Long Wire Antennas

[EI0CL]

When setting up a "Long Wire" antenna for all bands the number one issue is to determine the lowest frequency you intend to use. Then ensure that the length is several times 3/8 or 5/8 wavelengths on this band.

Long Wires are end fed as a rule and it is here that you can make tuning easy.

Use open wire feeder to the end of the long wire and instead of a simple tie back use a 1/4 wave length of wire for each or any band where tuning may be or is calculated to be difficult.

This will result in several 1/4 wave wire lengths being attached to the non long wire side of the feedline. These 1/4 waves can be fanned out or sloped downwards.


The height of the long wire section should in general attempt to be one half wave above ground at the lowest frequency which is height critical (operator decided)

The quarter wave wires will ease the job of tuning the transmitter to the antenna due to the resonance of the quarter wave elements.

I use this type of antenna from 160 thru to 6 meters.

If the long wire section is more than 400 feet then a third support will be necessary so the antenna does not come down every time there is a gale.

A 600 foot wire at 100 feet over ground with quarter wave sections on the other side of the feedline produces good results and excellent gain.

The downside is it can't be rotated

M Higgins

[K7PIG]

If you put out 600' of wire at 100' use a Sloping V-Beam instead of a longwire, open-wire fed with a decent matchbox.

[w4kp]

Sounds like a decent field day antenna......... http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

W4KP

[k2pdj]

If you use fence wire you will find it works real well and the cost is very low. Because the antenna is high impedence the resistance of the wire is inconsequential to effeciency of the antenna. Try not to bend the wire as it will rust at that point quicker. You will find it takes a little extra heat to solder to this wire. I have had one of these up for years with excellent results.

[ag4hy]

o o o k! one hunderd feet high, just anybody can put a wire up this high? #sounds fine b-u-u-u-u-t how many has the capability or funds to put one of these babys up?no flames intended, just a consideration or two http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif
sure would like to put a wire or any antenna up that high,but the possibility isn't in the picture for a lot of hams if not a major portion. not complaining but it is a thing to be considered
http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif
73 n have a nice day, lots of qsos'
#willie #ag4hy http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[kf4glg]

oooooook Willie, I guess you'll just have to figure out how to use a different antenna,Huh? Here's one foya! bury about 30 feet of RG 213 coaxial cable about six inches deep in a straight run away from your house. Unbraid the last nineteen inches of shield braid and bury it straight domn into the ground. Take the nineteen inches if center conducter and stand it straight up out of the ground. Now hook up a realistic pro-2030 scanner to the end in the house. You will no longer be a danger to anyone on the HF bands http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif 73...mike

[n4sl]

"o o o k! one hunderd feet high, just anybody can put a wire up this high? sounds fine b-u-u-u-u-t how many has the capability or funds to put one of these babys up?"

Actually, depending on where you live it's not a big deal to put up a LW at 100'. I have a 475' long off-center fed zepp up 100' at the middle sag point (110' on each end) and it cost me about $85 to put it up. How?!?!?! Well, I've got really tall trees on property out in the country. No towers but frankly I just don't need 'em and YES I KNOW I'm very lucky!

I use a 45 pound bow and some specially weighted arrows to shoot 8# monofilament over the tree tops, then pull over nylon twine and finally 3/16" Dacron rope. The rope just finds a home wedged in a tree branch near the tree top, runs all the way down to the base of the tree where I tie it off. Gotta replace the rope every three years due to limb friction and I have a kinda 'mechanical fuse' knot in the rope so when the trees sway in the wind too much it'll add 6' to the rope length automatically... and not break the antenna. Sometimes it takes all weekend to get ONE good tree shot at that height, but baby once it's up it's groovy. Yes, it's kinda complicated and yes sometimes it fails but it's cheap and amazingly effective.

This antenna seriously kicks ass as you might imagine.
I have another, 525' LW at 75' pointed about 75degrees off the 100' tall one. On different bands, each antenna has it's good and bad directions... two transmatches and a coaxial A-B switch solves the dilemma of which one works best in about two seconds.

I do sympathize with my treeless brothers, believe me, I was one for many years.

73, Steve N4SL Machias, WA (the sticks) CN88xa

A 600 foot long wire at 100 feet? Assuming a property is 600'x600', that is eight acres. And then there is the 100 feet up this thing is mounted, I guess one needs a giant redwood growing on those eight acres. Once, about a year ago, QST ran a story on a 160m parasol that you can build, deep in the story you find out that 240 ground radials of a ridiculous length needed to be buried in the yard. I thought, sure everyone has that much space to do this, the QST guys must be out of touch. Now I know there are more people out there that are out of touch.

[n4sl]

Some people really do build antennas like that. Me.

Some people really do live on property and have really tall trees. Me.

Some people have a passion for their hobby and spend their entire lives learning and experimenting with antennas and feedlines. Me.

It's really only recently that everyone lives in an antenna restricted environment, hams used to put up wires all over the place and nobody pitched a fit. Now, only the lucky can do that which is gonna hurt ham radio for sure.

I'm one of the lucky and I don't feel 'out of touch' or guilty and I really DO have a 475' LW up 100' and a 525' LW up 75'.

Steve N4SL Machias, WA CN88xa

[VU2CRD]

Dear OHM,
# # # # # #I am working for a company in SHARJAH.
HAM radio activity baned for expatriots.I have agood rx , but receiving heavy noice interference,can you advice a good wire antenna for HF-14 M Band?


VU2CRD
SHARJAH
rajsatellite@yahoo.com # http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[n2ea]

Great idea! In 40 + years in the hobby, I'd not
seen this implementation, with 1/4 wave fed alongside
the long wire. Great idea.

From the land of green mountains and tall pines....
Vermont, where my 160 meter halfwave is a mere
120' up, thanks to my trees.

The downside is....the woods are so bloody dense that
there's no way to get a real LW over them. Just barely manage the 256 feet for 1.8.

For the apartment crowd....I opeated for years using #24 wire, fed with twin-lead. Just about invisible!

Jim/N2EA

[n8vw]

Used a lw from w8lt for years in the 80's. #It was about 500' long 90' up. It was up since the early 60's and was taken down several years ago when OSU decided to make changes to Ohio Stadium.#If we could hear it we could work it.

[EI0CL]

To the query ref 14Mhz wire antennas

You can use a pair of 3/8 or 5/8 wave wires either side of the feed point , instead of a typical 1/4 wave each side as in a simple dipole antenna (2 pole antenna)

That will give you some gain.

You can consider a Wire beam such as a Quad or a wire beam with simple wires fixed to bamboo stlye woods spaced correctly.

You could consider Long Wires ( several odd 1/2 wave lengths .

You could do a vee beam , a loop , a delta loop , a Rhombic or even buy an out of date ARRL antenna manual.

A rotateble dipole will work well and a vertical dipole will also work well , keep the feeder at 180 degrees to the antenna afor 16/17 feet though.

As to the comments on the acerage , don.t b ejealous boys , my 8 acres are worth less that the typical plot in the USA so I get space you get value.

Sure looks like I got it going though ??!!

Mike EIOCL mhiggins@telecomes.com

[KM3M]

It would be great to have all of the acreage and money we wanted for our antenna farms.
I only have an acre but all three neighbors I have asked permit the use of their trees.
Unfortunately none are over 60 feet. I do recommend asking permission when you go on
their property and diong so without the bow and arrow in hand. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

[ag4hy]

http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif don't think that i'm stupid enought to bury a piece of coxial like one moron suggested. "I" am going to use the HF bands, when, and, if "I" want to; got that?http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif
"I" don't care if you are stupid enough to do it, i'm not.....
"I" have one "damn" tree that is about 40 feet high and the property is only 100 yards across, and a tower is not in the, even distant future. as was said some aren't that lucky,as to have tall trees on their property...
most of the ones here are only about 6/7 years old.
so that is out. sooooooooo i'll do what "I" can with what "I" have.
willie AG4HY
http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif

[WA3WDK]

I use a LW exclusively. It is only 110' long with a 20' down vertical section at the house and about 10' up vertical where it is stuck around a branch at the tree end. I used a fishing rod with a 1/2 ounce weight to get a starter line into the top of a 60' tree. (I also get my lures stuck in trees when I go fishing, that is how I got the idea) I use it with an LDG tuner on all HF bands and have good success. Not perfect, but perfectly fine. And it only cost me $14 for the wire!

