Social Security Disability

[KB3LIX]

I know lots of younz guys are on Social Security Disability for one reason or another.
In December 2006, 3 months ago today in fact, I filed for medical disability with SSA.

After several doctor visits and a series of X-rays, I got a letter about a week/10 days ago that states:

"You must meet certain medical and non-medical requirements to be entitled to disability payments.

We have found that you meet the medical requirements for disability payments

Blah
Blah
Blah

We have not yet made a decision about whether you meet the nonmedical requirements, but we will make that decision soon. Then we will send you a second notice explaining the decision"

Then it goes on to say that I have the right to appeal, can hire a thief in a three piece suit (I mean an attorney)
etc, etc.

"If you have questions about your disability claim or wish to appeal our findings, please do not get in touch with the Social Security office until you have the second notice."

OK, since I am not supposed to call them, here is my question.

What the devil are the NONMEDICAL requirements ?

Nothing was sent to me when I made application, and I got no reference material that 'splains NON-MEDICAL requirements.

Perhaps this is Social Security's way of trying to make applicants have heart failure or a stroke by not explaining things, then the applicant cannot collect benefits.

It's driving me CRAZY not knowing what's going on.

Any insight http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif

[WB2WIK]

You sure the nonmedical requirements aren't simply ones regarding financial need?

I know SSA pays maximum benefits to those who have virtually nothing and then less to those who have more, and eventually nothing to those who have a lot.

This is based on tax returns and other data sources reporting income.

Maybe it's that-?

WB2WIK/6

[kd7msc]

It took me 2 years to get my SS benifits. Lost my house and business. I think they deny everyone at first. They figure only a few will fight for it. Keep fighting, get a good doctor that will work with you and SS. If that doesnt work get a lawyer.

FYI: They have what is called the "blue book" of dissability. If you have one of these they have to approve you. We found out about this after my first claim was denied. I have Muscular Dystrophy and that is in there book. Problem was my diognosis was Dermatomyositis. One of 43 types of MD. We had teach SS this and press them. Once they saw I wouldnt give up, they approved me. After a year they did try and take it away. Now I have the MDA and there doctors on my side. Good luck. 73, Sean http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

Edit: The SSA does not allow me to have any earned income to qualify for my benifits. If you or your wife makes "to much" money they will not approve you.

[KB3LIX]

Sean,
"Too much" shouldn't be a problem.

I have ZERO income and she had all of $ 10,500 gross in tax year 2006.

I have heard that SSA denies ALL claims the first time around, and like you say, they figure that many will not press the issue.
(Same scenario as the book, The RainMaker by John Grisham)

If it's like Steve suggests, then maybe there is a time element for them to check tax returns and such before making a determination.

This waiting is making me ready for the "Whack-a-torium"
Not knowing is a killer.

[k7unz]

I think Steve pretty much hit the nail on the head.

Your financial situation, medical insurance coverage, possible payments you may already be receiving as a result of the injury, employment history, etc., all will be checked.

Jim/k7unz

[W0MT]

Quote[/b] (KB3LIX @ Mar. 15 2007,13:38)]***snip***

Then it goes on to say that I have the right to appeal, can hire a thief in a three piece suit (I mean an attorney)
etc, etc.

***snip***

If this is how you feel about attorneys, then I suggest if you need to appeal the SSA's decision, you go it alone. Your comment reminds me of the person who says he hates cops until someone is trying to break into his house and suddenly he is dialing 911.

Just my $.02 worth.

[KB3LIX]

Quote[/b] (W0MT @ Mar. 15 2007,22:34)]Quote[/b] (KB3LIX @ Mar. 15 2007,13:38)]***snip***

Then it goes on to say that I have the right to appeal, can hire a thief in a three piece suit (I mean an attorney)
etc, etc.

***snip***

If this is how you feel about attorneys, then I suggest if you need to appeal the SSA's decision, you go it alone. Your comment reminds me of the person who says he hates cops until someone is trying to break into his house and suddenly he is dialing 911.

Just my $.02 worth.
Sorry if I offend you, but I'm a firm believer of the jokes that go:

What are 1000 attorneys at the bottom of the ocean called ?

