Work the world on 160-10, 6 and 2 from anywhere.

[W1MWB]

Do you rent an apartment and have restrictions on putting up antennas? Perhaps you have a fixed income and can not afford to purchase new radio equipment? I want to tell you about a way that you can work the world, no matter what your situation is.

There is now a program where you can go on the internet and interface wth a fully functional HF/VHF station and be able to fully operate the station as if you were sitting in front of the radio. You may have seen an article about this in QST in the past year or so. Keith, W7DXX, and Stan, W4MQ have worked dilligently in the past year to provide hams with the oppertunity to operate HF over the internet. Stan has created a stand-alone application that serves as the controls of the radio. The audio is sent and received via Microsoft NetMeeting. As time progrsses, the technology is being improved. Keith, W7DXX has formed a club to support his remotebase and is now setting his remote base up for satellite operation, is installing a KW amplifier and much more. If you, or someone you know would like to find out about operating through their systems, visit http://www.w4mq.com or http://www.lamonica.com and sign up. The rig on both remotebase stations is a Kenwood TS-2000 all mode transceiver. Sign up and have fun.

Mike Biasin, KA1TJR

[kc8pnl]

Well, I'd love to register and start using the internet remote base, but it seems that the webcite for regristration is down. Do u have any idea when it'll be back online? I'm living in a leased apartment andno antennas are really aloud so I'd really love to give it a try. Thanks for the info Mike and 73 for now

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (kc8pnl @ Feb. 21 2003,17:28)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Well, I'd love to register and start using the internet remote base, but it seems that the webcite for regristration is down. #Do u have any idea when it'll be back online? #I'm living in a leased apartment andno antennas are really aloud so I'd really love to give it a try. #Thanks for the info Mike and 73 for now[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
u=you
webcite=website
andno=and no
aloud=allowed

reading aloud is not allowed http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[n3xp]

Just what was needed. I can't wait to read the replys to this ridiculousness.

[wa4dou]

Oh great ! More imitation ham radio for imitation hams.

[DriverSide]

Great Post Mike!

This is a great example of the coexistence between ham radio, PCs and the internet. I'm always gald to see that our hobby is advancing beyond "simple" communications.
This just illustrates that there really is a symbiotic relationship between amateur radio and the internet.

73's

[K5ZM]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (curmudgeon @ Feb. 22 2003,08:21)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Oh great ! More imitation ham radio for imitation hams.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Oh great ! More imitation ham radio for imitation hams.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>

Ya know, I thought long and hard about whether or not to reply to this. I can see your point to an extent. While it is NOTHING personal at all, I'll use the "shack on the belt" aspect of ham radio as an example. I've just never had a very high opinion of that type of operating preference. (Remember: I'm talking about the type of operation, not any one person). So I can see how you might think of a remote HF rig on the 'net as something for imitation hams.

Sometimes, however, things happen in our lives that result in our being in places we'd rather not be. Apartments, to be exact. As one who's primary interest is contesting, I'm obviously not thrilled about it. But for now, it'll have to be.

Now, I studied for each and every upgrade.. from Novice to Extra. True, the tech stuff was #-and still is- #the most difficult part for me to grasp. But I've never seen myself as an "imitation ham" and I'm not about to change that.

Oh wait! Maybe I'm speaking too soon? Put one of those handheld V/UHF rigs in my hand and tell me to bring up the nearest autopatch... then you'll see an imitation ham http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

[wu3u]

This type of operation is not "imitation" at all. #It is real HF using the Internet to control the station. #Only the means of controlling the station are different from actually being present at the control site.

That said, I DID try to register on both of these sites many months ago...and heard nothing from the sponsors.

I guess I will try again.

73 to all!

Tim
N8LXR

[W5HTW]

Technology is, indeed, marvelous. Operating a ham radio station without having a ham radio station is only one example of things either currently under development, or under consideration.

