Forbid the use [Archive]

K6UEY

10-02-2007, 10:23 PM

Even though the Novice License is no longer issued there still may be some Novices running around. I think calling a Technician a Novice is demeaning to the Novice Class Licensee.

The Novice as an entry level license was far more Technically oriented than to days Technician.

I think a "Neophyte" more apply describes their level of expertise .
Just the use of the word Technician is a diservice to the original Technician License who had to pass the General level Theory exam to get a license. The present level who get 5 points if they spell their name correctly, and 10 points if more than 15 letters of the alphabet are used!!
http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif

kl7aj

10-02-2007, 10:25 PM

Quote[/b] (K6UEY @ Oct. 02 2007,15:23)]Even though the Novice License is no longer issued there still may be some Novices running around. I think calling a Technician a Novice is demeaning to the Novice Class Licensee.

The Novice as an entry level license was far more Technically oriented than to days Technician.

I think a "Neophyte" more apply describes their level of expertise .
Just the use of the word Technician is a diservice to the original Technician License who had to pass the General level Theory exam to get a license. The present level who get 5 points if they spell their name correctly, and 10 points if more than 15 letters of the alphabet are used!!
http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif
That's why I specify novice with a small "n". Incidentally, when will the last of the Novices (with a capital N) expire?

wz9o

10-02-2007, 10:25 PM

Mommy…the big bad hammies called me a newbie!!
http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

KM5FL

10-02-2007, 10:28 PM

Why do we have to call them anything except what they are --- Technicians?http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif? Why must some of you guys always have to put a label on people??

http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif

VO1GXG

10-02-2007, 10:35 PM

Quote[/b] (KM5FL @ Oct. 02 2007,12:28)]Why do we have to call them anything except what they are --- Technicians?http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif? Why must some of you guys always have to put a label on people??

http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif
yes!

Whats wrong with calling em Ham's ? Or at the least New Ham's .

K6UEY

10-02-2007, 10:37 PM

kl7aj,
Unless I'm mistaken you can renew the Novice license now, unlike the the original,so I guess until the licensee expires, he can renew it forever.

As to the use of lower case letters that may create a hardship on some,I often see messages posted on QRZ using the old communications typewriters that have only upper case letters. # # http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif

kl7aj

10-02-2007, 10:37 PM

Quote[/b] (VO1GXG @ Oct. 02 2007,15:35)]Quote[/b] (KM5FL @ Oct. 02 2007,12:28)]Why do we have to call them anything except what they are --- Technicians?http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif? Why must some of you guys always have to put a label on people??

http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif
yes!

Whats wrong with calling em Ham's ? Or at the least New Ham's .
How about "piglets"? http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

kl7aj

10-02-2007, 10:38 PM

Or maybe "sausages".

K6UEY

10-02-2007, 10:43 PM

How about "SWINELETS"??

kl7aj

10-02-2007, 10:44 PM

I suppose, XYL's would have to be renamed "sows" http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

AA0CX

10-02-2007, 10:47 PM

"Hamlets." http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

kl7aj

10-02-2007, 10:49 PM

Or more poetically....a lamb.

Lamb radio operator. I like it. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

KC0ZZH

10-02-2007, 11:04 PM

Call them Hams, so what if they are new. We need more young people in this hobby.

k3wrv

10-02-2007, 11:19 PM

Eric-
you're discriminating against those of us who choose not to appreciate and be inconvenienced by the opearting system you choose to use. Noobie in Linux means you're not LEET (or as bastardized, L133T)
You wanna be a Winsucker?
In the Linux world, we try to help newcomers, and we have names for them, like NOOBIES, NUBIES, etc. and nobody takes offense.
I've even referred to myself (And I HAVE been licnsed longer than you) as a NOOB occasionally.
Get over it! We are all Noobies at something. If you don't know how to fix it, ask somebody who does. You got a quick and easy way to make a polorimeter out of some old P-3's?
de /.Bob/ grep| Winsuckckers | stdout >dev/nul

kl7aj

10-02-2007, 11:38 PM

Quote[/b] (k3wrv @ Oct. 02 2007,16:19)]Eric-
you're discriminating against those of us who choose not to appreciate and be inconvenienced by the opearting system you choose to use. Noobie in Linux means you're not LEET (or as bastardized, L133T)
You wanna be a Winsucker?
In the Linux world, we try to help newcomers, and we have names for them, like NOOBIES, NUBIES, etc. and nobody takes offense.
I've even referred to myself (And I HAVE been licnsed longer than you) as a NOOB occasionally.
Get over it! We are all Noobies at something. If you don't know how to fix it, ask somebody who does. You got a quick and easy way to make a polorimeter out of some old P-3's?
de /.Bob/ grep| Winsuckckers | stdout >dev/nul
I think you missed my point entirely. I'm just saying, since a lot of new hams already define themselves as "noobies" we should at least pick a better term! Novice is a great term with a really honorable history. Every field of endeavor has newcomers, and we really shouldn't degrade that fact with a really lame term like noobie, when there are other perfectly good words.

-E

AG3Y

10-02-2007, 11:54 PM

Well, Eric, on one of my latest posts I used the term "noobie" in quote marks, so that the newcomer would know EXACTLY who I was addressing. Since I see so many newcomers calling themselves "NOOBS" "NEWBIES" "NOOBIES" and all the alternative nom de plumes, I really expect that we are just frustrating ourselves by trying to come up with another name.

