View Full Version : Illegal Immigration and the costs
Within the last two weeks locally we have had 3 overloaded vans (mostly stolen) crash and roll due to being severely overloaded with illegal immigrants. All of these vans had 19-22 people in them and many were killed and injured.
Now a larger pickup truck has crashed near Tucson and witnesses say that there were near 60 in that truck. Again many killed and injured. The truck was stolen out of CA.
Guess who pays for the medical treatments and burials of these people? Taxpayers that's who.
This is getting worse every year here in AZ and something has to be done.
And if you think your gas bill is bad what do you thing the Border Patrol and other related agencies are spending?
And that's just part of it. Larger and larger drug shipments are being found every day in the SE area of AZ.
This country has got to do something about sealing it's borders. We cannot afford not to.
And the only candidate for president I have heard say anything about this at all so far is McCain. He says he has a plan.
Of course as a senior senator from AZ he knows well the problem.
I wrote to him and told him if he has such a great plan that he should introduce it in the Senate now. I did not get an answer from his offices of course.
Just telling you what you want to hear, that's all. Just more lip service.
Illegal immigration has been a problem in the southwest for decades and few if any elected officials really care. Now it has become an extended problem in all parts of the country...and few if any elected officals really care. Our elected officials have succumbed to the politically correct posture of not wanting to "offend" the Mexican-American community. While the majority of illegals may be from Mexico they are not the only ones coming her illegally. As pointed out on QRZ in the past many are coming from other countries not for peaceful reasons but to ply their violent criminal enterprise in this "land of opportunity". As but one example, MS-13 which is a violent drug distributing street gang from El Salvador.
It is not just elected officials who are gutless on this issue. As a retired Chief of Police (from the "southwest") I can say for a fact that the majority of so-called law enforcement leaders today are shirking their responsibilities on this issue. Local law enforcement can legally assist ICE in enforcing immigration law violations. Most choose not to because police chiefs and sheriffs (not all, but most) are afraid of the political consequences. When I came into the business and when I completed my graduate degree in police administration I was taught that our ethical responsibility was to do what was right, not what was politically expedient. I know of top cops who adhered to that even though it may have cost them their jobs. Today almost no one will stand up and do what needs to be done because of potential consequences. After all, "it's all about me".
IMO by the time this country wakes up it will be too late. Illegal immigration is killing our economy, driving up violent crime, and destroying the unique culture which we established over the past 200 years. Once destroyed (which we are allowing to happen at an alarming rate) it will be difficult if not impossible to repair the damage.
As with other issues the only way the illegal immigration problem will be controlled is for the public (that is you and me) to make it clear to our elected officials at all levels that we will not tolerate their inaction. They need to do what needs to be done to control the problem or we will vote them out. Votes are the only things most elected officials, who feed at the public trough, understand. Given the public's general apathy and "it's all about me" mentality such pressure on elected officials is not likely to happen.
As for the crop of candidates running for President NONE of them have any kind of correct track record on illegal immigration. I beg to differ with the poster from Arizona. While McCain SHOULD know how serious the problem is and SHOULD be solidly in favor of strict immigration laws/enforcement he is not. Once again, the fear of "offending" the Hispanic community rules over doing what is right and necessary. A sad state of affairs.
These people only want a better life. We should open the borders and let them ALL in. We should give them that opportunity for a better life even if it makes ours worse.
They contribute to our economy in taxes. Probably not as much as their kids let them take in welfare, but they still contribute.
We should also give them driver licenses, because, you know, then they'll get insurance and comply with all traffic laws..
And by the way, if you disagree with any of this, you're a racist!
N4VGB
04-28-2008, 03:06 PM
These people only want a better life. We should open the borders and let them ALL in. We should give them that opportunity for a better life even if it makes ours worse.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAH!:D:D:D
Of course it worked for you!
Well I guess according to N2RJ I am a racist from now on.
Cut me some slack! You seem to have very little common sense.
Just because I and many others object to people and drugs streaming over a border less than 10 miles away that costs this country millions and millions of dollars every year does not make me a racist.