For example:

For those of us not near large bodies of water, a team of professional fishermen is going to tour excellent fishing spots worldwide. They will take with them a laptop computer and a robotic arm. We will then be able to log onto their website and control the arm, which will select the bait or fly, and will strategically place it into the water. When a fish bites, we can push a button on our keyboard and the rod will hook the fish, reel it in, put it into the bucket, after holding it up on a string and taking a photo of it. The team, of course, is there simply to provide support for the computer, and to oil the robotic arm. When we are done for the day, we can supply the photos of our great fishing trip to our friends. No, I'm not talking about a "Fishing Simulator." I'm talking about the real thing – actually catching fish in your favorite lake, even if that lake or river is thousands of miles from you. And if you wish, the fish can be scaled and gutted, and shipped to you by rush, refrigerated air, delivered to your doorstep! You can catch, cook and eat, your own fish, caught over the internet! Wow!

Speaking of photos, another team is going to travel to exotic places and will carry a computer-operated camera. Sitting at home in the comfort of our living rooms, we will direct the camera to take photos, just as if we were really there, and send them via email to us. This will allow us the pleasure of announcing to our friends what a great photographer we are.

Under development is a robot which will skydive, and another which will hang glide. You and I can sit in our living room and operate these robots, providing us with the experience of hang gliding off the highest mountains in the world, and skydiving from such things as jet fighters, helicopters, whatever we choose - even commercial airlines. We will become expert in those activities.

Highest classified, as far as I know, is the internet interface between our home computer and the cockpit of a Boeing 737. Once this is fully developed, you or I will be able to sit home and actually fly that aircraft, carrying passengers, from one domestic location to another, as we will have access to the onboard computers. A little advice from air controllers will help us at first, to keep it even, and to land it, but as we become more proficient, they will take more of a background safety approach. Airplane included!

On the drawing board is a professional golfing robot, which, once in operation, will be directed from our home computers, and will be able to play a nearly perfect game of golf, allowing us to brag to our friends how great a golfer we have become. Likewise there is a bowling robot being prepared as we speak, which will permit any of us to bowl a perfect game anytime we press the "Perfect Game" button. We are NOT talking simulators here, folks.

Perhaps next will be the "New Baby" robot, which will allow not only women but men to experience, via computer, the act of childbirth, and once the child is born, we can direct it through life via computer, including going to school, to church, and playing computer marbles and riding the computer swing set. Baby not included, and not necessary.

Yep, well, April is still a month away, but this topic has been beat around so much on multiple web sites, I thought it would be more appropriate to have a little fun with it. No sense being serious ALL the time!

73
Ed

[kc0lpv]

I propose an experiment for all you "Curmudgeons" (in name or spirit!http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif.

Turn on your HF rig and call "CQ". #I'm betting that, most likely, you spoke into a microphone and did not directly modulate the RF with your brain. #Okay, so you are connected to the radio remotely through a mic cord.

Now, put an extension on the mic cord. #Call "CQ". #You are now ten feet away from the rig, operating remotely. #

Now, I install a "black box" at your rig, hooked to a looong cable--what the heck, trans-atlantic--and you call "CQ". #Are you still "using ham radio"? #Or is it fake?

What if I disconnect the cord, and show you that I had fooled you--I have made an unknown link between your mic cord and your HF rig. #Now, were you "using ham radio"? #Does it matter what method I used to connect your mic cord to your rig?

It's an issue of scale, which is a nuance that seems to be lost on most OT'ers. #I'm sure the same type of arguments were put forth when transistors were first used in Ham radio--it isn't really ham radio if it isn't all tubes! #

1955: #It isn't ham radio if it isn't AM!

1935: #It isn't ham radio if it isn't regenerative!

1915: #It isn't ham radio if you don't use a cat's whisker!

1910: #It isn't ham radio if it isn't spark-gap!

Jim kc0lpv

OKOKOK I like the idea of remote base operation... Koool STUFF.. But Hey whats with the pay $30.00 Bucks stuff..

OUch

Joe

WØANT http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif

[N0FPE]

http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif
Ok I am all for new modes and ways of operating. My question is not "Is it really Ham radio" but why go to all the trouble of getting a Ham ticket if all you plan to do is use the internet to talk to others? why not just forget that step? If you are not interested in learning how to build and install antennas, if you are not interested in propagation<how can you be if you use someone elses radio remotly?>, if you are not interested in using RF from your location to talk to someone else, if you are not able to install antennas at your location, if you dont have or dont want to spend the bucks to have your own station......why then go to all the trouble to get a ham ticket?
This is one of the big problems in ham radio today, folks want everything quick and eazy. So why do I want to spend mega$$$$ to have a station at home that does not require a internet connection?
Well for me I hate to depend on the phone company, the ISP, the WWW operators ect to chat with someone a world away or across the street. I didnt get my ticket to use the phone!
Now I do have a computer in the shack<2 in fact> One is for digitial modes on the HF/VHF/UHF bands and the other one is for accessing the internet and personal things. I have as of yet to find a need to add the ability to talk on the internet to someone else via VoIP, echoLink, ILRP, WIRES ect. On any given day at any given time I can ALWAYS find someone on the Ham bands to chat with.
And then you say well i can have antennas...I have to say you are not trying hard enough..and we are back at the fast and eazy thing....If there is a will there is a way to get on the air WITHOUT the internet.
And besides, what happens to your wonderful internet if there is a disaster, man made or natural? It goes poof!!!!!

All this is just my opinion of course
Your mileage may vary

Dan/NØFPE

Dan N0FPE was right on target on all counts. But the biggest reason of all is because its "My station", not someone elses. I only consider qso's from my station to be mine, none other.

[n3xp]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (kc0lpv @ Feb. 22 2003,16:38)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Now, I install a "black box" at your rig, hooked to a looong cable--what the heck, trans-atlantic--and you call "CQ". #Are you still "using ham radio"? #Or is it fake?[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
Or it could be said like this. You talk into the microphone, which sends your voice down a little cord into your sound card. From here that voice is converted to a stream of 1's and 0's. After your sound card gets done working its magic your PC gets to work its magic. That stream of 1's and 0's is broken down into IP packets, each addressed with an ISN. These packets are then sent out through your phone line or broadband connection, passing through a dozen or more routers in unknown locations. On the other end the packets are received and assembled based on ISN, crossing your fingers that non of the packets were lost. The stream of 1's and 0's are then converted back to audible speech, passed to a sound card/serial port/USB port and then sent on to the radio in some other state. That radio then transmits a signal. The process is reversed when a signal is received on the radio. This sound much more like Instant messenger or voice chat than it does radio.

I have an idea maybe the FCC should start testing on TCP/IP, networking theory, and just general data communications. After all who needs to know how a radio signal is sent through the air.

***Example above was simplified. Many more technical details were left out********

[n4ob]

errrrr.
Where do I plug in my paddles?
USB or Serial port?
http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

[ak7ml]

There are several difficulties which present themselves.
1. Anyone who makes up or steals a call sign can use this method, unless there is some verification. So a repeater attached to the system may get to sound like CB. Who is responsible if an irresponsible person uses this to jam the conversations of others?
2. A repeater attached to the system may become so full of distant logins that locals stay away from it for their local traffic. So the repeater will be hangout for only people who are distant.

I don't think some of the other comments are very relevant. I think that if all new technicians had to build their own transmitters there would be very few of them and there would be more TVI than you could shake a stick at! I work in electronics so I have the tools. When I had a government agency buy tools for adult student of mine, the total was about $1000 and that didn't include any RF tools like SWR meters, wattmeters, etc.
I share everyone's concern for imitation hams that are just CBers transmitting somewhere else.

[n3wjl]

I have a question for the HAM police...

Am I allowed to use my PC (sitting next to the radio) to control the radio or isn't that real ham radio?