If one is a "Noobie" he should wear the title with distinction. An exemplary "noob" will learn quickly, and just as quickly grow out of that stature. Otherwise, he/she might just become a "Lid" and remain known as that for the rest of time !

http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif 73, Jim

k3wrv

10-02-2007, 11:59 PM

Hi Eric-
Forgot the footnotes- Eric Raymond, the Art of Unix Programming, and a bunch of others.
Essentially agree with you, but new hikers (and Boy sprouts) are "tenderfeet". Newcomers shouldn't take offense. They're treading on sacred ground and need to learn the ropes. I spent nearly 35 years working Novices, before my code speed and muscles got to the point I can't slow down that much any more. Honestly, I can't get the J-38 below about 13 wpm these days, and for me, that's taken a lot of fun out of the hobby.
Part of the problem is that new hams now seem to think they know it all, and won't listen. Think Sokrates said something similar long before I was born.
Problem in my view is that nobody wants to learn ANYTHING after they've got their Extra, and that's not how Ham Radio Works!!. We all learn from each other.
One of my recent posts was about how to get fol;kl to answer me on 2M when mobile portable, and got some geat advice from the Tech's.
A driver's license is just a license to learn, and so is a Ham Radio Ticket. We need more elmering, and even teh Elmers need Elmering from time to time.
Are we on the same page?
On SSTV, we often have "Noobies" coming on the air who haven't bothered to adjust their slants, and are pretty hard to copy.
I can't propose a solution. Best I can do is point out the problem - if you don't know what you're doing, know somebody who does.
Noobie doesn't mean an insult. Just means read the man page, and do a bit of studying. A ham radio station isn't built in a day - it takes most of a lifetime.
de Bob

WA9SVD

10-03-2007, 12:02 AM

Quote[/b] (KM5FL @ Oct. 02 2007,15:28)]Why do we have to call them anything except what they are --- Technicians?http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif? Why must some of you guys always have to put a label on people??

http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif
Because (in the U.S.) they are NOT all "Technicians." Some are Generals, and some are even Extras.

The term is used in many ways, some as a generic term for a newly or recently licensed individual, and yes, unfortunately, some DO use it as a derogatory term.

But the same set of circumstances applies to the terms "OF" and even "OT." Some use those as a reference to a person with many years of experience, perhaps even with a reverential tone, while others use it in a derogatory manner to indicate someone who is opposed to new rules, new technologies, disrespects new operators, and any change in Amateur Radio in the last 60 years.

KC9JIQ

10-03-2007, 12:07 AM

Quote[/b] (wa9svd @ Oct. 02 2007,17:02)]Quote[/b] (KM5FL @ Oct. 02 2007,15:28)]Why do we have to call them anything except what they are --- Technicians?http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif? Why must some of you guys always have to put a label on people??

http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif
Because (in the U.S.) they are NOT all "Technicians." #Some are Generals, and some are even Extras.
Don't forget the Advanced operators that refused to upgrade to a downgrade! http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif

N0KLT

10-03-2007, 12:20 AM

Quote[/b] (kl7aj @ Oct. 02 2007,16:44)]I suppose, XYL's would have to be renamed "sows" http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif
You go ahead and call one that, but first let someone know where to send the flowers for the funeral or if you are lucky, the extended hospital stay http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

WA9SVD

10-03-2007, 12:24 AM

Quote[/b] (KC9JIQ @ Oct. 02 2007,17:07)]Quote[/b] (wa9svd @ Oct. 02 2007,17:02)]Quote[/b] (KM5FL @ Oct. 02 2007,15:28)]Why do we have to call them anything except what they are --- Technicians?http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif? Why must some of you guys always have to put a label on people??

http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif
Because (in the U.S.) they are NOT all "Technicians." Some are Generals, and some are even Extras.
Don't forget the Advanced operators that refused to upgrade to a downgrade! http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif
Somehow, I doubt there are any Advanced license holders that are "newbies." At least, I would HOPE any licensed holder of an Advanced ticket before the FCC decided to stop issuing that class license would have "advanced" (not sure the pun is intended or not, YMMV) beyond the "newbie" stage by now.

KC0OFZ

10-03-2007, 02:58 AM

Quote[/b] (kl7aj @ Oct. 02 2007,15:44)]I suppose, XYL's would have to be renamed "sows" http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif
WOW!! Are you that brave or just plain good ol' crazy? If you can get away with that, well ,then more power to you. Just in case you don't, can I have your radios?
http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif

kf4vgx

10-03-2007, 03:25 AM

Call it as you will http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif .
Amateurs grow bored of ridicule http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif .
Ridiculing seems to be the passion of amateurs these days http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif .

N8CPA

10-03-2007, 08:40 AM

Quote[/b] (VO1GXG @ Oct. 02 2007,18:35)]Quote[/b] (KM5FL @ Oct. 02 2007,12:28)]Why do we have to call them anything except what they are --- Technicians?http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif? Why must some of you guys always have to put a label on people??

http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif
yes!

Whats wrong with calling em Ham's ? Or at the least New Ham's .
Because Ham's is a misspelling, unless it's intended as a possessive, or a contraction of "Ham is." #If you're talking about "a ham's rig," or "those hams' licenses," or "that ham's an XYL," the apostrophe is apropos. #But "hams," as a plural doesn't get one.

Good grief! #You have to explain everything to these newbies.

# http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

2W0ZAE

10-03-2007, 09:53 AM

Quote[/b] (KC0ZZH @ Oct. 02 2007,16:04)]Call them Hams, so what if they are new. #We need more young people in this hobby.
Could not agree more myself just started in this great hobby but late in life in my 60s.Just started the Intermediate second licence course.M3s or any other new licence holder.They should have the same respect as any other licenced operators.And in most cases helped in every way they can.Because without the influx of new Hams this hobby would be dead in around 10 to 15 years.And respectively remind the full Hams that once they were Newbies too.

2W0ZAE

10-03-2007, 09:54 AM

double post

n9lya

10-03-2007, 10:05 AM

And to think we wasted valuable server space for this thread...

http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif

Only the weak minded would take offense to a term that has been used for decades to describe someone who is NEW to something...

k6jpd

10-03-2007, 11:46 AM

Quote[/b] (n0nwo @ Oct. 02 2007,14:47)]Ok... No more "noobie"

How about...

newbie
newby
nuby
nooby
nuebie

would any of these work better?
http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif #

Minton
wait, we are missing a great chance to expand this.
don't forget procedural signals :
newbie ..KNewbie
newby .. KNewby
nuby .. KNuby
nooby ..KNooby
nuebie ..KNuebie

KN...., that way it will apply only to that particular person, and not be a general statement #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

N8CPA

10-03-2007, 01:58 PM

Quote[/b] (k6jpd @ Oct. 03 2007,07:46)]Quote[/b] (n0nwo @ Oct. 02 2007,14:47)]Ok... No more "noobie"

How about...

newbie
newby
nuby
nooby
nuebie

would any of these work better?
http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif #

Minton
wait, we are missing a great chance to expand this.
don't forget procedural signals :
newbie ..KNewbie
newby .. KNewby
nuby .. KNuby
nooby ..KNooby
nuebie ..KNuebie

KN...., that way it will apply only to that particular person, and not be a general statement #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif
Actually, the KN is a (. And KK is ).

So that would be (ooby, (ewbie, etc.

Are you such a (ooby that I had to tell you that?
http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

kl7aj

10-03-2007, 03:22 PM

Quote[/b] (N8CPA @ Oct. 03 2007,06:58)]Quote[/b] (k6jpd @ Oct. 03 2007,07:46)]Quote[/b] (n0nwo @ Oct. 02 2007,14:47)]Ok... No more "noobie"

How about...

newbie
newby
nuby
nooby
nuebie

would any of these work better?
http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif #

Minton
wait, we are missing a great chance to expand this.
don't forget procedural signals :
newbie ..KNewbie
newby .. KNewby
nuby .. KNuby
nooby ..KNooby
nuebie ..KNuebie

KN...., that way it will apply only to that particular person, and not be a general statement #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif
Actually, the KN is a (. And KK is ).

So that would be (ooby, (ewbie, etc.

Are you such a (ooby that I had to tell you that?
http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif
What in tarnation is a "Kilonoobie"? http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif

N8CPA

10-03-2007, 03:41 PM

Quote[/b] (kl7aj @ Oct. 03 2007,11:22)]Quote[/b] (N8CPA @ Oct. 03 2007,06:58)]Quote[/b] (k6jpd @ Oct. 03 2007,07:46)]Quote[/b] (n0nwo @ Oct. 02 2007,14:47)]Ok... No more "noobie"

How about...

newbie
newby
nuby
nooby
nuebie

would any of these work better?
http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif #

Minton
wait, we are missing a great chance to expand this.
don't forget procedural signals :
newbie ..KNewbie
newby .. KNewby
nuby .. KNuby
nooby ..KNooby
nuebie ..KNuebie

KN...., that way it will apply only to that particular person, and not be a general statement #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif
Actually, the KN is a (. And KK is ).

So that would be (ooby, (ewbie, etc.

Are you such a (ooby that I had to tell you that?
http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif
What in tarnation is a "Kilonoobie"? #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif
I admit, I'm kind of bad at arithmetic. #Uncorrectable dyscalculia, you know--both horrible and incurable. #But isn't kilonoobie = .001 x meganoobie?

http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif

And sometimes I can't see my errors for my mistakes.

K7JBQ

10-03-2007, 03:49 PM

Quote[/b] (kl7aj @ Oct. 03 2007,08:22)]Quote[/b] (N8CPA @ Oct. 03 2007,06:58)]Quote[/b] (k6jpd @ Oct. 03 2007,07:46)]Quote[/b] (n0nwo @ Oct. 02 2007,14:47)]Ok... No more "noobie"

How about...

newbie
newby
nuby
nooby
nuebie

would any of these work better?
http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif #

Minton
wait, we are missing a great chance to expand this.
don't forget procedural signals :
newbie ..KNewbie
newby .. KNewby
nuby .. KNuby
nooby ..KNooby
nuebie ..KNuebie

KN...., that way it will apply only to that particular person, and not be a general statement #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif
Actually, the KN is a (. And KK is ).

So that would be (ooby, (ewbie, etc.

Are you such a (ooby that I had to tell you that?
http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif
What in tarnation is a "Kilonoobie"? #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif
A noobie with an Alpha, of course. Jeesh.

And while we're at it, why has no one noted before that about the last thing a new Techician is, is a technician?

Maybe we should amend a fine old tradition: You get to be a noobie for one year, max. No renewal. Upgrade or pffffft.

In that one year, the noobie gets cut some slack when he/she asks questions like "what dipole should I buy?"

After that, it's "read the book."

73,
Bill

N8UZE

10-03-2007, 04:06 PM

I've never considered newbie to be a derogatory term.

KI4ODO

10-03-2007, 04:13 PM

How long should a person be considered a noobie, newby, newbie, nuby, whatever? LOL I am coming along pretty good. Ragchewing at 12-15wpm, pretty involved in my local club, learning more and more. I still feel new. I'm thinking maybe a year? I have been a general since March, a tech for a year before that. I still feel new, but my skill and knowledge is totally different from March now. What say you? I think an active year at a certain level, be it tech, general, or extra.

N8UZE

10-03-2007, 04:16 PM

Quote[/b] (KI4ODO @ Oct. 03 2007,12:13)]How long should a person be considered a noobie, newby, newbie, nuby, whatever? LOL I am coming along pretty good. Ragchewing at 12-15wpm, pretty involved in my local club, learning more and more. I still feel new. I'm thinking maybe a year? I have been a general since March, a tech for a year before that. I still feel new, but my skill and knowledge is totally different from March now. What say you? I think an active year at a certain level, be it tech, general, or extra.
I think that will vary from individual to individual. However when you start to answer more questions from others than you can think of to ask, you should be past the newbie stage.

KI4ODO

10-03-2007, 04:20 PM

Quote[/b] (N8UZE @ Oct. 03 2007,09:16)]Quote[/b] (KI4ODO @ Oct. 03 2007,12:13)]How long should a person be considered a noobie, newby, newbie, nuby, whatever? LOL I am coming along pretty good. Ragchewing at 12-15wpm, pretty involved in my local club, learning more and more. I still feel new. I'm thinking maybe a year? I have been a general since March, a tech for a year before that. I still feel new, but my skill and knowledge is totally different from March now. What say you? I think an active year at a certain level, be it tech, general, or extra.
I think that will vary from individual to individual. #However when you start to answer more questions from others than you can think of to ask, you should be past the newbie stage.
great point

kl7aj

10-03-2007, 04:25 PM

Quote[/b] (KI4ODO @ Oct. 03 2007,09:20)]Quote[/b] (N8UZE @ Oct. 03 2007,09:16)]Quote[/b] (KI4ODO @ Oct. 03 2007,12:13)]How long should a person be considered a noobie, newby, newbie, nuby, whatever? LOL I am coming along pretty good. Ragchewing at 12-15wpm, pretty involved in my local club, learning more and more. I still feel new. I'm thinking maybe a year? I have been a general since March, a tech for a year before that. I still feel new, but my skill and knowledge is totally different from March now. What say you? I think an active year at a certain level, be it tech, general, or extra.
I think that will vary from individual to individual. #However when you start to answer more questions from others than you can think of to ask, you should be past the newbie stage.
great point
I passed my General class license on the VERY DAY my Novice license expired.....back when it was 2 years. I almost became an ex-novice...or a has-been-noobie, I suppose. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

WA9SVD

10-03-2007, 04:27 PM

Quote[/b] (KI4ODO @ Oct. 03 2007,09:13)]How long should a person be considered a noobie, newby, newbie, nuby, whatever? LOL I am coming along pretty good. Ragchewing at 12-15wpm, pretty involved in my local club, learning more and more. I still feel new. I'm thinking maybe a year? I have been a general since March, a tech for a year before that. I still feel new, but my skill and knowledge is totally different from March now. What say you? I think an active year at a certain level, be it tech, general, or extra.
Actually, it's a nebulous (or is that "noobulous?") concept.
A Newbie is someone with NO experience. It's NOT necesarily a derogatory term (Just like OT or even OF.) But with experience, a person begins to be able to ANSWER questions, not just ask them. (So maybe THAT is where the term "novice" [small "n"] could come in.) But with more experience, a person can begin to answer most questions themselves, and actively STRIVE to increase their knowlwdge. But again, it's a relative thing. Some can pass theough the "newbie" stage in a few months, and others take years and years to progress. To some extent, it IS a state of mind.

kl7aj

10-03-2007, 04:33 PM

Quote[/b] (wa9svd @ Oct. 03 2007,09:27)]Quote[/b] (KI4ODO @ Oct. 03 2007,09:13)]How long should a person be considered a noobie, newby, newbie, nuby, whatever? LOL I am coming along pretty good. Ragchewing at 12-15wpm, pretty involved in my local club, learning more and more. I still feel new. I'm thinking maybe a year? I have been a general since March, a tech for a year before that. I still feel new, but my skill and knowledge is totally different from March now. What say you? I think an active year at a certain level, be it tech, general, or extra.
Actually, it's a nebulous (or is that "noobulous?") concept.
# #A Newbie is someone with NO experience. #It's NOT necesarily a derogatory term (Just like OT or even OF.) #But with experience, a person begins to be able to ANSWER questions, not just ask them. #(So maybe THAT is where the term "novice" [small "n"] could come in.) #But with more experience, a person can begin to answer most questions themselves, and actively STRIVE to increase their knowlwdge. #But again, it's a relative thing. #Some can pass theough the "newbie" stage in a few months, and others take years and years to progress. #To some extent, it IS a state of mind.
Actually, in the original sense, a novice was a monk-in-training. He had ALREADY passed a certain bar by that point. In this sense Novice license was a very correct adaptation of this. And the original term of 1 year was actually very appropriate, as well.

Most self proclaimed noobies on QRZ are already licensed, so I wouldn't say "no experience."

Of course, this is all highly variable. Lots of Novices in times past came out of years of shortwave listening and such, and knew more than a lot of Extras do now.