All I would like them to do is enforce the laws that are on the books and have been for 50 or more years that I know of.
Not too long ago my neighbor who came into this country many years ago legally from Mexico, tried to stop a small group of them from stealing his truck. They pulled a knife and threatened him. He pulled his gun and fired two warning shots and they ran. The ohly mistake he made was not killing the guy with the knife.
But that makes him a racist too, sure it does.
Get a life!
If someone pulls a knife on me they are going to be a permanent resident of this country, the hard way.
I believe N2RJ was "tongue in cheek". Those truely against enforcing immigration laws do not acknowledge that letting in illegals will make our way of life worse, that many of them cost the welfare system billions, or that illegals with drivers licenses often don't get insurance and will always comply with traffic laws. N2RJ seems to get it.
N5NPO
04-28-2008, 06:05 PM
mean-spirited homophobic knuckledragging mouthbreathing imperialistic corporate america loving neocon warmongering anti-clean water biggoted racist anti-immagrant spewage from the uber-right wing...
Typical!
K8ERV
04-28-2008, 06:08 PM
You must have a good macro program, or you just like to type!
TOM K8ERV Montrose Colo
N5NPO
04-28-2008, 06:10 PM
You must have a good macro program, or you just like to type!
TOM K8ERV Montrose Colo
Simple cut and paste...
k8wpj
04-28-2008, 06:13 PM
They contribute to our economy in taxes. Probably not as much as their kids let them take in welfare, but they still contribute.
We should also give them driver licenses, because, you know, then they'll get insurance and comply with all traffic laws..
Any time you care to substantiate that comment that they pay taxes, you just feel free to quote a source... I am calling a major league 'BS' on this one... There's no way someone in this country illegally is gonna pay taxes... They AVOID any form of contact at all costs, for fear of detection and deportation...
and if you seriously think granting licences to illegals will compel them to suddenly start obeying traffic laws, and paying for the insurance, then I suppose you have no problem granting an immedaite release to all non violent offenders currently incarcerated.
Hey the illegal broke the law more than once getting here and working, and you're willing to let that slide, in the belief they willl suddenly not break any more laws, how is he any different than the guy in jail for shoplifting...?
After all, nobody got hurt and they are both just trying to take care of their families, right?
I believe N2RJ was "tongue in cheek". Those truely against enforcing immigration laws do not acknowledge that letting in illegals will make our way of life worse, that many of them cost the welfare system billions, or that illegals with drivers licenses often don't get insurance and will always comply with traffic laws. N2RJ seems to get it.
I would certainly hope so, but you never know. I had one guy from TX threaten to come over and kick my ***. I told him to name the place and I'd be there.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAH!:D:D:D
Of course it worked for you!
Damn straight.
I would certainly hope so, but you never know. I had one guy from TX threaten to come over and kick my ***. I told him to name the place and I'd be there.
I was tongue in cheek.
Well I guess according to N2RJ I am a racist from now on.
Cut me some slack! You seem to have very little common sense.
Speak for yourself. You're the one without any common sense here.
Just because I and many others object to people and drugs streaming over a border less than 10 miles away that costs this country millions and millions of dollars every year does not make me a racist.
All I would like them to do is enforce the laws that are on the books and have been for 50 or more years that I know of.
Not too long ago my neighbor who came into this country many years ago legally from Mexico, tried to stop a small group of them from stealing his truck. They pulled a knife and threatened him. He pulled his gun and fired two warning shots and they ran. The ohly mistake he made was not killing the guy with the knife.
But that makes him a racist too, sure it does.
Get a life!
If someone pulls a knife on me they are going to be a permanent resident of this country, the hard way.
Get a life yourself.
N4VGB
04-28-2008, 06:54 PM
TNX for the info.
Your post hurt N2RJ's feelings, he's from Trinidad. Drop him in your backyard with no ID and he's in Mexico before he knows what hit him. :D
Not too long ago my neighbor who came into this country many years ago legally from Mexico, tried to stop a small group of them from stealing his truck. They pulled a knife and threatened him. He pulled his gun and fired two warning shots and they ran. The ohly mistake he made was not killing the guy with the knife.
