Morse Code Eliminated by FCC

[k7nys]

Quote[/b] (KL7FZ @ Dec. 18 2006,14:57)]Quote[/b] (k7nys @ Dec. 18 2006,14:23)]Quote[/b] (KL7FZ @ Dec. 18 2006,05:10)]Somewhere tonite, a lot of villages have lost their idiots. Oh wait.... they've all gone down to take the no code General test. Never mind.


Somewhere tonite, a circus has lost all of its clowns. Oh wait...There they are! They've all piled into one small car to drive down to the VE NO-CODE General Testing Session.

I know! I know! I shouldn't make fun of them and call them names. After all, they couldn't even learn 5 Wpm code so how could we expect them be able to properly defend themselves?
What a complete loser. The ARS doesn't need people like you. If you don't like the change, there are other options available to you. Is there really a need for the name calling etc?
Ah come'on now! I am here to help all my new code challenged buddies. I have laid in a large supply of crayons and some nice colored paper from them to draw their no-code test on.
The actual tests are to be in two parts. First is the color in between the lines test. OOOOOPPS!! MY BAD!! We could never require a test that would require a demonstration of physical dexterity. That would be unfair!
Oh the horror!!
Never mind class we will continue on to the next part.
Enter your name on the line at the top.
Yes, Little Billy??
Sure. You can use any color crayon you want.
Susie, stop fighting with Billy and give him back the purple crayon.
After you have spelled your name correctly then you will be given a nice shiny new licence with a pretty Gold Star at the top.
Then you can go out and play with the big kids.
What's that Billy??
You don't know how to spell your name?
That's OK. Just scribble in something you like, maybe just draw a dog and we'll give you a star anyway.
I feel we must not allow our little ones to feel they are not equals with the rest. It sure would give them some sort of complex and destroy their sense of self worth.
So come one and come all...I have large supply of crayons and after our naptime, we are all going down to the Fischer-Price factory and see how they make all those neat little radios with the bigggg pretty knobs.
I am not name calling. I am here to help all that wants help. Still looking for one though. Anyone? Anyone at all?
Naw. It looks like they all want it for nothing.
Stephen....go club a baby seal!......Seems MR. Tolley can't deal with change....please send a truckload of kleenex® to
5000 W GREENSWARD DR
WASILLA, AK 99654

[KI4MSA]

Quote[/b] (K4JF @ Dec. 17 2006,15:04)]Actually, 12/15/06 did far, far more damage to CW mode than eliminating the exam. #Just more of the pattern.
Where sir, is your proof to back that statement up?



This NO-CODE Technician Says:
... . . # -.-- .- # --- -. # .... ..-. #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[KB1SF]

Quote[/b] (N4WSP @ Dec. 18 2006,11:11)]
If you are memorizing something you are learing it. # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # #Steve # # # # # #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif[/QUOTE]
Well...er...yes....BUT...

There is a significant difference between simply memorizing a series of facts about something, and fully understanding the background and significance of that "something". #

The latter is best attained by the "hands on" learning, experimenting and tinkering that can only come from actually DOING it.

This is why the FCC's so-called "incentive licensing" approach to our Service is such a FARCE. #All the current FCC tests measure is one's (usually innate) ability to memorize and regurgitate facts about a subject...NOT one's depth of understanding about that subject nor its significance in the larger context of the art and science of radio.

That is, one can read stacks of books about building and then tuning a transmitter, cutting and pruning a dipole antenna to a particular frequency, or chasing DX on 10 Meters at the bottom of the sunspot cycle. #But, unless and until one actually DOES any of these things, their understanding of that particular part of Amateur Radio (and how it fits with everything else in the hobby) will be sorely limited.

73,

Keith
KB1SF / VA3KSF

[kb8nds]

Quote[/b] (AB2MH @ Dec. 17 2006,21:40)]Quote[/b] (k7nys @ Dec. 17 2006,21:00)]I haven't heard one of these NCT bashing antiques offer to sit down and teach the code to someone.
Nobody asked me for help!

If you ask people to teach, they'll teach.

If you lay back and expect it to be handed to you, then well you get nothing.

It's really that simple.

P.S. I'm hardly an antique. At 28 years old I'm younger than many NCT's. ;)
I'm only 26 (27 in about 2 weeks). http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[KL7FZ]

Quote[/b] (k7nys @ Dec. 18 2006,15:07)]Quote[/b] (KL7FZ @ Dec. 18 2006,14:57)]Quote[/b] (k7nys @ Dec. 18 2006,14:23)]Quote[/b] (KL7FZ @ Dec. 18 2006,05:10)]Somewhere tonite, a lot of villages have lost their idiots. Oh wait.... they've all gone down to take the no code General test. Never mind.


Somewhere tonite, a circus has lost all of its clowns. Oh wait...There they are! They've all piled into one small car to drive down to the VE NO-CODE General Testing Session.

I know! I know! I shouldn't make fun of them and call them names. After all, they couldn't even learn 5 Wpm code so how could we expect them be able to properly defend themselves?
What a complete loser. #The ARS doesn't need people like you. If you don't like the change, there are other options available to you. Is there really a need for the name calling etc?
Ah come'on now! I am here to help all my new code challenged buddies. I have laid in a large supply of crayons and some nice colored paper from them to draw their no-code test on.
#The actual tests are to be in two parts. First is the color in between the lines test. OOOOOPPS!! MY BAD!! We could never require a test that would require a demonstration of physical dexterity. That would be unfair!
Oh the horror!!
Never mind class we will continue on to the next part.
Enter your name on the line at the top.
Yes, Little Billy??
Sure. You can use any color crayon you want.
#Susie, stop fighting with Billy and give him back the purple crayon.
#After you have spelled your name correctly then you will be given a nice shiny new licence with a pretty Gold Star at the top.
#Then you can go out and play with the big kids.
#What's that Billy?? #
# You don't know how to spell your name?
#That's OK. Just scribble in something you like, maybe just draw a dog and we'll give you a star anyway.
# I feel we must not allow our little ones to feel they are not equals with the rest. It sure would give them some sort of complex and destroy their sense of self worth.
# So come one and come all...I have large supply of crayons and after our naptime, we are all going down to the Fischer-Price factory and see how they make all those neat little radios with the bigggg pretty knobs.
I am not name calling. I am here to help all that wants help. Still looking for one though. Anyone? Anyone at all?
Naw. It looks like they all want it for nothing.
Stephen....go club a baby seal!......Seems MR. Tolley can't deal with change....please send a truckload of kleenex® to
5000 W GREENSWARD DR
WASILLA, AK 99654
Oh man this IS FUNNY!! I just read your QRZ bio and you stated you are going to MAKE YOUR KIDS GET THEIR LICENSES.
Isn't that kinda like making someone learn code even if they don't want to???

I'm gonna make'em (http://www.qrz.com/detail/K7NYS)

On one hand you say we should not MAKE anyone learn code if they don't want to...on the other hand......

#Geepers! A bit of a double standard there fellow?

# Plenty of crayons here.. send the kids over. We'll get'em started.

# #Yeppers

# #Come on up anytime. Many hams do. I try to teach a little something about what they are seeing when they get here. Almost ALL go away having learned something about radios, electronics, or equipment.
#After all, there are only twenty buildings full of nothing but radio gear. Some large and some small. But all crammed to the ceiling with real radio stuff. It is a fascinating tour for most. Takes a couple of hours to see most of it. New building going up in spring so I will be able to get more of it out where it can be seen. I am starting to get rid of a lot of it though. Been giving away some of it. Donating some. Selling some.
But you are always welcome to come see some real radios.

# #KL7FZ

[kb8nds]

Quote[/b] (K1EEB @ Dec. 18 2006,02:57)]Maybe a march on Washington, during the summer of course.
Why? It was 74 degrees here today.

[n5iln]

Quote[/b] (K4JF @ Dec. 18 2006,14:22)]Quote[/b] (n5iln @ Dec. 17 2006,13:06)]Like CW? Keep operating it. Teach it to some people.
You can't teach those who refuse to learn.
Then move along to those who are. They're out there. I'm one of them. My MorseRunner scores suck right now, but that doesn't keep me from practicing and trying for higher.

Maybe that's the secret...get people to try the MorseRunner <s>game</s> simulator, and post high scores. All of a sudden, WHAM, a Katrina or a Loma Prieta come along, and the voice circuits are kaput, and the digital circuits useless because nobody's computers work. But guess what? I have a key on the desk, hooked up to my IC706IIG. And I've been practicing what everyone thinks is just a <s>game</s> simulation. Traffic will get through, with me either the originator or receiver.

How 'bout that? Being good at some games DOES help in the real world. (Just don't tell my daughter. For some reason she's hooked on Half-Life 2. If she ever needs THAT in real life, we're all screwed anyway.)

[N0MLR]

FCC = Fantastic Christmas Company.....LOL

[kg4llq]

The deal's done. Get over it! #It is now incumbent upon us, as experience Amateur Radio Operators, to Mentor new no-code Hams in the ways of properly operating in the Amateur Bands. #We should be well aware that if these new Amateurs turn our frequency allotments into new "citizen bands" with profanity and childish behavior, then the FCC will have fodder to sell our allotments to the highest bidders. #Make no mistake; we must "step up to the plate" and encourage, no demand, new Amateurs act responsibly. #We police our hobby and our fellow operators. #Now more than ever we must be viligent in monitoring all our frequencies to ensure they're being used in the proper, legal manner. #The choice is ours. #Either we look at this as an "opportunity" or we face the loss of our hobby. #73, - Ken, KG4LLQ

[k7nys]

Quote[/b] (KL7FZ @ Dec. 18 2006,15:28)]Quote[/b] (k7nys @ Dec. 18 2006,15:07)]Quote[/b] (KL7FZ @ Dec. 18 2006,14:57)]Quote[/b] (k7nys @ Dec. 18 2006,14:23)]Quote[/b] (KL7FZ @ Dec. 18 2006,05:10)]Somewhere tonite, a lot of villages have lost their idiots. Oh wait.... they've all gone down to take the no code General test. Never mind.


Somewhere tonite, a circus has lost all of its clowns. Oh wait...There they are! They've all piled into one small car to drive down to the VE NO-CODE General Testing Session.

I know! I know! I shouldn't make fun of them and call them names. After all, they couldn't even learn 5 Wpm code so how could we expect them be able to properly defend themselves?
What a complete loser. The ARS doesn't need people like you. If you don't like the change, there are other options available to you. Is there really a need for the name calling etc?
Ah come'on now! I am here to help all my new code challenged buddies. I have laid in a large supply of crayons and some nice colored paper from them to draw their no-code test on.
The actual tests are to be in two parts. First is the color in between the lines test. OOOOOPPS!! MY BAD!! We could never require a test that would require a demonstration of physical dexterity. That would be unfair!
Oh the horror!!
Never mind class we will continue on to the next part.
Enter your name on the line at the top.
Yes, Little Billy??
Sure. You can use any color crayon you want.
Susie, stop fighting with Billy and give him back the purple crayon.
After you have spelled your name correctly then you will be given a nice shiny new licence with a pretty Gold Star at the top.
Then you can go out and play with the big kids.
What's that Billy??
You don't know how to spell your name?
That's OK. Just scribble in something you like, maybe just draw a dog and we'll give you a star anyway.
I feel we must not allow our little ones to feel they are not equals with the rest. It sure would give them some sort of complex and destroy their sense of self worth.
So come one and come all...I have large supply of crayons and after our naptime, we are all going down to the Fischer-Price factory and see how they make all those neat little radios with the bigggg pretty knobs.
I am not name calling. I am here to help all that wants help. Still looking for one though. Anyone? Anyone at all?
Naw. It looks like they all want it for nothing.
Stephen....go club a baby seal!......Seems MR. Tolley can't deal with change....please send a truckload of kleenex® to
5000 W GREENSWARD DR
WASILLA, AK 99654
Oh man this IS FUNNY!! I just read your QRZ bio and you stated you are going to MAKE YOUR KIDS GET THEIR LICENSES.
Isn't that kinda like making someone learn code even if they don't want to???

