Family's residence auctioned for a $1.63 tax bill

[w4wtf]

Government at its best! (http://www.nola.com/news/t-p/frontpage/index.ssf?/base/news-8/1184482256189990.xml&coll=1)

We keep getting told of insurance company horror stories.... but there are plenty of stories just as bad about the people they want to replace insurance companies with.

Would you want this crew making your medical decisions?

[N2RJ]

The Government makes mistakes and tries to cover it up while private companies deliberately cut corners at your expense to maximize profit.

[w4wtf]

Quote[/b] (N2RJ @ July 16 2007,08:41)]The Government makes mistakes and tries to cover it up while private companies deliberately cut corners at your expense to maximize profit.
But at least if my private company does bad things I can go to another....

[AC0H]

We have tax sales here all the time.
People get behind on their tax bills and somebody comes in and buys that debt from the county. You then owe them what you owed the county, with interest. I can't believe somebody forclosed on a property for a $1.63.

Probably wanting to "flip" the property and make a buck or two.

I also don't know how anybody can claim they don't know they have an outstanding tax liability.

[al2i]

Quote[/b] (AC0H @ July 16 2007,08:33)]I also don't know how anybody can claim they don't know they have an outstanding tax liability.
Happens all of the time here. We had one famous case of a long-term state legislator who had his land foreclosed on him. The government is not about customer service.

[KI4PEQ]

Quote[/b] (AC0H @ July 16 2007,10:33)]We have tax sales here all the time.
People get behind on their tax bills and somebody comes in and buys that debt from the county. You then owe them what you owed the county, with interest. I can't believe somebody forclosed on a property for a $1.63.

Probably wanting to "flip" the property and make a buck or two.

I also don't know how anybody can claim they don't know they have an outstanding tax liability.
Like the couple in the story, due to my status as a 100 percent service connected disabled veteran, I have no ad valorem tax liability. I know I do have a fire tax assessment that I pay every year. So when I go to the courthouse every year to pay my assessment, they will also tell me if there were additional taxes to pay. Since I am a rural resident, I don't see additional taxes or assessments on the horizon.

I could see how this would happen. It happened to my father two years ago. Same situation with the tax notice being misdelivered. The first notice he received was the offer of sale of a tax certificate listed in the classified ads in the local newspaper. His mortgage company wasn't too happy, either.

Now my father has passed on, with a mortgage that is three times the value of the property. I hope that someone DOES file to buy his land at a tax sale. Boy, will THEY be surprised!

[N2RJ]

Quote[/b] (w4wtf @ July 16 2007,10:46)]Quote[/b] (N2RJ @ July 16 2007,08:41)]The Government makes mistakes and tries to cover it up while private companies deliberately cut corners at your expense to maximize profit.
But at least if my private company does bad things I can go to another....
Not true with health insurance if you have a "pre existing condition", nor is it true if you're stuck in a hospital and can't get off life support to be transported somewhere else.

And none of this is any good if you're too sick to make your own decisions.

[w4wtf]

Quote[/b] (AC0H @ July 16 2007,09:33)]I also don't know how anybody can claim they don't know they have an outstanding tax liability.
In this case, the couple had never had a tax liability before, and the laws changed and then they had this small one.

However, years earlier, the government had implemented a new 911 system that including changes everyones address.

Of course, the government could not be bothered to use the new address, that it created, to mail the tax notice, and the other government system, the postal service, of course did not bother to correct the error.

Then, instead of using common sense and trying to find them in the phone book or even driving out... they just ran the legal notice in the paper and sold it.

Common sense and government do not go hand in hand.

[w4wtf]

Quote[/b] (N2RJ @ July 16 2007,10:31)]Quote[/b] (w4wtf @ July 16 2007,10:46)]Quote[/b] (N2RJ @ July 16 2007,08:41)]The Government makes mistakes and tries to cover it up while private companies deliberately cut corners at your expense to maximize profit.
But at least if my private company does bad things I can go to another....
Not true with health insurance if you have a "pre existing condition", nor is it true if you're stuck in a hospital and can't get off life support to be transported somewhere else.