A GOOD START !!!!!!!!!

and

How do you tell if an attorney is lying http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif

His lips are moving !!!!!!!!!


There are too many attorneys in this area that are theives, liars, ambulance chasers and WORSE !!!!!!

I have had to deal with two in the last 10 years.
One left me hanging by not following thru on a committment, the other FLAT OUT LIED when figuring up his charges. He still overcharged me $ 100.00 and I have no chance of collecting it.

THEIVES !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[KB3LIX]

Anyhow,

The question is now moot.

The second notice was in todays mail.

I am approved for disability starting in May 2007. I have the option of appealing the start date,

BUT I DON'T TRUST LAWYERS, AND I DO NOT WANT TO DEAL WITH ANY OF THEM.

So I may just live with the decision.

[ac3p]

For info on SS programs, go here.

Social Security Website (http://www.ssa.gov)

[n0jaa]

I never heard of "nonmedical" requirements. I applied for, and received, SSDI, two years ago, and I was never asked for any "nonmedical" prerequisites.

If the second notice denies your benefits, you'll want to retain an attorney who specializes in Social Security issues. It's very rare that Social Security approves anyone on the first application.

[k8pg]

Liars(Lawyers-legal theft) Ive had dealings with the Liars over the yrs and Id trust a Used Car Salesmen over 1 any day:D The non-medical issues are your assets and families income combined only in your household-73 Good Luck OM. Paul

PS: A LIAR will TAKE 1/3rd of your back payment,possibly MORE:(

[KB3LIX]

"It's very rare that Social Security approves anyone on the first application."

I must be lucky.

It's time to buy that PowerBall AND MegaMilliones ticket !!!

[K9STH]

Like 99.99 percent of the applicants are rejected on their first application for SS disability. With the letter of rejection they also send you an application for appeal. On the first appeal over 75 percent of the applicants are approved. On the second appeal another 15 percent are approved. The final option (and this is the one that requires an attorney) you have to sue them in Federal court. This results in an average of around 7.5 percent being accepted. After everything is said and done around 98 percent of the applicants are accepted.

Frankly, considering what all the appeals cost what is "saved" by rejecting the final about 2 percent actually costs several times what those "savings" are!

When I applied for disability several years ago (same time my wife applied for "normal" benefits) they told me up-front that I would be automatically rejected, but not to "give up". Almost 30 days to the day from when I applied I got a letter of rejection with the form for appeal. Of course I immediately filled out that form. In about two weeks I got a letter telling me to appear at a certain doctor's office (located about 5 miles from me) at a particular time to be evaluated.

On the day of the appointment I was really feeling good and just "knew" that I would be rejected. But, I showed up and had the examination. Three weeks later I received a letter telling me that I had been accepted for disability benefits. Then I got another letter telling me that I would be getting a cheque for "back benefits" which totaled an additional 10 months (the maximum "back benefits" that you can get is 1 year).

Then I received another letter telling me that my wife could also receive benefits based on my benefits in addition to what she was already receiving! This letter told me to telephone the office which I did. The person handling my claim then asked to talk with my wife. After answering several questions my wife was told that her benefits based on my claim were approved! She didn't even have to go to the office.

Then about a month later we got another letter telling us that my wife would also receive 10 months "back benefits"!

One thing that was in our favor. We had the choice of either going to one of the Dallas, Texas, Social Security offices, or, since we live 3/8ths of a mile into Collin County that we could go to the office in the county seat. The nearest Dallas office is a couple of miles closer but, at the time, the freeway was under construction and it would take considerably more time to get there. The result was that we went to the McKinney, Texas, office.

The staff at the McKinney office are "locals" and most of them really care about helping the applicants. The Dallas offices are staffed to a large percent by "bureaucrats" who just show up to get their paycheques. The Dallas offices have one of the worst approval rates in the country, at least through the first 3 stages. Most of their rejections are overturned in the court system but then the lawyers get 40 percent of your back benefits.

I really believe that if I had applied for disability at the Dallas office that I would still be fighting for benefits!

A while back I "ran into" an amateur radio operator friend who also is an attorney. When I told him that I was on disability he asked me which lawyer I had used to get the benefits. He was astounded when I told him that I didn't need one and that I had been approved on the first appeal. He was used to dealing with the Dallas offices and didn't realize that the people in the McKinney office were really helpful.

Now I am still fighting with Hartford Insurance Company for benefits from a policy that I had with them when I was employed. They fight you "tooth and nail" and it usually takes years before you see anything. Of course if you die or give up you don't get a thing. Once you die your heirs lose any claim that you had. Also, under federal law even if the insurance companies finally pay you a lump sum for back benefits they do not have to pay one cent of interest. Therefore, it is to the insurance company's benefit to hold off paying as long as possible. The final results are that on average less than 10 percent of those with private disability insurance ever collect.

I have learned a LOT about insurance companies and insurance law over the past several years. The company has 30 days to reply to any letters that I send them. They have taken almost a year to reply in some cases. Yes, they have "broken the law". However, there are no penalities in the law so it doesn't matter how long they take to reply. I send them things by certified mail and get the receipt. They claim that they never get the mail and when I provide a copy of the receipt their answer is that "they are a big company and things get lost". My doctor has FAXed things to them while I was in his office and he is talking with them on the telephone. These never seem to make it! Their first answer is that "doctors never send them information". When I tell them that I was there when the information was sent they reply "we are a big company and things get lost"!

Anyway, Social Security can be a real "pain in the posterior" to work with where disability benefits are concerned. But, unlike private insurance when dealing with Social Security there is like a 98 percent chance that you will eventually be accepted.

Glen, K9STH

[N2RJ]

Congratulations (I think) Bill.

I know it aint easy for you, but at least it will help.

[N7CPC]

May I recomend the law fim I keep on retainer?

Dewy,Cheetum and How, Seattle, USA.

Good Luck!!

[KB3LIX]

I about fainted when I read the letter last night. As you say Glen, I have only heard of two people that were approved on the first go-round.

One is my XYL's lyin, cheatin, no-good cousin, that I wouldn't doubt PAID someone off to get disability. The second is the wife of a friend of mine, but she had a LONG history of heart problems (multiple open-heart surgeries) several stents, and such, she was approved right off the bat.

I had to go thru the doctors appointment for evaluation and a round of X-Rays at the local hospital, but the approval came thru in EXACTLY 3 months, right to the day.

I didn't know about the maximum "back benefits" limit of 1 year.
I was considering an appeal of the start date, but that now sounds like an exercise in futility.

I have been disabled for a long time, but was reluctant to admit that fact, mostly to myself.
I still want to work, this sittin at home all the time is $### for the birds. But I have come to the realization that there is no way in heck that I can go back to work.
Sounds funny doesn't it ?
Lots of people would be tickled to be able to sit at home and do nothing, but I miss the constant interaction with my field techs and the constant learning something new just about every day.

More time to "play" radio I guess.

Enough of my whining.

Thanks everyone for your input.

[AG3Y]

The thing I can't understand is why my insurance company is continuing to "check up" on my status when there is no question about it as far as the Social Security System is concerned. I just recently turned in a several page questionare to my insurance company about my inability to return to work, drive a car, ADL functionality, etc. etc. All a bunch of un-necessary gobble-de-gook when a doctor, appointed by them, essentially swore under oath that my condition would never improve to the point that I would be able to return to work again!

Yes, I did receive full disability without needing to appeal, but it seems that my insurance company would like to weasel out of their part of the bargain if they could do so!

Such is life ! 73, Jim

[KI4PEQ]

Quote[/b] (N7CPC @ Mar. 16 2007,16:19)]May I recomend the law fim I keep on retainer?

Dewy,Cheetum and How, Seattle, USA.

Good Luck!!
We have Dewey, Cheatham, and Howe here in Florida, too.

Must be a long line of established lawyers, or a franchise like McDonald's!

[KB3LIX]

Quote[/b] (AG3Y @ Mar. 16 2007,23:53)]The thing I can't understand is why my insurance company is continuing to "check up" on my status when there is no question about it as far as the Social Security System is concerned. #I just recently turned in a several page questionare to my insurance company about my inability to return to work, drive a car, ADL functionality, etc. etc. #All a bunch of un-necessary gobble-de-gook when a doctor, appointed by them, essentially swore under oath that my condition would never improve to the point that I would be able to return to work again! #

Yes, I did receive full disability without needing to appeal, but it seems that my insurance company would like to weasel out of their part of the bargain if they could do so!

