May QST Article Illustrates Dumbing Down of Ham Radio

[ab0wr]

A couple of weeks is half a month. that's 1600 units per month, had he been able to sustain sales and still less than Yaesu.

As far as 'most people wondering', what's going on is that Tony's selling a cheap toy, which is well within the joe-sixpack number for Hams.

It's not a toy, folks. It is a full-fledge SDR direct-conversion receiver. Steve made this very same claim until I showed the test results for MDS and third order intercept.

Being inexpensive only makes it a toy to those that judge quality and usefulness by price alone.

Ah. Even dumber.

Another Prophetic Announcement, Marty?

You're the one who made the non-competition claim, Tim. You're the one who has to support it and has failed to miserably.

*YOU*, you the one that *never* provides any proof of anything, are claiming someone else has failed to support their claims?

ROFL!!!

You, *yourself*, claimed that demand in the HF radio market was inelastic. And now you are trying to run away from the results of that claim???

I'm not surprised.

From no price changes due to inflation or monetary evaluation, to no price changes over a decade as marginal cost *should* have been dropping, to no price changes based on the increases in manufacturing productivity over the past decade there are all kinds of indicators of these being a non-competitive market with a few competitors exerting significant control.

And what have *YOU* offered for assertions otherwise? Icom is giving away their radios at a loss. There have been no productivity gains in consumer electronics manufacturing over the past decade. That inflation doesn't affect prices. That there are huge price differences between TFT and monochrome displays.

Of course none of your assertions are true, I have posted quotes from numerous sources that show this.

I notice that you keep ducking another key piece of evidence, so I'll mention it again:

If Icom can charge whatever margins they want, how come they only net 10 percent?

Hardly sounds like gouging the consumer to me, Tim.

Equivocation again, Marty? You gave the answer yourself, you can't remember it?

Low volume in the amateur market *is* one of your claims. That means that the amateur market is a small contributor to their bottom line since they are the No. 2 manufacturer of transmitting radios in the world. That means that they compete in other markets with much higher volume that *are* competitive and their margins are driven to a more reasonable level. Remember that you, YOURSELF, said that Icom doesn't break out their sub-markets in their financials.

Hoist by your own petard again, Marty?

Like I said, you couldn't win a freshman debate. All you know how to do is use argumentative fallacies.

tim ab0wr

[ab0wr]

::And I'll repeat my question, asked three times now and never addressed:

"I don't understand how there's "no competition in the market" when the market currently is Icom, Yaesu, Kenwood, Ten Tec, Flex Radio, Elecraft, JRC, Hilberling, Alinco and others."

No competition would imply one source, or possibly two sources to serve the market. There are at least nine major sources for HF amateur gear, and I'd have to make that ten if I include MFJ, who sells 5W-20W PEP QRP/portable/mobile transceivers, and make it fourteen if I include the current specialty QRP-only (mostly CW only) rig manufacturers.

That's "no competition?"

WB2WIK/6

You've *got* to be kidding, right?

Not a single one of you read that web article I posted for meaning, did you? Not a one!

It isn't an issue of the number of competitors you list.

First, when you say that there are nine *major* competitors, you are obfuscating. There are not *nine*. There may be four if you include Ten-Tec. But as someone on here noted, Elecraft apparently doesn't even have a real offering that is shipping. And if you consider Alinco and Hilberling as competitors in the US HF amateur radio market then they are probably both totally outsold by Tony Parker who really isn't even *in* the business. That means they carry no competitive weight at all.

Go read that web article again. Competitive markets are marked by differentiation in offerings along with pricing differentials generated *by* the competition for market share. That is *exactly* the opposite of what you see in US HF amateur radio market.

Even a child comparing the automobile market in the US with the HF amateur radio market could see the differences. Yet you folks, in your drive to rationalize your expenditure of money simply cannot face the reality. If the US auto market was like the HF radio market no one would be selling anything except Jaguars, Porsches, and Lambourghini's.

Why do you think those "speciality" rigs sell so well?

tim ab0wr

[ab0wr]

He doesn't miss any questions, he simply replies "ROFLOL *you* don't know what you're talking about." :)

Sorry, guy. I *did* reply. Mike just didn't like the answer so he claims that *I* ignored him.

Pricing based on features is called Premium Pricing. It is one of the Ultimate Sins in competitive marketing.

I gave Mike a web site to go read up on this. He refused. It's too damaging to his worldview I guess.

He would rather assert that my claim that HF amateur radio manufacturers are using Premium Pricing strategies (an Ultimate Sin) and that is a symptom of a non-competitive market simply cannot be true.

tim ab0wr

[WB2WIK]

You've *got* to be kidding, right?

Not a single one of you read that web article I posted for meaning, did you? Not a one!

It isn't an issue of the number of competitors you list.

First, when you say that there are nine *major* competitors, you are obfuscating. There are not *nine*. There may be four if you include Ten-Tec. But as someone on here noted, Elecraft apparently doesn't even have a real offering that is shipping.
tim ab0wr

::Tim, you're verifying once again how out of touch you are. I never hear you on the air, so maybe your entire contact with amateur radio is via the web, I don't know. (I do work many others here on the air.)

In any case, Elecraft's been in business many years and has shipped tens of thousands of K1s, K2s, KX1s and other kits. Only their brand new K3 has just begun shipping, and they have a large backlog they're starting to fill. I understand the first 200 or so have now shipped, but it will be a while until they catch up -- and this is a $2000 rig, not $40. I have personally built the K1, K2 and KX1, and when operating CW, I hear more K2s on the air than Icoms.

FlexRadio, who you seem to ignore, has sold out their production runs of SDR1000s and has been shipping the new SDR5000 for about four months. They have a backlog also and have not kept up with orders, but not a day goes by that I don't work somebody using a Flex SDR, especially if I'm on "phone." They're very popular.

Ten Tec's been shipping ham gear longer than Icom has, at least within the U.S. Their current models Omni-VII, Jupiter, Orion-II and Argonaut V are all very popular, with the Orion-II being a top choice of DXers and contesters and the Omni-VII taking the top spot as rig of choice for those setting up remotely operated stations. I know two dozen of those guys already, driven to remote operation due to restrictive covenants at their homes but now happily on the air with big, successful stations thanks to the unique capabilities of the OMNI-VII. One of those is my "neighbor" Dwight K2YT who has a killer HF station set up in an industrial area at his office, and can operate it from anywhere in the world using Skype.

Ten Tec sells as many HF rigs as Kenwood. Alinco has shipped over 20,000 of their HF transceivers, the DX-70 and DX-77, since their introduction.

You're out of touch, Tim.

WB2WIK/6

[kj3n]

::Tim, you're verifying once again how out of touch you are.


(snipped big time)

You're out of touch, Tim.

I figured that out 30 pages ago..... ;)

[ab0wr]

::Tim, you're verifying once again how out of touch you are. I never hear you on the air, so maybe your entire contact with amateur radio is via the web, I don't know. (I do work many others here on the air.)

In any case, Elecraft's been in business many years and has shipped tens of thousands of K1s, K2s, KX1s and other kits. Only their brand new K3 has just begun shipping, and they have a large backlog they're starting to fill. I understand the first 200 or so have now shipped, but it will be a while until they catch up -- and this is a $2000 rig, not $40. I have personally built the K1, K2 and KX1, and when operating CW, I hear more K2s on the air than Icoms.

FlexRadio, who you seem to ignore, has sold out their production runs of SDR1000s and has been shipping the new SDR5000 for about four months. They have a backlog also and have not kept up with orders, but not a day goes by that I don't work somebody using a Flex SDR, especially if I'm on "phone." They're very popular.

Ten Tec's been shipping ham gear longer than Icom has, at least within the U.S. Their current models Omni-VII, Jupiter, Orion-II and Argonaut V are all very popular, with the Orion-II being a top choice of DXers and contesters and the Omni-VII taking the top spot as rig of choice for those setting up remotely operated stations. I know two dozen of those guys already, driven to remote operation due to restrictive covenants at their homes but now happily on the air with big, successful stations thanks to the unique capabilities of the OMNI-VII. One of those is my "neighbor" Dwight K2YT who has a killer HF station set up in an industrial area at his office, and can operate it from anywhere in the world using Skype.

Ten Tec sells as many HF rigs as Kenwood. Alinco has shipped over 20,000 of their HF transceivers, the DX-70 and DX-77, since their introduction.

You're out of touch, Tim.

WB2WIK/6

Out of touch?

Again, please point out where *any* differentiation exists in this market, Steve.

And Alinco has sold 20,000 units combined in almost 9 years of producing the radios? That's what, about 200 units per month?

ROFL!!! That about equals sales of the softrock per month and it isn't even a *BUSINESS*.

The flex radios aren't even marketed as a competitive offering. They are marketed as the *Porsche* of radios today. They are supposedly so good they don't even *need* a roofing filter. Is Porsche a competitor of Ford? Not in the view of most people. Their base offering is almost as much as a 756ProII and *doesn't even come with a computer*!. This is competition?

Again, the KX1 is a CW only transceiver. It costs an order of magnitude more than an SDR in the alternative market and doesn't offer the same functionality. True, it is a rig you can carry in your backpack but that claim has never been made for radios in the SDR genre -- so using that as a comparison is a Red Herring argumentative fallacy.

There is also a reason you hear so many K2's on CW, at it's base price it is only a CW rig, and not even a 100watt one at that. The price point *does* make it competitive compared to the offerings of the Big 3 -- that alone proves *my* point more than it does yours.

And remember, the K2 takes no advantage of the productivity gains from using SMT parts and integrated construction - AND IT STILL COMES IN AT A PRICE POINT EQUAL TO ICOM'S LOWEST POINT. This is competition?

That alone does more to prove *my* point than yours.

Competition drives markets to *lower* prices, not to raise them. The only things you can come up with to show there is competition are units that don't offer the same functionality (e.g. CW only rigs) at an order of magnitude higher cost or are priced using the Premium Pricing strategy (the flex radio). The only true competitor you have to offer is Alinco and there *is* a reason why people don't usually buy them -- and their sales aren't as good as units from people that aren't even in the business!

If you think this is somehow proving your point that the HF radio market is a competitive one where the consumers are NOT at the mercy of the suppliers, you are still dreaming. What you are trying to do is say Vespa Scooters and Lamborghini compete head to head with the Ford Taurus. It just doens't work.

As far as me being on the air -- I am on the air *every* day. Are you in the habit of talking to *all* 600,000 hams regularly? Are the only ones you consider to be active the ones *you* hear? Talk about Hubris!

tim ab0wr

[AE6IP]

And this is proof of *YOUR* assertion in what way?

No particular way. I'm not going to debate you on agricultural economy, Tim, since your reference to McCormick shows you're not informed enough to be worth engaging.

[AE6IP]

oops. browser stutter.

[N2RJ]

Why are you guys continuing this thread? You do realize that ab0wr will never admit he is wrong, even though every last point of his is disproven.

[AE6IP]

It's not a toy, folks. It is a full-fledge SDR direct-conversion receiver.

It's a toy. There are a lot of features that it's missing to make it a "full-fledged" SDR receiver. A full-fledged SDR provides its output on a much wider bandwidth pipe than PC audio.

Low volume in the amateur market *is* one of your claims. That means that the amateur market is a small contributor to their bottom line since they are the No. 2 manufacturer of transmitting radios in the world. That means that they compete in other markets with much higher volume that *are* competitive and their margins are driven to a more reasonable level. Remember that you, YOURSELF, said that Icom doesn't break out their sub-markets in their financials.

They're not the No. 2 manufacture of "transmitting radios" in the world. There are at least fifteen cellphone makers that do more volume in "transmitting radios" than they do, and dozens of wifi makers.

Also their total business is less than 300 million per year. All of their devices are low-volume. They even mention that in the web site when they talk about their manufacturing facility.

But why stop at Icom, Tim? Kenwood and Yaesu do break out their amateur sales and they don't have high net margins on amateur sales either.

[AE6IP]

Is Porsche a competitor of Ford?

Anyone who has ever driven th GT (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_GT) would say yes.

As would anyone who has had the misfortune of driving a Cayenne.

[AE6IP]

Why are you guys continuing this thread? You do realize that ab0wr will never admit he is wrong, even though every last point of his is disproven.

Because from Steve's trying to teach Tim, I've learned many interesting things and Steve and I have discovered a mutual former employer.

You never know what might come of such a path until you've taken it.

[WB2WIK]

Anyone who has ever driven th GT (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_GT) would say yes.

As would anyone who has had the misfortune of driving a Cayenne.

::Or the old Porsche 814! (Volkswagon with sleek body styling.) A '64Mustang was a much more capable sports car.

WB2WIK/6

[N2RJ]

My friend who works at a porsche dealership told me that once you've seen one VW, you've seen them all. :eek:

(He's repaired and rebuilt quite a few POS Porsches and Audis in his career... He personally owns an Acura. :) )

[KI4NGN]

Sorry, guy. I *did* reply. Mike just didn't like the answer so he claims that *I* ignored him.

Pricing based on features is called Premium Pricing. It is one of the Ultimate Sins in competitive marketing.

I gave Mike a web site to go read up on this. He refused. It's too damaging to his worldview I guess.

He would rather assert that my claim that HF amateur radio manufacturers are using Premium Pricing strategies (an Ultimate Sin) and that is a symptom of a non-competitive market simply cannot be true.

tim ab0wr

Out of Tim's own mouth:


You pretty much have it pegged. Those that talk about "inflationary dollars" conveniently forget about the other side of the equation which is "productivity". There has been enough productivity gain in electronics design and manufacture to more than offset inflation over the past two decades or more.

What has kept the price where it is is -- MARKETING --. It's the "keep up with the Joneses" phenomenon. You have to keep adding on ever more "features" in order to keep up with the Joneses so the price points never benefit from the productivity gains. A *very* good single conversion HF rig *could* be built for way less than $100 even including a DDS vfo and two crystal filters (I built mine for about that). It would be way more than enough rig for a beginner and make the hobby far easier to get into for many.

Guess what? The margin on such a rig isn't sufficient for anyone to market such a thing based on the size of the potential buyer pool. So it will never happen.



He absolutely refuses to acknowledge any form of competition based on other than price, even though he acknowledges EXACTLY that above. "Keeping up with the Joneses" IS competition, because to not keep up is to possibly lose market share. Whether he knows it or not, he is impliclty acknowledging that the buyers of the higher end level of HR rigs WANT those features, which means that the manufacturers are responding to the MARKET.

He also acknowledged, prior to changing his tune, that there is most definitely a relationship between margin and (potential) sales volume. The manufacturers would not be able to set margins high enough on the rigs he was discussing in order to make a profit without setting the price so high that no one would think the rig was worth it.

He refuses to acknowledge marketing and sales in such a small, narrow niche market as HR, thinking it no different from a company selling hundreds of millions of cellphones.

This thread has continued not so much because of disagreement, but because he keeps blatantly telling everyone who disagrees with him that they're wrong, including those who work in the electronics manufacturing industry!

I don't know if he is enjoying himself, but with every post his credibility goes down on this website. EVERYONE knows that he's wrong, yet he insists that everyone else is wrong.

It's hard not to respond to such arrogance.

Mike

[WB2WIK]

It's hard not to respond to such arrogance.

Mike

::Like watching a train wreck?

[W3MIV]

It's hard not to respond to such arrogance.


Wisdom of the ages: "Pride goeth before the fall, and an haughty demeanor before destruction."

[KI4NGN]

::Like watching a train wreck?
Morbid curiosity?

Tim's train wrecked a long time ago, but he can't understand why no one else is boarding.

I suppose the curiosity is wondering how long he'll stay on the train, insisting that all of those who don't board are foolish, uneducated, or just plan stupid, when everyone is trying to tell him that the train is not going anywhere.

Mike

[ab0wr]

It's a toy. There are a lot of features that it's missing to make it a "full-fledged" SDR receiver. A full-fledged SDR provides its output on a much wider bandwidth pipe than PC audio.[/quote

Really? Go take a look at the flex radios and see what they have for A/D bandwidth. I think you'll find it is 192khz.

ROFL!!

[quote]They're not the No. 2 manufacture of "transmitting radios" in the world. There are at least fifteen cellphone makers that do more volume in "transmitting radios" than they do, and dozens of wifi makers.

Oh, I forgot! I thought we were talking about HF RADIOS here. I forgot that you are the master of equivocation.

tim ab0wr

[ab0wr]

Anyone who has ever driven th GT (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_GT) would say yes.

As would anyone who has had the misfortune of driving a Cayenne.

Yeah, you see a LOT of those on the floor inventory of *EVERY* Ford dealer, don't you?

tim ab0wr

[ab0wr]

Out of Tim's own mouth:



He absolutely refuses to acknowledge any form of competition based on other than price, even though he acknowledges EXACTLY that above. "Keeping up with the Joneses" IS competition, because to not keep up is to possibly lose market share. Whether he knows it or not, he is impliclty acknowledging that the buyers of the higher end level of HR rigs WANT those features, which means that the manufacturers are responding to the MARKET.