I'm gonna make'em (http://www.qrz.com/detail/K7NYS)

On one hand you say we should not MAKE anyone learn code if they don't want to...on the other hand......

Geepers! A bit of a double standard there fellow?

Plenty of crayons here.. send the kids over. We'll get'em started.

Yeppers

Come on up anytime. Many hams do. I try to teach a little something about what they are seeing when they get here. Almost ALL go away having learned something about radios, electronics, or equipment.
After all, there are only twenty buildings full of nothing but radio gear. Some large and some small. But all crammed to the ceiling with real radio stuff. It is a fascinating tour for most. Takes a couple of hours to see most of it. New building going up in spring so I will be able to get more of it out where it can be seen. I am starting to get rid of a lot of it though. Been giving away some of it. Donating some. Selling some.
But you are always welcome to come see some real radios.

KL7FZ
Ok Stephen...at least you said "I try to teach"..good enough for me....BTW, My kids aren't interested in AR...guess I'll change the bio

73

[N0MLR]

Quote[/b] (kg4llq @ Dec. 18 2006,16:06)]The deal's done. Get over it! #It is now incumbent upon us, as experience Amateur Radio Operators, to Mentor new no-code Hams in the ways of properly operating in the Amateur Bands. #We should be well aware that if these new Amateurs turn our frequency allotments into new "citizen bands" with profanity and childish behavior, then the FCC will have fodder to sell our allotments to the highest bidders. #Make no mistake; we must "step up to the plate" and encourage, no demand, new Amateurs act responsibly. #We police our hobby and our fellow operators. #Now more than ever we must be viligent in monitoring all our frequencies to ensure they're being used in the proper, legal manner. #The choice is ours. #Either we look at this as an "opportunity" or we face the loss of our hobby. #73, - Ken, KG4LLQ
What a great Idea Kenneth and thanks for your concern that us new guys are kept on the straight and narrow.
Perhaps you should start Boneing up on all that advice by Elmering some of the Old Fart Know Code Ops who are on 75 and 20 meters right now! In short if you live in a glass house don't throw stones.
By the way I thought I had been operating on the Ham Bands for the last 9 years. Who was that Masked Man who declared 6 meters and up to be non Ham Bands anyhow?

73
Greg

[K4JF]

Quote[/b] (KI4MSA @ Dec. 17 2006,16:10)]Quote[/b] (K4JF @ Dec. 17 2006,15:04)]Actually, 12/15/06 did far, far more damage to CW mode than eliminating the exam. #Just more of the pattern.
Where sir, is your proof to back that statement up?



This NO-CODE Technician Says:
... . . # -.-- .- # --- -. # .... ..-. #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif
What proof do you need? It seems pretty obvious to me.

Squeezing CW into an ever smaller segment of the band will do more damage to the mode than just eliminating part of the exam, in my experienced opinion.

Eliminating the exam does no damage to those who already use the mode. (That's why I was for eliminating code exam for General - but not Extra). Reducing the available operating space is a whole 'nother matter.

[M3KCK]

I will let You into a little Secret!!

HF Propagates World-Wide http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

So if your Fellow Countrymen won’t work you don’t worry because the Rest of the World Will #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif
Welcome to HF,
es 73
Regards,
Andrew # M3KCK


Ps.
I don’t remember the FCC ever mentioning that they would Keep Code testing for the Extra http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif
I guess that was just Wishful thinking!! (They did Exactly what they said on the tin)


PPs.
You are Not the only Country in the World to Stop Code testing.... Is HF CB Already?? (Your 75m Band Excluded, Yes we can Hear it, See propagation above)

edit:
No code or Know code....
Merry Christmas & Happy New Year to You All.

[N4XFF]

I am glad yet sad to see the passing of the code requirement but time marches on.

My biggest hope is that our great hobby does not go the way of Citizen's Band radio.

Folks since this is going to happen the best thing to do is the following : Show interested people all aspects of Amateur Radio; teach the code to those that want to learn it (believe there are some out there that will want to learn it, I've already talked to 2); those that don't want to learn code, taech them what they want to learn and encourage them in all aspects maybe they will eventually want to learn code too? maybe not.
But at least our ranks will increase when we let people that said they would do it if it were not for the code requirement. Those that do get into amatuer radio then will get into it, those that don't weren't just blowing smoke anyway!!!!!!

Oh well I'm done, I have to go work some CW.

[KB2SFH]

Quote[/b] (KI4RHE @ Dec. 17 2006,19:22)]None of the negative comments amount to more than "I had to do so should you".
My arguement in a nutshell is this: IF YOU WANT SOMETHING THEN WORK FOR IT AND QUIT SITTING AROUND WHINING UNTIL IT GETS HANDED TO YOU.

[KB1SF]

While all those crusty, Morse-testing-forever curmudgeons have been breathlessly predicting the end of Morse on our bands (if not the end of Amateur Radio itself), it would seem the FCC, by its actions, is encouraging just the oppose.

That is, once the changes are in effect, ALL Technician licensees -- whether or not they have passed a Morse code examination -- will have "Tech Plus" operating privileges.

This means "no code" Tech will have all of their current VHF/UHF and above frequencies and also will have access to the Novice/Technician Plus frequencies on HF, with a power limit of 200W PEP for Technician operators. These frequencies include:

3525-3600 kHz CW only
7025-7125 kHz CW only
21,025-21,200 kHz CW only
28,000-28,300 kHz CW, RTTY and Data
28,300-28,500 kHz CW, SSB

Translation: #In order to have access to all these "new" HF frequencies, no-code Techs are now GOING TO HAVE TO LEARN MORSE!

Isn't that what "incentive licensing" was supposed to be all about?

73,

Keith
KB1SF / VA3KSF

[KB4YKJ]

After following the 31 pages of dribble I just about am ashamed to say I'm a ham operator. And it's not because the code was eliminated. Its because of the comments made by long term operators. I hate double standards and and here are some:

1. The same operators who say a no code operator would be inferior, a slacker, lazy and undeserving beg to search out that distant signal from an operator in a country that has not required code for years. They power over each other to talk to that foreign operator that did not need code to obtain his/her license.

2. In many areas coded operators state they will not talk to a no coder but live on 2 meter 70cm repeater full of well mannered no code techs.

3. They claim they will not talk to a no code general but I can't wait to see every extra look up every QSO on QRZ to see what date the license was issued before they answer that call.

4. Pity the poor fool who renews his license after this takes place. Based on what is being said here a renewal date after Feb 2007 will appear that he just got his license issued without code.

5. CBers will not flock to ham. They have already flocked to cell phones and computers because they are much cooler than listening to a bunch of OF talking about their latest surgery, health problems or service in WWII.

6. This forum is exactly why amateur radio is dying. Who willingly wants to be subjected to this kind of elitist I'm better than you attitude.

7. The same generals and extras who want to keep the hobby the way it was 30 years ago can't wait for the newest HRO catalog to come out instead of building a rig.

I think its time for a moderator to close this thread because it isn't even a debate anymore. It's the sorry truth why our hobby and clubs are dying.

Signed
A 30+ year operator with code.

[k7nys]

Quote[/b] (KB4YKJ @ Dec. 18 2006,17:31)]After following the 31 pages of dribble I just about am ashamed to say I'm a ham operator. And it's not because the code was eliminated. Its because of the comments made by long term operators. I hate double standards and and here are some:

1. The same operators who say a no code operator would be inferior, a slacker, lazy and undeserving beg to search out that distant signal from an operator in a country that has not required code for years. They power over each other to talk to that foreign operator that did not need code to obtain his/her license.

2. In many areas coded operators state they will not talk to a no coder but live on 2 meter 70cm repeater full of well mannered no code techs.

3. They claim they will not talk to a no code general but I can't wait to see every extra look up every QSO on QRZ to see what date the license was issued before they answer that call.

4. Pity the poor fool who renews his license after this takes place. Based on what is being said here a renewal date after Feb 2007 will appear that he just got his license issued without code.

5. CBers will not flock to ham. They have already flocked to cell phones and computers because they are much cooler than listening to a bunch of OF talking about their latest surgery, health problems or service in WWII.

6. This forum is exactly why amateur radio is dying. Who willingly wants to be subjected to this kind of elitist I'm better than you attitude.

7. The same generals and extras who want to keep the hobby the way it was 30 years ago can't wait for the newest HRO catalog to come out instead of building a rig.

I think its time for a moderator to close this thread because it isn't even a debate anymore. It's the sorry truth why our hobby and clubs are dying.

Signed
A 30+ year operator with code.
Amen

[N7YA]

OK, survey time...play along if you like...by a show of hands, answer the following:

1) When was the last time you were on HF?

2) When was the last time you elmered someone?

3) When was the last time you operated CW? (band not an issue)

4) How often do you get on the air in general?

5) Do you plan to upgrade? (if you are not an extra)

6) How often to you get on QRZ, eHam, other forums?

7) If you are a new ham, do you use, or do you plan on using CW?

...I have other questions, but this should give us a decent idea of who we are talking to here. be honest.

I will answer my own questions if you want to know so im not hiding behind anything. Im just curious about the pool of folks chiming in here. Thanks.

73...Adam, N7YA

[n0zoa]

Quote[/b] (kb1sf @ Dec. 18 2006,17:28)]While all those crusty, Morse-testing-forever curmudgeons have been breathlessly predicting the end of Morse on our bands (if not the end of Amateur Radio itself), it would seem the FCC, by its actions, is encouraging just the oppose.

That is, once the changes are in effect, ALL Technician licensees -- whether or not they have passed a Morse code examination -- will have "Tech Plus" operating privileges.

This means "no code" Tech will have all of their current VHF/UHF and above frequencies and also will have access to the Novice/Technician Plus frequencies on HF, with a power limit of 200W PEP for Technician operators. These frequencies include:

3525-3600 kHz CW only
7025-7125 kHz CW only
21,025-21,200 kHz CW only
28,000-28,300 kHz CW, RTTY and Data
28,300-28,500 kHz CW, SSB

Translation: #In order to have access to all these "new" HF frequencies, no-code Techs are now GOING TO HAVE TO LEARN MORSE!

Isn't that what "incentive licensing" was supposed to be all about?

73,

Keith
KB1SF / VA3KSF
no we wont because all we have to do is go take a extra exam and pass it and we will have full access to wherever and whatever mode

[KI4BNC]

Quote[/b] (n6kzb @ Dec. 18 2006,13:59)]Whiners all.........

(cheeze available at the checkout stand)

It is done, so move on................


Hey, how bout them Chargers, eh?



http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif
I dunno...
really have always liked fords myself...
OOOOOOOHHHHHHHHHHhhhhhhhhhh...
you mean football?
sorry.
I don't follow sports.

[N7YA]

Whoa...weird, KB4YKJ and I must have been typing these at the same time.

And i couldnt agree with you more! I agree with everything there...And i will add to this that the smartest ham in the world right now isnt an angry, spiteful OF with a million years of experience, it isnt a geeky new NCT who can build a satellite and launch it on his own hand made rocket...its Fred, AA7BQ!! hes smarter than all of us, the longer this goes, the better off he sits...hes a smart man. How often does Fred jump into the fray and let his opinions be known? VERY rarely...he will post first, but thats about it...he doesnt need to. I know Fred has opinions and ideas, im sure Fred is a good guy...but he is also a smart guy!

