In the Army Now

[KB3RCL]

So up until a few days ago I was working as an Aerial Torchman for a demolition company. Due to some trust issues with my employer and "the man" who contracted us, I told him to take the job and shove it.

So where do I find myself after a days worth of pondering of what to do about money and health benefits? The US Army Recruiting office.

Out of high school I wanted to join up and serve for a career. Many forks in the road later, I've finally found myself with the motivation to do so. With a wife, one child who just turned one year on the 8th, and another on the way I decided I was done chasing paychecks and drowning in medical debt.

While I have not been the most frequent tenant here on the zed I have enjoyed my stay. As such, I figured I would post this for those who frequent my PM box and my posts. Where I still have a bit before leaving I decided to post and fill-in recent events, regardless.

Tomorrow I am set to finish the enlistment process. After which I will have signed on for a 6 year term. My job within the army has yet to be decided. Though my recruiter is pushing for either a combat engineer (following my current knowledge and path of my younger brother), or as a radio operator/repairer.

The point of this aside from simply informing the community in which i socialize is this; How many people here have served in the Army, and do you have any advice on what to expect going in with an already established family?

Any responses are appreciated.

[AC4BB]

I spent 22 years between the U.S. Navy & The Army. I would do it all over again.
Thank you for serving the Country GL.

[W2FCP]

I was single, just out of high school when I joined the Air Force 17 years ago. My advice for you, at basic training do what you are told, don't volunteer for anything. If the TI's catch you screwing up once they will never let you forget it and will harass you till the day you leave. Your child is not too old which is good, may help with the seperation. Your wife needs to adjust to being a single mother for the time you are at basic. The Air Force will pay for spouses and families to come live at tech school, not sure if the Army will do that or not. If you have any more questions let me know, I will try to answer them. I know I have the Air Force perspective, but my brother has been in the Army 18 years so I know what he has gone through as well.

Good luck in the Army and Congrats on a new career!

[K8YZK]

Hi, I am retired US Army, but I have been out for 17 yrs and it has changed a lot.
Now I have a son who is in. Joined and when to Iraq twice(at the beginning of the war, I actually had my oldest and youngest there at the same time), got out and tried to find a job that would support his family(wife 2-kids) and pay child support. Well FOC(friend of the court it's actually called something else) decided that his ex need more money then him and his current family. Well he reenlisted for the reason you joined, medical and to pay the bills.

If you have specific questions ask away, if I can't answer them, I will ask my son when I can and see if I can help you go.
73
Kurt
K8YZK

[WA6MHZ]

Wish my son would take a trip to the Recruiter. That is his ONLY HOPE of getting a job. And then, if he signs up for IRAQ, he can get to SHOOT PEOPLE just like he enjoys so much doing in his video games. He will be very trigger happy there, shooting anything that moves. Nothing like the adrenalin burst from firing a machine gun!!! So, I heartily encourage him to join! Then he can LIVE his dreams!

[KD0FIN]

I would be 100% sure you want to do 6 years straight out of the gate. By the time I hit 3 years I was itching to get out and be on my own again. Not to mention with a 4 year enlistment they will offer you large sums of money to re-enlist once your re-up window opens. If you get deployed (which is highly likely) you can re-enlist for the extra 2 years and get your bonus tax free.
Something to think about...

Edited to add: BTW as may already know recruiters are a bunch of back-stabbing theives, worse than used car salesmen. (Not neccesarily the recruiter himself but "counseler/advisor" at MEPPS is usually the worst one.) Not only will they screw you out of money, but also your life if you aren't careful. If they don't offer a large signing bonus or whatever else you're asking for don't hesitate to walk right out of MEPPS. They'll give you biggest speech/guilt trip about how you can't leave MEPPS once you've started the process blah, blah, blah, but they have no power over you at this stage. You're still a free civilian, they're the one stuck in the uniform, do what you want and they can't do a thing about it. Use it as a bargaining point and if they aren't hooking you up with the good stuff simply threaten to walk out of MEPPS and you'll begin to see them trying a little harder. If they still are trying to stick you with something you don't want or a crappy bonus walk out and tell them you're going to find a new recruiter etc. they'll give you another pity party/guilt trip speech but ignore them and either A) find a new recruiter, or B) just come back another day. If they see that you mean business and you know you're stuff and how they are supposed to work with you they probably try to get you what you need and not screw you. Granted not all recruiters are this way but just keep it mind. I thought I was getting a good deal with a $3000 bonus but when my buddy signed up a week later and got $25,000 (this was all for 11B MOS) I knew something was up. Also if you can work with the time, ask to be in the delayed entry program (DEP) as long as possible, or ask for a very late ship date. All your time in the DEP is time they take off the end of your 8 year inactive reserve commitment. If I think of anything I'll add it.

Another edit: Joining the Army with a family will be tough. The Army (at least the 82nd ABN, I can't speak for other units) loves to keep you at work as long as possible for stupid stuff. You will miss out on a lot of family time. It is good however that you'll have all the medical coverage etc. Just be ready for it and try your hardest to maintain your family or else it will fall apart. In my unit people were getting divorces left and right.

Commo jobs are pretty good jobs if you don't like "roughing" it too much. On our deployment commo guys rarely left the FOB and were in charge of fixing radios, computers, truck commo equipment, and distributing COMSEC and the like. They all had pretty regular schedules and had a pretty consistant life. Not to mention they all had the hook up with internet and cable TV because they are the ones in charge of all that. Combat engineers on the other hand are quite different. In my experience overseas they are in charge of most route clearance and IED clearing. They are always on call and were always heading out to blow up UXO, mines, IED's etc., they had a very irregular schedule and were pretty much on call 24/7. Blowing stuff up sounds fun until you have to do it for 15 months and the stress of irregular schedules/dangers/ etc will get to you, no way around it. Not to mention they were getting blown up themselves pretty much every week because their mine clearing vehicles ended up driving over more mines/IED than actually detecting any. I don't want to sound discouraging or anything, just want to make sure you're aware of what you're getting into.

[KB3RCL]

Wish my son would take a trip to the Recruiter. That is his ONLY HOPE of getting a job. And then, if he signs up for IRAQ, he can get to SHOOT PEOPLE just like he enjoys so much doing in his video games. He will be very trigger happy there, shooting anything that moves. Nothing like the adrenalin burst from firing a machine gun!!! So, I heartily encourage him to join! Then he can LIVE his dreams!