He also acknowledged, prior to changing his tune, that there is most definitely a relationship between margin and (potential) sales volume. The manufacturers would not be able to set margins high enough on the rigs he was discussing in order to make a profit without setting the price so high that no one would think the rig was worth it.

He refuses to acknowledge marketing and sales in such a small, narrow niche market as HR, thinking it no different from a company selling hundreds of millions of cellphones.

This thread has continued not so much because of disagreement, but because he keeps blatantly telling everyone who disagrees with him that they're wrong, including those who work in the electronics manufacturing industry!

I don't know if he is enjoying himself, but with every post his credibility goes down on this website. EVERYONE knows that he's wrong, yet he insists that everyone else is wrong.

It's hard not to respond to such arrogance.

Mike

Mike, only *YOU* guys would pay $200 for a single conversion rig when for $50 you can get a full-fledged SDR radio with more capability.

Unbelievable.

*That's* why there will never be a commercial market for such a rig.

"Keeping up with the Joneses" by adding features in order to raise prices is NOT competition except in a Premium Pricing market. And such a market can only occur in a non-competitive environment with a non-elastic demand where the suppliers control the prices.

You are [b]STILL[/]b looking for a Daddy-figure to tell you that you are getting a good buy. In order to rationalize that you are not paying too much you'll use *any* excuse.

I suspect that you agree with Marty and Steve that Yacomwood are actually *subsidizing* amateur radio by selling their radios at less than cost, right?

It would fit right in with this.

tim ab0wr

[AE6IP]

Really? Go take a look at the flex radios and see what they have for A/D bandwidth. I think you'll find it is 192khz.


Flex is a toy also, Tim. It's just a much more expensive and feature filled toy.

[KI4NGN]

Mike, only *YOU* guys would pay $200 for a single conversion rig when for $50 you can get a full-fledged SDR radio with more capability.

Unbelievable.

*That's* why there will never be a commercial market for such a rig.

"Keeping up with the Joneses" by adding features in order to raise prices is NOT competition except in a Premium Pricing market. And such a market can only occur in a non-competitive environment with a non-elastic demand where the suppliers control the prices.

You are [b]STILL[/]b looking for a Daddy-figure to tell you that you are getting a good buy. In order to rationalize that you are not paying too much you'll use *any* excuse.

I suspect that you agree with Marty and Steve that Yacomwood are actually *subsidizing* amateur radio by selling their radios at less than cost, right?

It would fit right in with this.

tim ab0wr

Laughing...see the bold??? So they ARE in competition despite your dozens of posts that they're not?

And in one statement you contradicted yourself.... They're not in competition except in a premium pricing market, and there can be no competition in a premium pricing "environment" (a way to make your statement not look contradictory, but the environment is still the market)?!?!!?

Tim, I'm not justifying anything.... I've NEVER purchased a new rig!

You on ther other hand are constantly justifying, page after page, why YOU never will.

Get over yourself Tim.

Mike

[WB2WIK]

In a few mins research I found some enlightening things about Topeka, KS, like this post on a website actually referenced in the Chamber of Commerce website (probably not purposely). The post is recent, from mid-December 2007:

"Ok, besides a couple of short stints, Im a lifelong Kansan. I am sad as heck to hear that Coal is going to win over Windpower, In Iowa and Minnesota, windpower has been wildly successful, and I know firsthand. Now on to Topeka. I am sure I will anger a lot of people, but so be it. To me Topeka is a crap filled piece of crap coated in crap. All of my life it went by the names of Toe-Picker and To-Puke-a. The Capitol is really nice, The Zoo at Gage park used to be nice. I think they still have a good museum on the far west end of town. The rest of the town is just dirty. So yes there are neat things to see there, but I'd never live there on a bet. One last thing positive I can say about Topeka is that Stormont-Vail is a fine Hospital. I agree with the person that said Lawrence or Silver Lake are fine options. That being said, I would say that the city should get off its butt and work on revitalizing the interior city, it could be beautiful with the right kinds of programs, it is really as if the town never recovered from the tragic tornado of 62, I believe thats the year. If Topeka wants to draw new people, or be the city it once was, some new leadership blood is needed, or some of the current city admin needs to get creative. The only reason the town hasnt fallen to total ruin is the Capitol, let's hope it can be restored to the gem it once was longggg ago, until then, Lawrence or Silver Lake is the way to go."