Remember this, gents...and the one fired up lady from 2 land (sorry, forgot the call). The internet wasnt around in the good old days either.

73...Adam, N7YA

[ah6gi]

Quote[/b] (ka9uce @ Dec. 17 2006,23:09)]I'd LOVE to see ALL the appliance EXTRAS lose their tickets if they can't pass a RIGOROUS technical test, in lieu of a CW test, THEN we'll see who cries foul!

Love that CW, but can't repair a radio...NO LICENSE!
I understand your frustration. Couple points, I got my Novice license in 1963 and will be 60 in a few days. You probably consider me a "geezer".

I don't operate much, I listen some, about half HF-SSB and half HF-CW. I copy CW to keep my code speed up, which isn't that great. I can copy stock QSO's at 20, maybe 30 WPM. Random code groups, probably 15 WPM max.

I encourage everyone to give CW a try. It is like riding a bicycle or swimming. It's not the fastest way to get from here to there but a lot of fun.

One caution. Do not pull "techno-geek" rank on any ham, no matter how young, how old, radio type, or license class.

I play on vacuum tube radios like my 75S-1 at night but during the day I work in software, machine language, C, Object Basic, Domino databases, and similar.

de ah6gi/4 Extra-13

[ah6gi]

Quote[/b] (kc7gnm @ Dec. 18 2006,13:18)]That is the best idea I have heard yet. I agree. Cancel all our licenses and start from scratch. Then you would get the old timers that can't pass a written exam becasue they can't see the words and have to get a doctors note saying they are exempt from taking the test. LOL.

Greg
KC7GNM
Not that bad an idea. While your hostility is rather open, there is some merit to leveling the playing field.

Tell you what. While we're upgrading the exams, bringing them into the 21st century, so to speak, how about adding material from a graduate level engineering program?

Digital logic, automata theory, combinatorics, discrete math.

For the practical side, we could all design and code a software radio.

Heck, let's build a CPU simulator in software. I did that for a hardware course about 1990. 16 bit addressing, a couple dozen OP-codes. Then I wrote programs and ran them on my simulator.

Let's define a new protocol, signal levels, error correction, argue for a bandwidth, showing the formal proofs.

I'm kidding, of course.

My point is this. Please do not fool yourselves. There are many, many older hams who really understand the technology. Younger ones too. There is a wide range of backgrounds and skillsets.

Please respect each other.

de ah6gi/4

[M3KCK]

Quote[/b] (KB4YKJ @ Dec. 19 2006,01:31)]After following the 31 pages of dribble I just about am ashamed to say I'm a ham operator. #And it's not because the code was eliminated. #Its because of the comments made by long term operators. #I hate double standards and and here are some:

1. #The same operators who say a no code operator would be inferior, a slacker, lazy and undeserving beg to search out that distant signal from an operator in a country that has not required code for years. #They power over each other to talk to that foreign operator that did not need code to obtain his/her license.

2. #In many areas coded operators state they will not talk to a no coder but live on 2 meter 70cm repeater full of well mannered no code techs.

3. #They claim they will not talk to a no code general but I can't wait to see every extra look up every QSO on QRZ to see what date the license was issued before they answer that call.

4. #Pity the poor fool who renews his license after this takes place. #Based on what is being said here a renewal date after Feb 2007 will appear that he just got his license issued without code.

5. #CBers will not flock to ham. #They have already flocked to cell phones and computers because they are much cooler than listening to a bunch of OF talking about their latest surgery, health problems or service in WWII.

6. #This forum is exactly why amateur radio is dying. #Who willingly wants to be subjected to this kind of elitist I'm better than you attitude.

7. #The same generals and extras who want to keep the hobby the way it was 30 years ago can't wait for the newest HRO catalog to come out instead of building a rig.

I think its time for a moderator to close this thread because it isn't even a debate anymore. #It's the sorry truth why our hobby and clubs are dying.

Signed
A 30+ year operator with code.
An Excellent post,

Respect to you Sir,
Merry Christmas & Happy New Year,
es 73
Regards,
Andrew M3KCK

[N2GOD]

Ahhhh... yes!

Well, now that the morse code requirement has gone "flat-line", (may it rest in peace), maybe now we can get to work on the other improvements which I will post as a new thread <span style='color:green'>(*CLICK HERE*)</span> (http://www.qrz.com/ib-bin/ikonboard.cgi?act=ST;f=7;t=140835) to not be off-topic in this one.

[w1tdp]

I have read every post, and just want to say that I agree with everything that everyone has said.

Now can we all be friends? http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[kc7jty]

Quote[/b] (w1tdp @ Dec. 18 2006,20:04)]Now can we all be friends? http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif
sure...can you loan me $300...friend?

[W5WEC]

I have read most of the post here, not all, nearly 800, the other thread has nearly 600. Some of it has made sence some of it does not. It has lost the original subject matter. What i do not understand we have known for some time that this was going to happen, and we should accept the fact that it has. Oh i know some CW die hards will never accept it, but it is a done deal now, get over it. The bands will not be taken over by the CB`ers and i doubt if we will really notice the difference other that the fact we will hear some new voices of the frequencies. I look forward to hear new hams and try to encourage them to get involved in the hobby. #Lets all work together to make the bands better. After all CW will not go away in fact i think it will survive all of this "hoop-ha" over nothing. Buy the way i am a 20 WPM extra. Fred should stop this and not let it go #on and on.

[K8MB]

Yet another idiotic government decision. There is no tradition with hamradio anymore. I think the United States in general is in decline and this is just one more small sign of it. The government is just giving it all away and selling us out. I am not an elitist and would never consider not speaking to another ham for any reason, however to me the code requirement was a really nice tradition because it was based on radio history and was one of the first building blocks of what we have become. I will always be glad that I made the effort to speak CW.

[w6aws]

Quote[/b] (kc8vwm @ Dec. 18 2006,09:12)]Quote[/b] (kc2jfs @ Dec. 18 2006,09:01)]Just another perfect example of a NCT that doesn't understand the meaning of accomplishment. You sir represent the mindset of people that will now be given privileges that you did not earn. Just as I will do on the air, I will do now. IGNORE YOU. BYE BYE.
Let me interject.

I am a NCT that took the time to learn CW. I didn't pass the element 1 testing. This doesn't necessarily mean that I don't know or never took the time to study CW, it just means I didn't get over the hurdle at the testing session.

I suspect there are many, many other NCT's out there just like this. It's not that they are all lazy and don't want to learn CW. They studied it just like you did but the difference in this case is the fact that they didn't pass the test and you did.

So try and consider that fact when you generalize all NCT's into one basket. Also try to consider that perhaps I was one of the few NCT's that supported to keep CW as a licensing requirement. #We are not your enemy. Remember, the FCC made this decision not the NCT's

I recieved my license at a point in time when it was already on the chopping block. While I did study it, I simply didn't make the grade. However, this doesn't mean I don't enjoy using CW on 2m.despite that fact.
I find it particularly handy for VHF DX situations. So I use it now out of sheer neccesity to communicate short and quick callsign exchanges etc. I am not perfect at deciphering it at times and sometimes I decipher a few characters into one another and misinterpret#letters at times. Like "R" and "F" or I sometimes hear "U" and "W" as the same sound but hey when I combine the callsigns with a grid squre I can get a correct match. I am not too shabby with using my fist for sending. Need to work on sending my "C's" a little better I think. Perhaps there's still a little more time to make the grade. This would be my 3rd attempt.

So there you have it. Just another lazy NCT with no desire to learn CW and who doesn't understand the meaning of what an accomplishment is.

73 and warm wishes for the holidays.

Charles - KC8VWM
Well, don't worry about it. #I am a current General and I have issues with the same letters. #I bet that 95% of the cw "operators" have the same issue from time to time. #

I tried to find the post from kc2jfs, but it was not there. Was hoping he/she would enlighten us on how they plan to determine who is "code" and who is "no code". Unbeleiveable.

Andy




Andy http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[KD5OEI]

still alot of great posts!
I've almost always chosen tranceivers rather than receivers when buying radio equipment. You get more value for the money in some cases. I do alot of SWL on them and generally don't leave the mikes plugged in since they would just be in the way.

Perhaps if more people are soon interested in transmitting on HF, the value of the used equipment will increase a bit. The decrease in complaining about the value/selling prices of used HF equipment might partially offset the increase in complaining about those of us who aspire to use HF for a variety of reasons but haven't bothered to, had time to, or been able to (you pick) learn the code well enough to pass.:p tell ya what.. instead of going ahead and trying again for the code test, I'll use vacuum tubes and do my own repairs. pennance enough? nay, a pleasure!

[n0zoa]

i posted on the other thread shouldnt we all live by these words

Amateur Radio Code

1 The amateur is considerate.... He never knowingly uses the air in such a way as to lessen the pleasure of others.
2 The amateur is loyal....He offers his loyalty, encouragement and support to his fellow radio amateurs, his local club and to the American Radio Relay League, through which amateur radio is represented.
3 The amateur is progressive.... He keeps his station abreast of science. It is well-built and efficient. His operating practice is above reproach.
((4)) The amateur is friendly.... slow and patient sending when requested, friendly advice and counsel to the beginner, kindly assistance, cooperation and consideration for the interests of others; these are marks of the amateur spirit.
5 The amateur is balanced.... radio is his hobby. He never allows it to interfere with any of the duties he owes to his home, his job, his school, or his community.
6 The amateur is patriotic.... his knowledge and station are always ready for the service of his country and his community. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[KB2UBH]

Quote[/b] (ke6oud @ Dec. 16 2006,04:40)]Quote[/b] (KL7FZ @ Dec. 16 2006,02:35)]Hmmmm. Interesting. I have never been on 11 meters, but you obviously have . You seem to know what goes on there......
Gave yourself away....did ya?

#And they say amateur radio isn't turning into CB? So what are all of you CBers doing here posing as hams?

#KL7FZ
Your pic. on your post tells most about you...Nuff said....
I LOVE IT!! I was thinking the very same thing.

You know, this hobby can do very well without the likes of KL7FZ and his other buddy KW6AM. People like him are the reason people shy away from radio.

I was around in the early to mid 70's, experimenting with EARLY CB, talking to Italy on 5 watts. Was great fun. My Uncle, who went all the way to extra back then, said the code would be gone some day back then. He tried for years to get it into my head. Couldn't do it. Been in the electrical/electronics field for 35+ years. Probably have forgotten more theory then the OF KL7FZ knows.

I have waited for this day for 30+ years.........I am going to enjoy it and then get out the book to review the general rules and find an exam somewhere.

Oh.........and BTW KL7FZ, there were lids and CB'ers on 80 meters back 35 years ago......it won't change. Won't get better, and it won't get worse. You want to get rid of that amp. let me know, I can use one now! LOL

[W0UZR]

Quote[/b] (KL7FZ @ Dec. 18 2006,16:28)]Quote[/b] (k7nys @ Dec. 18 2006,15:07)]Quote[/b] (KL7FZ @ Dec. 18 2006,14:57)]Quote[/b] (k7nys @ Dec. 18 2006,14:23)]Quote[/b] (KL7FZ @ Dec. 18 2006,05:10)]Somewhere tonite, a lot of villages have lost their idiots. Oh wait.... they've all gone down to take the no code General test. Never mind.


Somewhere tonite, a circus has lost all of its clowns. Oh wait...There they are! They've all piled into one small car to drive down to the VE NO-CODE General Testing Session.

