'FUN'ETICS are FUN!

Some time ago, a buddy of mine, Chet N6ZO and I were in friendly 'buddy to buddy' QSO on a local 2M repeater. #When ID time came, he proceeded to say 'KAY THREE FIVE TWO (pause) NINE SIX ZERO ONE'. #

I responded 'Fine Business, Chet! NINE SIX ZERO ONE (pause) KAY THREE FIVE TWO' and proceeded on with my comments.

The QSO ended and some guy called us and accused us of being bootleggers because we weren't using REAL phonetics which made us illegal.

I politely informed him that our phonetics were fine and that Chet's call is 'EN' 'SIX' 'ZED' 'OH' and gave the formal ITU phonetics as well as my own. I reminded him that the FCC rules mandate NO particular phonetics and the only proviso they DO talk to is the prohibition against use of codes and ciphers to obscure meanings. #I (again I was quite polite) informed him that our #use of FUNetics in no way approached that line.

My buddy Chet concurred with me. The guy came back, still a bit upset and gave a short commentary which indicated that no matter what we said or what explanations we offered he was sticking to his original point and that was that ITU phonetics should be used. At that point, I thanked him for his comments and turned it over the Chet by saying 'NINE SIX ZERO ONE KAY THREE FIVE TWO' #Chet replied in kind and we continued our coversation.

The point behind the posting is this...

All of us have 'fun'etics connected with our callsigns. WHen SERIOUS times come up.. it's ITU phonetics and down to business all the way.

We all know folks (usually) by thier ham calls and that usually comes from some kind of funetic recognition. For example. I use KILOWATT THREE FERTILE TURTLE. Most of the locals know me as 'FT' or 'Fertile Turtle' or some variatoin on that.

Another guy is N3FFB. He had the funetic 'Fuzzy Fuzzy Baseballs' hung on him and it has stuck. NOW, locals tend to ask 'Have you heard FUZZY FUZZY aroudn and EVERYONE who is active knows who it refers to.

Thepoint is.. It's easier to recall 'funetics' than straight ITU Phonetics. You might not remember FOXTROT FOXTROT BRAVO.. but trust me.. FUZZY FUZZY BASEBALLS will stick in your mind.

FOXTROT TANGO - maybe not.. but FERTILE TURTLE is more likely to stick in your mind.

My old call back in the dark ages 1978 #was WA3LQV. Not a lot of people recalled WHISKEY ALPHA THREE LIMA QUEBEC VICTOR.. but trustme on this one..

MANY knew WE ARE THREE LITTLE QUEER VAMPIRES (ok.. it sucked.. but that was hung on me at 15 and at that age I thought it was cool), WHISKY ALCOHOL THREE LEMONS QUININE VERMOUTH, and other unprintable versions of those letters.

So, if any of you have been chasstised for your FUNETICS.. enjoy..

I'm sure lots of oyu have your own stories about FUNETICS. I'd like to hear 'em!

Another one I hung out there was KAY THREE FEET (for K3FT) Why? Because one day a lady in a parking lot asked me about the ham plates on my car. She asked me 'What does KAY THREE FEET mean?' (She was assuming the 'FT' was the shorthand for 'FEET'http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif #I was in a 'MOOD' that day so I told her (with a dead serious expression on my face and a matter of fact tone in my voice) -

'I'm a surveyor! It is shorthand for 'One Thousand And Three Feet. 'K' is the shorthand for one thousand.'

She looked at me with a seroius expression, nodded her head in understanding and started to leave. I couldn't let her go. I laughed and told her that is my Amateur Radio callsign and gave her a brief sketchof Amateur Radio callsigns.

Of course, I DID NOT point out to her that written in English words in fairly big letters across the bottom of the tag was 'AMATEUR RADIO OPERATOR' cuz it would have been impolite.

But it was fun. I told it to a couple of buddies and they started calling me KAY THREE FEET for short. So that one stuck too.

FUNETICS ARE FUN!

73
Chuck
(what's my call? all together now! KAY THREE FIVE TWO!http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif
:-)
ADDED comment 6/1 - BRAVE typo fixed. Sheesh! ;-)

Proper ID.. Nowhere did I say that when we used those phonetics that we had ENDED our conversation OR exceeded the 10 minute mark in our QSO. (People 'assumed' we did, which lead to their comments, I suspect)

Let me clarify something.. At the END of the QSO and every 10 minutes we used the FULL AND PROPER ITU phonetics or just the callletters without phonetics.