Wow.

Dozens of similar comments from locals there.

Sounds like a boring place to live, so spending time researching stuff on the web might be a popular pasttime, as opposed to actually being out doing something.

:(

WB2WIK/6

[KI4NGN]

Nothing wrong with web research as long as you don't ignore data that contradicts your position.

I recently changed my position in another thread regarding GMRS when I did a little more research than I had originally to justify it. Found that I was wrong and admitted it.

I have no doubt that Tim is drawing all of his strength from research data supporting his position, but that he discards anything that is contradictory.

And of course he's completely disregarding the evidence of reality.

He likes to quote from his "research" that premium pricing is a "deadly" business sin. What can that possibly mean other than a company following that pricing strategy cannot survive?

How long have the major HR manufacturers been around??? Either his researched data is wrong, and it's not a "deadly" practice, or he is wrong and the HR companies are NOT using that strategy. Either way, HE is wrong.

Again, he ignores reality.

Mike

[WB2WIK]

Nothing wrong with web research as long as you don't ignore data that contradicts your position.

I recently changed my position in another thread regarding GMRS when I did a little more research than I had originally to justify it. Found that I was wrong and admitted it.

I have no doubt that Tim is drawing all of his strength from research data supporting his position, but that he discards anything that is contradictory.

And of course he's completely disregarding the evidence of reality.

He likes to quote from his "research" that premium pricing is a "deadly" business sin. What can that possibly mean other than a company following that pricing strategy cannot survive?

How long have the major HR manufacturers been around??? Either his researched data is wrong, and it's not a "deadly" practice, or he is wrong and the HR companies are NOT using that strategy. Either way, HE is wrong.

Again, he ignores reality.

Mike

::I guess I don't really understand the point of lecturing the masses about the evils of suppliers making profit. And the fact is, the U.S. companies are taking the ham radio consumer market by storm using no predatory practices but only good old fashioned engineering and service. Dismissing Ten Tec and Elecraft as second-tier players is ridiculous, and every day I work another guy using a new SDR5000. Just last night on six meters I worked Bill W3XO/5 (50.135 SSB) who was thrilled to be using his new Flex SDR5000 on six. It happens every single day.

Who cares what Icom, or anybody else, does? The strong will survive and the weak won't, just like in any other market.

WB2WIK/6

[AE6IP]

It dawns on me that I've not offered an alterantive to the toy softrock and flex SDRs.

For those who are interested in seriously experimenting with SDR, I strongly recommend Universal Software Radio Peripheral, or USRP (http://www.ettus.com/).

Unlike the softrock and flex designs, this is not a 'soundcard' radio and is capable of much wider bandwidth protocols than either, making it suitable for a much wider range of experiments.

[KI4NGN]

::I guess I don't really understand the point of lecturing the masses about the evils of suppliers making profit. And the fact is, the U.S. companies are taking the ham radio consumer market by storm using no predatory practices but only good old fashioned engineering and service. Dismissing Ten Tec and Elecraft as second-tier players is ridiculous, and every day I work another guy using a new SDR5000. Just last night on six meters I worked Bill W3XO/5 (50.135 SSB) who was thrilled to be using his new Flex SDR5000 on six. It happens every single day.

Who cares what Icom, or anybody else, does? The strong will survive and the weak won't, just like in any other market.

WB2WIK/6

Amen!

:)

[K5MVP]

Just two thoughts. I too was not pleased with the dumming down of the May issue of QST. I have been licensed for over 50 years. Just go back and pick up an old issue of QST from the 50's or 60's and compare it to the May ''08 issue.

And yes, I have a KWM-2a which I enjoy operating all the time. Isn't it amazing that the KWM-2a is operating since 1964 without any major problems. I do not think the new offerings from the equipment manufacturers will be around that long since most are using custom IC's and displays and when they are not available you might as well take the rig to the dump. I am in no way saying these rigs are inferior..... they work very well. For those who have never seen a KWM-2a, 30L1 amplier or 30S-1 amplifier by Collins I suggest you look at the workmanship and the quality that wen into these famous rigs.

[N2RJ]

It dawns on me that I've not offered an alterantive to the toy softrock and flex SDRs.