LOL, as long as he doesnt answer that he is joining because he weants to shoot something he should be good. My younger brother of...22 years? Yeah, 22, enlisted straight out of high school as a combat engineer. When the "conflict" in Iraq had started he volunteered to go several times but was denied on each occassion. Suddenly he found himself changing to infantryman. I still believe that was his choice. Anyway, he has just been sent to california for Climate Acclimation before going to the sands.

He says it was the best choice he has ever made. But then he was 17 when he enlisted and still has no family tying him down. Might not be such a bad idea for your son. Best wishes on getting him out there in the real world. And if the Army is his choice, best of luck on a happy and safe journey to him.


Hi, I am retired US Army, but I have been out for 17 yrs and it has changed a lot.
Now I have a son who is in. Joined and when to Iraq twice(at the beginning of the war, I actually had my oldest and youngest there at the same time), got out and tried to find a job that would support his family(wife 2-kids) and pay child support. Well FOC(friend of the court it's actually called something else) decided that his ex need more money then him and his current family. Well he reenlisted for the reason you joined, medical and to pay the bills.

If you have specific questions ask away, if I can't answer them, I will ask my son when I can and see if I can help you go.
73
Kurt
K8YZK

The good thing about being in a solid relationship is that at this point I dont have to worry about child support and such. From what I've been told by others it is simply murder when you are in the service. Hopefully my current path doesnt change my marriage to the point of dealing with the same issue.


I was single, just out of high school when I joined the Air Force 17 years ago. My advice for you, at basic training do what you are told, don't volunteer for anything. If the TI's catch you screwing up once they will never let you forget it and will harass you till the day you leave. Your child is not too old which is good, may help with the seperation. Your wife needs to adjust to being a single mother for the time you are at basic. The Air Force will pay for spouses and families to come live at tech school, not sure if the Army will do that or not. If you have any more questions let me know, I will try to answer them. I know I have the Air Force perspective, but my brother has been in the Army 18 years so I know what he has gone through as well.

Good luck in the Army and Congrats on a new career!

My son being the age he is was one of the issues nagging at the back of my head, but I came to the same conclusion. Better now than later. The part that's going to be rough is realizing the possibility that I may not be present for the birth of the next. But this will benefit them just as much as me if not more.

My only big concern with already having a family is that I know if I am shipped to an area of conflict, they cannot go. BUT say I am sent to Germany for a year or two as many new recruits are; Can they go? Not only would it be a huge comfort having them close, but i think it would also be a great experience for my wife and children to partially live life in a foreign culture (especially being that both my wife's and my family are trace to german descent.)

[KB3RCL]

I would be 100% sure you want to do 6 years straight out of the gate. By the time I hit 3 years I was itching to get out and be on my own again. Not to mention with a 4 year enlistment they will offer you large sums of money to re-enlist once your re-up window opens. If you get deployed (which is highly likely) you can re-enlist for the extra 2 years and get your bonus tax free.
Something to think about...

My recruiter was actually quite upfront on this issue. His recommendation was a two year enlistment they now offer just to be sure it was the life i wanted. Then of course I could always re-enlist later if I wanted to continue it. But as I said this is what i've wanted to do since my teens and was always deterred another way by one event or another.

If for no other reason other than financial consistency and knowing my family will always be covered medically, I'll make a career out of it. Especially knowing that if I enlist now, by the time I am 45-ish I can collect my pension and still work full-time on top of that if I wish. Granting even further security for my family in the future.

[W2FCP]

My only big concern with already having a family is that I know if I am shipped to an area of conflict, they cannot go. BUT say I am sent to Germany for a year or two as many new recruits are; Can they go? Not only would it be a huge comfort having them close, but i think it would also be a great experience for my wife and children to partially live life in a foreign culture (especially being that both my wife's and my family are trace to german descent.)

Yes, if you get orders to somewhere like Germany they would pay for your family to come with you as long as they are command sponsored. There have been guys I know that got married after they got there initial assignment and they had to jump through hoops to get there family over with them.

[WA6MHZ]

Probably the biggest deterent from my son joining is that he can't bring his MOM along! WHO is going to wash his clothes, make his meals, Clean up his room, pay for his car accidents, pay for all his other bills?
He needs to enlist with his MOM, thats the only way!!!

[KB3RCL]

Yes, if you get orders to somewhere like Germany they would pay for your family to come with you as long as they are command sponsored. There have been guys I know that got married after they got there initial assignment and they had to jump through hoops to get there family over with them.

So I have heard. I was told they could go as well since I was married and such prior to enlistment. But I have heard horror stories of the military backing out on such deals. This is the single-most concern of mine.

Thank you for the prompt replies, btw.

[KB3RCL]

Probably the biggest deterent from my son joining is that he can't bring his MOM along! WHO is going to wash his clothes, make his meals, Clean up his room, pay for his car accidents, pay for all his other bills?
He needs to enlist with his MOM, thats the only way!!!

LOL, well if she is below the age of 42, SHE CAN. :p

[KD0FIN]

I added some more to my post above ^^^

[KD7PAB]

My recruiter was actually quite upfront on this issue. His recommendation was a two year enlistment they now offer just to be sure it was the life i wanted. Then of course I could always re-enlist later if I wanted to continue it. But as I said this is what i've wanted to do since my teens and was always deterred another way by one event or another.

If for no other reason other than financial consistency and knowing my family will always be covered medically, I'll make a career out of it. Especially knowing that if I enlist now, by the time I am 45-ish I can collect my pension and still work full-time on top of that if I wish. Granting even further security for my family in the future.I'd strongly consider a 2 or 4 year enlistment. 6 years is a really long time if it turns out to be something you don't want/like anymore. I respect the concern for your family's well being. I joined for the same reason. It ended up not being what I thought or wanted. It wasn't hard, I just hate bureaucracy and BS.

Have you taken the ASVAB yet? What are the enlistment bonuses being offered? Any sort of tech related MOS should fetch a good chunk of change. The problem is will they ever pay it. Let us know what the specific MOS's are, recruitment bonus and starting rank. You have a lot of power right now. You NEED to negotiate everything you want up front and in writing because once you're in, it's too late to ask for more money, etc.

[WA6MHZ]

Do they have an Army position for Washing Dogs? My son is qualified for that!

[KB3RCL]

I would be 100% sure you want to do 6 years straight out of the gate. By the time I hit 3 years I was itching to get out and be on my own again. Not to mention with a 4 year enlistment they will offer you large sums of money to re-enlist once your re-up window opens. If you get deployed (which is highly likely) you can re-enlist for the extra 2 years and get your bonus tax free.
Something to think about...