But, if you have to put a time on it....I'd say a year is good. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

n9vo

10-03-2007, 04:41 PM

Quote[/b] (n9lya @ Oct. 03 2007,03:05)]And to think we wasted valuable server space for this thread...

http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif

Only the weak minded would take offense to a term that has been used for decades to describe someone who is NEW to something...
I would say that most of "aj"'s posts are a waste of server space. Completely frivilous.........Some people have entirely too much time on their hands. Averaging over 4 posts a day. Give us a break or come up with something worthwhile. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

WA9SVD

10-03-2007, 04:51 PM

Quote[/b] (kl7aj @ Oct. 03 2007,09:33)]Quote[/b] (wa9svd @ Oct. 03 2007,09:27)]Quote[/b] (KI4ODO @ Oct. 03 2007,09:13)]How long should a person be considered a noobie, newby, newbie, nuby, whatever? LOL I am coming along pretty good. Ragchewing at 12-15wpm, pretty involved in my local club, learning more and more. I still feel new. I'm thinking maybe a year? I have been a general since March, a tech for a year before that. I still feel new, but my skill and knowledge is totally different from March now. What say you? I think an active year at a certain level, be it tech, general, or extra.
Actually, it's a nebulous (or is that "noobulous?") concept.
A Newbie is someone with NO experience. It's NOT necesarily a derogatory term (Just like OT or even OF.) But with experience, a person begins to be able to ANSWER questions, not just ask them. (So maybe THAT is where the term "novice" [small "n"] could come in.) But with more experience, a person can begin to answer most questions themselves, and actively STRIVE to increase their knowlwdge. But again, it's a relative thing. Some can pass theough the "newbie" stage in a few months, and others take years and years to progress. To some extent, it IS a state of mind.
Actually, in the original sense, a novice was a monk-in-training. He had ALREADY passed a certain bar by that point. In this sense Novice license was a very correct adaptation of this. And the original term of 1 year was actually very appropriate, as well.

Most self proclaimed noobies on QRZ are already licensed, so I wouldn't say "no experience."

Of course, this is all highly variable. Lots of Novices in times past came out of years of shortwave listening and such, and knew more than a lot of Extras do now.

But, if you have to put a time on it....I'd say a year is good. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif
Well, actually a "novice" was a monk OR a nun in training. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

And I'll agree, Eric, that "newbie" (no matter HOW it's spelled) should apply to someone with no real experience. (And I'm from the time when NOVICE license was one year, non-renewable.)
But today, a license, ofANY level, does NOT indicate ANY level of "experience." It's merely a license to GAIN experience. (Again, that's the FCC's decision, but no license indicates any level of experience.)

But I disagree with pinning a specific time period on the term. Some (probably many if not most) newly licensed operators gain experience and knowledge is short order, and can honestly shed the moniker of newbie with honor.
But what of the "instant Extra," who buys a $4000 radio, buys a $500 dipole, or has a tower put up by a commercial company, and has someone put up that tribander beam, but then asks why his legal limit linear doesn't work on 10 Meters with the same RG-58 he used in his previous experience? Even after five years, is he considered experienced, or just a "newbie," (although other terms may also apply?)

KE3WD

10-03-2007, 04:56 PM

These old eyebrows raised over the topic header with the word, "Fordbid" in it.

Which IMO is far more nefarious than any word that "forbid" the use of connotates.

Furthermore, the term in question is one that the young people do indeed use all over the internet and text messaging, it has become a firmly planted part of the vernacular -- and if you really want to look like old farts that don't want any young folks into the hobby, start "forbidding" the use of their terminology whenever you see them.

That's what I think about it.

KE3WD

kl7aj

10-03-2007, 05:01 PM

Good points. Well, as most of us know, amateur radio existed for quite a while before there was a novice class license. This was because it was just ASSUMED everyone had an Elmer...which was,indeed a very good assumption. It's really something we need to get BACK to. If I ran the FCC, I'd put in a requirement that you have to show proof that you sat at the feet of a certified Elmer before even taking a test. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif (Now wouldn't THAT go over like a lead balloon). However, many countries have "experience" tests....I think Russia at one time required that you made a certain number of confirmed contacts before upgrading. That really wasn't a bad idea.

But, whether required or not...we REALLY really really really really need to get back to encouraging elmering.
Noobies, newbies or whatever you want to call them absolutely NEED to see a functioning ham station for a while. I don't think there's ANY debate about that

eric

N8CPA

10-03-2007, 05:03 PM

Quote[/b] (wa9svd @ Oct. 03 2007,12:51)]Quote[/b] (kl7aj @ Oct. 03 2007,09:33)]Quote[/b] (wa9svd @ Oct. 03 2007,09:27)]Quote[/b] (KI4ODO @ Oct. 03 2007,09:13)]How long should a person be considered a noobie, newby, newbie, nuby, whatever? LOL I am coming along pretty good. Ragchewing at 12-15wpm, pretty involved in my local club, learning more and more. I still feel new. I'm thinking maybe a year? I have been a general since March, a tech for a year before that. I still feel new, but my skill and knowledge is totally different from March now. What say you? I think an active year at a certain level, be it tech, general, or extra.
Actually, it's a nebulous (or is that "noobulous?") concept.
# #A Newbie is someone with NO experience. #It's NOT necesarily a derogatory term (Just like OT or even OF.) #But with experience, a person begins to be able to ANSWER questions, not just ask them. #(So maybe THAT is where the term "novice" [small "n"] could come in.) #But with more experience, a person can begin to answer most questions themselves, and actively STRIVE to increase their knowlwdge. #But again, it's a relative thing. #Some can pass theough the "newbie" stage in a few months, and others take years and years to progress. #To some extent, it IS a state of mind.
Actually, in the original sense, a novice was a monk-in-training. #He had ALREADY passed a certain bar by that point. #In this sense Novice license was a very correct adaptation of this. #And the original term of 1 year was actually very appropriate, as well.

Most self proclaimed noobies on QRZ are already licensed, so I wouldn't say "no experience." #

Of course, this is all highly variable. #Lots of Novices in times past came out of years of shortwave listening and such, and knew more than a lot of Extras do now. #

But, if you have to put a time on it....I'd say a year is good. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif
Well, actually a "novice" was a monk OR a nun in training. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

# #And I'll agree, Eric, that "newbie" (no matter HOW it's spelled) should apply to someone with no real experience. #(And I'm from the time when NOVICE license was one year, non-renewable.)
# #But today, a license, ofANY level, does NOT indicate ANY level of "experience." #It's merely a license to GAIN experience. #(Again, that's the FCC's decision, but no license indicates any level of experience.)

# #But I disagree with pinning a specific time period on the term. #Some (probably many if not most) newly licensed operators gain experience and knowledge is short order, and can honestly shed the moniker of newbie with honor.
# #But what of the "instant Extra," who buys a $4000 radio, buys a $500 dipole, or has a tower put up by a commercial company, and has someone put up that tribander beam, but then asks why his legal limit linear doesn't work on 10 Meters with the same RG-58 he used in his previous experience? #Even after five years, is he considered experienced, or just a "newbie," (although other terms may also apply?)
Novice is derived from Latin Novus, meaning exactly what it does in the context of licensing; new.

And Technician implies a lot more than it delivers for an entry level license. The Novice license at least used to tell more experienced hams to cut a guy some slack. Not anymore.

If I went to the garage for brake service and the man's (generic syntax--I don't want to hear what a sexist I am) name tag said, "Novice," I'd ask for at least a Technician.

kl7aj

10-03-2007, 05:10 PM

Quote[/b] (n9vo @ Oct. 03 2007,09:41)]Quote[/b] (n9lya @ Oct. 03 2007,03:05)]And to think we wasted valuable server space for this thread...

http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif

Only the weak minded would take offense to a term that has been used for decades to describe someone who is NEW to something...
I would say that most of "aj"'s posts are a waste of server space. Completely frivilous.........Some people have entirely too much time on their hands. Averaging over 4 posts a day. Give us a break or come up with something worthwhile. #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif
Hey...that's why God invented the "Format C:" command. Fred is more than welcome to use it. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

eric

WA9SVD

10-03-2007, 05:12 PM

Quote[/b] (KE3WD @ Oct. 03 2007,09:56)]These old eyebrows raised over the topic header with the word, "Fordbid" in it.

Which IMO is far more nefarious than any word that "forbid" the use of connotates.

Furthermore, the term in question is one that the young people do indeed use all over the internet and text messaging, it has become a firmly planted part of the vernacular -- and if you really want to look like old farts that don't want any young folks into the hobby, start "forbidding" the use of their terminology whenever you see them.

That's what I think about it.

KE3WD
Very good point, that extends beyond this current thread. "FORBID" should only apply to personal attacks, indecent/obscene/vulgar language, and name-calling.

kl7aj

10-03-2007, 05:19 PM

Quote[/b] (wa9svd @ Oct. 03 2007,10:12)]Quote[/b] (KE3WD @ Oct. 03 2007,09:56)]These old eyebrows raised over the topic header with the word, "Fordbid" in it. #

Which IMO is far more nefarious than any word that "forbid" the use of connotates. #

Furthermore, the term in question is one that the young people do indeed use all over the internet and text messaging, it has become a firmly planted part of the vernacular -- and if you really want to look like old farts that don't want any young folks into the hobby, start "forbidding" the use of their terminology whenever you see them. #

That's what I think about it.

KE3WD
Very good point, that extends beyond this current thread. #"FORBID" should only apply to personal attacks, indecent/obscene/vulgar language, and name-calling.
Mea Culpa.....I should have used the words "strongly discouraged."

http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

k0cmh

10-03-2007, 09:26 PM

DSL would be a term some here would like to substitute (dumb slackard lid).

WA9SVD

10-03-2007, 09:46 PM

Quote[/b] (k0cmh @ Oct. 03 2007,14:26)]DSL would be a term some here would like to substitute (dumb slackard lid).
That was uncalled for, unless you were blessed with a profusion of knowledge and inate experience in Amateur Radio the day before YOU were licensed.
The rest of us mere mortals had to start somewhere.

KI4WCQ

10-04-2007, 06:00 PM

How about "sorry, dumb f*^&!@#, no code , worthless, chicken bander? That's the reason I only browse this site to see if there's an occasional useful answer to a technical problem. I learned a long time ago to never ask your own question here....you either get beaten up for not passing a code test, not being able to send 40 wpm, and for the general state (as perceived by the lords of these forums) of amateur radio.

Meanwhile, I'm trying to read an understand every word that was ever written about radio theory so I will never have to ask a question on this forum. Besides, from the vitriol I've encountered on QRZ I am not sure I'd completely trust answers from several of the prominent posters here. I think some would set you up for equipment damage just for laughs. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif

WA9SVD

10-05-2007, 05:12 AM

Quote[/b] (KI4WCQ @ Oct. 04 2007,11:00)]How about "sorry, dumb f*^&!@#, no code , worthless, chicken bander? That's the reason I only browse this site to see if there's an occasional useful answer to a technical problem. I learned a long time ago to never ask your own question here....you either get beaten up for not passing a code test, not being able to send 40 wpm, and for the general state (as perceived by the lords of these forums) of amateur radio.

Meanwhile, I'm trying to read an understand every word that was ever written about radio theory so I will never have to ask a question on this forum. Besides, from the vitriol I've encountered on QRZ I am not sure I'd completely trust answers from several of the prominent posters here. I think some would set you up for equipment damage just for laughs. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif
If that's the way you see yourself and others, so be it. In that case, we probably can't help you.

Have a legitimate question and want an honest answer? Q&A is the place. (Not "Talk and Opinions." That's your first mistake.)
But be willing to accept an honest answer, not necessarily the answer you want.

ky5u

10-05-2007, 01:28 PM

Quote[/b] ]KI4WCQ: How about "sorry, dumb f*^&!@#, no code , worthless, chicken bander?I think your self assessment is a little cruel. After all, it's obvious you're not "sorry".

By the way, the word "Noobie" comes from "Noo Noo", the Teletubby Vacuum critter and from "Bie" as in Bie Tingfang a Chinese warlord who is known for his ceasless efforts to fight communism. Noobie literally means "Sucks at putting forth great effort".

W0BKR

10-05-2007, 03:47 PM

So if you upgrade, are you also no longer considered an OF, OT, Elitest, etc?

KL1ZB

10-05-2007, 07:26 PM

Quote[/b] (KI4WCQ @ Oct. 03 2007,12:00)]How about "sorry, dumb f*^&!@#, no code , worthless, chicken bander? That's the reason I only browse this site to see if there's an occasional useful answer to a technical problem. I learned a long time ago to never ask your own question here....you either get beaten up for not passing a code test, not being able to send 40 wpm, and for the general state (as perceived by the lords of these forums) of amateur radio.

Meanwhile, I'm trying to read an understand every word that was ever written about radio theory so I will never have to ask a question on this forum. Besides, from the vitriol I've encountered on QRZ I am not sure I'd completely trust answers from several of the prominent posters here. I think some would set you up for equipment damage just for laughs. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif
I totally agree with what you said.

kb9xn

10-06-2007, 03:18 AM

I say get rid of NEWBIES and NOOBIES and the one on the top of my list of expressions to get rid of is XYL.

My wife of 43 years has always been my wife and never my XYL. How I hate that expression and you should too!
'

73, Howard

K7JBQ

10-06-2007, 04:09 AM

Quote[/b] (kb9xn @ Oct. 05 2007,20:18)]I say get rid of NEWBIES and NOOBIES and the one on the top of my list of expressions to get rid of is XYL.

My wife of 43 years has always been my wife and never my XYL. #How I hate that expression and you should too!
'

73, Howard
Howard,

"XYL" is one of the few completely politically incorrect terms that has staying power in this oh-so pc world. Like the "Washington Redskins."

Fight for old D.C.

73,
Bill

W0BKR

10-09-2007, 11:45 AM

Again, if you want to reduce or eliminate the use of newbie, etc, you need to be inclusive and get rid of the term OF and OT when talking in regards to someone licensed longer then 2 years.

Even playing field. Hi.

WA9SVD

10-09-2007, 02:32 PM

Not everyone uses the term "newbie" in a derogatory manner. When used to mean a recently licensed person, it's not making a statement of judgement, merely of fact. And let's face it, we were ALL "newbies" at one time. The same applies to OT. (OF might be a bit different, depending upon usage.)
There's no shame in being a newbie, unless a person's practices are a cause for shame.

k4kyv

10-09-2007, 03:47 PM

Quote[/b] (kl7aj @ Oct. 02 2007,19:27)]Noobie is such a lame term..
I agree. The proper spelling and pronunciation is "newbie".

The first syllable rhymes with the word "few". The word does not rhyme with "boobie".

k0cmh

10-09-2007, 03:56 PM

SVD:

It appears my reply, and one other, went completely over your head, or you completely missed the point.

Not referring to myself, but to a number of persons who regularly post here and seem incapable of getting over the fact that every licensed person does not have a doctorate degree in radio theory and can send and receive CW at 50 wpm.

The post was a jab at persons who continueously take this position.

I recall a post about 2 months ago where someone here stated that the term "newbee" applied to almost every licensed Ham. I wonder who that was? http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif

WA9SVD

10-10-2007, 02:55 PM

Quote[/b] (k0cmh @ Oct. 09 2007,08:56)]SVD:

It appears my reply, and one other, went completely over your head, or you completely missed the point.

Not referring to myself, but to a number of persons who regularly post here and seem incapable of getting over the fact that every licensed person does not have a doctorate degree in radio theory and can send and receive CW at 50 wpm.

The post was a jab at persons who continueously take this position.

I recall a post about 2 months ago where someone here stated that the term "newbee" applied to almost every licensed Ham. I wonder who that was? http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif
I guess I've missed your point more than once.
We've all been "newbies" at one time, or are there some with an inate knowledge so they instantly know everything about everything, including "good Amateur Practice" and operating procedures?

I dare say even Albert Einstein would qualify as a "newbie" Amateur Radio operator for a while, either in his OWN time, or in the present time, if that were possible.

KA4DPO

10-12-2007, 05:22 PM

I'm afraid it's true, we were all newbies once.

WA9SVD

10-14-2007, 08:30 PM

Quote[/b] (KA4DPO @ Oct. 12 2007,10:22)]I'm afraid it's true, we were all newbies once.
Why be afraid of the fact? There's nothing to be ashamed of, unless a person never progresses beyond "newbie" status. And unfortunately, there ARE some operators that despite 20 or more years of licensure, can still be classified as "newbies."

KA4DPO

10-14-2007, 10:14 PM

I was never bothered by being a noobie I was having too much fun learning and burning stuff up to care. Wish I could do it again.. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

K1VSK

10-14-2007, 11:51 PM

There is only one word which I can image that captures them all --

HAMSTERS:p

WA9SVD

10-15-2007, 03:19 PM

Quote[/b] (KA4DPO @ Oct. 14 2007,15:14)]I was never bothered by being a noobie I was having too much fun learning and burning stuff up to care. Wish I could do it again.. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif
I'd pretty much agree, except for the part about "burning stuff up." http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif
Learning can be very enjoyable, especially if you manage to do it without inflicting major damage or sustaining major imjuries.

kl7aj

10-15-2007, 03:41 PM

Quote[/b] (wa9svd @ Oct. 15 2007,08:19)]Quote[/b] (KA4DPO @ Oct. 14 2007,15:14)]I was never bothered by being a noobie I was having too much fun learning and burning stuff up to care. #Wish I could do it again.. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif
I'd pretty much agree, except for the part about "burning stuff up." http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif
# #Learning can be very enjoyable, especially if you manage to do it without inflicting major damage or sustaining major imjuries.
Burning stuff up is ABSOLUTELY NECESSARY for proper enjoyment of ham radio. It is an integral them of "The Opus of Amateur Radio Knowledge and Lore."

Keep on Smokin!

eric

k0cmh

10-15-2007, 04:11 PM

If burning things up is a definition of a "non-noobie" then I have graduated. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

KA4DPO

10-16-2007, 03:41 PM

Burning stuff up was sort of a right of passage for noobies. We had transistors in the 60s but they were very low power and not much good for RF. War surplus tubes and tube equipment was cheap and plentiful but most required modification to get on the ham bands.

As a curious 15 year old with just enough knowlege of electronics to be dangerous I began to experiment with tube circuits. Some worked much to my amazement, others failed in a loud pop also much to my amazement. The primary lessons were:

a. Respect for high voltages. This was learned the hard way a few times.

b. Always double check your wiring before applying power. Also learned the hard way more than once.

c. So it burned up, try it again and see what happens. Most of the time I got it to work unless I cooked the transformer which happened only once.

d. Fuses are your friends. And how.

So if you're a noobie you probably won't experince the thrill of 250 volts shorting to ground while your hand is in the chassis holding a probe. Circuits these days still fail but they mostly do it silently without acrid odors and there's no penalty for accidentally touching the drain of a FET in your mixer circuit. Too bad.... http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

kl7aj

10-16-2007, 04:56 PM

Quote[/b] (k0cmh @ Oct. 15 2007,09:11)]If burning things up is a definition of a "non-noobie" #then I have graduated. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif
Congratulations! You have joined the club.

Now for the NEXT step. Can you identify precisely what you fried by smell alone? (The Opus of Amateur Radio Knowledge and Lore will include a section on nasal inspection techniques)

eric

k0cmh

10-16-2007, 04:59 PM

Maybe we need a "smoke factor" to indicate the amount of, or lack there of, of newbeeness.

A few smoked, small transistors and/or small discrete parts is a smoke factor of 1.

Smoking large, high-power descrete components and expensive circuit boards is a smoke factor of 3.

Smoking complete units, such as an entire transciever, large tuner, 1.5 KW amp, etc. is a smoke factor of 5.

A person gets one of the smoke factors for each incident.

If you add up a persons smoke factors, and they add up to __ #(what number do you think would be good), then you are no longer a newbee.
http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

kl7aj

10-16-2007, 05:00 PM

Quote[/b] (KA4DPO @ Oct. 16 2007,08:41)]Burning stuff up was sort of a right of passage for noobies. #We had transistors in the 60s but they were very low power and not much good for RF. #War surplus tubes and tube equipment was cheap and plentiful but most required modification to get on the ham bands. #

As a curious 15 year old with just enough knowlege of electronics to be dangerous I began to experiment with tube circuits. #Some worked much to my amazement, others failed in a loud pop also much to my amazement. #The primary lessons were:

a. #Respect for high voltages. #This was learned the hard way a few times.

b. #Always double check your wiring before applying power. #Also learned the hard way more than once.

c. #So it burned up, try it again and see what happens. #Most of the time I got it to work unless I cooked the transformer which happened only once.

d. #Fuses are your friends. #And how.

So if you're a noobie you probably won't experince the thrill of 250 volts shorting to ground while your hand is in the chassis holding a probe. #Circuits these days still fail but they mostly do it silently without acrid odors and there's no penalty for accidentally touching the drain of a FET in your mixer circuit. #Too bad.... http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif
Let us now address each of these points in detail. Number one, electrocution, is a good place to start. Amateur Radio is an electrical hobby. Radio amateurs, for the most part (with a few notable exceptions), have bodies which are every bit as subject to the ill effects of electricity as other mortals. Fortunately, the modern ham shack is far safer in this regard than those of yore. Most modern, commercially made radios have nearly inaccessible sources of dangerous electrical currents. With the advent of low-voltage, solid state technology, you almost have to work at getting a lethal jolt.
Contrast this with the typical radio shack of half a century ago, which consisted of a loose collection of extremely high-voltage components lashed together with uninsulated jumper cables, sitting on the edge of a water-soaked desk, all powered by a distribution panel populated entirely with glass “fuses” bypassed with rusty copper pennies, and operated by a pre-teen boy sitting on a steel folding chair donning nothing but damp swimming trunks.

This is the absolute truth! (From the Opus)

kl7aj

10-16-2007, 05:02 PM

Quote[/b] (k0cmh @ Oct. 16 2007,09:59)]Maybe we need a "smoke factor" to indicate the amount of, or lack there of, of newbeeness.

A few smoked, small transistors and/or small discrete parts is a smoke factor of 1.

Smoking large, high-power descrete components and expensive circuit boards is a smoke factor of 3.

Smoking complete units, such as an entire transciever, large tuner, 1.5 KW amp, etc. is a smoke factor of 5.

A person gets one of the smoke factors for each incident.

If you add up a persons smoke factors, and they add up to __ #(what number do you think would be good), then you are no longer a newbee.
http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif
You forgot fried modulation transformers from a 50KW broadcast station! I have a "gold star" smoke endorsement!

eric