[ag4hy]

in reference to my last S T U P I D !! comment, where i called one of the respondants a "moron" this was completely U N C A L L E D for, and i'm sorry for the remark.. yes i know this is off topic; but what better place to say " I WAS WRONG" than in the same topic where i blasted a fellow ham kf4glg. I apologise mike...
i was wrong and am big enough to admit it.
73 and all have a good weekend
willie ag4hy

[kf4glg]

It was a nice antenna article and several of the other posts have some good ideas for wires too. My sense of humor isn't taken well by everyone, Willie. I am not offended by your remark. I have too good a time with this hobby to be that serious. Wires are a great way to work the world on a budget. I hope you got some good ideas from the postings in this thread 73. mike

[ag4hy]

this is ag4hy SK

[WA0KNP]

Well, you guys who don't own massive amounts of property, take heart! #How about a nice little random wire antenna like mine. #It runs from the top of my porch, about 8 feet off the ground at that point. #From there it runs out 70-feet to an evergreen in the backyard (one roll of Radio Shack antenna wire). #The highest point is 8 feet and I use no ground system with it. #Using 85 watts and an MFJ 949E tuner I have worked 85 DX entities and 49 states in the past year on 10-15-20 & 30 meters. #Incidentally it is fed with a piece of stranded automotive wire which comes up out of my basement window. #I just got done working about 130 DX stations with it in the weekend contest, there were very few stations I called that didn't come back to me. #Wire antennas don't even have to be "long" to be effective.

The fence wire idea is very good, but think of this.. If you live or travel in an area were there are large leases of land for cattle the top wire of the fence(barbed wire) on "dry" wood posts, cut to length and hooked to a random wire tuner can work like a charm. #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif #Think about it I'm camped next to a section of land fenced to live stock, with three insulators and some fencing pliers I can have a full wave 160M dipole. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif . Just remember to not make a break in the fence line that livestock can #walk thru, by leaving an opening. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif

[N4ZN]

Best hope the SPCA doesn't find out that you're RFing poor dumb animals...and remember to check the fence first for voltage http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif

[KG4OHE]

I am using a "random" length wire (Radio Shack said the spool had 100 ft) strung into a tree and use an antenna tuner (MFJ 949) and resonant cut counterpoise wire "reflectors" with good experience.

Am able to tune and load all the bands that I've cut a counterpoise wire for.

Wire is black insulated 22 ga hookup wire for "stealth" purposes and low budget.

We're a LPCA advocate here. (Low Power, Crummy Antenna)

[jxs2151]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (KG4OHE @ Feb. 19 2002,18:33)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">and resonant cut counterpoise wire "reflectors"[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
How important is it that the counterpoises be resonant? In what directions should they lie on the ground? Directly under the wire? How does the location of the counterpoises affect the pattern? How does one model counterpoises in EZNEC?

Looks I have used up all of my question points......

http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[k2yyy]

I started out wanting to put up a long wire antenna on my property. #
I ended up with a 210' terminated wire antenna about 30' off the ground. #The trees
on my property are Aspens and they don't grow to 100'.

I am using a 600 ohm 100 watt resistor to terminate the antenna. #The end of the
antenna comes down out of the tree and connects to the resistor and to a ground
rod. #I have 10 20' radials laying on the ground connected to the ground rod.

I am able to tune it up with minimal SWR (1.1:1) on 80-10m. #My radio (Atlas 210X) does
not have 160m or the WARC bands. #Without the radials or ground rod, I could not tune it
on 20, 15, or 10. #When I added the GR, I got 20 and 15. #The radials made 10m tuning easy.

Not only have I worked 50 states on 75m SSB, but for Hawaii and Alaska I was using
a borrowed Argo Scout and 5 watts.

Stuart, WA2PQE (wa2pqe@arrl.net)

[ve7qrz]

Good forum, I picked up a couple of good points. Here is a summary of my last experiment with long wire(multiple wavelength) antennas.

The closer you can get to the theoretical ideal the better.

My last long wire antenna was 400 feet of 22 gauge wire hung from trees at heights varing from 20 to 10 feet above the ground(wire sag). There was one 310 degeee jog on the wire run. The rig was grounded into the house electrical ground outlet on the second floor of the house. The antenna was fed directly into the back of my MFJ 160 - 6m tuner. Power 100 watts. I was working as VE7QRZ/VE3 for a few weeks.