Personally I don't think it is the greatest idea to put a radio on the web for everyone to use. I also think that it is VERY questionable to charge for access, but I don't see anything wrong with a HAM putting his or her own station on the 'net for his or her own private use.

I enjoy logging into the receive only web radio site to listen around the bands at lunch time.

N3WJL

who still doesn't see what the purpose of HAM radio is.

[w0aew]

Albert Einstein, when asked to describe radio, replied:
"You see, wire telegraph is a kind of a very, very long cat. You pull his tail in New York and his head is meowing in Los Angeles. Do you understand this? And radio operates exactly the same way: you send signals here, they receive them there. The only difference is that there is no cat."

[wu3u]

Tonight I used the internet controlled remote HF station
mentioned in this article with receive only priviledges.

Today I will GLADLY send my 30 dollars to receive full transmit and receive priviledges as I live in a city apartment and have no way of erecting an HF station from my current QTH. #

That is a small price to pay for the full use of a fairly elaborate HF station featuring Internet remote control.

This project is a great contribution to Ham Radio and I cannot understand the attitude of some contributors in this thread who seem content to simply critisize. #Why is it that so many Hams are negative about new and innovative ways of doing things in Ham Radio? #So many in the Amateur Community seem to poo-poo everything!

I think that the sponsor's asking for 30 dollars a year to use his station via the Internet is perfectly justifiable. #Think of the cost of building and maintaining this system.
Do you think that the sponsor should foot the bill for everything while others use the station and pay nothing?
Someone has to pay for everything that is needed, everything from the purchase of equipment to paying the electric bill. #Come on now guys...get real! #

The requirement of becoming a dues paying member via a written application along with a copy of your license also safeguards the station from being used by unlicensed people, and to some extent it filters out the
less-than-serious, merely curious folks who may abuse it.

If gaining full transmit and receive priviledges were simply a matter of filling out an online form and receiving a password at no cost, the system would be inundated with users, many of whom may be more inclined to abuse it because gaining access cost them nothing. #Asking for a written application along with
a small fee to become a member is one way to keep that from happening.

Is it "real Ham Radio?" #It certainly is. #It is not "virtual"
Ham Radio or any other sort of simulated radio experience. #Only the means of controlling the station
are different from being in the shack.

Those making the claim that people interested in this
unique way of gaining access to the HF bands are not
really interested in electronics, propagation, or what have you, are making very dubious claims.

At different times in my life, I have had a home station.
I've built several transmitters and various kits, tons of antennas, and so on, #and I am a proficient high speed code operator holding an Extra Class ticket. #Right now I live in a place where I cannot erect outdoor antennas...so something like a Internet linked remotely controlled HF station such as this allows me to remain active in Ham radio despite my living arrangements.

I can think any number of people who may have a keen, genuine interest in Ham Radio who would benefit from this:

* Young people living with parents in an antenna
# restricted environment.

* Older Hams who have to move to retirement homes
# yet still want to remain active in Amateur Radio.

* #Students away at college

* #Military personnel away from home.

In short, this is a great project...a way of keeping people interested and active who, for one reason or another, simply cannot be on the air from where they are living currently.

And if CC and Rs continue to proliferate at the rate they are currently, a few decades from now THIS may be only way that MANY of you will be able to get on the air....as older housing is phased out and new, almost always
antenna restricted properties are phased in.

The nay sayers are,,in my opinion, just being flat out negative...and trying to poo-poo the project based on their notion of what "real Ham Radio" is.

When I hear these types complain and question endlessly about this and practically everything else new and innovative in Ham Radio...I am reminded of the saying "Some days it does not pay to get out of bed!"

73

Tim
N8LXR

2003: #It isn't ham radio if it isn't ham radio!

1955: #It isn't ham radio if it isn't AM!

1935: #It isn't ham radio if it isn't regenerative!

1915: #It isn't ham radio if you don't use a cat's whisker!

1910: #It isn't ham radio if it isn't spark-gap!