But that makes him a racist too, sure it does.
Get a life!
If someone pulls a knife on me they are going to be a permanent resident of this country, the hard way.
You are so right. He should have dropped the guy without hesitation.
Your post hurt N2RJ's feelings, he's from Trinidad. Drop him in your backyard with no ID and he's in Mexico before he knows what hit him. :D
My feelings weren't hurt, but I'm guessing if we drop you in the middle of a mental institution you'd blend in quite well as well.
I get a real kick out of people that try to hang the race tag on someone when they speak their mind about illegal activity and exercise their freedom of speech to bring attention to it.
But I guess all our forefather's in this country were racist too when they kicked the British out?
Beats me.
N4VGB
04-28-2008, 07:03 PM
My feelings weren't hurt, but I'm guessing if we drop you in the middle of a mental institution you'd blend in quite well as well.
You know I worked a comm contract at one of those, had a hard time differentiating between the residents and the staff!? :confused:
You know I worked a comm contract at one of those, had a hard time differentiating between the residents and the staff!? :confused:
No, just have a hard time diffrentiating between the residents and you, because in all honesty I think you should be in one.
Your level of trolling here is leaps and bounds beyond the regulars. It's quite entertaining in fact.
I get a real kick out of people that try to hang the race tag on someone when they speak their mind about illegal activity and exercise their freedom of speech to bring attention to it.
But I guess all our forefather's in this country were racist too when they kicked the British out?
Beats me.
I do too, and I am not exactly a white person who is usually accused of being racist.
However, to everything there is a sliver of truth, and I do sincerely believe that some who oppose illegal immigration do so primarily on the basis of race. They use code words like "destroying our culture."
As much as I hate illegal immigration, I also hate racism.
N4VGB
04-28-2008, 07:10 PM
However, to everything there is a sliver of truth, and I do sincerely believe that some who oppose illegal immigration do so primarily on the basis of race. They use code words like "destroying our culture."
As much as I hate illegal immigration, I also hate racism.
Well, aren't we just so touchy feely and PC. :p
The issue I addressed had nothing to do with race.
People that want to play that silly game can kiss off.
It was addressing the problem of illegal immigration and the costs in both lives and money to taxpayers.
I served in the Army side by side with many races and got along well with all.
I have many Hispanic friends here in this area.
That does not change the fact that our government does not enforce the rules that are on the books and it costs us a lot of money.
And when is the last time in New Jersey that an illegal stole a car to transport large numbers of people who came here illegally and crashed and killed themselves and others in your community. It's happens all the time here.
Well, aren't we just so touchy feely and PC. :p
Not really. I would never want to touch you.
N4VGB
04-28-2008, 11:10 PM
Not really. I would never want to touch you.
OH now, kissy kissy! :p:p:p
kc9jwa
04-29-2008, 07:19 PM
Simple answer, we go to war with iraq, ect in the years, so why not same thing, bomb illegal immagrants country, least they died although hmm didnt gain anything did we:confused:, had to pay for death.:eek:
KD6NIG
04-29-2008, 07:56 PM
Any time you care to substantiate that comment that they pay taxes, you just feel free to quote a source... I am calling a major league 'BS' on this one... There's no way someone in this country illegally is gonna pay taxes... They AVOID any form of contact at all costs, for fear of detection and deportation...
and if you seriously think granting licences to illegals will compel them to suddenly start obeying traffic laws, and paying for the insurance, then I suppose you have no problem granting an immedaite release to all non violent offenders currently incarcerated.
Hey the illegal broke the law more than once getting here and working, and you're willing to let that slide, in the belief they willl suddenly not break any more laws, how is he any different than the guy in jail for shoplifting...?
After all, nobody got hurt and they are both just trying to take care of their families, right?
I'm guessing the reference to "paying taxes" would refer to taxes of the sales type. Buying food, clothing, stuff like that to 'fit in' does require the payment of sales tax. Just like any other visitor would.
I don't think that he was referring to income tax, per se.