The point of the posting was (and I admit.. I was a bit neglient in not stating that we DID follow the rules at the end and every 10 minutes) to point out that FUNETICS are useful because they add a bit of enjoyment to ham radio and make things stick out

To the guy who said that my ID as KAY THREE FIVE TWO could have been confused other than K3...I dunno how that was arrived at. I think, again, my error in not clarifying that our FUNETICS were used within the 10 minute/end of series of transmissions rule.

BROADCAST.. when I was doing that type of work (love those log schedules!http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif It was required that we ID the station 'at the top of the hour or at the nearest break in programming to the top of the hour' by stating the station callsign plus the licensed location. They could put anyting before it or after it, but there had to be a definite ID of callsign and licensed location. USUALLY that was well within the +/- 5 minutes.

[N0PU]

I agree phonetics can be fun, however in your example I do not believe you are fulling the requirement of the law...

See from your favorite phonetics we can't tell if you are K3FT or KT5T both of which are not only legal call signs but are also both active... which means you have not completely identified your station. And KT5T COULD be mobile in your area and on the same repeater using the same phonetics.

There's nothing wrong, IMHO, with K3 Fertile Turtle which DOES identify your station.

Your friend is in the same boat as we can't tell his phonetics from NSØ0 which is also an active call.

Just my opinion.

[W5HTW]

This has been one of the really big controversial issues in ham radio today. The regulations say, paraphrased, the use of standard phonetics is encouraged 'for clarification of the call sign." It is my take on this (and many do not agree, including, it seems Riley Hollingsworth!http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif that the phonetics should be used to clarify the call sign, not in lieu of the call sign. In other words, to me, it says on my amateur radio license that my call sign is W5HTW. Not "Whiskey Five Hard To Win." Or even "Whiskey Five Hotel Tango Whiskey." Again, this is my opinion, and apparently not the "law of the land" and I readily admit it. But that makes my legal ID "W5HTW" and nothing else. However, if my call sign is not understood due to conditions, I am encouraged by the regulations to use, in addition to the legal ID, standard phonetics to clarify it. The rules do not suggest I can use non-standard phonetics for such purposes, and most especially do not state I may use non-standard phonetics in lieu of a legally-issued call sign.

Using that view, I think you failed to ID. In addition, I think you used what would appear on the surface to the non-initiated to be a false ID, and to the initiated, to be something other than your real call sign, suggesting numerals instead of letters in the call sign suffix. In other words, you used a system that could be construed as deliberately misleading.

But I'm a dinosaur, and clearly ham radio has changed, as has the interpretation of the rules regarding much of it. I am aware of that. Plus I came from the broadcast industry where the "Legal ID" is very specifically, the call letters of the station, followed by the city of license, and in NO other format. You can say "94 Rock" all hour long, but on top of the hour (or as close to it as programming permits) you MUST use the actual call letters as issued by the FCC, followed by (with no other word, such as "in" or "near" between) the city of license. "Legal ID" has a specific meaning in the broadcast field. It used to have in the amateur radio field.

Still, even in the most liberal interpretation of the rules, you used misleading call signs that could be construed as false.

73
Ed

[K9STH]

I agree that you need to use a "proper" identification every 10 minutes and at the beginning and end of your series of transmissions. All that aside, when conditions are such that using "standard" ICAO phonetics are not required, then there is nothing wrong with using "funny" ones.

Of course, the ICAO phonetic for "B" is "bravo" and not "brave".

Back during the 1960s, when we were still flying a lot of aircraft out of Great Britain, a lot of the British pilots would "authenticate" with what the proper return was "YY" which they would take great pleasure when they said "yankee yankee". Well, the US pilots got where they would authenticate with what was "LL". However, instead of saying "lima lima", they would say "Limey Limey" just to get the "goats" of the Brits.

I am reminded of the phonetics that the late Jack Camp used when he got his two-letter call which came through the system as W5HS (you couldn't choose your call back then). He would identify on 6 meters (the old 50.700 MHz "sorehead" frequency - a group who worked at Collins Radio and Texas Instruments primarily) as Whiskey Five Horse Shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhoe!

Back when I was in high school, K9LHC, K9TZS, K9WHF, and myself, K9STH, hung out a lot together. K9LHC was Jim Conrad. People came up with a saying "Love Happy Conrad knew Two "Zippy" Sisters, who Were Horney Females, and Saw Them Home. It wasn't that good of a sentence, but people tried to make fun of us.