Edited to add: BTW as may already know recruiters are a bunch of back-stabbing theives, worse than used car salesmen. (Not neccesarily the recruiter himself but "counseler/advisor" at MEPPS is usually the worst one.) Not only will they screw you out of money, but also your life if you aren't careful. If they don't offer a large signing bonus or whatever else you're asking for don't hesitate to walk right out of MEPPS. They'll give you biggest speech/guilt trip about how you can't leave MEPPS once you've started the process blah, blah, blah, but they have no power over you at this stage. You're still a free civilian, they're the one stuck in the uniform, do what you want and they can't do a thing about it. Use it as a bargaining point and if they aren't hooking you up with the good stuff simply threaten to walk out of MEPPS and you'll begin to see them trying a little harder. If they still are trying to stick you with something you don't want or a crappy bonus walk out and tell them you're going to find a new recruiter etc. they'll give you another pity party/guilt trip speech but ignore them and either A) find a new recruiter, or B) just come back another day. If they see that you mean business and you know you're stuff and how they are supposed to work with you they probably try to get you what you need and not screw you. Granted not all recruiters are this way but just keep it mind. I thought I was getting a good deal with a $3000 bonus but when my buddy signed up a week later and got $25,000 (this was all for 11B MOS) I knew something was up. Also if you can work with the time, ask to be in the delayed entry program (DEP) as long as possible, or ask for a very late ship date. All your time in the DEP is time they take off the end of your 8 year inactive reserve commitment. If I think of anything I'll add it.

Another edit: Joining the Army with a family will be tough. The Army (at least the 82nd ABN, I can't speak for other units) loves to keep you at work as long as possible for stupid stuff. You will miss out on a lot of family time. It is good however that you'll have all the medical coverage etc. Just be ready for it and try your hardest to maintain your family or else it will fall apart. In my unit people were getting divorces left and right.

Commo jobs are pretty good jobs if you don't like "roughing" it too much. On our deployment commo guys rarely left the FOB and were in charge of fixing radios, computers, truck commo equipment, and distributing COMSEC and the like. They all had pretty regular schedules and had a pretty consistant life. Not to mention they all had the hook up with internet and cable TV because they are the ones in charge of all that. Combat engineers on the other hand are quite different. In my experience overseas they are in charge of most route clearance and IED clearing. They are always on call and were always heading out to blow up UXO, mines, IED's etc., they had a very irregular schedule and were pretty much on call 24/7. Blowing stuff up sounds fun until you have to do it for 15 months and the stress of irregular schedules/dangers/ etc will get to you, no way around it. Not to mention they were getting blown up themselves pretty much every week because their mine clearing vehicles ended up driving over more mines/IED than actually detecting any. I don't want to sound discouraging or anything, just want to make sure you're aware of what you're getting into.

Dont worry about sounding discouraging or whatnot as you are simply stating what i've already pondered. The info is both resourceful and appreciated. My brother has already tried to deter my away from combat engineer as thats what he originally signed-up for. Then again he is he gunner on a bradley now...where he gets it is any safer, I am not sure. lol.

[KB3RCL]

I'd strongly consider a 2 or 4 year enlistment. 6 years is a really long time if it turns out to be something you don't want/like anymore. I respect the concern for your family's well being. I joined for the same reason. It ended up not being what I thought or wanted. It wasn't hard, I just hate bureaucracy and BS.

Have you taken the ASVAB yet? What are the enlistment bonuses being offered? Any sort of tech related MOS should fetch a good chunk of change. The problem is will they ever pay it. Let us know what the specific MOS's are, recruitment bonus and starting rank. You have a lot of power right now. You NEED to negotiate everything you want up front and in writing because once you're in, it's too late to ask for more money, etc.

Originally they were tryign to use my old score; however, too much time has passed and from what i was just told moments ago I am to retake the test tomorrow. Though I have been reassured that based on my previous score of 91 and the score on my "practice" asvab (79) that I should not have a problem as long as i dont rush through the arithmetic as i did on the practice. The ASVAB I am not particularly concerned with. Though I am curious to see what MOS' is availible to me.

I will be sure to update on such and more after I know.

Again, thanks for the prompt replies everyone.


Do they have an Army position for Washing Dogs? My son is qualified for that!

Sadly...yes. Sorta. It's under a much more "desireable" name, of course. I believe it is listed as Veterinary Corps Officer and/or Animal Care Specialist.

[KB0YYO]

I was in the Army many years ago. Regret not making it a career.
If I had to do it again I would make a career of it but I think I would go Coast Guard.

Army, Marines stand in formation a LOT regardless of weather.
For the most part Coast Guard only for command change.

Navy is good too . Youngest son is Navy and he gets lots of Ship duty pay. He goes about every 18 months to B'hrain. His pay nearly doubles . Staying physically fit is his job. little emphasis on PT. He is in charge of a shop that repairs Helicopters in Norfolk VA
When gone it is for 6 months.

My friend was was stationed at Ft Riley KS ( here) 12 years Army, got tired of taking crap for underlings goofing off and went to the Coast Guard. Loved it. So does his family He got his river boat pilot license. Barge pilot license to 900,000lbs and made rank Like crazy Was stationed in VA..Family loves it too as chances of going to a war zone are less likely than Marines or Army.

Thank you for offering to serve. God Bless you and Gods speed.

[KD5ZPG]

I spent 6yrs in the Army as an officer at the company level.

Words of advise that I am sure you already know.............

Whatever the recruiter tells you..........if he doesn't put it word for word in writing on a piece of paper you have nothing........before you sign anything you must have his words in writing.


KD5ZPG

[KL7AJ]

So up until a few days ago I was working as an Aerial Torchman for a demolition company. Due to some trust issues with my employer and "the man" who contracted us, I told him to take the job and shove it.

So where do I find myself after a days worth of pondering of what to do about money and health benefits? The US Army Recruiting office.

Out of high school I wanted to join up and serve for a career. Many forks in the road later, I've finally found myself with the motivation to do so. With a wife, one child who just turned one year on the 8th, and another on the way I decided I was done chasing paychecks and drowning in medical debt.

While I have not been the most frequent tenant here on the zed I have enjoyed my stay. As such, I figured I would post this for those who frequent my PM box and my posts. Where I still have a bit before leaving I decided to post and fill-in recent events, regardless.

Tomorrow I am set to finish the enlistment process. After which I will have signed on for a 6 year term. My job within the army has yet to be decided. Though my recruiter is pushing for either a combat engineer (following my current knowledge and path of my younger brother), or as a radio operator/repairer.

The point of this aside from simply informing the community in which i socialize is this; How many people here have served in the Army, and do you have any advice on what to expect going in with an already established family?

Any responses are appreciated.

Probably the best choice you could have made...ESPECIALLY in economic time like this. I was never in the armed services, but have always been in support. Currently I work as a contractor at Eielson Air Force Base, was formerly State MARS Director for Alaska A.F. Mars, and am now in Navy/Marine MARS.

One thing you can say for certain....you will NEVER be unemployed in the military. Maybe this isn't a good thing...but for now, take advantage of it. Get all the training and advancement you can get....and if you're in electronics, you can't do any better (well, maybe in the the NAVY...hi).

If your family supports you, that's all that matters.

eric

[KL7AJ]

Do they have an Army position for Washing Dogs? My son is qualified for that!

I'm sure the K9 Corps is always in the market for dog washers.

[KI4GST]

If they wouldn't 4F me in a heart beat because of my eyes I would sign up ASAP. But that is the way it goes. My wife wouldn't like it but hey she would be taken care of. Shame they can't come up with a way for army to use people that can't be in the field do to disability to do office stuff. I don't think it is right that they can discriminate on disability since it is unlawfull for any one else to but oh well.

[KL7AJ]

I have to add that about 80% of the people working with me on the contract were former active duty, who left the air force to do something else....got re-hired doing almost EXACTLY the same jobs.....so it can't be all that bad!

I read somewhere that the MAJORITY of the high ranking officers in all the military services never intended to go that route...they joined up for "something to do" and never left. It could happen to you too!

Eric

[KD0FIN]

On another note unless you're 100% set on joining the Army the quality of life in the Air Force is much better than the Army. Ask anyone and they'll agree. Whoever mentioned the Navy or CoastGuard that is an excellent idea as well. The Army gets the dirty ground pounder work done but if your primary concern is taking care of your family the Army would be one of my last choices. There's idiots anywhere you go but it seems the Army has a pretty good collection going already.

And yet another idea: Pretty much any of the services will have you deployed in the next couple years anyway so why not go over as a civilian contractor and make more money with much less risk? There are plenty of contractors out there that will hire you for very good wages. Some of our civilian contractors that worked on our HMMWV's had no formal training (were just good with tools), got paid $105,000 (starting pay) yearly with medical benefits etc. and had something like a 5 week 9am-5pm schedule with 2 weeks off every 5 weeks. FWIW

[KB3LAZ]

So up until a few days ago I was working as an Aerial Torchman for a demolition company. Due to some trust issues with my employer and "the man" who contracted us, I told him to take the job and shove it.

So where do I find myself after a days worth of pondering of what to do about money and health benefits? The US Army Recruiting office.

Out of high school I wanted to join up and serve for a career. Many forks in the road later, I've finally found myself with the motivation to do so. With a wife, one child who just turned one year on the 8th, and another on the way I decided I was done chasing paychecks and drowning in medical debt.

While I have not been the most frequent tenant here on the zed I have enjoyed my stay. As such, I figured I would post this for those who frequent my PM box and my posts. Where I still have a bit before leaving I decided to post and fill-in recent events, regardless.

Tomorrow I am set to finish the enlistment process. After which I will have signed on for a 6 year term. My job within the army has yet to be decided. Though my recruiter is pushing for either a combat engineer (following my current knowledge and path of my younger brother), or as a radio operator/repairer.

The point of this aside from simply informing the community in which i socialize is this; How many people here have served in the Army, and do you have any advice on what to expect going in with an already established family?

Any responses are appreciated.

No, you cant leave me at home with our crazy family! Man I will go insane!! You, Tony, and Adam all in the military, I feel left out.

BTW you did not show up at grandpas last night, I had to watch the game with Jared.:(

HAHAH, you are calling me right now.

[WA6MHZ]

I'd like to go to Iraq, but I am deathly afraid of all the Scorpions and Camel Spiders!!!

[KE7VLC]

On another note unless you're 100% set on joining the Army the quality of life in the Air Force is much better than the Army. Ask anyone and they'll agree. Whoever mentioned the Navy or CoastGuard that is an excellent idea as well. The Army gets the dirty ground pounder work done but if your primary concern is taking care of your family the Army would be one of my last choices. There's idiots anywhere you go but it seems the Army has a pretty good collection going already.



And thats the reason why the Air Force's nick name is the Chair Force. I was in the USCG for 5 years and loved it. Not much on the way of military feeling, although you use the same protocols the Navy does but you don't get lost in the shuffle as much as the other branchs do. I was stationed at an air station for my last year in the service and that place was 1 24 hour duty day a month and the rest was 8 to 5 Monday through Friday and only Saturdays and Sundays being recall days if needed. I was right out of high school and it seemed as if they treated you more like an adult then a grunt. However, if you end up afloat then you will be out to sea almost half the year but it's not like the Navy in the way that it's usually for a few weeks at a time. I was on the Buoy Tender fleet and they rarely went overseas, and they spent about 2 weeks out 2 weeks in and in Alaska the scheduled time in port was 6am to 2pm Monday through Friday. Of course the downfall to a small crew was more duty time, basically 1 in 4. Thats every 4 days you spend 24 hours onboard as emergency crew, and typically it was just in case there was a fire or flooding onboard. Boot camp was 8 weeks in Cape May NJ and was not that hard, compared to the Army or Marines. Most of the training you get in the USCG relate to ocean going trades such as a deckhand, or navigation, or marine mechanics, or even law enforcement, Firemen, or EMT's. Plus there is the aviation side of the USCG and they typically are the best pilots (at least in Alaska they have to have tons of flight time in order to be stationed there).

I looked at the Army and it looked like the work they did was War and not much else. In the USCG the jobs seemed to be mostly law enforcement, Search and Rescue and Environmental protection, with Buoy work in the mix. I would go for either the USCG or the Air Force myself just because the jobs tend to fold over into the civilian side much easier.