I thought I had heard something recently about a levy being placed on any large transfers of cash being sent from here to Mexico, but it didn't get far I guess. I know the places that do those transfers charge a nice fee. The banners for them are everywhere around here.
The most recent "immigrant" issue around here is our county hospital-they are 25M in the red and there is no solution. They are thinking about taking it private-the county can no longer afford to provide service to just anyone without any payment anymore.
I'm not saying illegals caused it, but I'm sure a good portion of it is theirs. When you can't ID someone, you sure as heck can't go after them and collect....
Simple answer, we go to war with iraq, ect in the years, so why not same thing, bomb illegal immagrants country, least they died although hmm didnt gain anything did we:confused:, had to pay for death.:eek:
So where is big business going to get its cheap labor from then?
I guess if they can't pay them under the table and reap the additional profits that they will have to pay the prevailing wages legally. And if they can't get the quality employees that they want they will just have to pay more.
Locking down the ability to hire illegals is a major step into stopping this activity.
AZ recently put in some kind of system that "e checks" the ID of people going to work for being valid somehow. My kids, who both work in management for housing building the the Phoenix area, report that the sub contractors have had newer employees leave when they are told that this state is using the system. So I guess it's working here.
But the problem still remains as they go to other states.
Just a few years ago we lost a major trauma center in Tucson as they could no longer afford to provide emergency care for people who could not pay and could not be traced.
And here in AZ at least you can only transfer so much money to Mexico. I don't' know if that's a federal law or state. But it's not that much at a time and you are right it's expensive.
And N2RJ could come live in my area and have no problems. I would say that most of the people here are brown skinned and nobody thinks anything of it. Even some white people are brown skinned with all the sun we get!
The only problem people who appear to be Hispanic in nature here have to my knowledge it that the Border Patrol is going to stop you from time to time to make sure you belong here due to the problems we do have in this county with illegals.
262,000 were arrested in 2004. I know that for a fact. And they only catch some 1-4 or 6. You do the math as to how many come over that border every day here and get to stay unless the are caught later. And even if they do catch them, unless they are committing some other criminal act that warrants it, they are only returned to Mexico so they can try to get in again. Many do this the same day!
A few years ago the legal counsel for the Forest Service worrying about people threatening to sue them for not warning them about the problems in our National Forests required the posting of the attached sign. This sign and the Coronado National Forest are within 1mile of my home.
That as far as I am concerned was a poor day in the history of this country and this state.
And you would be surprised to know just how many fire fighters find stashes of illegal drugs hidden for pickup by others when they have a fire in the National Forests. It's a security problem for the firemen to watch it and have it picked up.
Just click on it to see it a little bigger.
w2amr
04-29-2008, 10:16 PM
Not really. I would never want to touch you.
Pick a number and go to the back of the line.
N4VGB
04-29-2008, 10:22 PM
Pick a number and go to the back of the line.
Is that a pistol in your pocket or are you just glad to see me? Come on over some time, big boy! :p:p:p
kc9jwa
04-30-2008, 01:08 AM
So where is big business going to get its cheap labor from then?
Darn i forgot that.:D Its like when i put new tile on my floor and tiled myself in and got stuck, pretty good glue i will say.:D:D
ac5de
04-30-2008, 02:45 AM
Illegal Immagration is a problem of the first order. It is bankrupting our country! I think John McCain wanted to give all of the illegals that are here now amnesty even though he said it wasn't. I was working in Laredo a couple of years back and on the local TV newscast that they had a report from the Neuvo Laredo police about a house on their side of the border that had a constant stream of Middle Eastern men streaming through trying to assimalate and learn spanish so that they could enter into the U.S. as an illegal mexican migrant worker. From the news report it was like the response from homeland security was "Thanks Pedro we have it under control". Makes me wonder if anyone in government really cares?:mad:
kc9jwa
04-30-2008, 03:21 PM
[quote= . From the news report it was like the response from homeland security was "Thanks Pedro we have it under control". Makes me wonder if anyone in government really cares?:mad:[/quote]
Heck no no one in the goverment cares, they are all greedy, non caring animals, who just need to loose thier spots and put it some real humans.:mad::cool: