours that we must guard aginst.

[W1LC]

Wrong again Tom! Pornography and other anti-family sin is more of a threat to the fabric of a nation than is your "invented" boogieman trying to deny sinners a peak at "whatever". Sin will always have an audience in a fallen world. That's not the issue here. Keeping Amateur Radio clean and enjoyable for all -- is! If we lose our privileges some day, it will be to no small extent that those like yourself -- who support or even show apathy towards abusers of the frequencies (in contravention of FCC rules) -- who are responsible. Grow up!

[tkinney]

W1LC and I am sure you would like to be the sin Judge , Jury and executioner...you religionists had your time when good morals and religion ruled the earth...it was called The Dark Ages...

[tkinney]

To KD1CW: whats a "markist/determinist ?...you must be better educated that me....or are you some kind of Commie Lover..please explain better.

[W1LC]

Convenience excuses Tom. You can explain it to Jesus someday, though you may want to rethink your position. The Dark Ages huh... you're a real "wanderer" through time, all over the place... Typical Lib!

Actually, I view the "Dark Ages" as when we had a recent President commit adultery in the White House and use tobacco products in a rather unnatural way with a 21 year-young intern. Another great example for our youth! I'll take Dubya choking on a pretzel or using West Texas dialect rather than Slick Willy trying to use a tiparillo as an tampon insert... http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

I'm glad most Hams have more sense than you apparently do Tom. Of course, there is much wisdom in not e-speaking with a fellow who thinks a family of eight in the U.S. is a threat to the eco-balance or who cannot spell correctly http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif

[tkinney]

To W!LC....good reply,, well, I'm sure jesus has a place for self promoting better than all whiners like yourself...carry on !

[kb1hlz]

There are ways to report this kind of stuff on the internet, especially if the persons posing might be a child.Click on #National Center for Missing & Exploited Children (http://www.missingkids.org) and put exact information about the contact. #There is an international group of investigators that follow up on your reports. It is important to act when you see this stuff. #

You can also check out our special event station on May 19th to raise awareness for this problem and the problem of child pornography at Radio Operators for Missing Children, KB1HGK, Special Event Station (http://www.lyceumpress.com/ham_radio.htm)

Sheree Greenwood, KB1HLZ (member of KB1HGK-Radio operators for missing children)

[kg4muw]

I had the same experience 4-11 at 0025z. #I left the rig on 14.230 for a while and went away to do other things. #Later, I was working some slow scan with some of the 6M ops. #I scrolled back the history, and there was a pict that I would not want my family to see. #

My rigs are in a corner of the garage, which is a common path in and out to the back yard. #Sometimes others in the household enjoy just seeing what is materializing on the monitor here. #Now, I'll have to remember to close MMSSTV or turn off the radio to prevent such things from appearing on the monitor while I am away from the rig, or working another radio. #I had seen a few that were distasteful, but now it has escalated to porn.

I don't need it in my shack, or my home for that matter. #It appears amateur radio is becoming another media source that must be carefully screened by parents. #Sounds like commercial TV and the internet, doesn't it?

What a shame...
Ken

[ad4c]

How come in the world can anyone blame a guy who's happy and proud to say he has 8 kids and he sure is capable of feeding and clothing them properly,GOD BLESS HIM for having them,no one has the right to critize this guy who as he said loves his wife and kids are a product of love,If he can afford them,let it be for God sake!! Leave him alone,and lets go to the main matters,pornografy on SSTV that is a real big deal and MUST be punished by the FCC and not If some one has or not 8 kids,its embarrasing truly to see bad pics like those on 14,230 but its more embarrasing to see people writting bad things about a nice decent guy who loves his 8 kids.This is a FREE country and you can have your own family no matter how big it be.He is just having 8 future valuable citizens who will help this country to be the best in the world.
God bless America
73 and good DX's
Hector
AD4C

[N1NKM]

It looks like the dust may finally be settling on this issue. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/s