I know! I know! I shouldn't make fun of them and call them names. After all, they couldn't even learn 5 Wpm code so how could we expect them be able to properly defend themselves?
What a complete loser. #The ARS doesn't need people like you. If you don't like the change, there are other options available to you. Is there really a need for the name calling etc?
Ah come'on now! I am here to help all my new code challenged buddies. I have laid in a large supply of crayons and some nice colored paper from them to draw their no-code test on.
#The actual tests are to be in two parts. First is the color in between the lines test. OOOOOPPS!! MY BAD!! We could never require a test that would require a demonstration of physical dexterity. That would be unfair!
Oh the horror!!
Never mind class we will continue on to the next part.
Enter your name on the line at the top.
Yes, Little Billy??
Sure. You can use any color crayon you want.
#Susie, stop fighting with Billy and give him back the purple crayon.
#After you have spelled your name correctly then you will be given a nice shiny new licence with a pretty Gold Star at the top.
#Then you can go out and play with the big kids.
#What's that Billy?? #
# You don't know how to spell your name?
#That's OK. Just scribble in something you like, maybe just draw a dog and we'll give you a star anyway.
# I feel we must not allow our little ones to feel they are not equals with the rest. It sure would give them some sort of complex and destroy their sense of self worth.
# So come one and come all...I have large supply of crayons and after our naptime, we are all going down to the Fischer-Price factory and see how they make all those neat little radios with the bigggg pretty knobs.
I am not name calling. I am here to help all that wants help. Still looking for one though. Anyone? Anyone at all?
Naw. It looks like they all want it for nothing.
Stephen....go club a baby seal!......Seems MR. Tolley can't deal with change....please send a truckload of kleenex® to
5000 W GREENSWARD DR
WASILLA, AK 99654
Oh man this IS FUNNY!! I just read your QRZ bio and you stated you are going to MAKE YOUR KIDS GET THEIR LICENSES.
Isn't that kinda like making someone learn code even if they don't want to???

I'm gonna make'em (http://www.qrz.com/detail/K7NYS)

On one hand you say we should not MAKE anyone learn code if they don't want to...on the other hand......

#Geepers! A bit of a double standard there fellow?

# Plenty of crayons here.. send the kids over. We'll get'em started.

# #Yeppers

# #Come on up anytime. Many hams do. I try to teach a little something about what they are seeing when they get here. Almost ALL go away having learned something about radios, electronics, or equipment.
#After all, there are only twenty buildings full of nothing but radio gear. Some large and some small. But all crammed to the ceiling with real radio stuff. It is a fascinating tour for most. Takes a couple of hours to see most of it. New building going up in spring so I will be able to get more of it out where it can be seen. I am starting to get rid of a lot of it though. Been giving away some of it. Donating some. Selling some.
But you are always welcome to come see some real radios.

# #KL7FZ
Do you have any Collins S line equipment?

I've always wanted a Collins S line station.

Are there any amps in that pile? Need an extra amp so I can still do nets while I'm getting the other fixed..

[W0UZR]

Quote[/b] (w1tdp @ Dec. 18 2006,21:04)]I have read every post,
~snip~
You DID, and you are still sane and don't need a,,

PSYCHIATRIST?


~~~~~~~ !!!! ~~~~~~

[nd6f]

HAY fcc - .--. - .--. - .--. - .--. - .--. - .--. ahh crap I got my screen all wet got any tp. 73's K7TST

[k0jk]

Quote[/b] (kc8vwm @ Dec. 18 2006,12:28)]Actually, I didn't find the W5TJZ's story "grumpy" or mean sprited or anything else. #

Just seemed like an interesting way he got started in amateur radio.

I thought it was sort of interesting how Mr. Simpson (the FCC inspector) graded him by simply saying, "Well, I guess thats good enough for a Novice"

That kind of reminded me of taking a pass/fail road test examination in similar sort of way.

73
He is till lamenting about something that is meaningless. It is as if suddenly cw was outlawed and no new hams will get to learn and use it... That is simply not true.

[k0jk]

Quote[/b] (KB2SFH @ Dec. 18 2006,17:06)]Quote[/b] (KI4RHE @ Dec. 17 2006,19:22)]None of the negative comments amount to more than "I had to do so should you".
My arguement in a nutshell is this: IF YOU WANT SOMETHING THEN WORK FOR IT AND QUIT SITTING AROUND WHINING UNTIL IT GETS HANDED TO YOU.
You are still whining that it is "easier" for todays hams to get what you have... So you learned code... Who cares besides you? It was your achievment milestone, but it might not be for others in the hobby. Is it about the code or your self esteem?

[PE1RDW]

Quote[/b] (N7YA @ Dec. 19 2006,02:42)]OK, survey time...play along if you like...by a show of hands, answer the following:

1) When was the last time you were on HF?

2) When was the last time you elmered someone?

3) When was the last time you operated CW? (band not an issue)

4) How often do you get on the air in general?

5) Do you plan to upgrade? (if you are not an extra)

6) How often to you get on QRZ, eHam, other forums?

7) If you are a new ham, do you use, or do you plan on using CW?

...I have other questions, but this should give us a decent idea of who we are talking to here. be honest.

I will answer my own questions if you want to know so im not hiding behind anything. Im just curious about the pool of folks chiming in here. Thanks.

73...Adam, N7YA
1) Over a year ago.
2) just yesterday.
3) automatic ID daily, computergenerated a couple of months ago.
4) daily for several hours.
5) not an extra but dutch full licence so no posibilety to upgrade any further.
6) almost daily
7) not a new ham but I use CW in highspeed or coherent mode from time to time (computer generated tough)

[NL7W]

Quote[/b] (KB2UBH @ Dec. 18 2006,22:57)]Quote[/b] (ke6oud @ Dec. 16 2006,04:40)]Quote[/b] (KL7FZ @ Dec. 16 2006,02:35)]Hmmmm. Interesting. I have never been on 11 meters, but you obviously have . You seem to know what goes on there......
Gave yourself away....did ya?

And they say amateur radio isn't turning into CB? So what are all of you CBers doing here posing as hams?

KL7FZ
Your pic. on your post tells most about you...Nuff said....
I LOVE IT!! I was thinking the very same thing.

You know, this hobby can do very well without the likes of KL7FZ and his other buddy KW6AM. People like him are the reason people shy away from radio.

I was around in the early to mid 70's, experimenting with EARLY CB, talking to Italy on 5 watts. Was great fun. My Uncle, who went all the way to extra back then, said the code would be gone some day back then. He tried for years to get it into my head. Couldn't do it. Been in the electrical/electronics field for 35+ years. Probably have forgotten more theory then the OF KL7FZ knows.

I have waited for this day for 30+ years.........I am going to enjoy it and then get out the book to review the general rules and find an exam somewhere.

Oh.........and BTW KL7FZ, there were lids and CB'ers on 80 meters back 35 years ago......it won't change. Won't get better, and it won't get worse. You want to get rid of that amp. let me know, I can use one now! LOL
Now your pretty little head doesn't have to worry about code. Keep boasting about superior knowledge, friend. Your pretty little head isn't so pretty or little anymore.

Such a fool...

[k0jk]

Quote[/b] (NL7W @ Dec. 19 2006,01:32)]Quote[/b] (KB2UBH @ Dec. 18 2006,22:57)]Quote[/b] (ke6oud @ Dec. 16 2006,04:40)]Quote[/b] (KL7FZ @ Dec. 16 2006,02:35)]Hmmmm. Interesting. I have never been on 11 meters, but you obviously have . You seem to know what goes on there......
Gave yourself away....did ya?

#And they say amateur radio isn't turning into CB? So what are all of you CBers doing here posing as hams?

#KL7FZ
Your pic. on your post tells most about you...Nuff said....
I LOVE IT!! I was thinking the very same thing.

You know, this hobby can do very well without the likes of KL7FZ and his other buddy KW6AM. People like him are the reason people shy away from radio.

I was around in the early to mid 70's, experimenting with EARLY CB, talking to Italy on 5 watts. Was great fun. My Uncle, who went all the way to extra back then, said the code would be gone some day back then. He tried for years to get it into my head. Couldn't do it. Been in the electrical/electronics field for 35+ years. Probably have forgotten more theory then the OF KL7FZ knows.

I have waited for this day for 30+ years.........I am going to enjoy it and then get out the book to review the general rules and find an exam somewhere.

Oh.........and BTW KL7FZ, there were lids and CB'ers on 80 meters back 35 years ago......it won't change. Won't get better, and it won't get worse. You want to get rid of that amp. let me know, I can use one now! LOL
Now your pretty little head doesn't have to worry about code. #Keep boasting about superior knowledge, friend. #Your pretty little head isn't so pretty or little anymore.

Such a fool...
So bitter...

[k8cpa]

793 comments, 32 pages, good grief! http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif

bad part is, nothing said in here, is really gonna change anything. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif

oh well, let's move on.

[kc7noa]

So ... when does this go into effect??

SOOOooooo manny posts .. its a pain to look through the flaming posts.

[KL7FZ]

Quote[/b] (w0uzr @ Dec. 18 2006,23:24)]Do you have any Collins S line equipment?

# # # # I've always wanted a Collins S line station.

Are there any amps in that pile? #Need an extra amp so I can still do nets while I'm getting the other fixed..
Just sold the KWM-2. You're too late. Just got in a brand new Lunar Link on Black Friday. That was a real up and down day. Ecstasy when the amp arrived and agony when I go home and got the news about code being dropped. I will use it on moonbounce. On CW.
Just bought an ACOM 2000A. Don't know what I will do with it though. Probably CW on the bottom of 20.

BTW: For reference for the rest of you: I will never ever sell any of my working amps to a NO-CODE HF ham. Probably none of my rigs either. Might even put it in my will.

Got about 10 rigs up for sale now. Will be on the swap sites and ebay.

#KL7FZ

[KI4NNL]

Hey folks,
My hope is that after a few weeks the the uproar will die down and we can get on with being hams. I have been lurking for a long time because as a new ham, one who is learning code so I can use it, required or not, I could not stand the code/no code debate and found myself sucked in rather early on in my time here. Real life and other projects has put most of my ham radio on hold. The nice thing is it showed me the folly of the idea that loosing CW would kill the ham radio tradition. I have a few other things in my life that are focused around traditional activities, one of them is something there is no license for and that by all rights should be dead, yet remains a love of millions and is probably a bigger interest then ham radio. Despite being an outmoded technology, dead for nearly a century! In every part of the country you can see enthusiasts taking part on any nice weekend. It takes an incredible amount of work, for its not just a "brain" hobby but takes physical work as well, but many do it, young and old, male and female.

This technology once drove empires, but is now all but useless. There is no need for it except in very very rare and unique situations, yet millions do it?

I ride horses.

There is no requirement anywhere that I know of to have any level of equestrian knowledge, no license, no incentive, yet millions willingly learn how these creatures behave, how to modify how they behave, genetics, vetrinary health issues, spend LOTS of money on care and devote a tremendous amount of time to keep thier animals healthy and happy. The car it seems did not put an end to the equestrian world, and there are now more horses owned and ridden in this country then ever in history, not bad for dead technology. So tell me, if people wish to use CW, how is it dead?

There is no test requirement for basic riding skills.
There isn't even a requirement for putting the tack on the animal, or even displaying ground manners? How can people drive a car without knowing that? Without forcing people to know that won't horseriding die?

Well, maybe not... If you need a federal law enacted/defeated so you can enjoy your hobby, maybe you should rethink your hobby. If you love a tradition, work to preserve it, I don't need to saddle up my quarter horse or my paso fino to do anything vital to this world, but I enjoy it, and it carries on a tradition that has carried on for many years and will continue to do so without being required for anything!


Chris

[ke4cxp]

What is happening to our hobby?

The majority of these posts are nothing more than flame jobs on NCT's and potential newcomer to this hobby. The FCC has just done what a lot of older hams have been doing for years by getting doctors notes saying they can not hear well enough for the higher speed code tests.

Lets drop this argument and get on with Ham Radio.
http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[n9lya]

I believe it is not CODE that makes the ham.. It’s the Basting and pineapples, whoops wrong ham... lol But their human-relations skills.. It takes a great person to be a great ham and a bad person to be a bad ham.. I know both examples of Hams unfortunately and a few in-between...


What catagory are you in....


73 Jerry N9LYA http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif

[WA4RYW]

Quote[/b] (VE3UUH @ Dec. 18 2006,11:02)]http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif I am not sure what will happen in the USA after the dropping of code as a test requirement . I can say in Canada after it was dropped you barely noticed a ripple effect . If a couple of hundred people even bothered to get on HF it would be a momentous event
You have to remember, most of these other countries didn't HAVE a Citizen's Band, or at least certainly not as lawless and lowbrow as ours became. The 11 Meter CB debacle was a uniquely US experience, largely created by FCC policy, the Bandit, and individuals in this country that think laws are merely suggestions to be followed when convenient. This culture has been permeating the ham bands for years now. This isn’t anything new, and I’m not really expecting a huge surge in culture degradation. I give you an example. In ham radio, an RF amplifier has always been referred to exactly as that; an RF amplifier. CB slang called them many things; foot warmers, linears, shoes, whatever. Check the July issue of QST front page where they feature an article “Keep Your Linear Humming”. Turn to page 37, and you’ll get treated to the article “Learning to Live with a Linear”, that goes on talking about highly technical issues such as “how to tune your amp, er, linear”, what amps do, why they knock the hell out of you if you don’t know how to install them, how to install them, and why RG-58 isn’t a good idea. Take a thumb through a QST from the 70’s, and you will learn about modifying amplifiers for higher performance and the theory behind it.

Guys it has already happened. You just missed it.

[kc7gnm]

OK, survey time...play along if you like...by a show of hands, answer the following:

1) When was the last time you were on HF? Today

2) When was the last time you elmered someone? Yesterday

3) When was the last time you operated CW? (band not an issue) Never. I took the code test and was studing for 13wpm when the FCC dropped 13 and 20 and then dumped it.

4) How often do you get on the air in general? Everyday

5) Do you plan to upgrade? (if you are not an extra)Yes one day I plan to upgrade to extra.

6) How often to you get on QRZ, eHam, other forums? Only when something worth reading is on here.

7) If you are a new ham, do you use, or do you plan on using CW? Been a ham for 13 years.

[kc7gnm]

Quote[/b] (ah6gi @ Dec. 18 2006,21:24)]Quote[/b] (kc7gnm @ Dec. 18 2006,13:18)]That is the best idea I have heard yet. I agree. Cancel all our licenses and start from scratch. Then you would get the old timers that can't pass a written exam becasue they can't see the words and have to get a doctors note saying they are exempt from taking the test. LOL.

Greg
KC7GNM
Not that bad an idea. #While your hostility is rather open, there is some merit to leveling the playing field. #

Tell you what. #While we're upgrading the exams, bringing them into the 21st century, so to speak, how about adding material from a graduate level engineering program? #

Digital logic, automata theory, combinatorics, discrete math.

For the practical side, we could all design and code a software radio. #

Heck, let's build a CPU simulator in software. # I did that for a hardware course about 1990. #16 bit addressing, a couple dozen OP-codes. #Then I wrote programs and ran them on my simulator. #

Let's define a new protocol, signal levels, error correction, argue for a bandwidth, showing the formal proofs. #

I'm kidding, of course.

My point is this. #Please do not fool yourselves. #There are many, many older hams who really understand the technology. # Younger ones too. # There is a wide range of backgrounds and skillsets. #

Please respect each other.

de ah6gi/4
But what I am talking about is the old fogies that think just because they took the test so many years ago they think they know more than someone coming in the hobby today. Since we tested on the "mode" morse code for so long how come we never tested on any other mode seperately? Why didn't we make someone set up a packet station and send a packet email out or track someone using APRS or even demonstrate your ability to decode psk31 or SSTV signals? Those are all modes that are not tested like the code was. Now we are all on a level playing field. I did the code years ago but I bet you any amount of money that I cannot pass a 5wpm much less a 2 wpm speed test now. I do not like code but I did not complain that I had to take a test so why all the complaining from coders that like the code then? If you like code that is fine. I have no problems with you playing code on the bands. Let me do my part of the hobby and you do yours. BTW all the modes I mentioned I do every one of them.

[WA4RYW]

Quote[/b] (kb8nds @ Dec. 18 2006,11:57)]
If this whole debate is about "We had to learn code, so should they," I have a very radical idea that is sure to generate a few more pages of responses to this thread...



The FCC should cancel everyone's license, thereby placing everyone back at square one. #Then as everybody moves up the ladder, no one will be learning anything that the other hasn't.









This thread will never die!!!! http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif
Actually, that’s NOT the point. That’s just a symptom of the fundamental problem. It’s the culture. The pre-somewhere around the early nineties group have nothing in common with the vast majority of people that came in after the no-code tech came out, other than a desire to “ratchetjaw” (<-CB terminology!). I’ve posted many times speaking to the culture that amateur radio used to be, so I won’t go into that now. The point is, the new post-reconstruction crowd does not share the same values, they can’t POSSIBLY feel the sense of membership or brotherhood, and actively seek to further dilute whatever is left of the foundations of the service. The majority of this new crowd serves up constant whining and bellyaching to the requirements and refusal to make any effort to become a part of that brotherhood, but yet bulldoze their way in with a sense of entitlement that causes a natural and predictable resentment, and then they have the nerve to wonder why.

Now, having said all that, the old guard began to die in the late 70’s with the introduction of the home computer. Everyone knows what has happened there and where the experimenters, future and present engineers and other technical experimenters went from there. The question that is left at the end of the day is, will amateur radio die a quiet death, or will it carry on as a generally public use of spectrum? That’s what we’re seeing and there will always be people fascinated by the magic of wireless communications. Our technology is extremely dated for the most part, but there will always be someone that will want to play with it. I think it’s a natural evolution. The old guard has left altogether or is aging out. Some drop out because they can’t live with the change. But change is part of life, and will continue marching on. I too grieve the loss of the brotherhood that we had. I felt that belonging, the common sense of achievement that everyone else went through, the feeling of almost being like an extended family. Amateur radio was a resume enhancement that actually secured new jobs for me, taught me discipline, and helped me develop my work ethic. I have many fond memories of what once was, but all things must die. We either must become a part of the next generation ham radio “hobby”, or leave it. It’s pretty clear cut path. But if we continue to rant and carry on as we are doing now, we’re becoming the very thing that we disliked so much about the entitlement crowd, or at least the constant whining part.

[WA4RYW]

Quote[/b] (K8MB @ Dec. 18 2006,23:33)]Yet another idiotic government decision. #There is no tradition with hamradio anymore. #I think the United States in general is in decline and this is just one more small sign of it. #The government is just giving it all away and selling us out. #I am not an elitist and would never consider not speaking to another ham for any reason, however to me the code requirement was a really nice tradition because it was based on radio history and was one of the first building blocks of what we have become. #I will always be glad that I made the effort to speak CW.
The thing you must remember about your “government” is that we have booted out all the statesmen and politicians and replaced them with businessmen. It’s no shock to me that the government and government appointees would not make decisions based on emphasizing profit. The radio manufacturers lobbied HARD for this change, and they’ll be rewarded handsomely for their efforts. You have to remember that the FCC now days is nothing more than an auctioneer. This amateur radio thing was a miniscule distraction to them; however someone got a nice dinner and a golf game in Scotland for their time and attention.

[w4sef]

I understand now that inside of every box of corn flakes will be included a ham ticket! Oh Boy!!


"We have met the enemy and he is us" Pogo

[kd5tlc]

LMAO.... CW FOREVER!... but have fun what ever your pleasure... and remember, be nice, it's a big sandbox

[al2i]

Quote[/b] (Kc5fog @ Dec. 16 2006,00:29)]All I can say is congratulations to my fellow no-code operators who helped fight this battle. Can't wait to see all of you giving the old timers a run for their money in those contests and chasing that rare DX.

I truly wish I could see the looks on each and every one of those old timers faces who said this would never happen when they read the news.

I look forward to seeing all of my fellow no-code ops down on HF very soon.


Eric Kc5Fog (soon to be EXTRA Fog)

And who said Christmas miracles never happen
http://imagecache2.allposters.com/images/pic/20/NIGHTMAREBEFORECHRISTMAS.JPG

[KB5DRJ]

Quote[/b] (N7YA @ Dec. 18 2006,18:42)]OK, survey time...play along if you like...by a show of hands, answer the following:

1) When was the last time you were on HF?

2) When was the last time you elmered someone?

3) When was the last time you operated CW? (band not an issue)

4) How often do you get on the air in general?

5) Do you plan to upgrade? (if you are not an extra)

6) How often to you get on QRZ, eHam, other forums?

7) If you are a new ham, do you use, or do you plan on using CW?
1) 0603 UTC 19 DEC 2006
2) 19 DEC 2006
3) 0603 19 DEC 2006
4) Generally once per day
5) Maybe some day
6) Every day - too often - it has become a distraction
7) N/A

Remember to be NICE on the forums - Santa is on his way and he's keeping a list. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[kd5tlc]

ROFLMAO:p

[kc7gnm]

Quote[/b] (KL7FZ @ Dec. 19 2006,06:00)]Quote[/b] (w0uzr @ Dec. 18 2006,23:24)]Do you have any Collins S line equipment?

# # # # I've always wanted a Collins S line station.

Are there any amps in that pile? #Need an extra amp so I can still do nets while I'm getting the other fixed..
Just sold the KWM-2. You're too late. Just got in a brand new Lunar Link on Black Friday. That was a real up and down day. Ecstasy when the amp arrived and agony when I go home and got the news about code being dropped. I will use it on moonbounce. On CW.
Just bought an ACOM 2000A. Don't know what I will do with it though. Probably CW on the bottom of 20.

BTW: For reference for the rest of you: I will never ever sell any of my working amps to a NO-CODE HF ham. Probably none of my rigs either. Might even put it in my will.

Got about 10 rigs up for sale now. Will be on the swap sites and ebay.

#KL7FZ
I hope a no code ham wins the auction on your rigs. Would love to see you try to bail out of a sale on Ebay and get hammered by Ebay for breaking a contract.

[W9WHE]

Here are some terms that we now need to become familliar with:

"See-ya on the flip-flop" (talk with you later)
"Keep the shine-ey side up" (have a safe trip)
"Walking tall, tree top tall" (you sound good)


So, now, where do I get my "power mic" and "roger beep"?









Good buddy!

[n1dvj]

Quote[/b] (kc7gnm @ Dec. 19 2006,09:05)]Quote[/b] (KL7FZ @ Dec. 19 2006,06:00)]
BTW: For reference for the rest of you: I will never ever sell any of my working amps to a NO-CODE HF ham. Probably none of my rigs either. Might even put it in my will.

Got about 10 rigs up for sale now. Will be on the swap sites and ebay.

#KL7FZ
I hope a no code ham wins the auction on your rigs. Would love to see you try to bail out of a sale on Ebay and get hammered by Ebay for breaking a contract.
I have to agree...

I've seen that before. The lids who used to say they wouldn't talk to novice enhancement types. The lids who say they wouldn't talk to anyone who got a call that was recycled. The lids who now project viscious and negative feelings at existing and more importantly new people coming into HAM radio.

Too bad all the lids who say they're getting out and selling equipment are fakes and liars that don't actually follow through with it. (Is that a trend in their everyday life?)

His attitude is EXACTLY the kind of attitude that doesn't belong in HAM radio. The kind that should be stomp on seriously in clubs.

I can hardly wait for his call to be recycled to a 'no code'!! But it will certainly be a random assignment. Who would want it!

[n9lya]

Quote[/b] (kc7gnm @ Dec. 19 2006,04:05)]Quote[/b] (KL7FZ @ Dec. 19 2006,06:00)]Quote[/b] (w0uzr @ Dec. 18 2006,23:24)]Do you have any Collins S line equipment?

# # # # I've always wanted a Collins S line station.

Are there any amps in that pile? #Need an extra amp so I can still do nets while I'm getting the other fixed..
Just sold the KWM-2. You're too late. Just got in a brand new Lunar Link on Black Friday. That was a real up and down day. Ecstasy when the amp arrived and agony when I go home and got the news about code being dropped. I will use it on moonbounce. On CW.
Just bought an ACOM 2000A. Don't know what I will do with it though. Probably CW on the bottom of 20.

BTW: For reference for the rest of you: I will never ever sell any of my working amps to a NO-CODE HF ham. Probably none of my rigs either. Might even put it in my will.

Got about 10 rigs up for sale now. Will be on the swap sites and ebay.

#KL7FZ
I hope a no code ham wins the auction on your rigs. Would love to see you try to bail out of a sale on Ebay and get hammered by Ebay for breaking a contract.
There is nothing illegal about a NOCODE ham or anyone for that matter owning the equipment... It would just be illegal for them to TX with it...
I know a lot of no-codes that have rigs like the Icom756Pro .. They use them for TX/RX on vhf and uhf... And just rx on 30 and below...

So what was your point, again???


Jerry

[k0jk]

Quote[/b] (kc7noa @ Dec. 19 2006,02:29)]So ... when does this go into effect??

SOOOooooo manny posts .. its a pain to look through the flaming posts.
I second that question... Who knows when?

[k0jk]

Quote[/b] (KL7FZ @ Dec. 19 2006,03:00)]Quote[/b] (w0uzr @ Dec. 18 2006,23:24)]Do you have any Collins S line equipment?

# # # # I've always wanted a Collins S line station.

Are there any amps in that pile? #Need an extra amp so I can still do nets while I'm getting the other fixed..
Just sold the KWM-2. You're too late. Just got in a brand new Lunar Link on Black Friday. That was a real up and down day. Ecstasy when the amp arrived and agony when I go home and got the news about code being dropped. I will use it on moonbounce. On CW.
Just bought an ACOM 2000A. Don't know what I will do with it though. Probably CW on the bottom of 20.

BTW: For reference for the rest of you: I will never ever sell any of my working amps to a NO-CODE HF ham. Probably none of my rigs either. Might even put it in my will.

Got about 10 rigs up for sale now. Will be on the swap sites and ebay.

#KL7FZ
Ha ha ha! But HRO and AES will! :P~~~~~~~~~~~~~

[k0jk]

Quote[/b] (kd5tlc @ Dec. 19 2006,07:30)]LMAO.... CW FOREVER!... but have fun what ever your pleasure... and remember, be nice, #it's a big sandbox
Yeah, but some of the big babies are pooping in the sandbox and making it stink. I think they forgot what it means to be a ham...

[N1BHH]

This all reminds me of something sung by Adrian Belew sang with King Crimson:
Talk, it's only talk
Arguments, agreements, advice, answers,
Articulate announcements
It's only talk

Talk, it's only talk
Babble, burble, banter, bicker bicker bicker
Brouhaha, boulderdash, ballyhoo
It's only talk
Back talk

Talk talk talk, it's only talk
Comments, cliches, commentary, controversy
Chatter, chit-chat, chit-chat, chit-chat,
Conversation, contradiction, criticism
It's only talk
Cheap talk

Talk, talk, it's only talk
Debates, discussions
These are words with a D this time
Dialogue, dualogue, diatribe,
Dissention, declamation
Double talk, double talk

Talk, talk, it's all talk
Too much talk
Small talk
Talk that trash
Expressions, editorials, expugnations, exclamations, enfadulations
It's all talk
http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif

[kd5tlc]

BREAKETTABREAKETTABREAKETTA... this here's the duck, I got my linear cranked up, I got my tubes hot, I got my lollipop, a pot full of coffee, and nothing to do for about three hours but lean on this mich switch and Bit#h about anything and everything... is that what we have to look forward to? Wait a minute, that's been going on on 75 meters for years,,,, HAHAHA

[kb8nds]

Whew! 3 days and 33 pages...I'm done! I have a headache that I don't think that the largest Tylenol in the world won't help!

[kd5tlc]

kb8nds,
Take a break, get rid of the headache and relax.... before long it'll be STRAIGHT KEY NIGHT.... YEAH!!!

[w0vu]

Quote[/b] (kc8vwm @ Dec. 16 2006,18:37)]What's next? Blame all Techs because they wear gray Yaesu baseball caps instead of wearing red Icom baseball caps?
Whats this!!!!!!!!!!! #Icom give me a black one with my
IC-7800 and I wanted a red one.

Happy Holidays to all
Bob w0vu

[KB5YAI]

Where is the love, enough hate, the FCC has made it's decision, if you older guys wanna throw away your gear and be mad its your loss.:D

[K2FX]

Quote[/b] (ka2pborick @ Dec. 15 2006,23:25)]So what happens now if a hurricane hits some little country somewhere and the only ham on the island is sending distress signals in CW???
This is typical of modern day America .We are becoming lazier and dumber.We lower our standards until everyone can pass or becomes equal.Its the same of our school systems and our youth sports programs .Everyone who participates gets a trophy even if your kid sucks!!!The poor fools who have talent or put in the extra effort are brought down to the lazy loads level!Socialism at its best!!!
CHECK OUT THE K2FX SITE LINK BELOW FOR SOME REAL COMMENTS ABOUT THIS POST

K2FX Website (http://www.radiok2fx.com) http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif

[kd5tlc]

LMAO.... AGAIN!

[KL7FZ]

Quote[/b] (kc7gnm @ Dec. 19 2006,09:05)]Quote[/b] (KL7FZ @ Dec. 19 2006,06:00)]Quote[/b] (w0uzr @ Dec. 18 2006,23:24)]Do you have any Collins S line equipment?