Over the years I have been called "Sweet Tooth Harry" among others. My mother's "baby" brother, who is more like an older brother to me than an uncle, came up with "Squaresville's Timid Halfwit".

Anyway, there's nothing wrong with "funny" phonetics so long as the call is properly identified at the proper time.

Glen, K9STH

[k3sam]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">You can say &quot;94 Rock&quot; all hour long, but on top of the hour (or as close to it as programming permits) you MUST use the actual call letters as issued by the FCC, followed by (with no other word, such as &quot;in&quot; or &quot;near&quot; between) the city of license. #&quot;Legal ID&quot; has a specific meaning in the broadcast field. [/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
Just a side comment Ed, your example refers to radio, not television. #In broadcast television, they may identify either by voice or visual.

Also, the hourly ID applies to once an hour, not necessarily at the <span style='font-size:13pt;line-height:100%'>TOP</span> of the hour. #One station in Pittsburgh did everything they could to make a name for themselves ( and they did ). #WWSW, or 3WS. #At the top of the hour, 3WS was the only identifcation they would give. #At the bottom was &quot;WWSW, AM/FM, Pittsburgh&quot;. #I might say extremely fast too. #Broadcast stations also have a five minute grace period each side of the clock, if I remember correctly.

Getting back to the original post, I agree with Harry .. you have to be careful. #I was attempting to be cute one day, and gave my call as &quot;<span style='color:blue'>Kilo Three Stupid And Mindless</span>&quot;, the guy I was talking to came back and said he was &quot;sorry to hear that&quot;, but could he still have my call !. #I have stayed away from the fun words since.

-Sam

[KM5FL]

Fun-netics or Phonetics. Using either one is ok to make sure you're understood by the person you're talking to.. But IDing your station is done to meet the rules set forth by the FCC.. Standard phonetics or plain English only is acceptable...

Kiss My Five Foxy Ladies for my friends...

KM5FL for the FCC.....

[K0rs]

I think I'm gonna be sick...

[k3sam]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Kiss My Five Foxy Ladies for my friends...[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
Why would I kiss them for your friends ?

[N0FFA]

After having worked for the FAA for 23 years and having been slapped up side o' the head (figuratively, not literally) every time I said 'N' vice 'November', you guys are gonna give me bad dreams!

[KB1GYQ]

Pass me another adult beverage

Kindly Bacchus One Gigantic Yearning Quenched

[n6hle]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (k3sam @ June 01 2003,20:17)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Also, the hourly ID applies to once an hour, not necessarily at the <span style='font-size:13pt;line-height:100%'>TOP</span> of the hour. #One station in Pittsburgh did everything they could to make a name for themselves ( and they did ). #WWSW, or 3WS. #At the top of the hour, 3WS was the only identifcation they would give. #At the bottom was &quot;WWSW, AM/FM, Pittsburgh&quot;. #I might say extremely fast too. #Broadcast stations also have a five minute grace period each side of the clock, if I remember correctly.

-Sam[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
I know this is a ham site rather than a broadcast radio site, but since that's my biz I hate it when people are misinformed.
The Legal ID has to run at the top of the hour. Just confirmed that with one of our engineers. Must be played within 7 minutes either way of the top. Chances are WWSW was playing what is known as a hidden ID at the top of the hour.
A long-gone station in Los Angeles (KQLZ) a number of years back used a hidden ID to keep the whole &quot;pirate radio&quot; theme, which was also their name. I sometimes run a hidden ID if my syndicated show is running too far over the top of the hour.
Also some radio stations use their legal ID as a form of humor... IE a station in California had a legal ID of K--- Ripon-Modesto... Their ID on the air went like this: &quot;K--- Rippin' Modesto a new ass(BLEEP TONE)&quot; Legal ID to the letter of the law, but not in spirit.
As far ham radio ID's, I've read that the FCC recommends the use of a standard phonetic alphabet but haven't seen anything about a STANDARD set of phonetics being REQUIRED.
However I think I would be confused by the use numerals as phonetics. But maybe that's just me.

73's to all

--Harry - KG6PTD

[k3sam]

Harry,

Check it out.

FCC Rules - 73.1201 (http://hallikainen.com/cgi-bin/addlink.pl?http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin/get-cfr.cgi?TITLE=47&PART=73&SECTION=1201&TYPE=TEXT&YEAR=)

FYI. #I believe I was correct, at least the FCC would back that theory.

