Is there a computer expert out there ?

[G0GQK]

Hello everyone,

I need some advice from an expert, I'm sure there will be one who reads these pages. I have a PC which I purchased in 2000, running on Windows 98, and starting recently I am getting problem messages when I try to open articles in newspapers.

The messages report that the " PC has performed an illegal operation, or an internal error, and will be closed down. Explorer caused an invalid page fault in the modules ", the problems are as follows

kernel32.DLL, #JScript.DLL, #mshtml.DLL, #wininet.DLL #

Windows 98 has been reloaded but the probem persists, and the local shop suggests that the cause is most probably old age, parts overheating etc. and that the .DLL's involved will affect the proper operation of the hardware.

As the shop replaced the CD drive saying it was faulty, when in fact it seemed to be operating OK when I used it about a week ago, I am wondering if the guy really knows what he's doing ! Surprising to me is that he never tested his work before returning the PC to me despite having the PC for 10 days.

Maybe he is right, but I'd like someone else to convince me !

Your help appreciated,

Kind regards, #Mel G0GQK

[AC0H]

First step, do a complete virus scan.
Second step, from the command prompt issue the command "scandisk" without the quotes. This will check the hard drive for errors.
You've obviously got some internet functionality so do a Google search for a utility called memtest86. It comes on a bootable floppy. Reboot the machine with this floppy and run through the memory test to see if you've got bad memory installed.

What was the last change you made before this problem started up? Visit a particular website for the first time etc....

From the list of dll's returned by the error message, specifically jscript.dll, mshtml.dll, and wininet.dll. jscript.dll tells us it's a Java script problem, mshtml.dll tells us it's an Internet Explorer problem and wininet.dll could be either Internet Explorer or Windows Explorer.

You can try this from the MS website.

1. On the Tools menu in Internet Explorer, click Internet Options.
2. Click the Advanced tab.
3. Click to clear the Use inline AutoComplete for Web addresses and Use inline AutoComplete for Windows Explorer check boxes.
4. Click OK.
5. Reboot your computer. Press and hold down F8 while the computer boots to display the Startup menu.
6. Choose Command Prompt Only, and then press ENTER.
7. Type the following items, pressing ENTER after each item:

cd\windows
deltree downlo~1
deltree tempor~1
deltree history
deltree cookies
NOTE: Press Y if you are prompted to confirm any deletion.

8. Reboot your your computer normally.
9. On the Tools menu in Internet Explorer, click Internet Options.
10. Click the Advanced tab.
11. Click to select the Use inline AutoComplete for Web addresses and Use inline AutoComplete for Windows Explorer check boxes.
12. Click OK.

[KB1JCY]

Does IE fail to launch? Have you tried running spyware dectection and removal software such as Spybot Search and Destroy?

As a last resort, you may need to back up your files, reformat your hard drive, and install Windows from scratch.

[KI4MRU]

Hi Mel,

This may not be exactly what you want to hear, but in my opinion a 7-year-old computer running a 9-year-old operating system is probably due for replacement altogether. Microsoft no longer issues security patches for Windows 98, so any new vulnerabilities which are discovered will remain wide open forever. Even if you don't want to make the step all the way up to Vista (I wouldn't blame you), I'm sure you could probably still find a reasonably priced computer with XP. Or you could buy a copy of XP and attempt to install it on your current computer, since XP was released in 2001 and should, for the most part, have no issues with a computer around that same age. Even though XP has had its share of security holes, Microsoft has been good about patching them in a timely manner, and will continue to support XP for the next several years. In any case, it's far more secure than Windows 98 and, in my experience, far more stable.

If you really must keep using your current computer, I would strongly urge you to switch to the Mozilla Firefox web browser, instead of using Internet Explorer. (http://www.getfirefox.com) IE has been notorious for security vulnerabilities, especially running on the older versions of Windows where patches are no longer issued. Firefox is free and just as easy to use as IE (if not easier).

[k3wrv]

I agree with the above, especially the post about re-formating your hard drive and about using firefox. If you do a scan for viruses, etc, please start your machine in Safe Mode (or better yet, boot from a floppy!)

If you do a reinstall of Win98, it "remembers" all the crap it had in the various config files BEFORE you did the re-install and brings back the same problems as before! (Been there, done that, got the scars to prove it!).

While it's true that Win1898 machines are past their prime, they're still an OK platform for a lot of ham radio applications. I still use one for SSTV (tho it's developed an allergy to RF and sometimes forgets that the keyboard is hooked up! For all else, I use Linux!

[WA7KKP]

Two points to make:

Microsoft doesn't "support" older Windows versions anymore since that would prevent sales of newer versions, like XP and Vista. These older versions have a plethora of virii swimming in cyberspace look for a Win95/98 box to do their thing.

Most computer techies and dealers want to sell you a new machine with a new OS instead of piecemealing the old boxes.

My PC is a K6-2 running 500 MHz and I use SuSE Linux -- the graphics can be a bit slow for the fancy stuff, but is still very adequate to run the latest Linux software that I'm interested in, so I just keep plodding along. Used hardware is of zero value on the used market if it is over 2 years old, so that makes it smart to go to Linux.

Gary WA7KKP

[G0GQK]

Hello everyone,

Thanks for all the replies I appreciate the time you have all spent in advising me and making helpful suggestions.

I am inclined to agree with the comment that even after re-loading Windows 98 the PC remembers all the crap which was in there before. I had that problem last year with Digipan and XP, and in fact still have it despite completely clearing everything out of the shack computer. When I open Digipan even though it is set for PSK 31 it opens on 63 and I have to squirt some RF to get it to change to 31. I tried everything , re-loading Digipan 3 times and it still does it !

So what I think I will do is to try Firefox and see what happens. As one of you wrote, the operating system is years out of date, Microsoft has written off 98 years ago, but as I only use this PC for surfing and nothing serious I just keep using it, but I find now when I try to look at products, for instance, the PC closes the page and that's it !

Well, after 7 years I'm running a Ford T, I'll have to spend some of this pocket money I've got and buy a new or a good used PC , I think I prefer XP at the moment.

Once again thanks chaps, much appreciated.

Kind regards to all, #Mel #G0GQK

[CW7168]

Quote[/b] (KI4MRU @ May 03 2007,20:31)]Hi Mel,

This may not be exactly what you want to hear, but in my opinion a 7-year-old computer running a 9-year-old operating system is probably due for replacement altogether. #Microsoft no longer issues security patches for Windows 98, so any new vulnerabilities which are discovered will remain wide open forever. #Even if you don't want to make the step all the way up to Vista (I wouldn't blame you), I'm sure you could probably still find a reasonably priced computer with XP. #Or you could buy a copy of XP and attempt to install it on your current computer, since XP was released in 2001 and should, for the most part, have no issues with a computer around that same age. #Even though XP has had its share of security holes, Microsoft has been good about patching them in a timely manner, and will continue to support XP for the next several years. #In any case, it's far more secure than Windows 98 and, in my experience, far more stable.

If you really must keep using your current computer, I would strongly urge you to switch to the Mozilla Firefox web browser, instead of using Internet Explorer. #(http://www.getfirefox.com) #IE has been notorious for security vulnerabilities, especially running on the older versions of Windows where patches are no longer issued. #Firefox is free and just as easy to use as IE (if not easier).
7 years old is pushing it to the max. Do you smoke near your computer? If you do you are running on borrowed time. A well maintained hard drive, one that doesn't move much or at all, and is in a smoke free environment should last 10 years if you are lucky.

To be running a computer that old tells me that you at least made a wise purchase in the past. Smile, and go get yourself another one.

[k7mh]

Windows 98 just sucks altogether!
A fresh install after reformatting the hard disk drive may help.
Installing over the top of itself will do nothing but waste time.
Move up to a Windows XP machine (at least) and you will be much happier. It is rock stable and trouble free for most people. If you just cannot, then Win 2000 is also very good and may do just fine on a fairly good Win 98 'puter.
But I would not do an upgrade, just a full install.
I would sooner run Win 95 than Win 98 if I had to.

[n6hcm]

Quote[/b] (WA7KKP @ May 04 2007,10:25)]Microsoft doesn't "support" older Windows versions anymore since that would prevent sales of newer versions, like XP and Vista.
that's a big part of the reason ... but you gotta remember that it costs money to keep up with the joneses by producing patches for a legacy product--if it's not bringing in revenue then they naturally have less incentive to produce the patches.

this is, however, a good opportunity for someone to consider linux ...

[ve3sre]

Yes I agree...in the "short run", stop using Microsoft Internet Explorer.

Mozilla Firefox is a possibility, but there are other browsers as well such as Sea Monkey, Opera, Flock and K-Meleon. # #Don't recall offhand if K-Meleon runs on Win98 or not...never tried it...but you might want to give it a shot. # K-Meleon is based on the same Gecko engine as Firefox, Sea Monkey and Flock, but is very small and lightning fast! # The way Firefox used to be! # Internet Explorer on Windows 98 as others have mentioned can not be patched...but the other browsers are continually updated with security patches. # So if your operating system isn't being patched, at least your web browser will be.

Should you decide to get a new machine at some point, keep the old "box" and install Linux on it! # #I think every ham should have at least one Linux box in the shack! #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif # #Linux makes computing fun again...the way it used to be #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[AG3Y]

Almost every day, I would scream and kick my 450 Mhz Win 98 II machine ( maybe that is why it stopped working so well ! http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif ) Well, actually, I didn't really do that, but I sure wanted to!

I went and bought a 3ghz Win XP machine, started loading in my legacy software, and have had nothing but great times with the machine all this week! I am soooo happy I dropped the Win98 machine. As soon as I get all the SSTV pictures and some medical files transferred to other places, that machine is going to get a complete new HD, Win XP software, and end up being used for the Grandchildren's learning games!

Bottom line, get a new computer, you will be soooo glad you did! A thousand bucks will buy you something today that you couldn't have imagined when your 450Mhz dinosaur was new!

I might put a dual operating system on it. Linux does sound like it could be fun.

73, Jim

[ka5piu]

Hello.

I load windows 98se from a CD, after a full flush of the hard drive.
A full flush means running a program the writes a bunch of garbage to every part of the hard drive, look for wipedisk or something of that sort.
I usually go as far as F-Disk, format to something really odd, like OS/2 HPFS, then F-Disk once more and format to whatever OS, for 98se this will be FAT or FAT16, your choice.
Now I load and 99.9% of the time everything is just fine.

[AC0H]

Quote[/b] (ka5piu @ May 13 2007,01:35)]Hello.

I load windows 98se from a CD, after a full flush of the hard drive.
A full flush means running a program the writes a bunch of garbage to every part of the hard drive, look for wipedisk or something of that sort.
I usually go as far as F-Disk, format to something really odd, like OS/2 HPFS, then F-Disk once more and format to whatever OS, for 98se this will be FAT or FAT16, your choice.
Now I load and 99.9% of the time everything is just fine.
Darik's Boot and Nuke.
We use a three pass wipe which gets you to DoD standards and Sarbanes/Oxley compliance.
1's, 0's, 1's and 0's then fdisk/format.

[WA9SVD]

Quote[/b] (AC0H @ May 13 2007,08:45)]Quote[/b] (ka5piu @ May 13 2007,01:35)]Hello.

I load windows 98se from a CD, after a full flush of the hard drive.
A full flush means running a program the writes a bunch of garbage to every part of the hard drive, look for wipedisk or something of that sort.
I usually go as far as F-Disk, format to something really odd, like OS/2 HPFS, then F-Disk once more and format to whatever OS, for 98se this will be FAT or FAT16, your choice.
Now I load and 99.9% of the time everything is just fine.
Darik's Boot and Nuke.
We use a three pass wipe which gets you to DoD standards and Sarbanes/Oxley compliance.
1's, 0's, 1's and 0's then fdisk/format.
Unless you're paranoid about security issues, or the MBR is seriously corrupted, you shouldn't have to go THAT far. Fdisk and reformat has always served to wipe enough to allow a truly fresh Win98SE install. (And rids pesky Norton data that remains after just a re-format; if the MBR is suspect, a "low-level" format may be necessary first. Most hard drives come with a utility to wipe out and restore the MBR to factory default.)
The only time you should really need to do a thorough "wipe" is if you are worried about data being recovered for nefarious reasons by extraordinary methods.
But anything less than an FDISK before a reformat WILL allow some trash to remain, and corrupt a new OS install.

[AC0H]

Quote[/b] ]The only time you should really need to do a thorough "wipe" is if you are worried about data being recovered for nefarious reasons by extraordinary methods.
I agree for the home user.
In the corporate environment we are required by law (Sarbanes/Oxley) to wipe to DoD standards or destroy any hard drive which has had proprietary financial or company data on it. If we move a PC or server from a sensitive area to another department we have to wipe and re-image.

DBAN is still a good idea for the home user who may have financial data on disk. Get a new computer, sell the old one or give it away, did you wipe the drive or just format?

[ve3sre]

DBAN is not only a cool tool if you're a little on the paranoid side http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif ... but I've also used it for wiping hard drives with major data corruption.

I recently recovered a 40 GB drive that was in pretty bad shape...and then once it was fixed, "liberated it" by putting it in a machine and installing GNU/Linux! http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[kf6snj]

If the hard drive is suspect, then I would suggest a thorough wipe. In truth, I had to do a thorough wipe myself when I went to install OS2 Warp 4 on a spare drive I had due to a corrupted MBR. To do this required my downloading and burning a copy of "the Ultimate Boot CD" (http://www.ultimatebootcd.com/) in order to make the hard disk work properly and accept the HP filesystem. It is definately a good tool, especially if your computer isn't floppy enabled. This tool is techinically a live boot linux cd with full dos emulation. Still, really cool.

[AB8RU]

I can say WIN 98 SE I would say its ok but dont expect updates from MS , on the other hand if your wallet can afford it a Used Computer with WIN XP SP 2 installed with the Full License. or buy a license from MS just about anyplace has SP 1 SP2 is free and I bought the disk so really XP is better on a P4 .

[KC2RPP]

im only 16 but i would say kick that Windows 98 out the door and get ur self a copy of Windows 2000 or Windows XP. I dont recommend Windows ME because it is way too unstable. I get the blue screen of death on my Windows ME machine every 1/2 hour.

[n6hcm]

Quote[/b] (KC2RPP @ June 18 2007,15:29)]im only 16 but i would say kick that Windows 98 out the door and get ur self a copy of Windows 2000 or Windows XP. I dont recommend Windows ME because it is way too unstable. I get the blue screen of death on my Windows ME machine every 1/2 hour.
a system that old probably doesn't meet the minimum spec for win xp ...

windows me is just fine if you load it directly--if you upgraded a system from win95/win98 to win me then it's just plain wacky.