[W4RLR]

Probably the biggest deterent from my son joining is that he can't bring his MOM along! WHO is going to wash his clothes, make his meals, Clean up his room, pay for his car accidents, pay for all his other bills?
He needs to enlist with his MOM, thats the only way!!! The drill instructors (or training instructors in Air Force speak) will have your son cured of that needing mommy thing in about two days. They will "instruct" him that they are not his mommy, his mommy does not live here, and he will have to start to tend to his own needs or have the wrath of 49 other guys falling on his head. When HE fails, the training unit fails with him.

He will learn the meanings of incentive and motivation. The difference between the two is explained "do your task quickly and efficiently and you will get a day pass = incentive." "do your task quickly and efficiently or you will do three days KP = motivation."

I went to college with people who could not live without mommy. I saw people in my training flight who could not live without mommy suddenly become independent after a "coming to Jesus meeting" with three TIs performed in front of the whole basic training flight.

[KE7VLC]

I was in the Army many years ago. Regret not making it a career.
If I had to do it again I would make a career of it but I think I would go Coast Guard.

Army, Marines stand in formation a LOT regardless of weather.
For the most part Coast Guard only for command change.

.

As an ex Coastie I have to agree that Coasties spend allot less time in formation. We do have morning muster and afternoon muster but mostly it's for infomational purposes only. We stand at semi-attention, meaning at attention but they wont yell at you for poping knuckles or snickering if something funny happens....and when we do it's for a few moments. I think the longest time I stood at attention was at boot camp graduation. I think that was for about 2 hours and allot of marching. Outside of boot camp not so much. At max even on change of commands we stood for maybe about an hour.

[WA6MHZ]

I can just see my son getting off the Bus at boot camp.

As the formation falls in, he steps up and raises his hand.

The annoyed DI (guess it is TI these days) says "WHAT??!!!!!!"

"Mister DI, err.. Your Honor..... How soon will it be until we get to SHOOT someone??..........."

HOW many pushups can he do??????

[W4RLR]

On another note unless you're 100% set on joining the Army the quality of life in the Air Force is much better than the Army. Ask anyone and they'll agree. Whoever mentioned the Navy or CoastGuard that is an excellent idea as well. The Army gets the dirty ground pounder work done but if your primary concern is taking care of your family the Army would be one of my last choices. There's idiots anywhere you go but it seems the Army has a pretty good collection going already.
FWIWHaving served in an Army unit for three years as an Air Force member, I can attest that the Air Force DOES treat its family members better. The housing is better. Even as a single airman, the food and the dormitory (NOT barracks) living was better. It's all a question of service tradition and culture.

General Curtis LeMay of Strategic Air Command, recognized throughout DoD as a world class hard a$$, knew that to keep a highly trained, technical fighting force effective, you had to provide for their needs, i.e. you take good care of the force, the force will take good care of you. He would do field promotions and demotions on the spot. To err was only human. To forgive was not SAC policy. But he made sure that SAC forces, and eventually the Air Force in general, were treated better than the average military man or woman.

That is why the Air Force has highly motivated troops who live in dorms instead of open bay barracks, who eat in award winning dining facilities (http://www.seebeecook.com/today/best/hennessy.htm) and bases that look a lot like corporate campuses.

Enlisted people in the Air Force are treated like mature adults instead of low-intelligence grunts. But chair force? You haven't been around today's Air Force. It's not the Air Force I was in, as there is an increased emphasis on weapons training, installation defense, and daily physical fitness. When I was in, you were responsible for your individual physical fitness, and only had to prove it once a year with a mile and a half run. I could walk the last half mile and still make it under the maximum time. A lot of my fellow zoomies did just that. The only time I picked up an M-16 was in basic training. The rest of my time I qualified with the 9mm sidearm.

You have to meet a certain intellectual standard to join the Air Force. They don't take just anyone. I found the opposite to be true with the Army. I liked the Army people I worked with, as public affairs people from all services went to the same technical school and you had to demonstrate a fair amount of smarts to get out of that school. The washout rate was over 50 percent when I went through the school house.

The Army is a good service, just different from what I experienced. They expected different things from their people, and being a blue suiter in a sea of Army green, I did clash with the culture every now and then. But my service took care of me even when I was in the Army wilderness, making sure that I was not completely assimilated by the Army Borg. :D

[W4RLR]

If they wouldn't 4F me in a heart beat because of my eyes I would sign up ASAP. But that is the way it goes. My wife wouldn't like it but hey she would be taken care of. Shame they can't come up with a way for army to use people that can't be in the field do to disability to do office stuff. I don't think it is right that they can discriminate on disability since it is unlawfull for any one else to but oh well. You wear the uniform, you have to be qualified to fight. Period. If your disability keeps you from fighting, you can't serve. I could do the job I was doing as a civilian, but not while in uniform. That's why I was medically retired. Other ailments discovered later made it practically impossible to be hired by a civilian firm. They don't want the drag on their medical insurance.

Discrimination has nothing to do with it. Physical ability does. If you lost your glasses in the heat of battle, the services don't want you to drag down the rest of your unit when you can't see the hand in front of your face.

[KB1LXF]

Also an ex-Coastie of 8 years and sometimes I do wish I stayed in for 20. Though military, if you are at a small unit, you don't have all the BS with the Big Brass, and most Coast Guard units are small. Think about it, a small boat SAR station might have 30 people and have an Senior enlisted Officer in Charge. Many small cutters might have one officer. However, there are many larger units, that the recruiters sometimes skip over. Large cutters, but unlike the Navy, we never went to sea for 6 months at a time. The ship I was stationed on usually had a 1 month in, 1 month out schedule.

The Coast Guard also had many non-war type missions, Search and Rescue, Port Safety, Ship Safety, HazMat, Aids to Navigation, Law Enforcement. The hours can be tough and the missions dangerous. One of the motto's for the Coast Guard is "they say you have to go out, but you don't have to come back". On what the Coast Guard calls a small boat (41 footer, 47 footer, or if your are an older Coastie, the old 44's) the crew is usually an 3 or 4 with an E-4 or E-5 as coxwain. Lots of responsibilities for young men and women and you will grow up very fast. You have to do your job and trust others to do theirs. You are not just a number or "cannon fodder" in the Coast Guard.



Marc
KB1LXF

[W2ZB]

Unless you are in a protected minority group, I always warn against joining any of the military services today. If you are not a member of one of the many protected minority groups, you will face continual reverse discrimination in today's U.S. military.

