bin Laden message has warnings for Iraq, Israel

[kg4kww]

Does this message concern you?

CAIRO, Egypt (AP) -- Osama bin Laden warned Iraq's Sunni Arabs against fighting al Qaeda and vowed to expand the terror group's holy war to Israel in a new audiotape Saturday, threatening "blood for blood, destruction for destruction."

Full Story (http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/meast/12/29/binladen.message.ap/index.html)

[K6BBC]

No. But the sub-prime crisis does worry me a great deal.

bbc

[KA7RRA]

I think bin Laden should be very carefull if he goes after Israel Israel wont put up with it

[AC4BB]

Going after Israel,would be Bin Laden's"Worst & Final mistake"

[K8MHZ]

Quote[/b] (AC4BB @ Dec. 29 2007,23:24)]Going after Israel,would be Bin Laden's"Worst & Final mistake"
You don't think we could stop Israel from hurting Osama?

[N7RJD]

Quote[/b] (k8mhz @ Dec. 30 2007,04:49)]Quote[/b] (AC4BB @ Dec. 29 2007,23:24)]Going after Israel,would be Bin Laden's"Worst & Final mistake"
You don't think we could stop Israel from hurting Osama?
Under Bush Sr. we could have and did.

Under Bush Jr. not so likely. We have very much become their kept mistress. Funny when you consider how much money we send them yet they own us. It's a very backward world.

[kc2orw]

Quote[/b] (k8mhz @ Dec. 30 2007,14:49)]Quote[/b] (AC4BB @ Dec. 29 2007,23:24)]Going after Israel,would be Bin Laden's"Worst & Final mistake"
You don't think we could stop Israel from hurting Osama?
No, not if they decided to go after him. They do seem to be under more moderate leadership at the moment. I suppose I should state that by "moderate" I only mean more moderate then in the past.

So back to the original question does this bother me... no.
Why, because it is the "same old same old" message from Bin Laden.
Is there no threat of terrorism towards the USA... no there is still a threat. But where that comes from is something other then Bin Laden the individual.

[kg4kww]

I agree Israel would do what Bush has failed to do.

[KC2PBJ]

Bin Laden is not stupid enough to attack Israel. One false step and he will incur the wrath of the Mossad - the most effective and efficient terrorist fighters in the world. Once unleashed, nothing will stop them from attaining their assigned goal. Let's hope he chooses to push the point and tick off the Mossad!

[ac4r]

Quote[/b] (KC2PBJ @ Dec. 30 2007,14:53)]Bin Laden is not stupid enough to attack Israel. #One false step and he will incur the wrath of the Mossad - the most effective and efficient terrorist fighters in the world. #Once unleashed, nothing will stop them from attaining their assigned goal. #Let's hope he chooses to push the point and tick off the Mossad!
Yes, before long Iran will probally get a taste of this too.

[kg4kww]

I agree

[kb2vxa]

Long ago the Arab world vowed to push Israel into the sea but it's still right where Moses left it.

[W2ILP]

Gentlemen and ladies....

I have no reason to believe that the Muslims on the streets of all Muslim nations will not eventually join forces and attack Israel. #They will do so even if it means that it will be a massive suicidal atack. #They first will get rid of all of their leaders, who are friendly trading partners with the US and Europe...and then they will cease attacking each other and jointly attack Israel. #They have been insulted by Israel...its very existance... as well as its unwillingness to return occupied territory to the Palistinians and the destruction of Palistinian homes and property as well as the creation of a vast number of refugees from the British Protectorate of Palistine. # I dunno if Israel can now do anything that will reverse the hatred that average Muslims in the middle east feel about the Jewish Zionist theocracy of Israel. #This is only my humble opinion, so you can just follow the news of world events, as they unfold and understand that the leaders of all Muslim nations will eventually be overthrown, if they do not join in the massive suicidal vendetta that will destroy Israel at any cost.

w2ilp (I Like Peace)...The US can only withdraw support for both Israel and the Muslim nations...unless we want to eventually become a significant player in a religious war of this century.

[K8MHZ]

Quote[/b] ]w2ilp (I Like Peace)...The US can only withdraw support for both Israel and the Muslim nations...unless we want to eventually become a significant player in a religious war of this century.

Religion and war. My how the two have went hand in hand for centuries.

[W2ILP]

This thread needs to get to the top of the heap. It isn't supposed to be funny...but it should give everyone something to think about...because if my thoughts ring true they are the thoughts of many who are afraid to knock religious motivations for hatred distrust...and suicidal terrorism.

Most of the media as well as the politicians avoid this subject matter...but it must be recognized and well understood by any future president of the USA. Unlike local issues or global warming theories it can not be swept under the rug because it must form the back bone of our future foreign policy. Suicidal Muslim terrorists are not going to disappear nor are Zionist Jews who want to own Jerusalem and keep the occupied west bank settlements growing, while preventing Muslim Palestinians from enjoying basic freedoms. We must address these problems with more than Condie Rice.

Unfortunately Bin Laden has clearly warned us all. He can't be found and stopped but even if he is dead his followers may carry out plans to destroy Israel eventually.

w2ilp (Impossible Lethal Problems)....based on religious differences that remain taboo for any serious logical discussion.

[W1GUH]

These subjects don't overly capture my attention anymore, for the very worst of reasons.

I'm convinced that the middle east is a powder keg and the spark that sets off a very dirty and nasty war could happen at any time. And I'm completely pessimistic that whatever clown is in the White House will take action that makes it worse, not better.

Yea, it concerns me...but..ho hum...IMHO, this is a foregone conclusion and inevitable.

[kg4kww]

If what you say is true W2ILP then why hasn't it happened already?

I think that we need to stop IRAN and nuke power before it gets out of hand.

[n2ize]

Israel is the greatest country in the world.

[n2ize]

Quote[/b] (kg4kww @ Dec. 31 2007,09:31)]If what you say is true W2ILP then why hasn't it happened already?

I think that we need to stop IRAN and nuke power before it gets out of hand.
If what they say about Iran is true then we should stop them or at very least intervene in some way.

[w3wn]

Funny thing.

Jordan occupied the West Bank territory of Palestine from 1948-1967. Egypt occupied the Gaza Strip for the same length of time. And they weren't exactly gentle in their treatment of the Palestinan refugees during that time period.

But that was OK?

To think, though, of all the money and blood that's been shed for over 80 years in that region... all because of induhviduals who used the Opposition as scapegoats in their own personal quests for power (and that goes for both sides... or if you think about it, all sides) and raised up the ire of the masses via propaganda of one form or another. Then when the dust settled, the smoke cleared, and the bodies were buried, the power-seekers reaped what benefits they could and started the cycle all over again.

If only there were some True Leaders on all sides willing to actually admit that this is a zero-sum game, and sue for peace. I know, it will never happen... even if there were a few True Leaders willing to stick their necks out, someone would have them assasinated in short order for speaking Truth. But one can hope.

[KC2PBJ]

Quote[/b] (n2ize @ Dec. 31 2007,11:41)]Israel is the greatest country in the world.
Okay, what's stopping you from moving there? Its no skin off anyone's butt if you go and there is one less person griping and whining. I'll stick around and try to help improve our lot in life.

[ac4r]

Quote[/b] (n2ize @ Dec. 31 2007,09:42)]Quote[/b] (kg4kww @ Dec. 31 2007,09:31)]If what you say is true W2ILP then why hasn't it happened already?

I think that we need to stop IRAN and nuke power before it gets out of hand.
If what they say about Iran is true then we should stop them or at very least intervene in some way.
Not to worry, Israel will probally take care of this problem in due time.

[N3ATS]

Quote[/b] (n2ize @ Dec. 31 2007,11:41)]Israel is the greatest country in the world.
Your quote says otherwise.

[WF7A]

Not many people know that ol' Bin Laden was part of a covert operation aimed at usurping the amateur radio communications of the U.S.; it involved a splinter group of binary religious fanatics belonging to the group, Al Coda.

And no, no musicians were involved.

[KC2PBJ]

The Islamic world has been fighting among themselves and destroying each other since the early Middle Ages. They have not stopped this internal mass murder or economic destruction of their "world" long enough to make any dent in Israel or surrounding nations. Osama Yo Momma is hoping for better luck this time around. Iran must first fall before any jihad can have any meaning on a larger scale.

[kg4kww]

The Islamic world is scared of Israel

[KP3FT]

Quote[/b] (W1GUH @ Dec. 31 2007,01:09)]These subjects don't overly capture my attention anymore, for the very worst of reasons.

I'm convinced that the middle east is a powder keg and the spark that sets off a very dirty and nasty war could happen at any time. And I'm completely pessimistic that whatever clown is in the White House will take action that makes it worse, not better.

Yea, it concerns me...but..ho hum...IMHO, this is a foregone conclusion and inevitable.
Funny how current events matches the Bible's predictions.

Zechariah 12:2 "Behold, I will make Jerusalem a cup of trembling unto all the people round about, when they shall be in the siege both against Judah and against Jerusalem."
Zechariah 12:3 "And in that day will I make Jerusalem a burdensome stone for all people: all that burden themselves with it shall be cut in pieces, though all the people of the earth be gathered together against it."

It's unsettling that it infers all nations will be against Israel. It suggests that America will no longer support Israel or is simply powerless to do so for whatever reason.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20080101/ts_nm/palestinians_israel_dc

[W2ILP]

kq4kww

You ask why the war hasn't happened yet.

There are many who would agree with me that what happened on 9/11/2001 was the first indication that the war has started. #The "war on terrorism" is recognized as the war between religious Muslims and Israel...and the U.S. is recognizable as the partner of Israel and thus conceived by religious Muslims of middle eastern nations as an ally of Israel. #They base this on the fact that the U.S. arms Israel with U.S. taxpayer money. # Even if we stopped doing so now we can not entirely erase our past policies. # My advice to the next president would be to stop sending 2.7 Billion dollars per year to Israel...unless Israel entirely gives back territory occupied since 1967 to the Palestinians and also make Israel give Jerusalem to the Muslims Palistinians, as the capital of their own recognized nation. #Since religious Jews will not agree to doing so, I suggest that they fight it out with the religious Muslims and keep the U.S.A. out of the battle because most Americans are Christians. #We don't need to get involved in a religious war...We have enough fanatics here that don't want to teach Intelligent Design allong with Darwin's theory of evolution in public schools...which in my opinion is of danger to nobody. #Religious folks can believe whatever they want in a democratic nation...SO LONG AS IT DOES NOT INVOLVE OVERTHOWING RESPONSIBLE GOVERNMENTS BY FORCE (Plotting Terrorist Wars).
There is no need, as I see it, for the U.S. to support theocratic nations such as Israel or the Muslim nations. #We must not involve ourselves in their religious wars...nor should Christians think that they recognize such wars as predicted in their own religious scriptures. #If Americans want to show that they respect HUMAN RIGHTS they should not take sides in religious battles. #Morally we should be humanists...even if not all atheists, as I am.

w2ilp (I Like Peace)...Only religious fanatics can claim to disprove the faiths of other religious fanatics. #People of faith are the SUICIDAL TERRORISTS...but in our country we must bring ourselves to recognize the difference between our own religious martyrs, who were the fathers of our own religion and their suicidal "terrorists".

[W4DFW]

Quote[/b] (W2ILP @ Dec. 31 2007,17:33)]My advice to the next president would be to stop sending 2.7 Billion dollars per year to Israel...unless Israel entirely gives back territory occupied since 1967 to the Palestinians and also make Israel give Jerusalem to the Muslims Palistinians, as the capital of their own recognized nation.
You just love to forget that Israel was attacked by unprovoked Arabs. The Arabs got their nose bloodied as Israel defended herself, and you somehow blame Israel for the Arab's bloody nose.

Right.

Let's see. You say Israel should give up territory to the Palestinians. Maybe not a bad idea, but let me ask you this.

Suppose Canada ceased to exist tomorrow, and all Canadians had to leave their country immediately. Do you suppose that 60 years later, Canadians would *still* be living in refugee camps in Montana??

I hardly think so.

The Middle East Arab Countries refuse to take in the Palestinians 'cuz they hate them as well. Only Jordan has stepped up to the plate, but it's a small country.

Why should Israel change anything 'cuz Arabs hate them for the stupidest of reasons and got their butts kicked trying to attack Israel?

One more question, ILP.

Is Lucifer Palestinian?

[kc7jty]

Quote[/b] (n2ize @ Dec. 31 2007,09:41)]Israel is the greatest country in the world.
head out.

[WF7A]

Quote[/b] (KP3FT @ Jan. 01 2008,02:20)]Funny how current events matches the Bible's predictions.
This isn't a religious jab, but isn't that like making the data fit the graph? The same claims can be said of Nostradamus's quatrains--his followers have said some of them were spot on in predicting the future. Then again, he made over 1,000 of them so out of sheer odds--and the unfortunate repetition of humans' folly throughout history--some of them will match a current event of some kind.

Personally, the only way there can be peace in the Middle East is for all the countries there to create a mutually satisfactory peace accord...if such a thing is possible; you can't force peace through military action. I think Aesop said it best: "Persuasion is better than force."

[k0ews]

I think Bin Laden is dead.

[W2ILP]

w4dfw

You seem to forget that the very existence of Israel caused the subjugation and relocation of millions of Muslims who lived relatively peacefully under British mandate before Jewish Zionists were given their "land of milk and honey".

There is no Lucifer. #As an atheist.. for me there is no Biblical God either. # The mythological attributes of Biblical Gods vary depending on whose Bibles are being taught.

Most of us have been preconditioned to believe in lots of stuff from childhood. #As we become adults most no longer believe in Santa Claus...but fear of death and suffering as well as subcoming to the path of conforming to what some believe are "the moral majority" makes the majority of people cling to what are actually nothing more than religious superstitions. #

The American Indians were chased off their lands by early Americans less than two centuries ago. Today we can not blame them for fighting back at the time that they were forced to move. #The American colonists had to fight the Indians and the Indians fought back whenever they could. #Many Americans thought that the Indians were less then human because they did not share the same culture or religion with the American settlers. They were seen as being more primitive to say the least. #There was a saying that there were no good Indians except dead Indians. #The Indians lost, probably because they did not have as many guns as the settlers had. #
#Now we know better. We now know that the Indians were humans and of the same human species as the American settlers, who took the best of their land from them by force.
Do we now blame the Indians for fighting back and for hating the "white men" in those days?http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif #Of cause not. #Why do we side with Jewish settler who came from Brooklyn, NY or Moscow, Russia and took the land of Muslims who lived on that land for as long as recorded history can tell?http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif
Does this have something to do with our own preconditioned religious beliefs? # #Obviously the Jews who sing, "This land is mine...God gave this land to me", #are not speaking for the Muslims who believe that Allah is another singular God that gave them the entire middle east.

The American Indians became weak in number, because they died of diseases and warfare. #Many actually intermarried with non Indians and many converted to the religions of the white Americans. #Their hatred thus died down and now American Indians #can run gambling casinos, etc....because the USA feels guilty for their early mistreatment. #
The Muslims however are more numerous in number than the Jews and just as fervent if not more so in their religious views. #Israelis have been inviting more Jews to move to Israel and religious Jews get bonuses for raising large families...but this can not help them to sufficiently raise the Jewish population of Israel so as to claim that they need territory any more than Muslims do.. #

The religious Muslims can be organized, even though the various sects fight and hate each other. #Make no mistake they all hate Israel even more than they hate other Muslims...but the few wealthy ones can tolerate Israel if it makes them wealthier. #We see millions of poor Muslims who make religious pilgrimages to Mecca and Medina. #Will they follow bin Laden or similar leaders? # I should think so...and if so... can they be stopped without the use of force? # I don't think so. #Should the U.S. be the nation to make a threat of being such a force? #After seeing how hard it has been to politically stabilize Iraq, Afghanistan and now Pakistan by the use of volunteer American troops on the ground;- #I don't think so. #And now...can we nuke them all...even though it would be inhumane and immoral? #I say no...because they might eventually become prepared to nuke us back. # They are not as likely to die out or be converted as the Amereican Indians were.

If the different religions cause hatreds they are STUPID reasons but if a fight for territory develops and reinforces such hatred it is not just based on stupid reasons...and territorial border wars become cause for political and nationalistic reasons. #SUICIDAL TERRORIST kill themselves for stupid religious reasons. #We can never know if and when there will be no such terrorists. # The Muslims were not well organized when Egypt and Syria (the UAR) lost a war against Israel. #They will probably be more organized next time I fear.

w2ilp (I Like Peace)...Escalating any reason for hatred can not lead to peace, whether a STUPID #religious reason or a pragmatic territorial reason.

[W4DFW]

Quote[/b] (W2ILP @ Jan. 01 2008,01:26)]w4dfw

You seem to forget that the very existence of Israel caused the subjugation and relocation of millions of Muslims who lived relatively peacefully under British mandate before Jewish Zionists were given their "land of milk and honey".

There is no Lucifer. As an atheist.. for me there is no Biblical God either. The mythological attributes of Biblical Gods vary depending on whose Bibles are being taught.

Most of us have been preconditioned to believe in lots of stuff from childhood. As we become adults most no longer believe in Santa Claus...but fear of death and suffering as well as subcoming to the path of conforming to what some believe are "the moral majority" makes the majority of people cling to what are actually nothing more than religious superstitions.

The American Indians were chased off their lands by early Americans less than two centuries ago. Today we can not blame them for fighting back at the time that they were forced to move. The American colonists had to fight the Indians and the Indians fought back whenever they could. Many Americans thought that the Indians were less then human because they did not share the same culture or religion with the American settlers. They were seen as being more primitive to say the least. There was a saying that there were no good Indians except dead Indians. The Indians lost, probably because they did not have as many guns as the settlers had.
Now we know better. We now know that the Indians were humans and of the same human species as the American settlers, who took the best of their land from them by force.
Do we now blame the Indians for fighting back and for hating the "white men" in those days?http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif Of cause not. Why do we side with Jewish settler who came from Brooklyn, NY or Moscow, Russia and took the land of Muslims who lived on that land for as long as recorded history can tell?http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif
Does this have something to do with our own preconditioned religious beliefs? Obviously the Jews who sing, "This land is mine...God gave this land to me", are not speaking for the Muslims who believe that Allah is another singular God that gave them the entire middle east.

The American Indians became weak in number, because they died of diseases and warfare. Many actually intermarried with non Indians and many converted to the religions of the white Americans. Their hatred thus died down and now American Indians can run gambling casinos, etc....because the USA feels guilty for their early mistreatment.
The Muslims however are more numerous in number than the Jews and just as fervent if not more so in their religious views. Israelis have been inviting more Jews to move to Israel and religious Jews get bonuses for raising large families...but this can not help them to sufficiently raise the Jewish population of Israel so as to claim that they need territory any more than Muslims do..

The religious Muslims can be organized, even though the various sects fight and hate each other. Make no mistake they all hate Israel even more than they hate other Muslims...but the few wealthy ones can tolerate Israel if it makes them wealthier. We see millions of poor Muslims who make religious pilgrimages to Mecca and Medina. Will they follow bin Laden or similar leaders? I should think so...and if so... can they be stopped without the use of force? I don't think so. Should the U.S. be the nation to make a threat of being such a force? After seeing how hard it has been to politically stabilize Iraq, Afghanistan and now Pakistan by the use of volunteer American troops on the ground;- I don't think so. And now...can we nuke them all...even though it would be inhumane and immoral? I say no...because they might eventually become prepared to nuke us back. They are not as likely to die out or be converted as the Amereican Indians were.

If the different religions cause hatreds they are STUPID reasons but if a fight for territory develops and reinforces such hatred it is not just based on stupid reasons...and territorial border wars become cause for political and nationalistic reasons. SUICIDAL TERRORIST kill themselves for stupid religious reasons. We can never know if and when there will be no such terrorists. The Muslims were not well organized when Egypt and Syria (the UAR) lost a war against Israel. They will probably be more organized next time I fear.

w2ilp (I Like Peace)...Escalating any reason for hatred can not lead to peace, whether a STUPID religious reason or a pragmatic territorial reason.
Idiots Like Palestine!

[kc7jty]

Quote[/b] (W4DFW @ Jan. 01 2008,23:37)]Idiots Like Palestine!
priceless! http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif

[w3wn]

Quote[/b] (W2ILP @ Jan. 02 2008,01:26)]w4dfw

You seem to forget that the very existence of Israel caused the subjugation and relocation of millions of Muslims who lived relatively peacefully under British mandate before Jewish Zionists were given their "land of milk and honey".
Ummm... no.

It is conveniently overlooked that prior to the 1948 war and the events leading up to it, most land "occupied" by the "Zionists" was legally purchased. No one was "forced" to relocate. In fact, most of the land purchased was considered poor or downright uninhabbitable... until it was reclaimed by one manner or another.

It is conveniently overlooked that at the outbreak of the 1948 war... which occurred after the United Nations voted to partition the former British Protectorate of Palestine into two nations... many Arab residents of the territory that later made up post-1948 Israel were encouraged to flee by their fellow Arabs, and were promised that after the Israelis were pushed into the sea, they could return to their homes and then claim the now abandonded settlements and cities. Didn't happen, of course.

It is conveniently overlooked that after the cessation of the 1948 hostilities -- the end of the shooting war even though "peace" was never truly established -- the Arab nations of the area had the opportunity to establish what we would now consider Palestine in the Gaza Strip and West Bank territories, and resettle those who fled the war there permanently. Instead, Gaza and the West Bank were formally absorbed by Egypt and Jordan. And those who fled the fighting were put in refugee camps, in those territories and elsewhere, and left there to basically rot for almost 20 years.

It is conveniently forgotten that those of Arab descent who did not flee were not thrown out of Israel, but permitted to stay and for the most part flourish.

You can certainly argue that the British, almost 100 years ago, had no business making the Balfour Declaration and declaring that they supported the return of those of Jewish descent to territory that they did not yet control. That doesn't change the fact that it happened. But there was a lot more that happened between then and now. To whitewash it with blanket statements that do not pertain to reality but do pertain to political correctness at it's worst is doing a disservice to all who read this.