And none of this is any good if you're too sick to make your own decisions.
Pre-existing conditions are one of those things that do present a problem, and I could almost support a small legislation to help fix that or provide for thsoe who fall through...but that does not justify pushing everyone under one massive state system.


As for if you are in the hospital sick, I have a medical power of attorney that designates two people whom I trust, a primary and an alternate, to represent me should I be incapacitated.... a simple thing that everyone should have.

[N2RJ]

Quote[/b] (w4wtf @ July 16 2007,13:14)]Pre-existing conditions are one of those things that do present a problem, and I could almost support a small legislation to help fix that or provide for thsoe who fall through...
Amazingly, that is a lot of people. However, if you enact such legislation, the insurance companies will either jack up the premiums, refuse to underwrite those customers or go out of business.

Remember, the insurance companies are out to make a profit. They are running a business, not a charity. If they see a potential customer as more of a liability than an asset, why should they be forced by the Government to take a loss and underwrite them?

And even if you enact a piece of legislation to protect these people, (even if there isn't one already) the insurance companies will absolutely find loopholes to deny coverage. That's what their attorneys are paid big bucks to do.

Quote[/b] ]but that does not justify pushing everyone under one massive state system.

So do you propose the for the Government to force private businesses to take a loss instead?

Quote[/b] ]As for if you are in the hospital sick, I have a medical power of attorney that designates two people whom I trust, a primary and an alternate, to represent me should I be incapacitated.... a simple thing that everyone should have.

Make sure you trust those people really well, especially if you have a lot of money saved up.

[KI4PEQ]

Quote[/b] (N2RJ @ July 16 2007,12:35)]Make sure you trust those people really well, especially if you have a lot of money saved up.
The wife already knows that if I get close to buying the farm, she is to withhold care that would only prolong life at the expense of actually living. No dialysis, no feeding by a tube, no other drastic and heroic measures if my quality of life would be drastically diminished.

She gets the benefits of my veterans group life insurance, the only insurance I can get. But if I get hit by a bus, get killed in a plane crash, or other accidental death, she gets an identical benefit from the credit union's insurance policy for accidental death.

I'm worth more dead than alive, and when I do go to the great ham shack in the sky, every bill will be paid and the wife owns the house free and clear. If living means being in a bed or a wheelchair with tubes coming out my wazoo, my instructions are to pump me full of morphine and pull the plug. Cremate my remains, and skip any fancy memorial service short of a small service at the national cemetery, where the honor guard will fire the volleys, the bugler will play "Taps", and the family gets the burial flag.

After that, I could care less where the money goes. I'll be dead.

[KV1M]

Quote[/b] (w4wtf @ July 16 2007,11:38)]Government at its best! (http://www.nola.com/news/t-p/frontpage/index.ssf?/base/news-8/1184482256189990.xml&coll=1)

We keep getting told of insurance company horror stories.... but there are plenty of stories just as bad about the people they want to replace insurance companies with.

Would you want this crew making your medical decisions?
Umm, the IRS isn't a government agency.
It's a private entity.

Just though you oughta know...

[K5FH]

Quote[/b] (kv1m @ July 16 2007,16:29)]Umm, the IRS isn't a government agency.
It's a private entity.
I have heard most of the tax protester/resister arguments over the years but that's a new one for me. I don't think that even Irwin Schiff uses that one.

Now, I'm not saying that you're wrong, but could you provide some links or more info?

[KV1M]

Quote[/b] (K5FH @ July 16 2007,20:14)]Quote[/b] (kv1m @ July 16 2007,16:29)]Umm, the IRS isn't a government agency.
It's a private entity.
I have heard most of the tax protester/resister arguments over the years but that's a new one for me. I don't think that even Irwin Schiff uses that one.

Now, I'm not saying that you're wrong, but could you provide some links or more info?
My apologies to all,

I spoke too soon.
The court has ruled in Donaldson v. United States, 400 U.S. 517, 534 (1971) that "[w]e bear in mind that the Internal Revenue Service is organized to carry out the broad responsibilities of the Secretary of the Treasury under § 7801(a) of the 1954 Code for the administration and enforcement of the internal revenue laws." and as such it is an act of "Positive Law" that it was created through a Congressionally mandated power given to the Secretary of the Treasury as opposed to a direct law by Congress.