[W7KKK]

Just get what you want in writing my friend. And remember one thing, if you flunk out of a technical course you are still in the Army.
I served 6 years, and time as a Drill Sgt for the Army. I ran into many that recruiters told lies to get them to sign up.
Further, I am of the understanding that radio operators don't exist as a primary skill anymore. I was one and an instructor when I served.
Today a radio operator is just an additional duty assigned or so I have been told.

[W7KKK]

You wear the uniform, you have to be qualified to fight. Period. If your disability keeps you from fighting, you can't serve. I could do the job I was doing as a civilian, but not while in uniform. That's why I was medically retired. Other ailments discovered later made it practically impossible to be hired by a civilian firm. They don't want the drag on their medical insurance.

Discrimination has nothing to do with it. Physical ability does. If you lost your glasses in the heat of battle, the services don't want you to drag down the rest of your unit when you can't see the hand in front of your face.

That has been true for many years. In fact my Father tried to join any service doing anything at the start of WW II in 1941.
He had polio as a child and one leg did not grow like the other and they would not take him for any job or in any service.

[N6KIA]

Did a little US Army myself, 4 yrs in the early 70's. You will not regret it. The Military takes very good care of their own. If I had it to do all over again I would of stayed in until retirement. :)

73 de N6KIA
Ed
Former 1st Infantry Division

[W5KLB]

US Army-

Forwards: Uncle Sam Aint Released Me Yet

Backwards: Yes, My Retarded A$$ Signed Up

Navy: Never Again Volunteer Yourself.

USMC: Uncle Sam's Misguided Children

:D :D :D :D

[WA6MHZ]

My boy said he wasn't suitable for Military service because he has a GIMPY knee. Do they have military service for people in Wheelchairs? Seems like the ADA should have something to say about that! People who can't walk want to shoot people too! Actually I think he's flaky. He can walk alot better than me, and I don't use a walker or wheelchair! I walked the Chino Hills swapmeet for 2 hours last saturday. So I think he would pass the tests after all.

[WF7A]

My MOS in the Army was Morse Code Decryptographer (Is that a cool title or what?) and it required a Top Secret security clearance. Unfortunately, due to a hearing defect, I was booted out before I could serve, even though I aced the test to get in. Rats! To this day I regret not being able to serve...especially with all the benefits that come with, and after, employment.

It's a good deal--go for it and make the best of it!

[KD0FIN]

From the sounds of it the Coast Guard is pretty legit. Sure, shooting, blowing up stuff, and doing nighttime helicopter inserts can be fun but you get burnt out after a few years in Army. We would laugh at AF, Navy, CG etc. in the Army but I think down deep we were just jealous because their life sucked a lot less than ours.

[N7WR]

Thank you for volunteering to serve. Wish you a safe 6 years with Uncle Sam. God Bless.

[AC2GM]

Further, I am of the understanding that radio operators don't exist as a primary skill anymore. I was one and an instructor when I served.
Today a radio operator is just an additional duty assigned or so I have been told.


Look at the 31, 36 and 29 series MOS's...all comms...

[W2ZB]

So up until a few days ago I was working as an Aerial Torchman for a demolition company. Due to some trust issues with my employer and "the man" who contracted us, I told him to take the job and shove it.

So where do I find myself after a days worth of pondering of what to do about money and health benefits? The US Army Recruiting office.

Out of high school I wanted to join up and serve for a career. Many forks in the road later, I've finally found myself with the motivation to do so. With a wife, one child who just turned one year on the 8th, and another on the way I decided I was done chasing paychecks and drowning in medical debt.

While I have not been the most frequent tenant here on the zed I have enjoyed my stay. As such, I figured I would post this for those who frequent my PM box and my posts. Where I still have a bit before leaving I decided to post and fill-in recent events, regardless.

Tomorrow I am set to finish the enlistment process. After which I will have signed on for a 6 year term. My job within the army has yet to be decided. Though my recruiter is pushing for either a combat engineer (following my current knowledge and path of my younger brother), or as a radio operator/repairer.

The point of this aside from simply informing the community in which i socialize is this; How many people here have served in the Army, and do you have any advice on what to expect going in with an already established family?

Any responses are appreciated.



You would have done better joining the Navy CBs.
Why in the world did you enlist for six years?

[W6VPS]

Look at the 31, 36 and 29 series MOS's...all comms...

Take a peak at the current Enlisted MOS list for the SIgnal Corps....boy have things changed...

http://www.us-army-info.com/pages/mos/signal/signal-mos.html

Paul/W6VPS

[W8ZNX]

haven't the time to read all the postings
a bit of advice from a Nam Vet

some timely tips for basic training

when standing in line
you do not want to be
near the front or the back of the line

its easier to march in the middle of a formation

do as your told

do not asume anything

try to always look busy
even when you are not

NCO's hate to see idle troops

do not volunteer
" im not talking taking some hill "

am talking some Sgt walks in
and says he is looking for somebody that knows
about radio antenas

you say im your man
you spend the next 12 hours
stacking tower sections while your buddies

getting what they need to do done

learn to deal with hurry up and wait

also

with in a week of showing up

you will hear from troops in cycles ahead of you

everybody ready for the line every new troop has heard













" YOULL BE SORRY "

good luck

mac

[KA5S]

My recruiter was actually quite upfront on this issue. His recommendation was a two year enlistment they now offer just to be sure it was the life i wanted. Then of course I could always re-enlist later if I wanted to continue it. But as I said this is what i've wanted to do since my teens and was always deterred another way by one event or another.

If for no other reason other than financial consistency and knowing my family will always be covered medically, I'll make a career out of it. Especially knowing that if I enlist now, by the time I am 45-ish I can collect my pension and still work full-time on top of that if I wish. Granting even further security for my family in the future.

I'm another retired Lifer.

Family medical care is not "always" but only while you are serving, or retired for length of service, and only as available and funded for. Congress has been known to turn off funding altogether while they wrangle over whether we got new weapons and pay, or to spend money on a voting bloc.

While I agree about the wisdom of starting with a shorter term enlistment, I did re-up after running away and signing up for 3 (in 1962) and kept reenlisting until I had to retire to take care of my son.

Good luck!

Cortland
KA5S

[KB0YYO]

w8znx hit the nail on the head. You do not volunteer. Period
volunteering does not impress anyone, It does not get you out of dirty details.
Someone will do the job even if you do not volunteer.

While in basic training the NCO wanted to know if anyone could type.? Since I had a summer school course in typing I figured , why not. and it would not be as hard as the policing detail where you pick it up or paint it green, I raised my hand high. Yo sarge.