Amazing how things change...

Charles, #N5PVL

[k8ld]

Well. I have a problem with using the Internet as a remote access tool. It's just not my bag. I like to operate QRP CW on rigs that I have built along with antennas that I've built. I get a lot of satisfaction out of building and learning from my mistakes. For me you can't replace this labor of love with an Internet interface. I realize some folk might get immense satisfaction from using the Internet but not me.

Mark--KF8KL

[W4CHL]

My two centivos:

- as a W4MQ/W7DXX user for over 4 months, I am thrilled with the availability of a ham station resource I can use when travelling, or even from my office. $30/year does seem reasonable to support its operation to me.

- this model is one many have setup before, typically for remote operation only of their own station perhaps using telco links and POTS service via modem instead of VoIP and "the Internet".

- club station or ARES training opportunities ? See PARC IRB planning (http://rtpnet.org/parc/Station/IRB) for an example of a common regional facility for hams to train on who don't have HF stations, or don't have digital capabilities which are both available at the club station.

Net here is: such stations can increase the availability of true ham radio stations to those who never have or may no longer be able to setup or maintain their own stations. Many of these hams are the BEST communicators we have, but not able to do so from their QTH.

With IRBs, we can have a larger pool of trained communicators who are even better prepared to be part of ARES/RACES when that emergency need arises.

Thank you for the discussion of this topic !

Cheers & 73s de Mark W4CHL

[kc8pnl]

What's wrong with the fee of the 30 dollars? Don't u pay club dues to use repeaters? If this isn't amature radio, then neither is talking on repeaters, packet radio, or anything else that retransmits your signal. Whether you winers like it or not, it is part of the hobby, so deal with it. If u don't like the use of internet remote bases, then don't use them! Why do u have to ruin everyone elses fun by complaining about it? There are certain aspects of this hobby that I don't particular care for either, but since I don't really care for them, I don't participate in them either. At the same time, I don't criticize everything everyone else does to advance that portion of the hobby. Why should i waste my time doing that when I can utilize the time I have to further persue my interests? Why don't you people that keep criticizing everything just let everyone else be and do what it is that you enjoy in amature radio?

Just my 2 cents worth, or maybe not even 1, not sure how much it's worth. I'm sure I'll be criticized and find out though.

73
Scott

[wu3u]

Hams in most all cases would probably prefer to have their own stations. #I agree that there is great satisfaction in having your own station. #

However, the W4MQ remote Internet controlled HF station is an excellent means of keeping people active and interested in Ham Radio who otherwise have no practical way of assembling a station of their own. #

I can understand some guys saying "Well it's just not my bag," especially if they have their own station at home.

But to the nay-sayers, who seem to delight in accentuating the negative about most everything new and innovative in Ham Radio (these types complained about SSB, FM, repeaters, etc., #in years past...most anything new) I say: #Lighten up! #And consider how this project is of great benefit to Ham Radio instead of being sour and negative about it.

Why is it that complaining and being negative, often unjustifiably so, #are so much a part of Ham Radio
culture? # To be honest, this tendency on the part of some Hams to dredge up often overstated and even
imaginary negative points about anything new that is proposed or undertaken is one of the reasons why I am no longer active in local clubs ...you just get tired of
of trying to be positive and enjoy Ham Radio in an environment that often includes that sort of behavior.

My hat is off to the folks who have made this station available to the Ham Radio Community!

73

Tim
N8LXR

[NN2X]

I am in Bahrain (Middle East), near the War zone. I use the W4MQ and W7dxx Site, Let me say it is totally needed and fills a need for those of us in these situations. My Calls NN2X

So this means I can communicate through HF with being dedicated. This might be advantageous whiling in a hostile environment.