# # # # I've always wanted a Collins S line station.

Are there any amps in that pile? #Need an extra amp so I can still do nets while I'm getting the other fixed..
Just sold the KWM-2. You're too late. Just got in a brand new Lunar Link on Black Friday. That was a real up and down day. Ecstasy when the amp arrived and agony when I go home and got the news about code being dropped. I will use it on moonbounce. On CW.
Just bought an ACOM 2000A. Don't know what I will do with it though. Probably CW on the bottom of 20.

BTW: For reference for the rest of you: I will never ever sell any of my working amps to a NO-CODE HF ham. Probably none of my rigs either. Might even put it in my will.

Got about 10 rigs up for sale now. Will be on the swap sites and ebay.

#KL7FZ
I hope a no code ham wins the auction on your rigs. Would love to see you try to bail out of a sale on Ebay and get hammered by Ebay for breaking a contract.
Nice try bozo. But no cigar. On Ebay as with any other auction, the seller dictates the terms of the auction. Just as many hams require a ham license for a bidder to buy a rig or amplifier, I can require a bidder be pre-qualified. That can include class of license, color of eyes or just plain stupid guys that post on QRZ.
#My stuff. I say who can get it. #Of course, nothing precludes a sell-out ham buddy from buying it for his dumber friend.
Nice try.
#KL7FZ

[k9ekg]

Quote[/b] (M3KCK @ Dec. 18 2006,16:50)]I will let You into a little Secret!!

HF Propagates World-Wide http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

So if your Fellow Countrymen won’t work you don’t worry because the Rest of the World Will #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif
Welcome to HF,
es 73
Regards,
Andrew # M3KCK


Ps.
I don’t remember the FCC ever mentioning that they would Keep Code testing for the Extra http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif
I guess that was just Wishful thinking!! (They did Exactly what they said on the tin)


PPs.
You are Not the only Country in the World to Stop Code testing.... Is HF CB Already?? (Your 75m Band Excluded, Yes we can Hear it, See propagation above)

edit:
No code or Know code....
Merry Christmas & Happy New Year to You All.
Thank you, Andrew. Spoken like a REAL Ham.

[k0jk]

Quote[/b] (KL7FZ @ Dec. 19 2006,11:36)]Quote[/b] (kc7gnm @ Dec. 19 2006,09:05)]Quote[/b] (KL7FZ @ Dec. 19 2006,06:00)]Quote[/b] (w0uzr @ Dec. 18 2006,23:24)]Do you have any Collins S line equipment?

# # # # I've always wanted a Collins S line station.

Are there any amps in that pile? #Need an extra amp so I can still do nets while I'm getting the other fixed..
Just sold the KWM-2. You're too late. Just got in a brand new Lunar Link on Black Friday. That was a real up and down day. Ecstasy when the amp arrived and agony when I go home and got the news about code being dropped. I will use it on moonbounce. On CW.
Just bought an ACOM 2000A. Don't know what I will do with it though. Probably CW on the bottom of 20.

BTW: For reference for the rest of you: I will never ever sell any of my working amps to a NO-CODE HF ham. Probably none of my rigs either. Might even put it in my will.

Got about 10 rigs up for sale now. Will be on the swap sites and ebay.

#KL7FZ
I hope a no code ham wins the auction on your rigs. Would love to see you try to bail out of a sale on Ebay and get hammered by Ebay for breaking a contract.
Nice try bozo. But no cigar. On Ebay as with any other auction, the seller dictates the terms of the auction. Just as many hams require a ham license for a bidder to buy a rig or amplifier, I can require a bidder be pre-qualified. That can include class of license, color of eyes or just plain stupid guys that post on QRZ.
#My stuff. I say who can get it. #Of course, nothing precludes a sell-out ham buddy from buying it for his dumber friend.
Nice try.
#KL7FZ
So bitter... Maybe all new Generals and Extras should avoid this jerk. He seems like he is not a very good operator. Hey, when all of your old school club buddies start dying off and you get lonely on the bands don't call for me because I will ignore you. We will know the good hams right away by the way they treat us as fellow radio amateurs enjoying the hobby.

[k9ekg]

Quote[/b] (W9WHE @ Dec. 19 2006,09:42)]Here are some terms that we now need to become familliar with:

"See-ya on the flip-flop" (talk with you later)
"Keep the shine-ey side up" (have a safe trip)
"Walking tall, tree top tall" (you sound good)


So, now, where do I get my "power mic" and "roger beep"?









Good buddy!
Ten-Foh.....BEEEEEP

[K5VGU]

Quote[/b] (kb1sf @ Dec. 18 2006,19:28)]While all those crusty, Morse-testing-forever curmudgeons have been breathlessly predicting the end of Morse on our bands (if not the end of Amateur Radio itself), it would seem the FCC, by its actions, is encouraging just the oppose.

That is, once the changes are in effect, ALL Technician licensees -- whether or not they have passed a Morse code examination -- will have "Tech Plus" operating privileges.

This means "no code" Tech will have all of their current VHF/UHF and above frequencies and also will have access to the Novice/Technician Plus frequencies on HF, with a power limit of 200W PEP for Technician operators. These frequencies include:

3525-3600 kHz CW only
7025-7125 kHz CW only
21,025-21,200 kHz CW only
28,000-28,300 kHz CW, RTTY and Data
28,300-28,500 kHz CW, SSB

Translation: #In order to have access to all these "new" HF frequencies, no-code Techs are now GOING TO HAVE TO LEARN MORSE!

Isn't that what "incentive licensing" was supposed to be all about?

73,

Keith
KB1SF / VA3KSF
Brilliant observation...you took the words right out of my mouth! Or to keep it on topic...YOU KEYED THE CODE FOR ME.

[ka9ekg]

DEAR MODERATOR:PLEASE CLOSE THIS THREAD.IT HAS BURNED ITSELF OUT.ENOUGH, IS ENOUGH, IS ENOUGH, IS ENOUGH, IS ENOUGH,IS ENOUGH,IS ENOUGH,IS ENOUGH(SUFFICIENT QUANTITY).............................. #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif

[kc7gnm]

Quote[/b] (n9lya @ Dec. 19 2006,12:45)]Quote[/b] (kc7gnm @ Dec. 19 2006,04:05)]Quote[/b] (KL7FZ @ Dec. 19 2006,06:00)]Quote[/b] (w0uzr @ Dec. 18 2006,23:24)]Do you have any Collins S line equipment?

# # # # I've always wanted a Collins S line station.

Are there any amps in that pile? #Need an extra amp so I can still do nets while I'm getting the other fixed..
Just sold the KWM-2. You're too late. Just got in a brand new Lunar Link on Black Friday. That was a real up and down day. Ecstasy when the amp arrived and agony when I go home and got the news about code being dropped. I will use it on moonbounce. On CW.
Just bought an ACOM 2000A. Don't know what I will do with it though. Probably CW on the bottom of 20.

BTW: For reference for the rest of you: I will never ever sell any of my working amps to a NO-CODE HF ham. Probably none of my rigs either. Might even put it in my will.

Got about 10 rigs up for sale now. Will be on the swap sites and ebay.

#KL7FZ
I hope a no code ham wins the auction on your rigs. Would love to see you try to bail out of a sale on Ebay and get hammered by Ebay for breaking a contract.
There is nothing illegal about a NOCODE ham or anyone for that matter owning the equipment... It would just be illegal for them to TX with it...
I know a lot of no-codes that have rigs like the Icom756Pro .. They use them for TX/RX on vhf and uhf... And just rx on 30 and below...

So what was your point, again???


Jerry
I never said it was a bad thing for a no-code to own HF gear. The guy I quoted obviously has a problem with it.

[kc7gnm]

Quote[/b] (K2FX @ Dec. 19 2006,14:15)]Quote[/b] (ka2pborick @ Dec. 15 2006,23:25)]So what happens now if a hurricane hits some little country somewhere and the only ham on the island is sending distress signals in CW???
This is typical of modern day America .We are becoming lazier and dumber.We lower our standards until everyone can pass or becomes equal.Its the same of our school systems and our youth sports programs .Everyone who participates gets a trophy even if your kid sucks!!!The poor fools who have talent or put in #the extra effort are brought down to the lazy loads level!Socialism at its best!!!
CHECK OUT THE K2FX SITE LINK BELOW FOR SOME REAL COMMENTS ABOUT THIS POST

K2FX Website (http://www.radiok2fx.com) # http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif
Another person who thinks the sky is falling when it isn't. Grow up and accept change. Just because you did it that way does not mean 30 years later it should still be the same. That is the real problem with ham radio. No inovation anymore. All the old guys are stuck in their 1970's mentality. Get a life and adapt to change because you will be left in the dust if you don't.

[kc7gnm]

Quote[/b] (KL7FZ @ Dec. 19 2006,14:36)]Quote[/b] (kc7gnm @ Dec. 19 2006,09:05)]Quote[/b] (KL7FZ @ Dec. 19 2006,06:00)]Quote[/b] (w0uzr @ Dec. 18 2006,23:24)]Do you have any Collins S line equipment?

# # # # I've always wanted a Collins S line station.

Are there any amps in that pile? #Need an extra amp so I can still do nets while I'm getting the other fixed..
Just sold the KWM-2. You're too late. Just got in a brand new Lunar Link on Black Friday. That was a real up and down day. Ecstasy when the amp arrived and agony when I go home and got the news about code being dropped. I will use it on moonbounce. On CW.
Just bought an ACOM 2000A. Don't know what I will do with it though. Probably CW on the bottom of 20.

BTW: For reference for the rest of you: I will never ever sell any of my working amps to a NO-CODE HF ham. Probably none of my rigs either. Might even put it in my will.

Got about 10 rigs up for sale now. Will be on the swap sites and ebay.

#KL7FZ
I hope a no code ham wins the auction on your rigs. Would love to see you try to bail out of a sale on Ebay and get hammered by Ebay for breaking a contract.
Nice try bozo. But no cigar. On Ebay as with any other auction, the seller dictates the terms of the auction. Just as many hams require a ham license for a bidder to buy a rig or amplifier, I can require a bidder be pre-qualified. That can include class of license, color of eyes or just plain stupid guys that post on QRZ.
#My stuff. I say who can get it. #Of course, nothing precludes a sell-out ham buddy from buying it for his dumber friend.
Nice try.
#KL7FZ
Yeah and you probably won't get any bids on your garbage. You are an elitest that is living in the past and cannot accept change. Grow up and get with the program. CW is just a mode. If they test this mode why not test all modes seperately then? Why not because the FCC saw like the rest of the world did that code is no longer needed. The Armed forces got rid of it years ago as did the Coast Guard. I wonder if you will talk to any DX stations now either because most countries in the world have already gone no-code for their HF privs. Guess you won't talk to anyone or sell anything soon.

[kc7gnm]

Quote[/b] (KC0WCE @ Dec. 19 2006,14:47)]Quote[/b] (KL7FZ @ Dec. 19 2006,11:36)]Quote[/b] (kc7gnm @ Dec. 19 2006,09:05)]Quote[/b] (KL7FZ @ Dec. 19 2006,06:00)]Quote[/b] (w0uzr @ Dec. 18 2006,23:24)]Do you have any Collins S line equipment?

# # # # I've always wanted a Collins S line station.

Are there any amps in that pile? #Need an extra amp so I can still do nets while I'm getting the other fixed..
Just sold the KWM-2. You're too late. Just got in a brand new Lunar Link on Black Friday. That was a real up and down day. Ecstasy when the amp arrived and agony when I go home and got the news about code being dropped. I will use it on moonbounce. On CW.
Just bought an ACOM 2000A. Don't know what I will do with it though. Probably CW on the bottom of 20.

BTW: For reference for the rest of you: I will never ever sell any of my working amps to a NO-CODE HF ham. Probably none of my rigs either. Might even put it in my will.

Got about 10 rigs up for sale now. Will be on the swap sites and ebay.

#KL7FZ
I hope a no code ham wins the auction on your rigs. Would love to see you try to bail out of a sale on Ebay and get hammered by Ebay for breaking a contract.
Nice try bozo. But no cigar. On Ebay as with any other auction, the seller dictates the terms of the auction. Just as many hams require a ham license for a bidder to buy a rig or amplifier, I can require a bidder be pre-qualified. That can include class of license, color of eyes or just plain stupid guys that post on QRZ.
#My stuff. I say who can get it. #Of course, nothing precludes a sell-out ham buddy from buying it for his dumber friend.
Nice try.
#KL7FZ
So bitter... Maybe all new Generals and Extras should avoid this jerk. He seems like he is not a very good operator. Hey, when all of your old school club buddies start dying off and you get lonely on the bands don't call for me because I will ignore you. We will know the good hams right away by the way they treat us as fellow radio amateurs enjoying the hobby.
I think all current generals and extras should ignore this lid now. He is not what ham radio is all about. He is in his own little world and is not even worth giving the time of day.

[n9lya]

Quote[/b] (kc7gnm @ Dec. 19 2006,07:42)]Quote[/b] (n9lya @ Dec. 19 2006,12:45)]Quote[/b] (kc7gnm @ Dec. 19 2006,04:05)]Quote[/b] (KL7FZ @ Dec. 19 2006,06:00)]Quote[/b] (w0uzr @ Dec. 18 2006,23:24)]Do you have any Collins S line equipment?

# # # # I've always wanted a Collins S line station.

Are there any amps in that pile? #Need an extra amp so I can still do nets while I'm getting the other fixed..
Just sold the KWM-2. You're too late. Just got in a brand new Lunar Link on Black Friday. That was a real up and down day. Ecstasy when the amp arrived and agony when I go home and got the news about code being dropped. I will use it on moonbounce. On CW.
Just bought an ACOM 2000A. Don't know what I will do with it though. Probably CW on the bottom of 20.

BTW: For reference for the rest of you: I will never ever sell any of my working amps to a NO-CODE HF ham. Probably none of my rigs either. Might even put it in my will.

Got about 10 rigs up for sale now. Will be on the swap sites and ebay.

#KL7FZ
I hope a no code ham wins the auction on your rigs. Would love to see you try to bail out of a sale on Ebay and get hammered by Ebay for breaking a contract.
There is nothing illegal about a NOCODE ham or anyone for that matter owning the equipment... It would just be illegal for them to TX with it...
I know a lot of no-codes that have rigs like the Icom756Pro .. They use them for TX/RX on vhf and uhf... And just rx on 30 and below...

So what was your point, again???