Such is life ! # #73, Jim
Insurance companies are in many ways, just like attorneys, they are weazels and will try to screw you out of a dime, even if it costs them $ 100.00 to do it.

The forms are just another way of playing weazel. If you do not return the forms on time, or make a simple mistake in filling them out, then they can use your mistake to deny payment, and save them a few pennies.
Even if later, you are able to correct the minor mistake, and make them pay, they have successfully delayed payment for days/weeks/months and accumulated interest on the money they "saved" by not paying the claim and that "savings" goes right to their bottom line in the quarterly reports.

Never mind the fact that they saved the money in the first quarter of the year that you were due, and paid it out in the second quarter, while screwing some other schmuck the same way in the second quarter to cover the payout to you.

It's all a big financial game.

And, to answer your question:

Yes, I am VERY cynical of insurance companies too.
Insurance is a racket. Consider the people that go for years faithfully paying premiums every pay period or month, only to find out that when you finally do have a valid claim, they refuse to pay.
Look at the thousands affected by Katrina.

And, why if you paid for years and years and never filed a claim,

Where is your refund http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif

Even if it's a small percentage of the premiums paid, you should get SOMETHING back, not just that warm and fuzzy feeling of supporting some big corporation and inflating their profits.

Soapbox mode OFF

[NE7NE]

Well I guess I'm one of the lucky ones also.I was approved on the first go around, but it took a year to get approved. My problem is I filed for VA disability at the same time as ssd and was approved in under 45 days. I was recieving my VA pension for over2 years and ssd for 1 year when the VA said because I was now getting paid by the SSD and am getting more then $800 a month that they now want all their money back. I have filed an appeal and am waiting on their reply. One hand giveth and the other taketh away.
Bob W. NE7NE http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif

[k4kyv]

It works like the mail-in rebates that have become so prevalent in retail sales. They operate on the assumption that many people will not mail in the paperwork in time, or simply won't bother with it. That saves them considerable money in the long run, even though they lose money denying benefits to those who do jump through the hoops via the appeals process.

I can't complain about my own recent experience with insurance companies and lawyers. My daughter had a serious injury as a pedestrian when she was run over by a car in an accident caused by a hit-and-run driver. We had Blue Cross medical insurance through my work which covered over $100,000 in medical bills related to the accident, but offered no compensation for pain and suffering, lost wages or other hardships suffered.

Even though she was 19 years old at the time, she was on my automobile insurance policy as a dependent child, since she was in university, so I filed a claim under our uninsured motorist policy. After a few weeks, the insurance agent called me and said, considering the circumstances of her accident, he was recommending that his company pay her to the full limit of the policy. A couple of weeks later, she received a check from the insurance company for that full amount, no strings attached.

Right away, Blue Cross sent us a bill for the full amount of benefits they had paid for her medical expenses, under the "subrogation" clause that allows an insurance company to recover damages when the injury they paid for is also covered by another insurance policy. She would have had very little money left over if we had simply made the payment demanded by Blue Cross.

Instead, we hired an attorney upon recommendation of a medical doctor we know. The attorney was able to get Blue Cross to agree to reduce their initial claim by over 50%, which amounted to tens of thousands of dollars. The attorney charged $1200 as his fee for services rendered. He was totally professional at all times, and it obviously was money well spent.

[WS2L]

KB3LIX,

I have heard (at least in NJ) that you are almost always turned down the first time. I was injured on the job in 1997 and receive an Accidental Disability Pension from the state of NJ who was my employer. I am in the near future going to file for SSD benefits as I have found that being able to work is nearly impossible. With the amount of pain medication I have to take to be functional I very often will not drive. That was a decision I made so that I don't hurt someone else and I'm comfortable with not driving.

Look up whatever you can find on the internet related to SSD in your state and get a good Lawyer. The lawyer works on a percentage basis so you need not worry about a retainer.

