View Full Version : Obama National School System???
N4VGB
06-04-2008, 03:38 AM
Besides his normal pactice of being all things to all people in his speech tonight, Obama said something that grabbed my attention. Apparently Obama is none too happy with the public school system!? Says he's going to hire an army of new teachers and pay them more than the present teachers??? I didn't know a President could operate/control any school system??? :eek:
So either it's more of his pure BS or the old boy intends to federalize the public schools of America? :confused:
Besides his normal pactice of being all things to all people in his speech tonight, Obama said something that grabbed my attention. Apparently Obama is none too happy with the public school system!? Says he's going to hire an army of new teachers and pay them more than the present teachers??? I didn't know a President could operate/control any school system??? :eek:
So either it's more of his pure BS or the old boy intends to federalize the public schools of America? :confused:
If you think a federal Dept. of Education is beyond the bounds of the Constitution, just wait. Far left socialist Obama will attempt to create an ever reaching socialist state rivaling anything in the modern world. His demogaugery thus far represents change... a purposefully vague message devoid of specifics. It's similarly lacking in depth and scope as are his experience and resume. Of what little is known of his record, background, and associations describes one far-left loony.
N4VGB
06-04-2008, 05:30 AM
http://forums.qrz.com/showthread.php?t=164733
Maybe he's going to turn the operation of the U.S. schools over to Trinity? Since we've already paid Trinity $15 million in our tax dollars. You'll note there is not a single response from the Obama camp on here to my new thread on this subject. Wonder if every Senator in the U.S. has their church on the U.S. taxpayers back? :)
W4DFW
06-04-2008, 05:37 AM
http://forums.qrz.com/showthread.php?t=164733
You'll note there is not a single response from the Obama camp on here to my new thread on this subject.
I did note that!
It's OK to DAMN AMERICA as long as the Guv'ment gives you millions of dollars!!
Freekin' hypocrite that Wright is . . .
Besides his normal pactice of being all things to all people in his speech tonight, Obama said something that grabbed my attention. Apparently Obama is none too happy with the public school system!? Says he's going to hire an army of new teachers and pay them more than the present teachers??? I didn't know a President could operate/control any school system??? :eek:
So either it's more of his pure BS or the old boy intends to federalize the public schools of America? :confused:
This one is too easy. Of course Uncle Sugar can, because they already do. All school districts get our money, doled out be the Fed, based on the attendance measured in the first 45 days of the school year. Since the schools are addicted to this money, they do what they are told. Same as our highway funds are used as a brickbat on the States.
So either it's more of his pure BS or the old boy intends to federalize the public schools of America? :confused:
Four words - No Child Left Behind.
Oh wait, that was Bush, wasn't it?
Four words - No Child Left Behind.
Oh wait, that was Bush, wasn't it?
That was by no means the start. You gotta go back to the Kennedy administration, and perhaps earlier.
kf6rdn
06-04-2008, 06:41 PM
...
You'll note there is not a single response from the Obama camp on here to my new thread on this subject.
...
IS there an obama camp here? I havent heard too many that like him, even amongst the liberal fellows.
That was by no means the start. You gotta go back to the Kennedy administration, and perhaps earlier.
Correct, but I'm just sayin' it doesn't start with Obama.
n2ize
06-04-2008, 08:09 PM
Obama is going to do all sorts of wonderful things. But nobody has the vaguest idea how... :confused::confused::eek:
Obama is going to do all sorts of wonderful things. But nobody has the vaguest idea how... :confused::confused::eek:
And hillary can do it better just because she's a woman. :rolleyes:
N9MOQ
06-04-2008, 08:54 PM
. .
wa8rti
06-04-2008, 11:20 PM
Will Obama's education ideas be any worst than the unfunded mandates that Bush's NCLB imposed on the schools???? But then the right only sees problems when questionable suggestions come from the left. Those from the right side must, by the nature of their source, be correct and never questioned. Heaven forbid that anyone should point out the problems created by No Child Left Behind. :D
Will Obama's education ideas be any worst than the unfunded mandates that Bush's NCLB imposed on the schools???? But then the right only sees problems when questionable suggestions come from the left. Those from the right side must, by the nature of their source, be correct and never questioned. Heaven forbid that anyone should point out the problems created by No Child Left Behind. :D
So, what problems do you have with "No Child Left Behind"? Since we do have downward directed, federal Dept of Education, please voice your problems with it's standards attainment and uniform testing -- testing that requires all students and public schools meet minimum education standards in reading comprehension, writing, and mathematics.
Personally, I would like to see the Dept of Education disappear. I'd like to see where creation of this federal department is authorized or legal under the Constitution and federal obligation. I'd also like to see the NEA disappear, too.
Like all of this is going happen...
K8YZK
06-04-2008, 11:50 PM
Wait, you will only have to know what way east is.
N4VGB
06-05-2008, 02:01 AM
Heaven forbid that anyone should point out the problems created by No Child Left Behind. :D
A list of those problems would be enlightening! :rolleyes:
A list of those problems would be enlightening! :rolleyes:
Teaching to pass tests versus a real education. That's the biggest issue.