Jerry
I never said it was a bad thing for a no-code to own HF gear. The guy I quoted obviously has a problem with it.
You are correct.. I stand corrected.. It was the other guys that had the problem.. Thanks for clearifying.. Sometimes its difficult to read these quoted quoted quoted quotes... lol

Merry Christmas

73 jerry http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

[K2FX]

Quote[/b] (kc7gnm @ Dec. 19 2006,12:47)]Quote[/b] (K2FX @ Dec. 19 2006,14:15)]Quote[/b] (ka2pborick @ Dec. 15 2006,23:25)]So what happens now if a hurricane hits some little country somewhere and the only ham on the island is sending distress signals in CW???
This is typical of modern day America .We are becoming lazier and dumber.We lower our standards until everyone can pass or becomes equal.Its the same of our school systems and our youth sports programs .Everyone who participates gets a trophy even if your kid sucks!!!The poor fools who have talent or put in the extra effort are brought down to the lazy loads level!Socialism at its best!!!
CHECK OUT THE K2FX SITE LINK BELOW FOR SOME REAL COMMENTS ABOUT THIS POST

K2FX Website (http://www.radiok2fx.com) http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif
Another person who thinks the sky is falling when it isn't. Grow up and accept change. Just because you did it that way does not mean 30 years later it should still be the same. That is the real problem with ham radio. No inovation anymore. All the old guys are stuck in their 1970's mentality. Get a life and adapt to change because you will be left in the dust if you don't.
CHANGE HAS BEEN GOING ON SINCE 1991.....REMEMBER THAT LITTLE THING CALLED THE NO-CODE LICENSE.....THE STATE OF THE HF BANDS HAS BEEN IN A STEADY DECLINE EVER SINCE. THIS DISCUSSION HAS LESS TO DO WITH CHANGE THAN IT DOES ENSURING THAT WE HAVE "QUALIFIED OPERATORS" ON THE BANDS.....YOU WANT NO CODE....FINE...THEN LETS DO MORE TO MAKE SURE THAT LICENSING BECOMES MORE STRINGENT IN OTHER AREAS. HERE IS A NOVEL IDEA....HOW ABOUT ACTUALLY GIVING A TEST THAT HAS NO PRE-PRINTED QUESTION POOL. HOW ABOUT YOU ACTUALLY LEARN THE MATERIAL, AND NOT JUST MEMORIZE IT FOR A SHORT TIME JUST TO PASS YOUR TEST, THEN FORGET EVERYTHING!!! IF YOUR REALLY BELIEVE THAT CHANGE IS GOOD, AND CW ELIMINATION SHOULD PART OF THAT CHANGE, THEN LETS TO CONTINUE TO CHANGE IN OTHER AREAS INCLUDING THE ACTUAL TEST MATERIAL.... http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[KI4NNL]

Good grief man, that there capslock key is there for a reason, and I don't think it's what you think it is.

[KL7FZ]

Quote[/b] (kc7gnm @ Dec. 19 2006,12:51)]Yeah and you probably won't get any bids on your garbage. You are an elitest that is living in the past and cannot accept change. Grow up and get with the program. CW is just a mode. If they test this mode why not test all modes seperately then? Why not because the FCC saw like the rest of the world did that code is no longer needed. The Armed forces got rid of it years ago as did the Coast Guard. I wonder if you will talk to any DX stations now either because most countries in the world have already gone no-code for their HF privs. Guess you won't talk to anyone or sell anything soon.
Greg # # If you are going to comment, please be sure of what you are saying. "MOST" countries have NOT removed code from their license requirements. Only about 10%. It has been repeated here time and time again. Only about 30 countries have no-code. The rest of the world still retains the requirement.
WHY must a few of you continue to demand that the US FOLLOW other countires?? I thought we were the leader?
Do you believe that if the rest of the world were to pee in their hats we should too??
Over to you, wet-head.
#KL7FZ

[K2FX]

Quote[/b] (KI4NNL @ Dec. 19 2006,13:06)]Good grief man, that there capslock key is there for a reason, and I don't think it's what you think it is.
Spoken like a true Technician. So what channel are you going to hang out on good buddy? Channel 9/16 on 24/7. I'm eastbound with the Hammer Down!

[N3KTH]

Quote[/b] (W9WHE @ Dec. 19 2006,09:42)]Here are some terms that we now need to become familliar with:

"See-ya on the flip-flop" (talk with you later)
"Keep the shine-ey side up" (have a safe trip)
"Walking tall, tree top tall" (you sound good)

So, now, where do I get my "power mic" and "roger beep"?







Good buddy!
Here's some more stupid sounding sayings...

Old Man
Young Lady
Chew The Rag
In the Shack
Hi Hi Hi Hi Hi Hi Hi
Five By Nine, Five By Nine
A Lid
Send me some Wallpaper
73
Get an Elmer


I think as a 48 Y.O., I'd rather be a "Good Buddy" than an "Old Man".....

I guess it's only the CB lingo that is stupid sounding huh?http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif?

[n0klu]

I see that this is the thread with the most "sour grapes" on it as the must have their shorts in a real twist! http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif
They must have gotten Rush's new "extra small thong"! http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif just for that "real up-tight" look!

[KI4NNL]

Quote[/b] (K2FX @ Dec. 19 2006,13:22)]Quote[/b] (KI4NNL @ Dec. 19 2006,13:06)]Good grief man, that there capslock key is there for a reason, and I don't think it's what you think it is.
Spoken like a true Technician. #So what channel are you going to hang out on good buddy? #Channel 9/16 on 24/7. #I'm eastbound with the Hammer Down!
Oh dear, I am well and truly crushed, my simple minded life is shown now to be worthless, I humbly grovel to your obviously superiour worth as a human being....


NOT!


Go spot some UFO's flyboy.

You drive a plane, I drove a nuclear reactor so get over yourself.

[ab8ko]

WHy is everyone panicing? lol
get on the horn to the FCC and voice your opinion...

IF you want to keep getting on the HF bands somnething that needs to be worked for,
simply do this:

Make the written elements VERY hard to pass without proper study....
i.e. drop the multiple choice crap that any moron can memorize,
and re-instate essay tests.

problem solved.
the craft preserved.

no big deal

BUT YOU HAVE TO SPEAK OUT
or nothing will be done about it

i.e. massive no-code lobby constantly pushing for this thing and virtually no response from
the "coded" Hams

get it?

[kc7gnm]

Got this off of K2FX's website and thought it was very interesting.

"K2FX is an ARRL Official Observer Station, and an Extra Class Volunteer Examiner for the ARRL and W5YI Groups. K2FX IS NOT AN ADVOCATE OF THE NEW LICENSE RESTRUCTURING POLICY. CW should remain a valuable part of the FCC testing process, and should especially be required for those who are seeking an Extra Class License. "

Now how can you be an impartial observer when you are obviously very biased on this issue.

[K2FX]

Quote[/b] (ab8ko @ Dec. 19 2006,13:43)]WHy is everyone panicing? lol
get on the horn to the FCC and voice your opinion...

IF you want to keep getting on the HF bands somnething that needs to be worked for,
simply do this:

Make the written elements VERY hard to pass without proper study....
i.e. drop the multiple choice crap that any moron can memorize,
and re-instate essay tests.

problem solved.
the craft preserved.

no big deal

BUT YOU HAVE TO SPEAK OUT
or nothing will be done about it

i.e. massive no-code lobby constantly pushing for this thing and virtually no response from
the "coded" Hams

get it?
Now this makes total sense, and is exactly what I've been saying for quite some time now!!!! Thank you for saying it again.

[K2FX]

Quote[/b] (KI4NNL @ Dec. 19 2006,13:39)]Quote[/b] (K2FX @ Dec. 19 2006,13:22)]Quote[/b] (KI4NNL @ Dec. 19 2006,13:06)]Good grief man, that there capslock key is there for a reason, and I don't think it's what you think it is.
Spoken like a true Technician. So what channel are you going to hang out on good buddy? Channel 9/16 on 24/7. I'm eastbound with the Hammer Down!
Oh dear, I am well and truly crushed, my simple minded life is shown now to be worthless, I humbly grovel to your obviously superiour worth as a human being....


NOT!


Go spot some UFO's flyboy.

You drive a plane, I drove a nuclear reactor so get over yourself.
Oh no!!! A Technician and a "Seaman"

[KI4NNL]

Yup, astounding observation there, guess thats why your an observer. #Any other astounding insite for us mere mortals? Or should I simply lie prostrate before you now?

[ab8ko]

Quote[/b] (K2FX @ Dec. 19 2006,13:48)]Quote[/b] (ab8ko @ Dec. 19 2006,13:43)]WHy is everyone panicing? #lol
get on the horn to the FCC and voice your opinion...

IF you want to keep getting on the HF bands somnething that needs to be worked for,
simply do this:

Make the written elements VERY hard to pass without proper study....
i.e. drop the multiple choice crap that any moron can memorize,
and re-instate essay tests.

problem solved.
the craft preserved.

no big deal

BUT # YOU # #HAVE # #TO # SPEAK # # OUT
or nothing will be done about it

i.e. massive no-code lobby constantly pushing for this thing and virtually no response from
the "coded" Hams

get it?
Now this makes total sense, and is exactly what I've been saying for quite some time now!!!! #Thank you for saying it again.
Personally, I would truly enjoy teaching someone, anyone how to be a good operator, and a superb representative of our country on the World Wide Band space.

It's called "Elmering" a lost art I'm afraid....

anyone want to discuss vector and phase analysis and it's associated affect on take off angle?

drop me a line

[n0doz]

>CHANGE HAS BEEN GOING ON SINCE 1991.....REMEMBER THAT LITTLE THING CALLED THE NO-CODE LICENSE.....THE STATE OF THE HF BANDS HAS BEEN IN A STEADY DECLINE EVER SINCE. <

Since no-coders can't do HF, how are the HF bands affected since 1991?

[K7JEM]

Osmosis.

[kc7gnm]

Quote[/b] (K2FX @ Dec. 19 2006,16:48)]Quote[/b] (ab8ko @ Dec. 19 2006,13:43)]WHy is everyone panicing? #lol
get on the horn to the FCC and voice your opinion...

IF you want to keep getting on the HF bands somnething that needs to be worked for,
simply do this:

Make the written elements VERY hard to pass without proper study....
i.e. drop the multiple choice crap that any moron can memorize,
and re-instate essay tests.

problem solved.
the craft preserved.

no big deal

BUT # YOU # #HAVE # #TO # SPEAK # # OUT
or nothing will be done about it

i.e. massive no-code lobby constantly pushing for this thing and virtually no response from
the "coded" Hams

get it?
Now this makes total sense, and is exactly what I've been saying for quite some time now!!!! #Thank you for saying it again.
And for you guys that insist that the code should still be tested then why not test all modes that are used on ham radio. Why not make someone send and receive a psk31 message. Make someone use aprs or packet or RTTY. They are all modes just like CW is. I have nothing against you guys using CW but testing it was just plain stupid. Apparently it was not a filter because just listen to 75m just about any night of the year. Most of those guys have been extra way before the 13 and 20 wpm tests were dropped.

I agree with making the test harder and also not putting the questions and answers out so that any monkey can memorize them. The only thing I see here is old hams complaining about losing the testing on a mode of ham radio. Any mode by itself is not ham radio. All the different modes make up ham radio. I do not like code and will never use it because I think it is worthless and outdated but I will never complain that you guys that love to use code should be banned. That is the whole problem with you guys is you only see one part of the picture and not the whole picture.

[kc7gnm]

Quote[/b] (n0doz @ Dec. 19 2006,17:04)]>CHANGE HAS BEEN GOING ON SINCE 1991.....REMEMBER THAT LITTLE THING CALLED THE NO-CODE LICENSE.....THE STATE OF THE HF BANDS HAS BEEN IN A STEADY DECLINE EVER SINCE. <

Since no-coders can't do HF, how are the HF bands affected since 1991?
Exactly.

[n0doz]

Sorry if this was presented before....
Suggestion for a new topic or even a new page on QRZ: why don't all of you that don't want to talk to no-coders post your calls, so that we don't accidentally try to talk to you? I'm perfectly happy to avoid running into you on the air.

[KI4NNL]

I have been saying this since I came to this board but got shouted down for the idea. #I read the R&O and it argues the point almost exactly the way I said it would finally end up, testing one mode has no legal basis if there is no treaty requiring code. #Either you test all modes or none. I think all should be tested, but it is unlikely the fcc will go that direction, so now we have no mode testing at all, it was coming, the writing was on the wall, and folks are now outraged by this "surprise" move and are striking out at anyone they deem 'unworthy'. #My hope is that with time they will get used to it or leave, cause I am already tired of the whining.

[ab8ko]

Quote[/b] (n0doz @ Dec. 19 2006,14:04)]>CHANGE HAS BEEN GOING ON SINCE 1991.....REMEMBER THAT LITTLE THING CALLED THE NO-CODE LICENSE.....THE STATE OF THE HF BANDS HAS BEEN IN A STEADY DECLINE EVER SINCE. <

Since no-coders can't do HF, how are the HF bands affected since 1991?
***Chuckles out loud***

now there's a good point it I've ever seen one....


Why is everyone getting nasty in here?


it really is a simple thing.....

Code... No-code.... #who cares?

make the best of your "HOBBY"

if you don't want to share conversation with new hams, don't....

If you want to give it a chance, then just "ADAPT"

Isn't that what we, as amateurs, have always done?
Adapt?

my opinion is this: #If we gain just ONE good ham with this no-code HF revolution, that ONE good ham is worth it.
that ONE good ham could potentially figure out a way to modulate gravity or something #lol

Everyone that's arguing needs to get over this and
get back to advancing the radio craft....

REMEMBER THE HAM RADIO CREED?

anyone?


If you have lots of Radio knowledge, spread it around....
start Elmering newcomers....

NOBODY # #just "knows" how to be a good operator.....

We need to take the newbies under the wing, and show them how to be a good operator.

this bickering in this thread is silly and counter-productive.

just start teaching....
and if you're not teacher material?
start learning to be

I'm out of here....

If things get crazy on the HF bands, and I don't want to play there anymore,
guess what?

I'll find something else to do on some other sub-band....

like concentrating on working more satellites, etc.

the hobby is far too vast in it's possibilities to get all bent out of shapoe over any one aspect of it.....

To all