Besides the need for these types of situations, Take a 12 Year boy or girl in front of a Ham SET and see if they enjoy the hobby as much as they would seeing it through their own domain (Computer). I can tell that most Children will respond better it you demonstrate HF communication through their own Domain (Computer), than they will outside

The system Description is the following

I am using the W4MQ and the W7DXX site, to communicate via HF. System Descriptions... Starting from Bahrain.. I use a PC Computer, which connects to an ADSL, interface, which connects to the Microwave link, inturn gets connected to the Satellite Earth Station in Bahrain. Then it gets relayed through a satellite, then gets connected to a Satellite Earth Station into England. At this point, it gets cross-connected to a fiber link and goes through the Atlantic Ocean. The Fiber Link, finally gets connected to the Internet Cloud. I use the Internet Cloud to remotely control a HF Station, in Boston, Mass or Reston VA.

I use Visual Basics (For the Virtual Radio, Which W7DXX, and W4MQ had developed). For the Voice Connectivity, I use Microsoft Net Meeting.

The Modulation schemes used for this entire Link, SSB, QPSK, and Celp Technology. The Network Protocols, consist of TCP/IP, UDP (Over the Satellite), RTP (To ensure Limited Time Delay), and there is Frame Relay also used.

There also a host of IP addressing schemes that is in every normal network..

I am happy to see HAM radio has crossed the Digital Divine!

[kf4lne]

2015: ham radio banned in the US due to CC&Rs!

2003: It isn't ham radio if it isn't ham radio!

1955: It isn't ham radio if it isn't AM!

1935: It isn't ham radio if it isn't regenerative!

1915: It isn't ham radio if you don't use a cat's whisker!

1910: It isn't ham radio if it isn't spark-gap!

[kj7gs]

I can't see how merging the Internet with ham radio can mean that someone using this mode is now not a ham. We've been through so many changes in our hobby over the years, this is just another new facet of what makes us amateur radio operators.

[w5vpu]

Whatever has become of the Amateur's Code? Or does the continued expression of anger over any change, realized or symbolic, expressed or perceived, get to the head of the line automatically?

Perhaps the internet and email have made it easier to express frustration and anger since we don't have to actually see the people we are expressing anger toward or about? Whoever says the internet is all good, or all bad, has missed the actuality that everything we have in life has both good and bad. Me. You. Our relationships. Our school systems. Our politics. ARRL. CW. SSB. Packet. Repeaters. QCWA. Our neighbors. Even Amateur Radio. Depends on what we do with it.

I wonder how Guglielmo Marconi would react to how we respond to one another about new processes and technologies. Ladies and Gentlemen, I have just recently learned that already folks are experimenting with superconductors which produce absolutely no heat for use in the various solid state devices. And the solid state transistor was invented in my lifetime. I've had a difficult time learning how those solid state devices work, but the only way is not the way of the past. "Just depends."

Frankly, I don't want to have to go back to the spark gap days of radio. And I can't even keep up with new technologies. I wonder, has anyone ever actually calculated the loss of person-hours that we ham operators throw away arguing over what is and what is not "right" in our technology? And I wonder what "Higher Authority" has laid down the Laws on Tablets of Stone to which we must all adhere? Last time that was done, I understand, it was to Moses in the Mountains of Sinai. (See the movie, "The Ten Commandments.")

Such a waste of possible creative energies we use -- unless it gets us to start thinking that some of us may actually be the "Marconis" of fifty years from now. Remember -- Marconi was awarded the Nobel Prize in physics with Karl Fernand Braun in 1909 (less than 100 years ago) who had invented a tube that imporoved wireless transmissions. With that they helped lead in the development of radio broadcasing. Marconi also pioneered tests with short waves and microwaves. Long may his spirit live.

I am 72, still trying to keep up. I just sold my last tube transceiver, although I've been also working CW and SSB with solid state device radios for eight or ten years. I am old enough to be glad someone took the time to experiment and bring out VFOs instead of me having to use fixed crystal oscillators. And boy am I glad for a well-designed transceiver with filters to ease out some of the QRM and QRN. And I thank you for reading the musings of a real Old Timer who has seen a lot of stuff come and go. I just see so little productive results from arguing over preferences and calling it "Right" and "Wrong." Seize the Day.