73,
Sam

[KB1GYQ]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (kg6ptd @ June 02 2003,10:14)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Also some radio stations use their legal ID as a form of humor... IE a station in California had a legal ID of K--- Ripon-Modesto... Their ID on the air went like this: &quot;K--- Rippin' Modesto a new ass(BLEEP TONE)&quot; #Legal ID to the letter of the law, but not in spirit.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
Back in the days I used to call to the local college station during the &quot;alternative music show&quot;, and request that they play the EBS tone! They would do a similar thing of adding a dedication afterward. It was great fun, but the station director hated me.

[n6hle]

Sam,

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">(2) Hourly, as close to the hour as feasible, at a natural break in program offerings. Television and Class A television broadcast stations may make these announcements visually or aurally.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>

Straight from the FCC... Note the words AS CLOSE TO THE HOUR AS FEASIBLE whereas &quot;the hour&quot; refers to THE TOP OF THE HOUR. Bottom of the hour can in no way be justified as feasible.

I've been in this business for quite some time now and I have NEVER worked for a station that runs their legal identification anywhere in the hour but near the top, nor ever heard it as a part of regular station policy. However I have known a board-op who got fired over the station being fined for not playing the legal identification at the top of the hour on several occassions.

Harry - KG6PTD

[k3sam]

Sorry for dragging this out, I have directed my comments to email so I don't take up QRZ space. However, my last post stands.

-Sam

[kd5icr]

Well as for me I have had my call come back to me as
KD5 ICom Radio (icr) Funny sometimes, but I like regular phons as in India Charley Romeo. I think it is just as ez and I wont have to deal with some hard nose ripping on me cause he/she just dont get it. But this is a hobby right we are allowed to have fun, I hope.
73
kd5icr (aka) Bill
http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[KD5NCO]

According to the FCC identification requirements, if I start my broadcast day at 06:30 AM, I am required to identify the station, and hourly there after...

In English I interpret the rule to apply to any 60 minuet segment of time, and note that the FCC allows me some ambiguous latitude to time my station identification to some natural programming break.

So to comply I must next identify within some short unspecified time close to 07:30.

&quot;Hourly&quot; is a 60 minuet period of time, &quot;as close to the hour&quot; is a phrase that allows some leeway ( + or - 5 to 7 minuets as an example).

I do not see in the FCC rule, any reference to TOP of the hour. Your have inferred this expression and that is ok, but not gospel.

Have a rag chew buddy who is K5LMI (Little Mean Indian) ;&gt;}

KD5NCO is not a vanity call, but as luck would have it, I am a Retired Army First Sergeant and spent 24 years as a Non-Commissioned Officer (NCO) and fortunately the &quot;NCO&quot; is a common enough term/Acronym that I seldom have to phonetically spell it.

[KC5ZQM]

Some look down on easy phonetics because &quot;that's too much like CB.&quot; #However, they have been benn around since the earliest days of radio. #One of the first broadcast stations on the air was KFBK (Kansas Folks Know Best) of Liberal KS.

I did read somewhere long ago that the ITU phonetics were required by international treaty. #If the FCC regs do no explicitly reflect this, then that may have changed or it applies only to international commo. #As long as you use the ITU's during #REQUIRED identifications, you should be safe; every thing else is just part of the QSO.

73 from Keeps Chasing 5 Zany Question Marks, or King Charley's 5 Zippy Quick Mobiles

[w3bny]

King Bunnie 3rd Just Looks Zany

Only used it once and that was in conjunction with phonetics. &quot;What was your call again? Kilo Bravo three Juliet Lima Zulu....King Bunnie 3rd Just looks Zany&quot; I got a giggle over the repeater but the other party pretty much understood. I dont do it very often either. All I need is to do it to the wrong person and go thru the on air reading of the riot act.:0

73 and good day all.

P.S. Its even on my avatar/QSL cards http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[k7dlx]

Too much whiskey in my phonetics.

Whiskey Seven Whiskey Whiskey Bravo

I much prefer the phonetics that were hung on me years ago (at the time I was the morning disc jockey on KDLX-AM Radio):

Whiskey Seven World's Worst Broadcaster

Ric W7WWB

[KD7WHQ]

I've only used phonetics once for the 10 minute ID, and only because the other guy was at the fringe of reception, and hadn't gotten it right for 20 minutes. I don't think that was out of line, as it just happened to time out that way.
But, how he initially got C out of Quebec is beyond me, lol..