Penalizing underperforming students. We should be taking remedial action and encouraging them, or finding their talents in which they can excel. Not everyone excels at academic subjects, not everyone wants to go to college, not everyone wants to follow the same career path.
Penalizing gifted, talented, and high performing students - Since schools are required to teach to pass standardized tests, gifted students are actually left behind because school budgets often don't have money for gifted education programs.
NCLB focuses mostly on math and English - a well rounded education requires FAR more than that.
No local control. We have 50 states for a reason. One size does NOT fit all.
I can go on and on and on, but these are some of the BIG problems with it, and why it will lead to a collossal FAILURE of the education system.
N4VGB
06-05-2008, 03:54 AM
Teaching to pass tests versus a real education. That's the biggest issue.
Penalizing underperforming students. We should be taking remedial action and encouraging them, or finding their talents in which they can excel. Not everyone excels at academic subjects, not everyone wants to go to college, not everyone wants to follow the same career path.
Penalizing gifted, talented, and high performing students - Since schools are required to teach to pass standardized tests, gifted students are actually left behind because school budgets often don't have money for gifted education programs.
NCLB focuses mostly on math and English - a well rounded education requires FAR more than that.
No local control. We have 50 states for a reason. One size does NOT fit all.
I can go on and on and on, but these are some of the BIG problems with it, and why it will lead to a collossal FAILURE of the education system.
No "shop classes" in NJ for the under achievers? No multiple study paths in NJ, general education, business and college prep? No separate schools for the "gifted, talented, and high performing students" with advanced abilities in NJ? How about a separate school for the arts, no encouragment or money to support music, theater or art in NJ? Gee, our "lousy" TN public schools have all these locally!
Plus for the truly gifted students, there are 2 local private schools that offer plenty of scholarships to even those who can't afford the cost.
Guess we'll need to really work to catch up to New Jersey? :confused::D
Teaching to pass tests versus a real education. That's the biggest issue.
Penalizing underperforming students. We should be taking remedial action and encouraging them, or finding their talents in which they can excel. Not everyone excels at academic subjects, not everyone wants to go to college, not everyone wants to follow the same career path.
Penalizing gifted, talented, and high performing students - Since schools are required to teach to pass standardized tests, gifted students are actually left behind because school budgets often don't have money for gifted education programs.
NCLB focuses mostly on math and English - a well rounded education requires FAR more than that.
No local control. We have 50 states for a reason. One size does NOT fit all.
I can go on and on and on, but these are some of the BIG problems with it, and why it will lead to a collossal FAILURE of the education system.
Ah yes... passing students on to the next grade level, those who fail miserably due in part to unmotivated, unionized teachers not doing a respectable job or executing a morally respected effort, is an all-too-often and disgraceful public school reality today. Standards testing addresses aspects of this issue. Standards and rightful level attainment law leaves no child behind. And rightfully so, those who are identified as falling below these minimum required levels should receive additional attention that brings them up-to-grade.
It's the Libs that have melded gifted Johnny and slow-reader Sue with the average kids in classrooms. For the liberal educators and the likes of the NEA, doing otherwise would discriminate between students, causing kids to realize they're different -- separating those smarter & capable of greater challenges kids beyond the standards laid down, from the majority who are not quite as capable. For the Libs, it's all about not hurting the fragile feelings, therefore they won't allow graduated or differing levels of education -- the "right and moral" kind that meets the demands and capabilities of the kids presented.
Separation of reading levels, gifted children, etc. worked in my day -- the 70's. In fact, I believe it caused a great many average kids to try harder -- to realize there were differences between them -- to realize that rising above mediocrity could be better for them in the long run.
Yes, we are not created equal in classrooms. The earlier we instill differentiation and a willingness or desire to succeed, rather than fail, which should remain the reality in every classroom, the better our kids will be.
KI6DCB
06-05-2008, 04:11 AM
Obama is going to do all sorts of wonderful things. But nobody has the vaguest idea how... :confused::confused::eek:
Or what. Or to whom. Or...
When asked what the change is that he keeps talking about, Obama said, "We need to become a nation of hope." When asked what we should hope for, he said, "Change." ;-) While the story might be apocryphal, he really is a vacuous idiot. Affirmative Action at its zenith.
KI6DCB
06-05-2008, 04:17 AM
So, what problems do you have with "No Child Left Behind"? Since we do have downward directed, federal Dept of Education, please voice your problems with it's standards attainment and uniform testing -- testing that requires all students and public schools meet minimum education standards in reading comprehension, writing, and mathematics.
Personally, I would like to see the Dept of Education disappear. I'd like to see where creation of this federal department is authorized or legal under the Constitution and federal obligation. I'd also like to see the NEA disappear, too.
Like all of this is going happen...
"No Child Left Behind" has become the classic left-wing solution to a problem that exists only in that not everyone is alike. It has become "No Child Gets Ahead" or worse. As long as we keep forcing everyone to converge upon the mean and keep moving the mean downward so that no one feels inadequate, everybody should be happy.
Wait... There are still some who are unhappy? We need more money, broader scope, and greater enforcement power! Yeah...THAT'S the ticket!
"No Child Left Behind" has become the classic left-wing solution to a problem that exists only in that not everyone is alike. It has become "No Child Gets Ahead" or worse. As long as we keep forcing everyone to converge upon the mean and keep moving the mean downward so that no one feels inadequate, everybody should be happy.
Wait... There are still some who are unhappy? We need more money, broader scope, and greater enforcement power! Yeah...THAT'S the ticket!
So right you are. Kids' learning abilities and capabilities sport a vast range. Lumping them together, all the time, does a disservice to them all.
It's a shame that our kids must suffer under today's liberal educators. Differentiation driving specialized curriculum and attention would better service future generations. The dumbing down continues...
I can speak to this subject with passion after growing up with parents as educators, and the fact I have two of my three kids in grade school right now. I'm experienced and knowledgeable about what happens behind the scenes from dedicated parent-teachers who served most positions in elementary education -- all grades K through 6th, Librarian, and as a Reading Specialist.
w2amr
06-05-2008, 07:18 AM
Wow, look at you giving the linkbot a run for his money. Good job buddy.
n2ize
06-05-2008, 08:10 AM
After reading some of the moronic, uninformed postings regarding education in this thread I think the government is going to need to create a Department of Stupid.
N5NPO
06-05-2008, 10:35 AM
After reading some of the moronic, uninformed postings regarding education in this thread I think the government is going to need to create a Department of Stupid.
It is named "The Dept. of Education". It was created by Jimmy Carter. He was our 39th President. Since the dept. of education was formed, education has improved drastically in this country. Especially since the late 50's and early 60's.
It is named "The Dept. of Education". It was created by Jimmy Carter. He was our 39th President. Since the dept. of education was formed, education has improved drastically in this country. Especially since the late 50's and early 60's.
Oh, you really know how to stick it to him!
N5NPO
06-05-2008, 11:33 AM
Oh, you really know how to stick it to him!
John will come up with something witty and factual to counter. If I were to guess, something along the line of Reagan gutted and cut their budget etc...
K8YZK
06-05-2008, 12:21 PM
It is named "The Dept. of Education". It was created by Jimmy Carter. He was our 39th President. Since the dept. of education was formed, education has improved drastically in this country. Especially since the late 50's and early 60's.
Really it has improved? From what I have read the number of college grad's in science, math are down and below the quality level of other countries? So what are they getting a degree in finger painting.
Dept of Education is a joke. You can't say Johnny failed anymore because it might hurt his feelings, so he just didn't meet the requirements and to hold one back in the grade again, oh no, mommy and dad won't like that, so have to please them also. Classes are now taught at the level of the lowest holding back those that are advanced instead of a median level.
I liked Jimmy Carter as President as he came in on the heals of Nam and Watergate, but he did make some bone headed calls, and DoE is one of them, as it seemed that education was having no problems for the hundreds of years prior to it.
wa8rti
06-05-2008, 01:06 PM
A list of those problems would be enlightening! :rolleyes:
The biggest I have heard of is that the law set requirements but provided no funding to meet them. Don't you think it strange that a group that says Federal regulations on industy, on the environment, etc. are too restrictive but had no problem dictating rules to local schools. That had been an area that was mostly left to local and state control. I am also puzzled by the comment that NCLB is a 'classic left wing solution". Strange since it was the work of a Republican president and a Republican controlled Congress.
N4VGB
06-05-2008, 06:56 PM
The biggest I have heard of is that the law set requirements but provided no funding to meet them. Don't you think it strange that a group that says Federal regulations on industy, on the environment, etc. are too restrictive but had no problem dictating rules to local schools. That had been an area that was mostly left to local and state control. I am also puzzled by the comment that NCLB is a 'classic left wing solution". Strange since it was the work of a Republican president and a Republican controlled Congress.
All public schools are federally funded. Public schools should be left totally up to the local school system. Carter may have had the best of intentions when he started the Dept. of Ed. but like most bureaucracies, it has gone astray. Local elected officials are much more under the direct control of their constituents and have more contact and understanding of the locals than anyone in D.C. ;)
Really it has improved? From what I have read the number of college grad's in science, math are down and below the quality level of other countries? So what are they getting a degree in finger painting.
Dept of Education is a joke. You can't say Johnny failed anymore because it might hurt his feelings, so he just didn't meet the requirements and to hold one back in the grade again, oh no, mommy and dad won't like that, so have to please them also. Classes are now taught at the level of the lowest holding back those that are advanced instead of a median level.
I liked Jimmy Carter as President as he came in on the heals of Nam and Watergate, but he did make some bone headed calls, and DoE is one of them, as it seemed that education was having no problems for the hundreds of years prior to it.
Like usual, NPO was being facetious.
kg4kww
06-05-2008, 08:00 PM
In the Obama National School System all girls will be required to wear burkas.
In the Obama National School System all girls will be required to wear burkas.
Plaid would be out; black in! :eek::rolleyes:
kb9xn
06-09-2008, 03:17 PM
Don't try to connect me to the Obama camp. I would never consider voting for a Mus..... no matter how much he claims to love America