I worked without much effort both coasts on 80m on up through the bands with good resluts and the Carribean on 6m. If I had only been closer to the theoretical ideal. #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif

Experiment, experiment,experiment http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[n4sl]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (ve7qrz @ Feb. 22 2002,19:18)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">I worked without much effort both coasts on 80m on up through the bands with good resluts and the Carribean on 6m.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>

Tell us more about these carribean "resluts" on 6m! Dang, VHF keeps getting better and better!! Hooo Doggies!!

Sorry, couldn't resist.

N4SL

[M0CPR]

its a good posting and well done to you if youve got the space for these type of antennas,but......i would be more impressed by someone who loads up a garbage bin and works the world with it,and then tells you he/she is only in an appartment block in the city and still does the business with it..........?http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif??? is size and i have a million acres of land to put up anything realy what ham radio is all about http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif??.they may not be 59+30 but the effort was there.......heres to normality, not ive got this ive got that.ohhh and welcome to the real world.

[n8ary]

What's the big deal? If you don't have the space, put up a smaller antenna and just live with it. The longwire I have up is about 150 feet long and is not anywhere near straight. The highest point is about 25 feet. I just have to accept I can't have a resonant antenna on any band below 40 meters because of my lot size unless it's a vertical.

[ve7qrz]

The last time I checked, I noticed that this forum is about Long Wire Antennas.

I really like long wire antennas and have been a member of the LPCA (Low Power Crummy Antenna) group for a long time. They are cheap.

I have been very lucky to have had the opportunity to expand on the basic design of a short piece of wire stuck out the back of the rig.

One phenomenon of long wire antennas I like is the apparent gain effect when the wire approaches 5 or more wavelengths of the operating frequency. The down side of course, is the non-rotatability of the antenna because of the size and construction logistics.

At the 6m-frequency range this multi-wavelength size can be reached with wires approaching 95 feet. The gain effect can also be noticed using a 160m dipole as a 6m antenna. Yes, you read that right, a 160m dipole as a 6m antenna. I have worked from VY1 land into JA8 land and the southeastern USA using that type of set up. Great fun! For those interested there is some theory and math involved that ties the two antennas together.

I have not had the opportunity to work 2m from long wire antennas and would be interested to hear from operators that have tried.

[KD7PTN]

I am a new ham operator and am interested in building a cheap 2 meter antenna for base station operations. Will a simple long wire work for this? and if so how long do I need to make it? I will be using a heathkit 2036 on a power supply. I aquired the radio at a thift shop for $14.

Believe it or not!
lonniebh@fidalgo.net
73's
KD7PTN

[W1ZY]

KD7PTN

Take a SO-239 chassis mount female coaxial connector and solder four lengths of coat hanger wire to the base after crimping them to the empty screw holes. Take a fifth piece of coat hanger wire and solder it to the center conductor. This makes a simple groundplane. Plug a PL-259 male coax connector into this and the other end ot your rig and you're all set.

The lengths of the coat hanger wires should be 5/8 or 1/4 wavelengths of the operating frequency. Mount the antenna on a broom handle and stick it on the roof.

[jxs2151]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (W1ZY @ Feb. 26 2002,06:40)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">KD7PTN

Take a SO-239 chassis mount female coaxial connector and solder four lengths of coat hanger wire to the base after crimping them to the empty screw holes. Take a fifth piece of coat hanger wire and solder it to the center conductor. This makes a simple groundplane. Plug a PL-259 male coax connector into this and the other end ot your rig and you're all set.

The lengths of the coat hanger wires should be 5/8 or 1/4 wavelengths of the operating frequency. Mount the antenna on a broom handle and stick it on the roof.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
This is the first antenna I ever had. #Made it exactly as you stated and it worked great. #Used it for simplex and packet.

[KD7PTN]

[B][I]Figured out the length using the formula L=234/f
However, getting a coat hanger to solider to the so 239 is interesting.. did get it .. only the center of the so 239 broke off still enough there if I can get a connect or over it and couple it to the coat hanger element.

i think i will place a piece of rubber tubing a couple inches long over the center end of the so 239 for reninforcement .. any body have any other thoughts on this ?

this is the first antenna i have ever built hope it works. I will be trying to key a repeater that is about 10 miles from me as well as simplex ..

[kd6gn]

on long wire antennas: see my article in the september 2001 cq magazine on a simple 160 meter inverted-v antenna which can easily be turned into a sloper v-beam for 40 through 10 meters. #kd6gn