Needless to say it was not what I expected. I pondered it as I unloaded a truck load of typewriters.

[W4RLR]

I'm sure the K9 Corps is always in the market for dog washers.
No, the dog handlers wash their own military working dogs. It promotes esprit de corps.:D

Not that we didn't ask when the wife opened up her mobile pet grooming business. A government contract would have been sweet!

[K9YLI]

Army Security and Intelligence agency.
ASIA.. used to be just ASA.
Non combatant. you get to be a tech-no-geek, learn lots of trouble shooting techniques, play with expensive electronics..
I worked 6 and 2 straight eves for 24 months.
Learned the mechanics of teletypes. lots of phone line information.

I had to learn to trouble shoot a communicatin line when there was NO alternate communication line.

"from deep in the heart of africa comes the battle cry of the ASA,
retreat !hell! backspace........"

[AA5TE]

I served in the Navy for about 5 years, and I've got 2 nephews who just got out of Army boot camp. If you want to spend more time with your family instead of staying late to clean the barracks, I'd strongly recommend looking at the Coast Guard or the Air Force instead of the others. My guess would be that the Coast Guard would be more interesting...

[W7KKK]

In the Army they call that training Basic, or BCT, which stands for Basic Combat Training.
I always wondered why the Navy called it Boot Camp?

[KL7AJ]

I served in the Navy for about 5 years, and I've got 2 nephews who just got out of Army boot camp. If you want to spend more time with your family instead of staying late to clean the barracks, I'd strongly recommend looking at the Coast Guard or the Air Force instead of the others. My guess would be that the Coast Guard would be more interesting...

Coast Guard= Shallow Water Sailors :)

[KB9BVN]

Unless you are in a protected minority group, I always warn against joining any of the military services today. If you are not a member of one of the many protected minority groups, you will face continual reverse discrimination in today's U.S. military.

BULL-LONEY

[AA5TE]

In the Army they call that training Basic, or BCT, which stands for Basic Combat Training.
I always wondered why the Navy called it Boot Camp?

Because it's all about shining your boots, and folding the things correctly that you can use to shine your boots, and marching so that you don't scuff your boots, and learning the history behind shiny boots, and stenciling your name correctly onto your boots, and stenciling your name correctly onto the things you can use to shine your boots, and so on and so forth...

[KL7AJ]

Because it's all about shining your boots, and folding the things correctly that you can use to shine your boots, and marching so that you don't scuff your boots, and learning the history behind shiny boots, and stenciling your name correctly onto your boots, and stenciling your name correctly onto the things you can use to shine your boots, and so on and so forth...


And if you screw up, you get the Seargent's boot in your "left behind."

That's their concept of "No Child Left Behind." :)

[KB3RCL]

Well unfortunately my old high school asvab score was too old. so yesterday i had to go and retake the test. over the last 7-8 years it has changed much. but ironically my score was exactly the same as in high school.

tomorrow night i go to stay in moon township for my MEPS review on friday. After which I still need to attend the army preparatory school since i do not have my diploma.

after which i can then choose my MOS. Currently I am looking into MP, Multimedia Illustrator, and Aircraft Electrician. Anyone have any experience with these specific MOS'?

Unfortunately being that i have to go through the army to get my diploma not all jobs are available to me. Out of the 110 jobs my ASVAB score qualified me for I have the pick of about 60. Not too bad though. I can handle that.

Thanks to everyone for the responses it has been a learning experience reading all of your own journeys. Please do keep them coming.

[W2ZB]

BULL-LONEY


Sorry, it is true in today's military services.

[KC9JWA]

Go, rcl, good choice , hope works well for u and family, hope out of all, u def always make it, just post so we know its all good.:D:)

[KB3RCL]

Well here's an update for those who asked for it.

It is official. RCL is in the army now. Enlistment for 6 years active duty. MOS 68W, Medical (Health Care) Specialist, and to be assigned to an airborne unit upon BCT, AIT, and Airborne training. $10K Enlistment bonus and further incentives amounting to an additional $60K and the GI bill for up to $70K.

32 Weeks and 4 days in training at the following:

Jackson, Benning, Sam Houston, and back to Benning

Shipping out Feb. 10th 2009

I think that covers all the updates that were asked for...am I forgetting anything?

Thanks again to all who answered questions and related personal experiences.

[W6VPS]

Anyone have any experience with these specific MOS'?



I trained at Fort Rucker, Alabama as a basic aircraft mechanic for both fixed and rotor wing aircraft. (Maytag Messerschmidts & Fling Wing Death Traps)
I then cross trained in my unit via OJT as a basic avionics tech) I can highly recommend either MOS. The exact same ones no longer exist as I knew them but looking at the EM's MOS list there are some which are still very close. The beauty of these jobs is that you are generally left alone to do your work and not hassled. This is because you have a special skill. Doesn't mean you might not have to drop the wrenches or test gear and use your M-16 but the job was a heck of a lot better than being a regular grunt.
By the way my avatar is the patch for the 6th army which was decommissioned many years ago. Good luck and thanks for your willingness to serve.
You've gotten good advice about basic. Remember...button the lip...stay in the middle of the crowd, do not volunteer and do what your told without question. You'll be fine.
Paul/W6VPS

[WB3JLA]

LETTER ON WHETHER TO BECOME AN AIR FORCE PILOT OR A NAVAL AVIATOR

The piece is written by Bob Norris, a former Naval Aviator who also did a 3 year exchange tour flying the F-15 Eagle. He is now an accomplished author of entertaining books about U.S. Naval Aviation including "Check Six"
and
"Fly-Off".

In response to a letter from an aspiring fighter pilot on which military academy to attend, Bob replied with the following:

Young Man,

Congratulations on your selection to both the Naval and Air Force Academies.
Your goal of becoming a fighter pilot is impressive and a fine way to serve your country. As you requested, I'd be happy to share some insight into which service would be the best choice. Each service has a distinctly different culture. You need to ask yourself "Which one am I more likely to thrive in?"

USAF Snapshot:

The USAF is exceptionally well organized and well run. Their training programs are terrific. All pilots are groomed to meet high standards for knowledge and professionalism. Their aircraft are top-notch and extremely well maintained. Their facilities are excellent. Their enlisted personnel are the brightest and the best trained. The USAF is homogenous and macro.
No matter where you go, you'll know what to expect, what is expected of you, and you'll be given the training & tools you need to meet those expectations.
You will never be put in a situation over your head. Over a 20-year career, you will be home for most important family events. Your Mom would want you to be an Air Force pilot...so would your wife. Your Dad would want your sister to marry one.

Navy Snapshot:

Aviators are part of the Navy, but so are Black Shoes (surface warfare) and Bubble Heads (submariners). Furthermore, the Navy is split into two distinctly different Fleets (West and East Coast). The Navy is heterogeneous and micro. Your squadron is your home; it may be great, average, or awful.
A squadron can go from one extreme to the other before you know it. You will spend months preparing for cruise and months on cruise. The quality of the aircraft varies directly with the availability of parts. Senior Navy enlisted are salt of the earth; you'll be proud if you earn their respect.
Junior enlisted vary from terrific to the troubled kid the judge made join the service. You will be given the opportunity to lead these people during your career; you will be humbled and get your hands dirty. The quality of your training will vary and sometimes you will be over your head. You will miss many important family events. There will be long stretches of tedious duty aboard ship. You will fly in very bad weather and/or at night and you will be scared many times. You will fly with legends in the Navy and they will kick your ass until you become a lethal force. And some days - when the scheduling Gods have smiled upon you, your jet will catapult into a glorious morning over a far-away sea and you will be drop-jawed that someone would pay you to do this! The hottest girl in the bar wants to meet the Naval Aviator.
That bar is in Singapore!

Bottom line, son , if you gotta ask...pack warm & good luck in Colorado!
Banzai

P.S.: Air Force pilots wear scarves and iron their flight suits.
P.P.S. And oh yes, the Army pilot program; don't even think about it unless you got a pair bigger than basketballs! Those guys are crazy!!

MY AMP SITE (http://www.geocities.com/insp/SUPRO6420.html)

[W4HAY]

Congratulations and thank you for your service to our country!

[KC9FSH]

Congrats on signing up! I have many friends who are in the various branches of the military but the majority of them are in the Army. Just hope are you aren't at Fort Jackson during the summer months. I went to one of my buddies graduations at the end of May last year and the temps and humidity were horrible down there.

[W2ZB]

LETTER ON WHETHER TO BECOME AN AIR FORCE PILOT OR A NAVAL AVIATOR


Bottom line, son , if you gotta ask...pack warm & good luck in Colorado!
Banzai

P.S.: Air Force pilots wear scarves and iron their flight suits.
P.P.S. And oh yes, the Army pilot program; don't even think about it unless you got a pair bigger than basketballs! Those guys are crazy!!

MY AMP SITE (http://www.geocities.com/insp/SUPRO6420.html)



There's something special that cannot be said about other military pilots for a pilot who can land a high-performance jet fighter at night on the deck of a rolling and pitching postage stamp!

[W4MAJ]

I've been at a loss of words as what to say, so I guess I'll just say good luck. Just make sure you use your education benefits when you get out. That's one benefit a lot of servicemembers enlist for and then forget about when they are discharged.

[K7IWH]

Congratulations ! 68W is a mighty fine MOS.
Thank you for enlisting in the US Army. Good luck, see you on the high ground. TJ K7IWH.

[W7IBI]

Wish my son would take a trip to the Recruiter. That is his ONLY HOPE of getting a job. And then, if he signs up for IRAQ, he can get to SHOOT PEOPLE just like he enjoys so much doing in his video games. He will be very trigger happy there, shooting anything that moves. Nothing like the adrenalin burst from firing a machine gun!!! So, I heartily encourage him to join! Then he can LIVE his dreams!

A trigger happy jerk is exactly what we don't need in the military! We read about them every now and then in the press and all the embarrassment they cause the U.S.

Best wishes to you in the military. I enjoyed my tour in the Navy back in the early to mid 60's.

[W7KKK]

Almost funny, that's exactly what they wanted in Viet Nam, an got via the draft.
It' my understanding we fired more munitions in RVN that any war, period.
But then again that whole war was senseless to start with.

[W2ZB]

A trigger happy jerk is exactly what we don't need in the military! We read about them every now and then in the press and all the embarrassment they cause the U.S.

Best wishes to you in the military. I enjoyed my tour in the Navy back in the early to mid 60's.


What you really wanted to say is we read the distorted and untruthful stories that the liberal left liars in the biased media write about our men & women in the armed forces.

[W2ZB]

Almost funny, that's exactly what they wanted in Viet Nam, an got via the draft.
It' my understanding we fired more munitions in RVN that any war, period.
But then again that whole war was senseless to start with.


You claim to have served in the U.S. Army, yet you just spit in the face of tens of thousands of your fellow vets who served in Viet Nam honorably and believed we DID accomplish something.

[W7KKK]

I don't spit in any vet's face.
But the fact remains I have a right to my opinion and I thought the war served no purpose.
Unlike many, I served my time and earned the right to voice my opinion about it.

[W2ZB]

I don't spit in any vet's face.
But the fact remains I have a right to my opinion and I thought the war served no purpose.
Unlike many, I served my time and earned the right to voice my opinion about it.


Keep back pedaling.

[W7KKK]

Why don't you drop down and pray about it for all the good it will do you.

[G3HGE]

So up until a few days ago I was working as an Aerial Torchman for a demolition company. Due to some trust issues with my employer and "the man" who contracted us, I told him to take the job and shove it.

So where do I find myself after a days worth of pondering of what to do about money and health benefits? The US Army Recruiting office.

Out of high school I wanted to join up and serve for a career. Many forks in the road later, I've finally found myself with the motivation to do so. With a wife, one child who just turned one year on the 8th, and another on the way I decided I was done chasing paychecks and drowning in medical debt.

While I have not been the most frequent tenant here on the zed I have enjoyed my stay. As such, I figured I would post this for those who frequent my PM box and my posts. Where I still have a bit before leaving I decided to post and fill-in recent events, regardless.

Tomorrow I am set to finish the enlistment process. After which I will have signed on for a 6 year term. My job within the army has yet to be decided. Though my recruiter is pushing for either a combat engineer (following my current knowledge and path of my younger brother), or as a radio operator/repairer.

The point of this aside from simply informing the community in which i socialize is this; How many people here have served in the Army, and do you have any advice on what to expect going in with an already established family?

Any responses are appreciated.

Just a couple of tips . Do not lend money to a fellow recruit ; he may be posted elswhere PDQ . Avoid talking in the john , you never know who is in trap one . Always remember , drill sergeants are as thick as planks . Good luck , you may need it .