[kd5qea]

I think operating over the web in a remote location would take away the fun of sitting there talking on your own radio with people that you know or live close to if you operate vhf i don't think it would seem right to be on someone elses radio very far away. All of the exitement wouldn't be there if you got to the other side of the world. I wouldn't say there is a right or wrong way to do it just different

now I could be wrong because I only xmit vhf but recieve hf

[kc5spr]

IT SEEMS TO ME AFTER READING ALL THIS THAT WE ARE BECOMING A NEW RACE OF "COUCH PATATOS" NO LONGER DO WE HAVE TO GET UP AND TAKE THE TIME TO LEARN HOW TO BUILD AN ANTANEA OR HOW TO CHOOSE THE RIGHT BAIT TO CATCH A FISH OR HOW TO FLY WITHOUT GETTING HURT ALL WE HAVE TO DO IS TURN ON OUR COMPUTERS AND SOMEONE ELSE WILL DO IT FOR U. I FOR ONE BELIEVE IN THE OLD FASHION GET OUT THERE AND DO FOR YOURSELF AND ALTHOUGH THE INTERNET IS A GOOD TOOL IT REALY SHOULDN'T BE YOUR LIFELINE TO THE OUTSIDE WORLD.
NOW JUST LET ME SAY THAT I LIKE ALL THE IDEAS BECAUSE I HAVE A FRIEND WHO IS A PARAPLEGIC AND HE GETS "OUT" BY USING HIS COMPUTER AND THIS IS GREAT FOR HIM BUT FOR THOSE OF US WHO CAN WALK DO SO.
YES GETTING ON THE HF BANDS ARE FUN BUT IF YOU LIVE IN AN APARTMENT OR SOMEPLACE LIKE THAT THEN USE THE KNOWLEDGE YOU HAVE AND GET A FIELD OR MOBILE RIG TOGETHER I DID WHEN I LIVED IN AN APARTMENT THATS WHAT HAM RADIO IS ABOUT.

[w4mq]

The scope of responses on this topics shows a lots of enthusiasm, both pro and con. Hopefully that flows over into your ham activities also. Only very few hams move away from their operating into building something these days. The ARRL QEX teckie journal is not read or even known by a majority of hams.

Ham radio has always been different things to diferent people. I like to operate CW, but to many of the newer hams CW is an old timers thing and within a ten or twenty years may be gone!! I hope not. #But the same was said for AM. Hams need to be progressive and not get stuck in the quagmire of their old ways. #The internet is one way of expanding ham radio for some. Actually you would be surprised on the number of computer-unliterate hams -- something I would never have thought about until we did this experiment. My 18mo granddaughter may actually know more about computers!! But that will change. The world of technologing is changing too rapidly for us to image. #In ten years, computer based living, ubiquitous cell communications (no more wall phones, etc..) will be more standard and you will wonder how we got along without it before. Ham radio will evelove to meet those challenges or it will be an interesting #and dwindling anachronism of the past.

Ham radio is whatever you enjoy it to be, whether using new technology or still operating the AM nets using that old VikingII .

Stan W4MQ

[WB2GOF]

I figure with all of the curmudgeons out there right now, I should wait another 5 ~ 10 years before I get really active again on the bands. #By then, most of them will be "calling CQ in the sky," or in a convalescent nursing home. #Then the only ones left will be those who are young enough to embrace new technology and new things, or else the hobby will be completely dead. #Then, finally, I won't have to endure comments from those who tell us "It ain't Ham Radio if it ain't ____ (fill in the blank with your most favorite disgruntled noun)."

[wa1nti]

Got an e-mail from Keith today. #1500 control operators and only a dozen supporters. #Good Grief. #If you are going to use the remote that Mr Lamonica set up for pete sake help the guy out.

[KC8VUC]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">And then you say well i can have antennas...I have to say you are not trying hard enough..and we are back at the fast and eazy thing....If there is a will there is a way to get on the air WITHOUT the internet.
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I think the thing being missed by some is that in certain situations an antenna may not be possible, ie when in an apartment where you would be nuking your neighbors just to try to get to someone across the country. I am in this situation, and I use Echolink pretty regularly. I think it's a great program. How else could someone like me (I just got my tech less than a month ago) talk through a 2m repeater in England (I live in Michigan)? Just my two cents worth.

[N0LOH]

So, if you send a QSL for a QSO made via WWW, do you use your QTH or the QTH of the HF via WWW?

Should the ARRL allow a QSL from a QSO via the WWW for WAS or DXCC?

My advice is buy the B&W AP10A antenna. Works for me.

OK?

[N9TTX]

Apparently, some people again have not read the original post well. For those that CAN NOT have antennas (and yes I know...stealth anennas are possible---but for HF??? yeah..a stealth 160 Meter antenna...right, what's an ark? This is a great thing for those that can't get on the air from their house directly. Apparently a written/copy of license...etc... is required to send to the guy before Xmit is available. and the fee is not outrageous. consider cost of the equipment, cost of ISP, electric..etc... someone mentioned these. let us not forget..what if something goes down? How many of you have had to send your rig in to get it fixed...oh that's right, I suppose being a "real ham" means you fix your own stuff. I do to a point...but how many have access to relow stations and such..not me. Anyhoo, I personally do not care for computer control (other than the onboard chips in the modern rigs). My shack computer just has some programs like buckmaster and ham related items on it...not even internet connected or networked to the main 'puter in the other room. For those that like it, it is a decent idea and kudos to the one that is offering it. It's not for everyone, yet it has it's place....just as everything else in this hobby has it's place. I don't care to do sattelite, packet, rtty, sstv, fstv, and I rarely ragchew on the HF bands. I contest for HF-SHF, mostly run phone. but do I tell others what they should or shouldn't do for modes or ideas in contacting? No. Yet it seems like most of the negative comments are doing just that. Putting it another way...If it is using our hobby in the manner it is supposed to be used, and being operated legally, there should be nothing wrong with it. only when it comes to operating Illegal should there be a kibosh to it, but as far as I have seen, at least here, it is using the internet at the guys house as a control link or as a repeater in a sense....just another form of such. Go for it and good luck.

73
Dave Aho N9TTX

[KG4WKR]

Why is the Internet the sacred cow these days? Why are hams who think radio signals and Internet communication are different things always characterized as old curmudgeons and neo-Luddites? I use computers for a living and am in no way anti technology. However, what is the purpose of using ham radio on the Internet, when it is a totally supurflous element added to the communication process? I can talk, send video, or call anywhere in the world without ham radio. That is no challenge, thanks to new technology. Radio communication is something totally different, requiring skill and knowledge not needed when communicating via computer. I just don't get it. If you want to communicate on a computer, go to any chat room, netmeeting, or your e-mail. What does ham radio add to this process? Just because a thing is possible to do doesn't mean it is practical to do. You're already on the Internet - just go ahead and talk on it! You don't need the radio!!

[KC8QNF]

This is an interesting topic. Here is something to think about. Is using a repeater ok? You are using someone elses radio to transmit and operating it from another location. Seems to be about the same as using a computer and a long wire to the repeating station, rather than sending the first transmision via radio signals, you are using a wire.

I am not a longtime ham, but I would guess that many of the same arguments were made when them new fangled repeaters were developed.

I am not all that interested in Echolink, but I see it as following the spirit of Amateur radio, experimentation and inovation, modern homebrew, so to speak. Modern rigs are so complex, that you would have to be an electrical engineer to experiment with them. So that leaves you with antenna building for homebrew projects. There are a lot of Hams out there that are very savy with computers and software, and that opens up a whole new world in Ham radio inovation. I am personaly amazed that Amateurs put something like this together. My hats off to them.

73