For those who are interested in seriously experimenting with SDR, I strongly recommend Universal Software Radio Peripheral, or USRP (http://www.ettus.com/).

Unlike the softrock and flex designs, this is not a 'soundcard' radio and is capable of much wider bandwidth protocols than either, making it suitable for a much wider range of experiments.

Actually I like HPSDR (http://hpsdr.org) a lot better. Apart from "soundcard" radios, they are also developing mercury which is wideband, just like Ettus' USRP is.

[k4kyv]

I have noticed in the last few issues, they now have a glossary section called Hamspeak, "brief descriptions of Amateur Radio related items found in this month's issue of QST". Each article that appears in the magazine is listed, and under the heading, terms used in that article are explained or defined.

Here are some of the terms that the editors decided readers might need help with in the June issue: carbon mic, dynamic mic, balanced load, unbalanced feed line, cathode ray tube, RTTY, slow scan television, FM capture effect, QRP transceiver, DXpedition, dummy load, and I have saved the best for last: solder lug!

[WA7KKP]

"With that being said, I've acquired a few rather nice rigs for nothing because someone attempted some modification or other electrical mishap, and the gear no longer works, one of which is a TS-930 with what appears to be a power supply problem. When I get the time I'll see if I can fix this stuff, which will likely cost me either a few $$ in parts, or an entire module/board/whatever is broken at used prices. This kind of thing can be quite a bargain for new hams if they have the technical ability to troubleshoot equipment, and they are willing to wait around until someone is parting out a rig that has the module they need, if that is what it takes for them to complete the repair."

----------------

This is where the real bargains are . . . and in my experience most "unfixable" problems are easily fixed, sometimes only a switch has to be thrown in the right position . . . And it isn't that hard to be a technogeek, mostly just paying attention to what's going on, having a good VOM, and a working brain.

I've always had used HF gear . . . bought a couple new Kenwoods for VHF: the TR7625 was stolen from my car because someone thought it was a CB, and my TM741 is so user unfriendly it now collects dust.

I believe in KISS, and my MFJ-9406 on 6 SSB with a twinlead folded dipole does me just fine . . .

Let someone else pay for the depreciation of new gear . . .

Gary WA7KKP

[kj3n]

Speaking of dumbed down......

http://www.arrl.org/?artid=8253

Does anyone bother to look at the band plan? :rolleyes:

[k3roj]

Well, I consider the first "dumbing down America" in amateur radio was when the FCC dropped the Morse Code requirement in testing. Learning Morse Code to get a license required effort and at the same time helped the brain think a little better. Picking out a good used or new radio was based on it's ability to separate stations, especially on CW. Nowadays new hams are only interested in using SSB on HF and FM on the VHF band.

Amateur radio will never return to it's original status unless enough of us stick together and pester the FCC into requiring Morse Code again. Of course then the ARRL may lose some money through subscribers and besides, someone working for the FCC may have to learn the code.

[AG3Y]

ROJ, not to pick on you, but WHY did you bring up this old chestnut again? We were all hoping it had died a natural death, and it was gone for about half a month. Then you have to bring up something that has been brought up time and time again. Did you read the whole thread before you responded? I'm sure the "dropping the code requirement" has been hashed over so many times that you can't even recognize it any more ! ( see KJ3N's avatar ! )

ENOUGH, ALREADY !

[K7JEM]

Well, I consider the first "dumbing down America" in amateur radio was when the FCC dropped the Morse Code requirement in testing. Learning Morse Code to get a license required effort and at the same time helped the brain think a little better. Picking out a good used or new radio was based on it's ability to separate stations, especially on CW. Nowadays new hams are only interested in using SSB on HF and FM on the VHF band.

Amateur radio will never return to it's original status unless enough of us stick together and pester the FCC into requiring Morse Code again. Of course then the ARRL may lose some money through subscribers and besides, someone working for the FCC may have to learn the code.

That'll be fun to watch. Why don't you send a petition to the FCC to start the Morse tests again, I'm sure they would be very receptive.

Apparently, learning the MC hasn't helped you think better, since this was just decided less than 2 years ago.

Those that want to learn MC can. Those that don't want to don't have to. Pretty simple concept really.

Joe

[k9jdk]

I agree with the last 2 posts. Let it go. Please.

[KA4DPO]

Oh I agree with ROJ. I just read a QST and came down with retardation.:D