Good Luck

[K9QJ]

My EX (Who had a legit claim) was rejected 3 times. She hired a lawyer. BAM!!! 3 WEEKS later she had a check for 16 g's. The lawyers bill was 4 g's. I told her to call him and ask for a fee reduction. He felt so guilty about it he shaved 2 g's off. BOTTOM LINE: Love 'em or hate 'em (and I truly hate 'em) they are a necessary pain in the ass if you want to get anything done with SS.

[w5klb]

Quote[/b] ]Anyway, Social Security can be a real "pain in the posterior" to work with where disability benefits are concerned. #But, unlike private insurance when dealing with Social Security there is like a 98 percent chance that you will eventually be accepted.

Meanwhile, as the wheels of Government turn slower than Molasses in January and you can't work and have no other source of income, you are forced with the choice of having a state "Access Card" (modern-day version of food stamps), or starving to death while you wait.

The "Social Security Way" of doing things is an enigma.

Quote[/b] ]Well I guess I'm one of the lucky ones also.I was approved on the first go around, but it took a year to get approved. #My problem is I filed for VA disability at the same time as ssd and was approved in under 45 days. I was recieving my VA pension for over2 years and ssd for 1 year when the VA said because I was now getting paid by the SSD and am getting more then $800 a month that they now want all their money back. I have filed an appeal and am waiting on their reply. #One hand giveth and the other taketh away.
Bob W. NE7NE

You must of applied for a "Non-Service Connected Disabilty" with our "friends" at the VA. Most 100% Service Connected Vets never had this problem.

My Story: Getting SSDI was fairly easy. I was immediately approved. However, getting approved for VA benefits wasn't so easy. There were three doctors from two (2) states telling the VA that I was unable to work. Thank heaven for D.A.V. and a Congressman. Together they help get my VA disability benefits all for FREE and you can't beat "free" at any price.

Some may not be too happy with Lawyers, but they need to remember this when they're navigating the waters of getting their SSDI: "He(/She) who represents himself(/herself) has a fool for an attorney." #"Uncle Sugar" doesn't always play well with others. You may have to get an attorney anyway so grin and bear it.

Methods of how to achive getting SSDI will vary. What may work for others may not work for you. Once you finally get your SSDI benifits, remember that what COLA (Cost of Living Allowance) raises Social Security may giveth, Medicare#taketh away.

Warning: Going through this process may drive you to the frayed ends of sanity. Best wishes.

[w2amr]

Quote[/b] (k8pg @ Mar. 16 2007,11:06)]Liars(Lawyers-legal theft) Ive had dealings with the Liars over the yrs and Id trust a Used Car Salesmen over 1 any day:D The non-medical issues are your assets and families income combined only in your household-73 Good Luck OM. # # # # # # # # # # # # #Paul

# # # # #PS: A LIAR will TAKE 1/3rd of your back payment,possibly MORE:(
One of the worse moves the government ever made is when they allowed these blood suckers to begin advertising on TV.

[n0jaa]

Quote[/b] (KB3LIX @ Mar. 16 2007,23:12)]I about fainted when I read the letter last night. As you say Glen, I have only heard of two people that were approved on the first go-round.
Make that three. I was one of those very few who was approved on the first application.

[n0jaa]

Quote[/b] (AG3Y @ Mar. 17 2007,00:53)]The thing I can't understand is why my insurance company is continuing to "check up" on my status when there is no question about it as far as the Social Security System is concerned. #I just recently turned in a several page questionare to my insurance company about my inability to return to work, drive a car, ADL functionality, etc. etc. #All a bunch of un-necessary gobble-de-gook when a doctor, appointed by them, essentially swore under oath that my condition would never improve to the point that I would be able to return to work again! #

Yes, I did receive full disability without needing to appeal, but it seems that my insurance company would like to weasel out of their part of the bargain if they could do so!

Such is life ! # #73, Jim
My LTD provider does that, too. I think it really is nothing more than a formality, as they informed me as long as I continue to receive Social Security Disability, I will continue to remain eligible for LTD.

Between the two of them, they amount to about 60% of my salary at the time I became medically disabled.