Sounds like political bull**** to me, but regardless of the validity of the ruling there it is.

I redact that statement.

On the other hand, based on this information the IRS was created without due representation (Congress was not directly involved in the creation of and had no say as to the powers and scope of the organization), and makes possible the argument of taxation without representation as a result.

[NA4BH]

Quote[/b] (N2RJ @ July 16 2007,11:35)]Quote[/b] ]As for if you are in the hospital sick, I have a medical power of attorney that designates two people whom I trust, a primary and an alternate, to represent me should I be incapacitated.... a simple thing that everyone should have.

Make sure you trust those people really well, especially if you have a lot of money saved up.
Agreed. Make sure the people will follow your wishes. The hardest call I have ever had was when the EMS responded for my Father. I was number two on the list. His Wife, number one on the list, was in a state of shock and could not relay his request.

TOUGH DAY

[K5FH]

Quote[/b] (kv1m @ July 16 2007,17:42)]On the other hand, based on this information the IRS was created without due representation (Congress was not directly involved in the creation of and had no say as to the powers and scope of the organization), and makes possible the argument of taxation without representation as a result.
Taxation WITH representation ain't so freakin' great, either.

[k4kyv]

You do not own your land. Land ownership in this country (and in most others too) is a myth. Your deed is at best a long-term lease from your landlord (the city or county government). If you fail to keep up your rent payments (AKA real estate tax), the landlord can have you evicted, just exactly the same as in the case of renting an apartment.

Even if you do keep up your rent payment, the apartment owner may have you evicted if he chooses to stop renting the property and use it for something else. In exactly the same manner, your landlord (the government) may decide to break your lease and use "your" property for something else - a highway, a power line, a school, or even sell (lease) it to another private tenant who is able to pay higher rent (more tax). The process is called "eminent domain".

[K5FH]

Quote[/b] (k4kyv @ July 17 2007,00:10)]You do not own your land. #Land ownership in this country (and in most others too) is a myth. #Your deed is at best a long-term lease from your landlord (the city or county government). #If you fail to keep up your rent payments (AKA real estate tax), the landlord can have you evicted, just exactly the same as in the case of renting an apartment.

Even if you do keep up your rent payment, the apartment owner may have you evicted if he chooses to stop renting the property and use it for something else. #In exactly the same manner, your landlord (the government) may decide to break your lease and use "your" property for something else - a highway, a power line, a school, or even sell (lease) it to another private tenant who is able to pay higher rent (more tax). #The process is called "eminent domain".
That is exactly what I have been saying for a long time. I have argued this with attorneys and they grudgingly admit that we don't "own" land as individuals. What we really do is lease land from the collective. The collective is, for all practical purposes, the Government.

Thomas Jefferson said it best: the power to tax is the power to destroy.

[al2i]

Quote[/b] (K5FH @ July 16 2007,23:46)]Quote[/b] (k4kyv @ July 17 2007,00:10)]You do not own your land. Land ownership in this country (and in most others too) is a myth. Your deed is at best a long-term lease from your landlord (the city or county government). If you fail to keep up your rent payments (AKA real estate tax), the landlord can have you evicted, just exactly the same as in the case of renting an apartment.

Even if you do keep up your rent payment, the apartment owner may have you evicted if he chooses to stop renting the property and use it for something else. In exactly the same manner, your landlord (the government) may decide to break your lease and use "your" property for something else - a highway, a power line, a school, or even sell (lease) it to another private tenant who is able to pay higher rent (more tax). The process is called "eminent domain".
That is exactly what I have been saying for a long time. I have argued this with attorneys and they grudgingly admit that we don't "own" land as individuals. What we really do is lease land from the collective. The collective is, for all practical purposes, the Government.

Thomas Jefferson said it best: the power to tax is the power to destroy.
For a crazy little Martian, you make a lot of sense. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif