Morse Code Eliminated by FCC

[KE4FES]

Quote[/b] (NI5W @ Dec. 15 2006,23:04)]We all knew it was coming sooner or later....sigh...goes to show that amateurs are not listened to at all. #5 wpm is slow.. and a lil code never hurt anyone. #Besides, comes through better during bad band conditions
http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif the FCC did not rule you can not continue to operate CW mode............... http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[KE8LW]

I believe this is a great time for all CB'ers to study the code in the back of ARRL Manuals and step up to swing there dirty powered amps, bleeding over the air. That way we can all enjoy this madness. I think this is the time for me to step out of Amateur Radio. I have been on air since 1985 loved every minute.
I started as a CB'er and wanted something more, so to get away from the bad language, and 10-4 good buddy I chose Ham. I learned the code 20wpm. Took the test's that kept the cb'ers away. I see Ham radio turning into an area of what cb is now.
Anyone want to buy a Knwd 950sdx,vibroplex,mc-60,65'rohn,and 4 ele a4s. Thank you FCC I may now start other hobbies.:angry:

[KB1LRT]

Quote[/b] (n7zsd @ Dec. 16 2006,00:32)]To all those who think this is the end of Amateur Radio as we know it:

I passed the 5wpm requirement because it was needed to get me on HF. #No big deal. #But I hardly ever use CW. #Don't get me wrong, CW is a cool mode, it's just not my thing. #Those who enjoy CW will continue to use CW, and I respect them for their skill and dedication. #If and when a NCT wants to join in a CW QSO, he will have to learn CW to do so. #Dropping the code requirement is NOT going to destroy ham radio. #In fact, I feel we can use some new blood. #In case some people haven't noticed, the younger generation of hams are some sharp guys and gals. #I think they will have alot to offer to the hobby. #Some of the worst behavior I have ever heard on the radio was on 75 meters...by two Extra Class ticket holders no less. #So don't sit there and tell me that NCT's are going to ruin the hobby...that is a load of crap and we all know it! #As a good friend of mine said.."Perhaps instead of 5 wpm morse code, we should test on proficiency with digital modes, but that would be forcing one aspect of Amateur Radio down everybody's throat. #Hmmm..." #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif
I agree 100%

I am a Technician and also a "Chicken Band"(Citizen Band) operator and proud of it. I wish people would take all of that negative energy and teach people about radio instead of crying about the demise of Amatuer Radio. There are bad radio operators on every band, But it's nice when the good ones out number the bad. Every Ham I know started off on CB Radio and they continue to talk on 11 meters. I think that most people complaining have the "I had to do it, So should they" attitude more than it is about preserving Morse code. I think Morse code is cool and I would like to learn it one day, How about instead of saying "Oh my God another Chicken Bander " when a No Coder comes on to the band, Try taking that negative energy and turn it into something positive and teach people why Morse code is important and share your idea's of thought. I'm sorry but this Ham vs. CBer thing is stupid. Teaching the great things about radio as a whole will promote Amateur Radio, The true demise of Amateur radio will come if the negativity runs wild on the bands, So please be positive. Remember new blood always breeds new ideas and you may make a lot more friends in the process. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[KE4FES]

Quote[/b] (KL7FZ @ Dec. 15 2006,23:11)]The saddest day in the history of Amateur radio. All that is left now is petition the FCC to change the name to "Citizen's Band Radio Service" and put 11 meters back in the allocations.
For over 45 years I was proud to say I was an Amateur Radio Operator. Now I am almost ashamed to tell anyone I am a part of it.
Very sad. And my new amp just came in the mail today.
Maybe I'll just take out the tubes and plant flowers in #
the holes.
73
KL7FZ
http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif NAW ! Sell it to a CB'er just like other HAMS have done.

I think it's time to start selling on eBay,,
crying towels otta go fast.



charlie http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[n9zxk]

All i can say its about time that we hear something about this. I know for myself i am sick of everyone fighting over it. I dont know if i will upgrade oor not, but i will say this. If i do I will do my best.

[K5VGU]

Know what I think is truly funny...

I haven't heard many (if any) TECHS WITH CODE complaining about the changes HALF as much as the 5 WPM Generals. etc.

A year from now, Generals will be Generals will be Generals...NO CODE...5 WPM...10 WPM...60 WPM..100 WPM...what will it matter.

I am ramping up to take the General test...practice is going very well. #I also have been working on the code and am going to try to pass the code before it goes away...just because I want to.

Let's all continue to enjoy the hobby while we are still free to do so.

[AD7DK]

Quote[/b] (KE8LW @ Dec. 17 2006,00:10)]I started as a CB'er and wanted something more, so to get away from the bad language, and 10-4 good buddy I chose Ham. I learned the code 20wpm. Took the test's that kept the cb'ers away.
I understand why you left 11 meters. I think that many hams today started on 11 meters and got into amateur radio for the same reasons. I do however have to disagree with the notion, that just because the code requirement has been dropped, radio as we know it will be dramatically changed. Does anyone really believe that a simple rule or license stopped anyone who wanted to wreak havoc on the bands. Everyone talks about CBers who run huge power, bleed all over the band, and break every rule known to man. They are definitely out there. We all know it. However, I seriously doubt that a CW requirement was stopping them from breaking another rule.

[KE4FES]

Quote[/b] (KE8LW @ Dec. 17 2006,00:10)]I believe this is a great time for all CB'ers to study the code in the back of ARRL Manuals and step up to swing there dirty powered amps, bleeding over the air. #That way we can all enjoy this madness. #I think this is the time for me to step out of Amateur Radio. #I have been on air since 1985 loved every minute. #
I started as a CB'er and wanted something more, so to get away from the bad language, and 10-4 good buddy I chose Ham. #I learned the code 20wpm. #Took the test's that kept the cb'ers away. #I see Ham radio turning into an area of what cb is now. #
Anyone want to buy a Knwd 950sdx,vibroplex,mc-60,65'rohn,and 4 ele a4s. #Thank you FCC I may now start other hobbies.:angry:
http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif #GEZZE. #What did the rest of the world do when they dropped the morse requirement ? Have you ever heard the phrase "dirty american" ? #NO ? Then stick your head BACK into the sand . WE are disliked in the majority of the world; #no wonder #what with "our attitudes" ; "we #we #we", WE ARE BETTER ! we know best ! Wake up,
CATCH UP, JOIN THE WORLD. Are you selling your car
because there are some "bad drivers " on the road.Better
sell your boat too. ? IS it at all a tiny possibility that YOU could be wrong? #I think not/ not you.! or people like you. don't worry; the world still turns. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[N0TTW]

Quote[/b] (N3KTH @ Dec. 15 2006,22:39)]How about this.. We require some of you old timers to master AMTOR and THROB in order to make Extra.
AMTOR and THROB? Give me a break.

How about MTMPSK (similiar to THROB, but more tones, with PSK involved) that fits in a 1Khz Bandwidth? Will be interesting to see if it works. This mode can have a full-duplex voice conversation in the same space as SSB with room to spare.

Really, if you want to be serious... how bout retesting for your license every 5 years. That's right and you have pass all the tests at the same time to keep your class of license every five years. I'm all for that!

That way we don't keep those who have no interest in bettering themselves.

Chris

[KB2SFH]

Quote[/b] (ad4mg @ Dec. 16 2006,10:54)]RIGHT, big guy. #Let's not even give them a chance. #Let's keep the hate going. #It is, after all, our hobby, right? #What right do these people have?
First of all, please check my listing on QRZ and rephrase that big guy comment, then I can send you the name and number of a very good eyedoctor.

And why should they be given a chance? they didn't want it bad enough to earn it. Sorry, I cannot respect that. They want to be on the air, fine, let them knock themselves out. I just have one statement for those that want to be on ham bands and those that have worked to be here: I don't care if you came from CB or not, JUST LEAVE THE CB AT THE DOOR WHEN YOU COME IN. If you can't honor that then stay out!!!

[KI4RTK]

Life is 10% about what happens to you and 90% about what you do about it.

[N0ZWG]

Quote[/b] (kc7jty @ Dec. 16 2006,10:55)]THIS IS ALL A JOKE.....RIGHT??
It's a pretty sick one if it is.

[n0fhv]

As a license ham of 34 years, I have heard how if we restuctured licensing requirements of hams the hobby would go to hell. Well it's been 34 years in the making but the fcc has finally gotten rid of the biggest road block to new hams CW. Nobody is telling CW'ers that can't run cw. All the fcc is doing is restucturing license test to represent the real radio world (cw being obsoulete). As for all these hams saying ham radio will be turned into the CB band, in 1973 we heard the same argument. Lets make these new hams welcome in the tradition that ham radio has always welcome new operators. They will make mistakes on the air but 34 years ago so did I and I still do.

[w4egr]

To all of the naysayers out in the crowd, do us all a favor and take a chill pill. I've been a NCT for almost 3 years now and I fully plan on learning the code at some point in time. I'm relieved that the FCC is dropping the code test since it confuses the mess out of a lot of people (including myself and 5 others from my area that I live in that all study together). Thankfully the FCC has gotten off of their tails and starting making headway again. Now the real question will be when will this thing take effect. Now, if they are coming out with this now, the R & O will most likely be released this coming week. However, they may hold it until the current general class question pool expires to give everybody a head start. But then again I'm probably wrong. Oh well, hurray for the FCC!!!!

HOOAH!!!!!

[NL7W]

Quote[/b] (w4clm @ Dec. 16 2006,02:58)]Well one good thing about this. We don't have to listen any more to all the morons with their excuses as to why they can't hear the code, can't hear the tones, I'm tone deaf, I'm dyslexic, I'm this and I'm that! I can't do this and I can't do that. Can't never did anything! I've heard it all, I've got hemorrhoids and can't sit for the code exam, every time I sit for the exam it pinches my optic nerve and I can't see to write because my head is in my anal cavity! And we don't have to worry about the code exams being compromised at the VEC session anymore, because we just threw the baby out with the bath water!

I've listened to and heard every excuse in the book for over 35+ years and I'm sick and tired of all the excuses as to why people can't get a license. Now everyone will have to find some new excuses for not getting a ticket. Hey here's a real classic they can try on for size "I'm just to damned lazy and stupid to memorize a hand full of questions to get that license."

Every road block and wall has been knocked down to this endeavor and THERE ARE NO MORE EXCUSES LEFT.
The old excuse that amateur radio is too expensive has long gone by the way side as every CB'er and trucker is running the latest and greatest Yaesu or Kenwood SSB rig on 27.6 MHz and 28 MHz.

I've been licensed 36 years, like anyone really gives a S**t. But you know there is one thing I've learned and it's an easy to do. Each and every one of these rigs has an ON / OFF switch and it's likely it will remain in the O~F~F position a little more. As the bands become more crowded and the Super Bowl gang on Channel 6 make their play for the 75 meter yard line the game will get a little more exciting. HELL, Riley can't enforce the problems he has to deal with now!

So lets just let everyone play ball as it would be politically incorrect to leave anyone out!
We have already given our jobs away overseas and we are giving the country away to Mexico. So why not license illegal aliens while we are at it too so they can buy radios and talk home! Everyone may as well join in, just slap $25 on the table guys for an amateur operators PERMIT. May as well just pay for the license! Technician and General are all the same, there is nothing advanced about an advanced class license and you didn't have to do any Extra works to get an Extra class ticket.

Yeah you guys are right, maybe the sky hasn't fallen, but it's a pretty damned dark day outside for amateur radio as a whole. Being an amateur radio operator with its once respected license, looked upon by outsiders with envy and respect as an honorable endeavor is not what it was only a few short years ago. Amateur radio and incentive licensing is now much like the commercial telephone and radio telegraph exams, they are all a joke. But I'm afraid the joke is on us as a community, while the quantity of so called licensed amateurs will likely increase, the knowledge base will be inversely proportional to the increasing license numbers.

Even at that, someone will still manage to be left out and find some reason to bitch to their liberal senator as to why they can't get a amateur permit, until even the written exams are more watered down then what they already are today until they follow that of the broadcast industry and marine radio that of signing nothing more the a signature line for an operators permit. (Hey here's a novel idea ~ I need a doctors permit for the written exam!)

No the sky has not fallen my friends, but it's a damned shame that the amateur radio permit has no pride in ownership.

73s
Carol Maher W4CLM
Well said, Carol. Thanks.

[na4it]

Remember, only the "requirement" has been dropped, nothing has been said about it being "illegal" to operate CW. Get on the air and enjoy it if that is your preference. I bet you'll find in years to come, there will actually be better CW operators, because they will have the "want to" do it.

-. .- ....- .. - http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[N7YA]

Damn,

Its a sad day for ham radio...not because the code was dropped or because cb this or that or whatever. Its a sad day because we are literally coming apart at the seams. we are acting like a bunch of 5th grade dicks.

Sell your damn gear...to me!! Im seeing a lot of really unlikeable people here, human beings who are spewing hatred towards others over a friggin hobby.... A HOBBY!!

Good god, you miserable bastards need to meet in a warehouse, turn off the lights and start swinging wildly.

I get on the air and i use our bands, I worked for my ticket, i passed 20 wpm, nobody in the rest of the civilized world could care less about ANY of that and neither do I! You know why? do you really want to know why? Its because i get up off my ass and do something other than stew on ridiculous subjects like morse code testing on the internet, I have a life! I get women! I have friends that i met face to face! not ONE of them thinks ham radio is cool, not ONE! they all think its dead, they all think its CB, the only recollection of it is some faint memories of old grandpa in the basement and a bunch of wire...THATS IT!! Tell me im wrong, go ahead! you bunch of bold, bloated arrogant masters of everything.

#Heres a nice tidbit for you from a guy who knows what hes talking about, If you think ham radio is done and over with, go away! If you still derive pleasure from it then shut up and get on the air...seriously. If you are THIS hateful and angry about what you THINK is going to happen and end up insulting a bunch of newcomers who are likely going to simply enjoy ham radio, leave the hobby and dont come back...I seriously find negative, hateful people extremely unattractive, unlikeable and basically character flawed.

The hobby is great, im in it for life, as long as there are other hams to talk to, i will talk to them...what could be more simple than that? What is hard to understand with this? Screw your standards...i simply dont care. individuals hold themselves to standards or they dont, if they dont then i dont talk to them...should i repeat this? is this incomprehensible? I have been a 20 wpm extra for years now, I have heard some of the most vile, ugly and disrespectful garbage eminating from the sewerholes of old school extras on the air, HF and repeaters,for WAY too long now...new techs are usually trying to rise above some nasty title they didnt deserve and usually become better ops than the old jerks who hate them. and THESE are the folks they should look up to??

I am sick of hate spewing men who have long passed their prime and missed their oportunities in life to be cool or accepted...if you arent happy with yourself, FIX IT! dont project onto others because you look like a real fool. This whole thing is not calming down, its getting uglier and so are we. Im staying in ham radio, I welcome newcomers because i know how to stay on top of MY own game, i dont blame anyone for my failings as a human, i fix it and try to find positives. But those of you who just want to cause pain and anger to validate yourselves, now you are starting to piss me off.

New hams, more power to you, I am a 20 wpm extra and i welcome you and whoever doesnt can go hang it in their pipe for all i care. I will qso anyone with a valid callsign because i still like ham radio. If you dont, please leave or find a way to fix it.

Im serious about that darkened warehouse thing.

73 to all but the negative ones, you guys can go scratch eachother...Adam, N7YA

[KE7IPY]

Hmm... it's been a whole day since the code requirement was dropped and the world hasn't ended yet.

[kc0kbc]

Adam N7YA,

You sir, are a credit to the service. Seriously!

Mike, KC0KBC

[ad4mg]

Quote[/b] (KB2SFH @ Dec. 17 2006,03:52)]Quote[/b] (ad4mg @ Dec. 16 2006,10:54)]RIGHT, big guy. #Let's not even give them a chance. #Let's keep the hate going. #It is, after all, our hobby, right? #What right do these people have?
First of all, please check my listing on QRZ and rephrase that big guy comment, then I can send you the name and number of a very good eyedoctor.

And why should they be given a chance? they didn't want it bad enough to earn it. Sorry, I cannot respect that. They want to be on the air, fine, let them knock themselves out. I just have one statement for those that want to be on ham bands and those that have worked to be here: I don't care if you came from CB or not, JUST LEAVE THE CB AT THE DOOR WHEN YOU COME IN. If you can't honor that then stay out!!!
OK Susan, in reference to the "big guy" remark, 99.9% of posters here are male, and I just don't check everyone's call for license class, sex, etc.

OK, so the FCC is going to make a ruling. #What other option do these folks you that you label as unworthy have? #Suppose you intended to enter amateur radio, say next year? #Would this type of treatment be acceptable to you?

Nobody says you have to happy about all of this. #I'm less than pleased, but I'm not going to take it out on all the amateurs who come to our HF & MF bands after this R&O goes into effect. #That's not fair, and these folks deserve better.

There are some who have waited for years for this to happen, and to the lazy and unmotivated, I say Pfffffft! #I don't figure those losers will hang around long anyway.

It won't become like CB radio, not yet. #If you sit down and really think about that statement, you will see how foolish it is. #There will be an initial increase in hams on HF. #There will be no large influx of new hams. #Face it ... amateur radio has seen it's heyday, and it will hang around in approximately its current size and state for years to come, but it's on the way out. #One day down the road, when you and I are long gone, it may survive as a niche hobby, but it will never be the driving force in new technologies it once was. #Oh, amateurs may contribute something new at some point in time, but it won't match the magnitude of previous accomplishments like radio astronomy, or satellite communications, where amateurs have contributed immensely.

Remain bitter if you wish, but I plan to enjoy my remaining time on the amateur bands. #And reconsider giving the new folks a chance. #What reason is there to do otherwise when they didn't make the call, the FCC did.

FWIW, from a 20 wpm extra class op since 10-10-1993, licensed since 03-1992. #And my primary operating mode remains CW to this day.

Best 73,
Luke

BTW - If you don't like the "big guy" remarks, try adding your name to your signature! # http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif

[w0vu]

Quote[/b] (kc0kbc @ Dec. 16 2006,04:54)]Adam N7YA,

You sir, are a credit to the service. #Seriously!

Mike, KC0KBC
I agree with you Mike.

Bob w0vu

[WA4RYW]

Quote[/b] (kc0kbc @ Dec. 17 2006,05:54)]Adam N7YA,

You sir, are a credit to the service. #Seriously!

Mike, KC0KBC
The "service" part has been dying a slow death for almost 30 years now. What's left is pretty much just a hobby now.

[KC2QHE]

Quote[/b] (WA4RYW @ Dec. 16 2006,23:17)]Quote[/b] (KC2QHE @ Dec. 17 2006,00:53)]i just can't believe some of the posts. many a long nights here have been spent on the cb radio. right now in fact, speaking on sideband, with some of my locals, and yes, most of us have our tickets, but there are close friends on the radio who don't have their tickets. should we dismiss these people as friends?

# KC2QHE

-HAM RADIO OPERATOR, AND DAMN PROUD OF IT-
73'S
The critical question you didn't address in your post is; are you talking on sideband on a legal crystal-controlled channel, or are you breaking the law and using ham gear, or even out of the allocated citizens-band frequency spectrum? That's the difference that I believe most object to. If you aren't using a crystal controlled radio type accepted for citizens band radio service and compliant with part 95, with 3.5 watts out and within the 40 channels, then you are a criminal breaking the law. That's not what we want for recruits. If you ARE meeting the law, then ham radio is for you. Welcome.
on ssb. on good old cobra 142, actually downtuned for 1-3.5 on am, and doing about 8 on ssb, no need for more to speak to locals. no extra channels, nothing. nice and clean- the way it should be. don't need to be sounding like on of them superbowlers.

[KI4MSA]

Quote[/b] (N9OH @ Dec. 15 2006,23:55)]Quote[/b] (KI4MSA @ Dec. 16 2006,23:04)]Quote[/b] (AB2MH @ Dec. 15 2006,22:10)]This NO-CODE Technician says:
... . . # -.-- .- # --- -. # .... ..-. # http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

Unfortunately, morse code is an audible language, not one written down in dots and dashes. #Learning dots and dashes rather than sounds puts a mental block on increasing CW speed.

A NO-CODE HF'er might want to learn code for contesting and working DX. #Contesters know that CW is where you make the most points... and DX is often only obtainable via CW. #If you refuse to learn CW that's just more points and better DX opportunities for the KNOW-CODERs #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif
I have learned the CODE! #I can send every letter and number, and most of the punctuation. #My problem is hearing the music of the code. #I have taken, and failed, my first code test. #I am close to passing it, but I'm not sure I'll get there before it goes away. #This news just means I can focus more on getting my General now.


So don't read more into that than what is truely there.


This NO-CODE Technician says:
... . . # -.-- .- # --- -. # .... ..-. #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[KI4MSA]

Quote[/b] (W8TCZ @ Dec. 16 2006,01:51)]Quote[/b] (KI4MSA @ Dec. 16 2006,14:32)]Quote[/b] (W8TCZ @ Dec. 15 2006,15:39)]After reading the sentiment of many on this site and another site where a "so-called" ham exclaimed that "We Won!" only shows how Amateur Radio has changed along with the quality of operator. #The fact is that we all have lost, but some are too ignorant to see that fact. #Thankfully, I #and others my age were fortunate enough to experienced Amateur Radio when it truly meant something to be one.
To make a statement like this take some big furry ones.

Whether you had to take a code test or not has absolutely no bearing on the QUALITY of the operator.

Listen to 20 & 75 meters real good, and then tell us what the quality level of some of those operators is. #One would think that they were listening to 27.185 MHZ to listen in on 20 & 75 Meters. And you can bet that those operators passed their code test.

This NO-CODE Tech says:
... . . # -.-- .- # --- -. # .... ..-. #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif
Evidently you cannot read as I never mentioned anything about code. #I said that the manner some are addressing this shows the quality of the hams have changed. #A true ham would not despise fellow hams with a "we won" attitude. #As I said we all have lost, especially with that sort of attitude. #Your description only contributes toward promoting that attitude.
May I remind you of what this thread is about?

"MORSE CODE ELIMINATED BY FCC"

There are too many posts from Generals and Extras to count that disparage Technicians because they don't have to pass the code.

This NO-CODE Technician says:
... . . # -.-- .- # --- -. # .... ..-. #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[kb2wye]

NO CODE- It could be a good thing or bad, it depends on the OPERATOR using that radio - morse code does not make you any better of an operator. They/everyone can be a proficient operator with OR without the morse code. Let the party begin... Hey, what's next 1-class license for all?

Happy Holidays To All... http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif

[ki4ima]

passed my5wpm code test on 12/14/2006 and they drop it on 12/15/2006 now thats timing
73 KI4IMA

[N3KTH]

Quote[/b] (N0TTW @ Dec. 17 2006,00:46)]How about MTMPSK (similiar to THROB, but more tones, with PSK involved) that fits in a 1Khz Bandwidth? Will be interesting to see if it works. This mode can have a full-duplex voice conversation in the same space as SSB with room to spare.
I'm with you Chris...

My point was there are many modes available to operators in this hobby. While I was a "no-coder" for several years before passing my 5WPM I worked ATV, built a repeater (on the 220 band), and worked packet and several digital modes..... As hard as it may be for the old timers to believe, I wasn't the least bit handicapped by not knowing morse code. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif - and let me say that a high percentage of the Hams I met working these modes were NCTs.

There are exciting things happening everyday and if this hobby is to survive, we need more young people coming in and exploring these exciting modern modes....

The code is still available for those who wish to learn it... And no one is stopping the old timers from doing nothing but "chewing the rag" on 80M every night or "workin the key" with others who are interested in that mode....

Regards & 73,
Al

[ad4mg]

Quote[/b] (ki4ima @ Dec. 17 2006,08:51)]passed my5wpm code test on 12/14/2006 and they drop it on 12/15/2006 now thats timing
# # # #73 #KI4IMA
I would say that it's incredibly good timing! Congratulations on passing element 1. You'll never regret it.

You will be forever a part of amateur radio history, as one of the last few to take & pass the code requirement. What an opener for a good rag chew!

Enjoy!

Best 73,
Luke

[ke4pkb]

Hello to everyone!
I know anything that I say here will not make a bit of difference in the big scheme of things. But I will say this anyway! I am a NO code tech that is absolutely going to continue to learn and use code! I have been slammed by General, Advanced, and Extra Hams since I was first licensed for being a NCT! I KNOW that the VAST and HUGE majority of Hams are decent and kind people! I would like to add my 2 cents worth in here now. I do not understand after being told that learning code will make you a BETTER Ham for nearly 14 YEARS... WHY is ALL this HATE coming from the CODED Hams who are General or Higher class licenses!!!http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif WHY when you go to the FCC and ARRL and QRZ websites to look who has been fined this month and WHY... that 9 times out of 10 it is the very same Generals and higher who are doing it!!!http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif I personally think that it is the long-time, tired, older hams who have lost their zeal and passion for ham radio, or even life in general! We all become complacent at one time or another. I think we should all thank GOD for what he has given us all! To try to over-look the things that others do wrong sometimes. We should all have that zeal, that passion when we FIRST got licensed, and made our first contact! Do you remember how good that felt? And how excited we were to get in there and make new friends and to try to spread good news! Anyway... that is what I wanted to say... GOD Bless!!!
Merry Christmas...
Stanton L. Shealy, ke4pkb.

[W4RQ]

Seems to me this thread might have been mis-titled just a bit. It should have been titled "Morse Code TESTING Eliminated by FCC". That might have prevented a lot of the misunderstanding we've seen in this thread.

I've been a ham 47 years now and yes, a 20-wpm Extra --- pre-VEC days!! I have been a VE/VEC for many years, too; I always enjoyed signing off on someone's CSCE when I felt he had earned it --- 10 year old kids on up to 70+ types. But I would think twice about signing it if I thought all I was doing was just "giving it away" and nothing was really done to "earn" it.

I'm not putting no-code Tech's down either. I know many great hams of all classes. I even know one no-code Tech whose CSCE I signed years ago. He is now a 20-wpm Extra. My point? His Tech ticket was just his entry into the hobby. He discovered he liked CW -- nobody forced him -- and --- HE PUT FORTH THE EFFORT to learn the code and to upgrade!! Now that kind of guy I have lots of respect for. Now, a lot of the no-coder types here with the ****-poor attitudes who are gloating over dropping the Morse requirement --- got no respect for you at all, as you don't even rate high enough to be called a scum-bag.

CW itself has not died. I enjoy it a lot and always will. You n-coders may have won a very shallow victory on the testing requirement. But you will ***NEVER*** take CW away from us. Just try --- you'll never forget how serious a butt-kicking you'll get for trying.

In the meantime, let's concentrate on preserving the best of amateur radio and the good hams. The malcontents and scum will ultimately hang themselves -- they always do. I, for one, don't mind feeding them a little extra rope to help them accomplish that.....

[k7yb]

ARRGH!!!!...The END OF THE WORLD!!! MAYHEM IN THE STREETS! CATS LIVING WITH RATS!!!!....uh, hello!! You could have seen this coming a long way off...like 30 years ago. The "end of the world as we know it crowd" has been screaming doom and gloom for the past 30 years and we still have the normal(?) number of miscreants and jammers on the band. Lets make them hams with class and teach them right.

[N3KTH]

Quote[/b] (W4RQ @ Dec. 17 2006,06:53)]Seems to me this thread might have been mis-titled just a bit. It should have been titled "Morse Code TESTING Eliminated by FCC". That might have prevented a lot of the misunderstanding we've seen in this thread.
You are , of course, 100% correct. Nothing has been eliminated and no one lost any operating privileges. Morse code is not for me in the same manner that packet may not be for you. Myself, I am not particularly interested in HF. I got my ticket because I wanted to build a repeater, work ATV, and play with the digital modes. Later (in the mid 90's), I got my 5WPM because I was interested in 10 M.... (Unlike most Techs, I almost never work 2M FM)....

The great thing about amateur radio is that there is room for everyone. I propose that ingorant people exist everywhere, and it is indeed the role to the amateur community to police itself. In the few times I have listed to HF, I've heard Extras (yeah the old 20 WPM variety) spewing as much filth as I ever heard on CB 19.

The hobby will be just fine. And if code is to survive, as has been mentioned, it is up to those who enjoy this mode to elmer others who share this interest.

73
Al

[KI4MSA]

Quote[/b] (KB2SFH @ Dec. 16 2006,02:52)]Quote[/b] (ad4mg @ Dec. 16 2006,10:54)]RIGHT, big guy. #Let's not even give them a chance. #Let's keep the hate going. #It is, after all, our hobby, right? #What right do these people have?
First of all, please check my listing on QRZ and rephrase that big guy comment, then I can send you the name and number of a very good eyedoctor.

And why should they be given a chance? they didn't want it bad enough to earn it. Sorry, I cannot respect that. They want to be on the air, fine, let them knock themselves out. I just have one statement for those that want to be on ham bands and those that have worked to be here: I don't care if you came from CB or not, JUST LEAVE THE CB AT THE DOOR WHEN YOU COME IN. If you can't honor that then stay out!!!

Right Susan, #And when do you plan on applying that statement to your fellow Generals on 20 & 75 meters?

Where is the difference in bad language from HF to 11 Meters? #Your fellow Generals seem to have forgotten why everybody hates 11 meters.

This NO-CODE Technician says:
... . . # -.-- .- # --- -. # .... ..-. #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[N3KTH]

Quote[/b] (KE8LW @ Dec. 17 2006,00:10)]to get away from the bad language, and 10-4 good buddy I chose Ham.
QSL on that Old Man, Hi Hi Hi, - let's just sit in the shack and chew the rag!

[KB1SF]

Quote[/b] (kc8vwm @ Dec. 16 2006,18:05)]Quote[/b] (K6RF @ Dec. 16 2006,17:51)]From "Incentive Licensing" to "Here it is free of work"

Amazing ! #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif
There is nothing free about it.

In order to "survive" in amateur radio one must learn, learn, learn and keep learning. Perhaps not by choice but sometimes we are forced by sheer necessity. #We are experimenters, innovators, inventors and builders.

"That's" what amateur radio is really all about.

The license is only the starting point to start this learning process. An academic degree is a final conclusion to learning. The license on the other hand is not intended as the final conclusion, just the starting point.

73
Charles, you've hit the nail squarely on the head!

In fact, I firmly believe the FCC's entire concept of incentive licensing was (and is) an oxymoron.

That is, if the REAL goal of that system is to educate and create a larger pool of trained,
technically competent radio operators (as they state) then why does the FCC insist on
placing the achievement tests BEFORE the bulk of the in-depth learning about what's on the test actually takes place?

Now, lets not confuse the concept of learning with memorizing and then regurgitating a
bunch of rote information that often makes absolutely NO sense to an applicant when
they take their tests. #That's because at that particular point in their Ham Radio education, they usually have little or no prior, practical experience to fully understand what it all means.

And, certainly, most (but not all) mentally-capable applicants can sit down with a book
and cram their heads full of mindless (to them) gobbledygook and then spit it all back out
to pass a multiple-choice exam. #

Wouldn't it make FAR more sense to give everyone the opportunity to GET ON THE
AIR on those frequencies and modes that the new license class grants to learn what all the
gobbledygook means FIRST and THEN give them the comprehensive examination over
what they've actually learned? #

As a professional consultant and teacher, I pass information along to my students in one
of three different ways. #I can lecture to them (I call this the "sponge" approach), which is
the classroom equivalent of reading a book (or a license manual) on the subject. #Or, I can
lecture to them and then demonstrate the concepts of the subject while they watch. Or, I
can "toss them in the deep end of the pool" and let THEM experiment on their own,
which, in turn, forces them to teach such concepts to THEMSELVES.
#
Years and years of professional research into the ways we humans learn things has shown
unequivocally that, of the three main ways information is learned, actual hands-on
experimentation yields BY FAR the greatest retention.

This may be why our age-old concept of "Elmering" has been so successful in our hobby
over the years. #While it is true that our own Elmers (if we were fortunate enough to have
one) demonstrated many Ham Radio concepts to us, the chances are very good that they
also forced us into teaching-learning situations where WE had to do a number of things
for ourselves…often by trial and error, with our Elmer always at the ready to provide
feedback on our creation(s). #And, I believe if each of us were to now reflect on that time when we were getting started in the hobby, my hunch is that the lessons we learned as a result of that hands-on experimentation were the ones that stayed with us the longest.

So, again, if the REAL goal of the FCC's incentive licensing system is to increase our
overall technical competency as a Service (rather than keeping the dreaded "CBer riff raff" out of the hobby), then forcing everyone to take comprehensive written examinations BEFORE the REAL learning takes place makes absolutely no sense at all. #

Clearly, the FCC's incentive licensing approach is an absolutely invalid and blatantly discriminatory way of measuring learning that is chock-full of meaningless barriers because it simply measures an #applicant's (usually innate) ability to memorize and then regurgitate facts.

Now, certainly, I am NOT advocating we dispense with all written examinations!

To the contrary, there still needs to be some government oversight to control access to
our Service. And there still needs to be some kind of mechanism to insure applicants
(particularly newcomers) have enough knowledge to keep themselves (and their
neighbors) safe. #The FCC also needs to have a reasonable assurance that such applicants
know enough of the "rules of the road" for the specific activities they will be doing on
the air so as to not make themselves a nuisance to others in their neighborhoods on the Ham bands.

So, in that sense, our testing structure ought to look more like a series of "learner's
permits" designed to get people up and on the air and communicating (that is…learning)
rather than a college-level degree program in RF engineering that rewards people various
"degrees" (a.k.a. "operating privileges") based on how well they can memorize and
regurgitate facts on multiple choice tests.

So, for all of these reasons, I firmly believe the FCC needs to now get out of the "badge
of honor" and "achievement test" business. #The FCC's testing structure SHOULD be
encouraging (rather than discouraging) the "hands-on" learning of a wide range of skills
in the technical and communications phases of the radio art, rather than simply
concentrating on "rote learning".

Unfortunately, the current FCC sub-band-based-on-license-class-and-operating-mode
stupidity only allows applicants to obtain such learning AFTER they've taken a "final
exam" on the subject. #

That's because, in typical government bureaucratic fashion the FCC has consistently
been pushing rote examinations and ill-timed "achievement tests" that measure the
absolute wrong set of knowledges and skills…at absolutely the wrong points in the
teaching-learning process.

73,

Keith
KB1SF / VA3KSF

[N3KTH]

Quote[/b] (ab5st @ Dec. 16 2006,19:58)]http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif
Well I gues I will forget morse and start learning cb 10 codes. Should I install a roger beep in my ic 718?
I don't understand what you're doing with the Icom in the 1st place... Obviously, since most old timers want to keep this dinosaur of a mode as a requirement, ... I'm surprised you wouldn't prefer to build your own vaccum tube transmitter to use as you primary code machine....

[ka5s]

GG STRG I C


!

Cortland
KA5S

[KB2SFH]

Quote[/b] (ad4mg @ Dec. 17 2006,07:42)]but I'm not going to take it out on all the amateurs who come to our HF & MF bands after this R&O goes into effect. #That's not fair, and these folks deserve better.
Oh I don't intend on taking it out on them, that isn't right. I blame the FCC for it, I only blame the whiners for not EVEN TRYING to get the code. I have been in their shoes when I first came in as a no-code in 1994 and a few of the higher classes crucified me, jammed me, turned off the repeaters when I signed on with my call to name a few of the things I had to endure. shortly after me, a new ham no-code came in and I befriended him on the air and was trying to give him some guidance to some mistakes he was making with on the air etiquette. well I never got the chance because the extra class bully control op of the repeater came on hollering in his typical drunken rage at this poor guy about it and then proceeded to turn on me and holler at me and totally not making sense in his accusations. the poor new guy was so horrified at being treated like this that he never ever came back on the air anywhere again and I lost a potential new friend in the process. the drunken maniac now lives in Dripping Springs, Texas and I hope he is proud of himself, Right Andrew? you know who you are, you are formerly AI2P from NJ in case you can';t remember in your usual drunken stupor. I haven't forgotten you, as unpleasant and nasty and disgusting as you were and probably still are down there in Texas. You and your cronies you hung with here can go rot for the way you treated me and ran others off the air and right out of the hobby. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif

[N3SGW]

I am a NCT and am involved in ARES, Skywarn and other volunteer organizations. What are you doing or volunteering in to better Amateur Radio? I don't see what the big deal is with so many Hams being so bitter about the FCC dropping the Morse Code requirements. #If you need to take out your aggression, Hate the game, don't hate the players. It wasn't my decision to drop the Morse Code requirement. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif #Can't we all just get along?http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif

[ke6oud]

Quote[/b] (W4RQ @ Dec. 17 2006,06:53)]I'm not putting no-code Tech's down either. ##Now, a lot of the no-coder types here with the ****-poor attitudes who are gloating over dropping the Morse requirement --- got no respect for you at all, as you don't even rate high enough to be called a scum-bag.

#You n-coders may have won a very shallow victory on the testing requirement. #But you will ***NEVER*** take CW away from us. #Just try --- you'll never forget how serious a butt-kicking you'll get for trying.

The malcontents and scum will ultimately hang themselves -- they always do. #
You sir, are just a mean old man PERIOD! If this is what I'm going to run into on HF, I don't want any part of it.
I passed my written 2 months ago & almost ready for my 5 wpm. Now it looks like the point is moot as by the time the next VE session gets here, I won't be able to test.
As I said in an earlier post, there's too much hate in the world without you adding to it!

[N1IRL]

Quote[/b] (KL7FZ @ Dec. 15 2006,23:11)]For over 45 years I was proud to say I was an Amateur Radio Operator. Now I am almost ashamed to tell anyone I am a part of it.
Very sad. And my new amp just came in the mail today.
Maybe I'll just take out the tubes and plant flowers in
the holes.
73
KL7FZ
Not proud to be an Amateur Radio Operator? Then turn in your ticket or let it expire like CW will soon!

This move was made to breath life into a dying hobby! CW was just another mode that should not be any different than any of the other many modes in amateur radio.

This change is for the good. Adapt to change and live on, reject change and die off like the dinosaurs you are!

Somebody finally got it right and now maybe everyone will understand why HF manufacturers for years sold a mic as a standard option with an HF rig and CW keys were ALWAYS an optional accessory, sold separately!

Go ahead, gripe all you want you old CW (Constant Whiners) farts. This will be the last place you will tap out anything that will be heard! LOL!!!!!!!!

I support the change and the hobby! NO CW requirement is the rule now.., if you support the hobby you will support the decision too! If not, maybe you should try another hobby..., like shuffleboard? LOL!!!

Sorry, but I have had it with stupid remarks from CW operators who have all had the attitude "We had to do it, why shouldn't you?", or "It will turn the bands into the CB bands!"!

We used to have to send smoke signals, crank a handle on our cars to start them and crank a handle on a phone to make a call too, right? Technology now lets us start our cars from inside our homes to warm up with a push of a button and to make a call by saying into the phone "Call home". Amateur radio is about experimenting and improving the hobby. We just did!

As far as turning the HF bands into the CB bands.., listen to all the CW guys on the 75M phone bands in the evenings! I hear better conversations on 11M than on 75M!!! The CW test didn't work as a good filter there did it?

Your theories and useless arguments are shot..., hence the new rule change!


N1IRL
Rick

[N2RJ]

Quote[/b] (N3KTH @ Dec. 17 2006,10:40)]Quote[/b] (ab5st @ Dec. 16 2006,19:58)]http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif
Well I gues I will forget morse and start learning cb 10 codes. Should I install a roger beep in my ic 718?
I don't understand what you're doing with the Icom in the 1st place... Obviously, since most old timers want to keep this dinosaur of a mode as a requirement, ... I'm surprised you wouldn't prefer to build your own vaccum tube transmitter to use as you primary code machine....
You're doing as if something is wrong with BUILDING equipment for use on the ham bands.

The future of ham radio folks, and it isn't looking too bright.

[N2RJ]

Quote[/b] (N1IRL @ Dec. 17 2006,11:02)]Quote[/b] (KL7FZ @ Dec. 15 2006,23:11)]For over 45 years I was proud to say I was an Amateur Radio Operator. Now I am almost ashamed to tell anyone I am a part of it.
Very sad. And my new amp just came in the mail today.
Maybe I'll just take out the tubes and plant flowers in
the holes.
73
KL7FZ
Not proud to be an Amateur Radio Operator? Then turn in your ticket or let it expire like CW will soon!

This move was made to breath life into a dying hobby! CW was just another mode that should not be any different than any of the other many modes in amateur radio.

This change is for the good. Adapt to change and live on, reject change and die off like the dinosaurs you are!

Somebody finally got it right and now maybe everyone will understand why HF manufacturers for years sold a mic as a standard option with an HF rig and CW keys were ALWAYS an optional accessory, sold separately!

Go ahead, gripe all you want you old CW (Constant Whiners) farts. This will be the last place you will tap out anything that will be heard! LOL!!!!!!!!

I support the change and the hobby! NO CW requirement is the rule now.., if you support the hobby you will support the decision too! If not, maybe you should try another hobby..., like shuffleboard? LOL!!!

Sorry, but I have had it with stupid remarks from CW operators who have all had the attitude "We had to do it, why shouldn't you?", or "It will turn the bands into the CB bands!"!

We used to have to send smoke signals, crank a handle on our cars to start them and crank a handle on a phone to make a call too, right? Technology now lets us start our cars from inside our homes to warm up with a push of a button and to make a call by saying into the phone "Call home". Amateur radio is about experimenting and improving the hobby. We just did!

As far as turning the HF bands into the CB bands.., listen to all the CW guys on the 75M phone bands in the evenings! I hear better conversations on 11M than on 75M!!! The CW test didn't work as a good filter there did it?

Your theories and useless arguments are shot..., hence the new rule change!


N1IRL
Rick
The hobby isn't dying!

Just ask any DX station who is fed up of being piled up on by countless North Americans or Europeans. Now the flood gates have been opened up wide, so many of the DX stations will either go away or move to CW where there is less of a pile up.

The hobby isn't dying and the numbers certainly aren't suffering, at least judging from what I hear on air, even at the bottom of the solar cycle as we are now!

That is only a MYTH perpetrated by the anti-coders and their supporters.

[KC2MRU]

First of all ... I was just as surprised as everyone else to hear that the FCC is dropping code just like that .

Second , I have to say that I agree with Mike (KC0KBC) . I'm a newer Amateur Operator that received my Technician license almost 4 years ago , but that doesn't mean that I have no interest in using code . I have been studying my butt off for the past few months so that I could take the Generals exam at a local Hamfest that is coming up at the end of February . With this new development I'm a little confused as to what I'm suppose to do now . In my area we have a VE test once a month , but with this change if I take the test in January (if I can get in that soon) would I still be a General or would I have to do it all over again after the new law takes effect ?

Also , I don't want to be looked at as one of the Hams that jumped on the ban wagon as soon as the FCC removed the code because I worked hard to learn the code and am ready to take the test . I like using code and I know that it'll still be widely used on the HF bands , I even bought my HF radio at the beginning of this past week . Anyways , If someone could shine a little light on to how I'm suppose to approach this new problem it would be greatly appretiated ...

By the way , when I do get to HF , I'll be one of the new Hams that's still using Code . All you old timers shouldn't worry so much about the FCC dropping the code , code will still be around for a long time to come because alot of us New Hams still like it . Although I have to say that I was surprised that they didn't leave the code requirement in place for the Amateur Extra exam as many others were .

[w9wo]

Quote[/b] (W9GRN @ Dec. 16 2006,11:21)]Quote[/b] (N9DGS @ Dec. 16 2006,08:42)]Quote[/b] (k8cpa @ Dec. 16 2006,01:43)]This is truly a sad day in Amateur Radio. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif

This Kenwood 950 can sit and ROT for all I care. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif

Truly, Truly Sad. #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif

73 DE K8CPA

-Chuck


Hey Chuck. Instead of letting such a fine piece of equipment just sit and rot why not let me have it and I'll put it to good use? Just send the michrophone with it. You can keep the CW key, I won't be needing that.

Seriously, I tested for my no code tech license 02/16/91, two days after it became available and drove six hours one way to do so because I was so excited and could not wait for three weeks until my area tested. I love the hobby but I wouldn't give a dime for every dit or dah ever made. I don't know of anyone who could say that I ever conducted myself unworthy of a ham although I hear a lot of it out there, HF bands included. So not being interested in CW don't mean anything more than that. It is a mode of communication just like a foreign language if you will, but I'm not interested in speaking spanish, french , or japaneese either, just good old english by word of mouth. Times do change, hopfully for the better. We'll see.
Darrell
Just wondering,now that Morse Code will be gone how will you be able to communicate with our counterparts in other countries? I thought the code was a universal language.
I thought english was also the universal language. That's like saying that everyone that don't comprehend english should learn it to communicate with me. Sort of the same thing huh? I just won't be in the CW band segments. I don't care for that mode of communication. As far as that goes I don't care for ATV or any of the digital modes either. As a matter of fact I would much rather speak this to you instead of punching it out on a keyboard. I'd have been done a long time ago.
73's to all and merry Christmas, Darrell.

[w9wo]

Quote[/b] (PE1RDW @ Dec. 16 2006,12:32)]Quote[/b] (k8cpa @ Dec. 16 2006,19:26)]Quote[/b] (N9DGS @ Dec. 15 2006,09:42)]Quote[/b] (k8cpa @ Dec. 16 2006,01:43)]This is truly a sad day in Amateur Radio. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif

This Kenwood 950 can sit and ROT for all I care. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif

Truly, Truly Sad. #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif

73 DE K8CPA

-Chuck


Hey Chuck. Instead of letting such a fine piece of equipment just sit and rot why not let me have it and I'll put it to good use? Just send the michrophone with it. You can keep the CW key, I won't be needing that.
Blow it out XXXXXXXXXXXEDITXXXXXXXXXXXXXX you see fit.

no-code, smart alleck twirp.

-Me
Nice language for someone with a christian avatar, my advice for you: sell the rig to a freebander and send you licence back to the fcc, hamradio will be better of without lids like you.
He called me a twirp.

[K4JF]

Quote[/b] (N3KTH @ Dec. 16 2006,08:41)]Quote[/b] (W4RQ @ Dec. 17 2006,06:53)]Seems to me this thread might have been mis-titled just a bit. #It should have been titled "Morse Code TESTING Eliminated by FCC". #That might have prevented a lot of the misunderstanding we've seen in this thread.
You are , of course, 100% correct. Nothing has been eliminated and no one lost any operating privileges.
Wrong. Generals (and Advanced) lost privileges as noted here earlier.

That is just as incorrect as saying no one is for eliminating CW. MANY are and they have posted right here.

[K4JF]

"An academic degree is a final conclusion to learning."

Just about as WRONG as one can be. When you got that degree it was at a "commencement", which is a synonym for "beginning".

I've learned far more about business after earning my Masters than I did while earning it. And just about anyone with some experience in the real world will concur.

And by the way, every decent educational institution requires you to learn some things you have no intention of using. So that particular argument against CW doesn't wash.

[kj3n]

Quote[/b] (n0klu @ Dec. 17 2006,01:06)]The irony is that we all saw the "handwriting on the wall" several years ago with the 03 decision...
Uh.... some of us saw that handwriting with the 2000 restructuring. It just took the rest of you a little longer. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

[w8rej]

I think the FCC should not have gone so far.

I agree with dropping the code requirement for those of us who would have never use anything but the voice bands.

They should have left to code requirement for only those of us who would want use the code bands.

[KC0TPI]

Quote[/b] (ka2pborick @ Dec. 15 2006,23:14)]Breaker Breaker 19.....Im gonna go get me one of them there ham radio sets good buddy!!!!No more of that there Morse code stuff.All I gotta do is memorize a few questions and I can be worldwide ..no doubt!!!!
why don't you guy stop makin fun of US truckdriver ok? im a trucker and a ham and i am one that thinks all of us who drive and haul your lil fancy dancy radios to the store should be showed some respect for once. mean after all if it wasn't for us truckers the price of everything would go through the roof and ya'll would be paying un-godly s&h rates....

[kg4ulp]

The truth is, ham radio is a dying hobby. Removing the code requiement will have very little effect on the bands. If you are going to get new members into the hobby, you need to focus on young people... and most of them are used to crystal-clear instanteneous long-distance communication through the Internet and cell phones - why play with walkie talkies orf spend hundreds of dollars on a radio, put up an antenna, just to listen to static, interference, birdies, and old farts who argue into the vacuum that is their hopelessly outdated version of the glory days that never existed?

I am a meteorolgy college professor who teaches an undergraduate course on radiation/thermodynamics and I spend one lecture per semester talking about ham radio, the structure and contents of the ionosphere, propagation and sky-wave transmission. I always end the lecture saying "if you are interested in knowing more about the hobby, I'm more than happy to oblige." In six years of teaching, I've had two students express any interest, one of whom is licensed as a General (and started his own club at the university) and one of whom has a few of my QST magazines to read over Christmas break. And my audience for the most part has a strong interest in weather spotting and could greatly benefit from getting the Tech license and a mobile station to radio in reports.

Let's face it, the hobby appeals to a small number of people; it always has, in fact. It always will. And that's great! Those of us who love it will do it, those of us who don't care won't, and those who are mildly interested will hopefully at least find someone in the first category who is willing to explain to them why some of us are think it is such a neat hobby.

[KB2SFH]

Quote[/b] (kg4ulp @ Dec. 17 2006,12:47)]The truth is, ham radio is a dying hobby. Removing the code requiement will have very little effect on the bands. If you are going to get new members into the hobby, you need to focus on young people... and most of them are used to crystal-clear instanteneous long-distance communication through the Internet and cell phones.
The real truth is ham radio is NOT a dying hobby and what will these young people who have all the new modern toys from mom and dad going to do with them when power goes out and communications go down? it's the ham radio ops that step up to the plate with teamwork to get communications through. sadly many of today's youth are so pampered they don't know what real teamwork is about, and up to us to show it to them.

[KI4MSA]

Quote[/b] (N7YA @ Dec. 16 2006,04:40)]Damn,

Its a sad day for ham radio...not because the code was dropped or because cb this or that or whatever. Its a sad day because we are literally coming apart at the seams. we are acting like a bunch of 5th grade dicks.

Sell your damn gear...to me!! Im seeing a lot of really unlikeable people here, human beings who are spewing hatred towards others over a friggin hobby.... A HOBBY!!

Good god, you miserable bastards need to meet in a warehouse, turn off the lights and start swinging wildly.

I get on the air and i use our bands, I worked for my ticket, i passed 20 wpm, nobody in the rest of the civilized world could care less about ANY of that and neither do I! You know why? do you really want to know why? Its because i get up off my ass and do something other than stew on ridiculous subjects like morse code testing on the internet, I have a life! I get women! I have friends that i met face to face! not ONE of them thinks ham radio is cool, not ONE! they all think its dead, they all think its CB, the only recollection of it is some faint memories of old grandpa in the basement and a bunch of wire...THATS IT!! Tell me im wrong, go ahead! you bunch of bold, bloated arrogant masters of everything.

#Heres a nice tidbit for you from a guy who knows what hes talking about, If you think ham radio is done and over with, go away! If you still derive pleasure from it then shut up and get on the air...seriously. If you are THIS hateful and angry about what you THINK is going to happen and end up insulting a bunch of newcomers who are likely going to simply enjoy ham radio, leave the hobby and dont come back...I seriously find negative, hateful people extremely unattractive, unlikeable and basically character flawed.

The hobby is great, im in it for life, as long as there are other hams to talk to, i will talk to them...what could be more simple than that? What is hard to understand with this? Screw your standards...i simply dont care. individuals hold themselves to standards or they dont, if they dont then i dont talk to them...should i repeat this? is this incomprehensible? I have been a 20 wpm extra for years now, I have heard some of the most vile, ugly and disrespectful garbage eminating from the sewerholes of old school extras on the air, HF and repeaters,for WAY too long now...new techs are usually trying to rise above some nasty title they didnt deserve and usually become better ops than the old jerks who hate them. and THESE are the folks they should look up to??

I am sick of hate spewing men who have long passed their prime and missed their oportunities in life to be cool or accepted...if you arent happy with yourself, FIX IT! dont project onto others because you look like a real fool. This whole thing is not calming down, its getting uglier and so are we. Im staying in ham radio, I welcome newcomers because i know how to stay on top of MY own game, i dont blame anyone for my failings as a human, i fix it and try to find positives. But those of you who just want to cause pain and anger to validate yourselves, now you are starting to piss me off.

New hams, more power to you, I am a 20 wpm extra and i welcome you and whoever doesnt can go hang it in their pipe for all i care. I will qso anyone with a valid callsign because i still like ham radio. If you dont, please leave or find a way to fix it.

Im serious about that darkened warehouse thing.

73 to all but the negative ones, you guys can go scratch eachother...Adam, N7YA
Adam,

With thinking like that, you could quite possibly be considered a God amongst men.

Thanks!

Hope to have a QSO with you one day.

73 & Merry Christmas

Jim
KI4MSA

This NO-CODE Technician says:
... . . # -.-- .- # --- -. # .... ..-. #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[K8MHZ]

I too think the truckers are getting unfairly bashed here.

If you could bear to spend some time listening to CB you would find that most of the truckers are quite polite. #It is the locals that have the worst habits.

Besides the slang, which I personally don't like, the locals are very vulgar. #They take an immense amount of joy trying to outpower each other and dead keying on one and other.

There are several truckers with licenses that frequent our 2 meter linked system. #It's great to talk to them and hear of their travel experiences. #They are all pretty decent folk.

If we do attract CBers it will be the ones that are disgusted enough with 11 meters that they want to join a more civilized group. #I think that is great. #CB can be a nice screening process. #I know of no CBers that want to get into ham radio in order to continue to cuss on the air and play with roger beeps.

The most foul mouthed amateur radio operators have never been CBers. #Perhaps if they had they would have stayed there.

[KB5YAI]

I have been a technician for 13 years and havn't upgraded because of the morse code barrier, I am finally going to study for my general license, CW is just a mode of operation which very few people use anyway once they get their general license they never use CW again, and the written test is not just memorizing the questions, you still need to know the math formulas for electronics and requires lots of study, I work with electronics and computers which require the use of math formulas to troble shoot some of the circuit problems. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[K8MHZ]

Quote[/b] ] and the written test is not just memorizing the questions, you still need to know the math formulas for electronics and requires lots of study,

I disagree with you there.

If you take the practice exams on QRZ and eHam over and over again you will be able to pass the written test just by memorizing the answers.

Have you ever heard of the Ham in a Day classes? #They teach people how to pass the Tech test in 8 hours and test them at the end of the day. #I assure you that they are not being taught the formulas and theories behind the questions.

I passed my General without studying. #I also did not use a calculator at the test. #I passed my CW test and they said I could take a shot at General for free. #I did and I passed. #I did not even bring a calculator with me.

I studied the Gordon West Extra book for a couple months on and off. #I started taking the tests on line until I could pass every time without doing any math. #I could pass the tests every time and spent less than ten minutes doing so. #I just started memorizing the answers to the questions that required math. #I took the test for real yesterday and passed. #I got a 44 out of 50 and only used the calculator for three questions. #I could have left it at home and passed the Extra test as well.

Yes, you can indeed pass all the written tests by memorizing the answers or not even looking at the answers at all.

The good part is that by even memorizing the answers you still learn some things. #Especially when it comes to the rules and regs. #You also get to learn a bit about antennas, electronics, etc. just by memorizing the answers.

[K8MHZ]

From another web site:

Quote[/b] ]"Many countries have still retained the Morse requirement for HF, and some countries continue to require a Morse qualification for HF operation by amateurs visiting from other countries," RAC advised in a recent bulletin.

Well, now that the US no longer has a Morse certification will the codeless Generals and Extras *not* be able to operate HF in those countries?

Does anyone know if the FCC is planning on retaining the Element 1 tests on an optional basis in order to accommodate US hams that want to be able to operate HF in countries that require a Morse certification?

[kb8nds]

Quote[/b] (KL7FZ @ Dec. 16 2006,02:15)]Quote[/b] (KE7GGV @ Dec. 16 2006,02:00)]oh yes...what do you say to those handicapped....who have the no-code tech..are they lazy???...would they be the same...on HF...or visually impaired...or who cannot write...or back then...some did not have to take the 5 WPM test...becasue of some circumstances....are they retarded or lazy....well...I guess...we will all drop dead...I will be honest just because I am disabled...and with a mental disease and disability....and cannot grasp CW yet...and yet I passed the test..mmm...gee I guess..I am a lousy operator...just because I chose not to use CW now...
Sorry Dude. I have seen a lot of people with all sorts of severe handicaps overcome the code tests. And more. It is overcoming the handicap that is the true sucess. Not sitting around saying "I am so pitiful, I have a handicap" and waiting for someone to give you something like most of the no-code promoters.
I was there when it was REAL HAM RADIO. You were not! Don't fool yourself into believing that what you are seeing now and will be seeing will be the real Amateur Radio. YOU LOSE!
I was there when ham radio was building and developing new gear and operating new bands and seeing communication firsts.
I was there. I participated. I learned. I enjoyed.
I was there when it was EXCITING. When it was MAGIC!
YOU LOSE! YOU WILL NEVER KNOW!

Continue on with your shooting skip and how to build dipoles buddies.

I was there when it was FUN. I was there when it took effort that was satisfying and rewarding.

I WON. YOU LOST! YOU HAVE JUST NOT REALISED IT YET!!

CB ON GOOD BUDDY!

You just shot yourself in the foot!

HA!
KL7FZ
You sure keep saying "You Lose" and "I Won" a lot. Can you tell me what exactly we have lost and you have won?

[WA4RYW]

Another sign pointing toward the death of amateur radio is how it is perceived within the community. I have noticed that almost every post refers to amateur radio as simply a “hobby”, which isn’t necessarily incorrect. That IS what it has become. Nothing more, nothing less. What was once a service has lost its value over the years. As far back as the early 70s, our value was demonstrated daily during the Viet Nam war as most often the only practical communications channel for the servicemen to communicate with family back home. Phone patching ships at sea, missionaries, and other groups/individuals in remote outposts used short wave as a lifeline. This need is dead today thanks to rapidly advancing communications technology. Satellite phones that will fit on your belt can communicate from anywhere in the world, and advances in municipal communications systems, as well as rapid deployment emergency platforms have hobbled our need even further.

Trained technical pool. There’s not a lot of call for skilled analogue trained people any longer. Almost everything in the commercial world is digital, and what’s not will be soon. Most systems are modular in construction, and the modules, or circuit packs that make up these systems are not field repairable. What few component level repair jobs that are out there pay poorly compared to the ones where circuit pack swapping is standard. There is also a radically reduced call for analogue engineers in today’s economy.

Another sign of the decline of the service, or fraternity as it once was, and that is has degenerated into a hobby is the way hams feed upon hams. Mentoring was once a pillar of the service. When new blood petitioned to join the service, the elders took it upon themselves to tutor them along and help them learn not only the technical and code requirements, but to learn protocol and etiquette. Today, hams feed and profit on newcomers, assuming they don’t just discount them right away. I’ve seen Ebay ads (they’re ALL estate liquidations, aren’t they?) where someone has purchased coax from one of the retailers for .50 cents a foot (a price that’s available to anyone that is aware), and tries to sell it to future hams on Ebay at .75 cents a foot. My first ham radio was given to me by an elmer to use until I could afford one (I was 13 when I passed my novice). Not that I have anything against Capitalism, but the sprit of ham radio didn’t reflect the absolute need to turn a buck within the community before the decline. One could go to a hamfest and find a reasonable price on an older radio to get started on. Today, a radio will trade up from table to table until it leaves at the end of the day selling for 40% more than it did when it arrived that morning. It’s more like a distribution channel than a hamfest.

I can’t believe that anyone was surprised by the events that have transpired concerning the FCC. As many have said, the handwriting was on the wall. The only thing was the sudden shock of the announcement. I expect a lot more adjustments to come. As we degenerate into a “hobby” it will start looking more like a hobby, most notably by purging the “classes” from amateur radio (it’s a hobby, why are we discriminating?). Next will be the removal of the exams completely, not that we’re pretty much there now with the question and answer pools published verbatim. 11 meters is the new “novice”, and one day very soon, will be re-united with its separated brethren, the amateur spectrum. The only real debate that has validity in my opinion is how long will it take the guys that bought Henry 8KUltras and built quad 4-1000 amps for multi-killowatt action on 75 meters to force the FCC either to eliminate the “hobby” in lieu of reassigning our frequencies to Homeland Security, or to allow it to run wild as 11 meters did when it effectively deregulated and went lawless. The question we must ask ourselves is do we want to participate in the “hobby” phase, or not?

RIP amateur radio service. Party on ham radio hobby!

[W9CDL]

The idea that the code was a "security buffer" is both wrong, and
quite frankly insulting to a great many hams, not just the "no coders".

As other have pointed out, a quick listen on 75 phone clearly
indicates that CW, even 13WPM never kept out any of the "Riff Raff".
I have heard some of the most foul language, racial/ethnic slurs, and
other non prime time antics down there. I've been hearing those
conversations for many years and long before the no code days.

No, the CW requirement, even if it were intended as a right of
passage, did not stop people from being people. Amateur radio is not
just people in electronics, it is people from all backgrounds and is a
cross section of the country.

To single out no-code operators as the root of all that is wrong with
Amateur radio is both incorrect and hurtful.

Leave the no coders alone, it is not like they created the law, and
they are within the law to take advantage of it. They are certainly
not what is wrong with the hobby.

The best way to promote the hobby is by providing a good example. The
best way to correct bad operating practice, is to demonstrate good
practice, and/or to not acknowledge bad practice. If the individuals
are extreme in their bad operations, report them to the FCC.

Making blanket condemnations about an entire group of people based on
a few examples is just wrong, period.

Do I think everybody on 75 phone is a LID? No!

The biggest enemy that this hobby faces today is the non acceptance of
new blood, simply because they did not have to do what "you did" to
get licensed. These people should not be shunned, generalized about,
or even/especially ignored on the air, but rather welcomed with a
friendly response.

We as individual amateurs should not be deciding who is and who is not
qualified to become a ham, beyond our right to make comments on
pending rule changes with the FCC. They passed their tests, good
enough for me. Got a problem with them, take it up with the FCC.


Having said that, IMHO, if anybody should not be in Amateur radio, it
is those who would exclude others from their "exclusive club", based
on their personal criteria of who is qualified.

Let it go people!

[KI4MSA]

Quote[/b] (W9CDL @ Dec. 16 2006,13:11)]The idea that the code was a "security buffer" is both wrong, and
quite frankly insulting to a great many hams, not just the "no coders".

As other have pointed out, a quick listen on 75 phone clearly
indicates that CW, even 13WPM never kept out any of the "Riff Raff".
I have heard some of the most foul language, racial/ethnic slurs, and
other non prime time antics down there. I've been hearing those
conversations for many years and long before the no code days.

No, the CW requirement, even if it were intended as a right of
passage, did not stop people from being people. Amateur radio is not
just people in electronics, it is people from all backgrounds and is a
cross section of the country.

To single out no-code operators as the root of all that is wrong with
Amateur radio is both incorrect and hurtful.

Leave the no coders alone, it is not like they created the law, and
they are within the law to take advantage of it. They are certainly
not what is wrong with the hobby.

The best way to promote the hobby is by providing a good example. The
best way to correct bad operating practice, is to demonstrate good
practice, and/or to not acknowledge bad practice. If the individuals
are extreme in their bad operations, report them to the FCC.

Making blanket condemnations about an entire group of people based on
a few examples is just wrong, period.

Do I think everybody on 75 phone is a LID? No!

The biggest enemy that this hobby faces today is the non acceptance of
new blood, simply because they did not have to do what "you did" to
get licensed. These people should not be shunned, generalized about,
or even/especially ignored on the air, but rather welcomed with a
friendly response.

We as individual amateurs should not be deciding who is and who is not
qualified to become a ham, beyond our right to make comments on
pending rule changes with the FCC. They passed their tests, good
enough for me. Got a problem with them, take it up with the FCC.


Having said that, IMHO, if anybody should not be in Amateur radio, it
is those who would exclude others from their "exclusive club", based
on their personal criteria of who is qualified.

Let it go people!
Thanks Christian!

73 & Merry Christmas

This NO-CODE Technician says:
... . . # -.-- .- # --- -. # .... ..-. #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[WA4RYW]

Quote[/b] (k8mhz @ Dec. 17 2006,12:58)]From another web site:

Quote[/b] ]"Many countries have still retained the Morse requirement for HF, and some countries continue to require a Morse qualification for HF operation by amateurs visiting from other countries," RAC advised in a recent bulletin.

Well, now that the US no longer has a Morse certification will the codeless Generals and Extras *not* be able to operate HF in those countries?

Does anyone know if the FCC is planning on retaining the Element 1 tests on an optional basis in order to accommodate US hams that want to be able to operate HF in countries that require a Morse certification?
When the US originally dumbed down the code in 2000, countries like Australia at the time still required 12 WPM, I believe, for Unlimited class privileges. What they did for someone in the US that applied for a reciprocal license was to allow you to prove being licensed before May 2000, or whenever it was, and assign the local class based on that information. I was Extra at the time I applied for mine, but I produced an old Advanced class license which was adequate to prove a tested 13 WPM proficiency necessary to get an Unlimited call which I still have; VK2IOS. I’m sure a similar system will be used if we have a reciprocal agreement. Of course, most of Europe is governed by the CEPT treaty, which would not present any obstacles.

[kb8nds]

To all the people who think people are going to memorize the questions just so they can pass the license test...I'd really like to meet someone who can memorize 486 (or however many questions are in the Tech pool) questions and answers, word for word and letter for letter.

[KB4YKJ]

Quote[/b] (KB2SFH @ Dec. 17 2006,09:57)]Quote[/b] (kg4ulp @ Dec. 17 2006,12:47)]The truth is, ham radio is a dying hobby. Removing the code requiement will have very little effect on the bands. If you are going to get new members into the hobby, you need to focus on young people... and most of them are used to crystal-clear instanteneous long-distance communication through the Internet and cell phones.
The real truth is ham radio is NOT a dying hobby and what will these young people who have all the new modern toys from mom and dad going to do with them when power goes out and communications go down? it's the ham radio ops that step up to the plate with teamwork to get communications through. sadly many of today's youth are so pampered they don't know what real teamwork is about, and up to us to show it to them.
And old guys like me who refuse to join ARRL and pay for all the now required training.

[k7nys]

Quote[/b] (k1lwi @ Dec. 16 2006,04:52)]THIS IS SAD DAY IN HAM RADIO WHAT NEXT DO WAY WITH WRITTEN EXAM TOO .JUST GIVE LIC WAY ANY ONE WANT IT http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif
PS JUST DUMMING DOWN OF THE HAMS http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif
Wow! That made the Extra look like a genius!....try spellcheck!

[KB4YKJ]

What I find 24 hours after the announcement is I am hearing more whinning on the 2 meter frequencies than I am on HF. If you old timers are so offended by the no coders why do you spend so much time on 2 meters where you know they all are?

[ka9ekg]

Wow:This tread will for sure break a record.The NCT that stated there were more Gen.and above that are leaving negative comments is WRONG.On going through all comments so far the NCT's out number the others by 78%.Back in the early 2000 they granfatherd the Tech+ into Gen.class lisc.Cause they had passed the element(CODE).I did it the hard way I passed my Gen.a week before at 13wpm.There was not such a cry and sob going on then.What I think gets to the others is how the GIMMIE crowrd is bragging abought this.Maybe it was our fault as parents that we raised a GIMMIE generation what I want now,I want now.I do not put myself over others that want to enjoy this HOBBY,yes HOBBY,but the rules are rules.You have that all the way in life....When I was in the service back in 1959 my outfit had to know the code,cause it was the matter of life and death.I have handled alot of traffic via CW on this past Katrina Hurricane,were other communications could not get through.Yes you have Echo Link(but you need power).We with the sunspots being high and HF communications being hard to copy(phone) use CW to get through on our morning Wx.reports for the NOAA.No CW will not be dead.As CW can be sent anywere in the HF band(your lisc.Novice,Gen,Adv,Extra allows)so dont think for a second that just because the FCC did away with the qualifications to become a ham that it is dead.I get a big kick out of all the NCT's that say man I know the code now but why bother.Well my friends you can memeorize all you want on the questions.But here is the BIG SHOCK,they have changed.So now you will have to put alot more effort into getting your GIMMIE.Do not worry only 50%of you will pass.The others that do take the time I will welcome into the HF fold.To the Gen&Extra that are crying(did you take the time to respond to this bill?)or did you think it would not pass?73s De.KA9EKG

[k7nys]

Quote[/b] (KG4ZQZ @ Dec. 16 2006,05:14)]Quote[/b] (Kc5fog @ Dec. 16 2006,05:17)]Look what happened with the no-code, everyone said 2 meters would turn to CB, well it didn't. So keep on serving up your steaming nuggets of crap, because guess what, no one is buying it including the FCC.
- you should try listening to some 2M repeaters down here in Florida... there's one right now with the largest reach in the area, that has a drunken, slurred rant for its broadcast ID - and no callsign ID is broadcast... it's more like a CB repeater... (folks in Pinellas, Pasco, and Hillsborough know the callsign)...
You said Florida.....enough said!

[kb9ygd]

I am not sure if dropping the cw requirment will help amateur radios dwindling numbers.I am sure that there are many amateurs who look at cw as worthless without even giving the mode a chance & dont even give it a 2nd thought.As with anything in life i am of the opinion that a person should earn whatever he/she gets & ham radio is no exception.I am also of the opinion that dedicated hams do cw,keep detailed logbooks & qsl 100% and that there should be some machanism in place in the tests that insure that we dont populate our ranks with those that are unfit to be an amateur radio operator or to lazy and want something just handed to them without any effort at all on their part.73,de kb9ygdMy Webpage (http://mysite.verizon.net/res868sp/thetriantafilosfamily/index.html)

[KC8VWM]

Quote[/b] (K4JF @ Dec. 17 2006,09:30)]"An academic degree is a final conclusion to learning."

Just about as WRONG as one can be. #When you got that degree it was at a "commencement", which is a synonym for "beginning".

I've learned far more about business after earning my Masters than I did while earning it. #And just about anyone with some experience in the real world will concur.

And by the way, every decent educational institution requires you to learn some things you have no intention of using. #So that particular argument against CW doesn't wash.
I think this is quickly becoming an exercise in semantics.

An academic degree is received "after" you have met all the necessary requirements for demonstrating knowledge and practical experience pertaining to the subject of study. Hence the term, "conclusion" is used. You have graduated, you have reach a conclusion in an academic #learning process. etc..etc..etc..

While it is true that once you have received that degree you are now able to take that knowledge to practice your academic training out into the real world, (commencement comes to mind) I agree that this commencement is not considered as the final conclusion involving a persons career.

I stated earlier that a ham radio ticket is only the starting point in the learning process. This means when a person memorizes and regurgitates the answers to #written test, it's really not much of a reflection of a persons overall practical experience, knowledge or operating skill. #

Receiving an academic degree on the other hand places that same individual at a much diferent concluding point of the learning process as far as learning is concerned. That is what receiving an academic degree is supposed to reflect. It reflects the idea that you have worked and achieved a certain level of education in that field of study.

On the other hand, to suggest that a person who holds a certain class of ham radio license has equally achieved a level of education in that field of study, and to equate that fact into the idea that this person may actually know something about that subject is seriously flawed because the testing process we have in place only places that individual at the starting point of the overall learning process in comparison. In fact a person can obtain a ham radio license without ever owning or practically demonstrating how one may actually be used.

Unlike receiving an academic degree, they have not achieved any ongoing prior testing, hands on practical experience nor have they demonstrated any on the air experience prior to receiving that level of license class.

This is why I feel these are quite different plateau's of achievement in comparison with one another and why an amateur radio license is only considered as the starting point and not the final conclusion in the learning process.

Does that clear things up?

73

[kb8nds]

Quote[/b] (w2hld @ Dec. 16 2006,05:36)]Good for the FCC... they can do less work
Good for the equipment manufacturer.. Sell more radios..
Good for the "entitlement" class of people... they get something for almost nothing..
BAD for those who worked hard for the privilege of being a part of this hobby.. and now having their efforts and license diluted with the right of passage but a few pages of questions memorized.
A few?http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif Try about 120. See my above post.

[KB2SFH]

I wonder if it really ever occured to anyone what the real reason might be that the fcc dropped the code?

My hunch is that they really want to get everyone on the hf bands with the intention of once again trying to sell our vhf-uhf to commercial interests, just some food for thought here.

[k7nys]

Quote[/b] (na4it @ Dec. 16 2006,07:00)]R.I.P.
'nuff said about that too....everything will die eventually.

[WA4RYW]

Quote[/b] (kb8nds @ Dec. 17 2006,13:53)]Quote[/b] (w2hld @ Dec. 16 2006,05:36)]Good for the FCC... they can do less work
Good for the equipment manufacturer.. Sell more radios..
Good for the "entitlement" class of people... they get something for almost nothing..
BAD for those who worked hard for the privilege of being a part of this hobby.. and now having their efforts and license diluted with the right of passage but a few pages of questions memorized.
A few?http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif #Try about 120. #See my above post.
It happens, and it happens frequently. My wife passed her exams by memorizing the pool, and she's semi-proficient in battery-changing with two and three cell flashlights. She wouldn't have the slightest idea describing Ohm's law or a Wheatstone bridge.

[KC8VWM]

The above comment futher demostrates a license is only the starting point.

[KB4YKJ]

QUOTING RILEY HOLLINGSWORTH:

“Stupid Filter”
Hollingsworth acknowledged that “certain problem operators” remain, but
the real troublemakers are rarely the newcomers to Amateur Radio. “If there’s
a downfall in Amateur Radio, it won’t be caused by no-code Technicians or
codeless anything else,” he said. “It’ll be caused by the microphone--no doubt
in my mind.”

This forum seems to be a pretty good indicator of that.

[n0klu]

Quote[/b] (n3jja @ Dec. 17 2006,16:36)]Quote[/b] (n0klu @ Dec. 17 2006,01:06)]The irony is that we all saw the "handwriting on the wall" several years ago with the 03 decision...
Uh.... some of us saw that handwriting with the 2000 restructuring. #It just took the rest of you a little longer. #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif # http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif
You have a point. Of course 2000 was before I got into ARS so I missed that "sign" sorry.

[kb8nds]

Quote[/b] (wd5jnc @ Dec. 16 2006,07:50)]Well looks like it has started. I always thought you used a calling frequency to make contact and then move off to a clear freq. so some one else could use the Calling frequency. Well Not not on 146.52 seems the "boys" (read No code techs.) are on there talking about getting thier HF antennas up and what radios and amps they are going buy. funny i only heard one call sign in the bunch in the last 20 minutes. Looks like it hasnt taken long for ham radio to go down the tubes. Any good buddies out there want a entire station cheap? http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif
What'cha got?

[k7nys]

Quote[/b] (wa4eho @ Dec. 16 2006,08:23)]10-4 I copy that good buddy, but I don't like it. Just one more thing to convert Ham Radio to chicken band radio. My perposal is since they've done away with the code good buddies, then they should make it against the law to post the Q&A. There has to be some incentive to want to be a ham and now they have taken that away. I've heard some Extras on the air that don't even know the color code of a resistor. What does that tell me? Well, sorry good buddies but contrary to what a lot of you may think, this is the beginning of the end to Ham Radio as it was intended by the founding fathers.
So, there you have it trucker buddy. Does anybody know where I can buy an echo box for my base rig??
Lay off the truckers....I drive a truck and I don't even own a CB.

[n0klu]

Quote[/b] (KB2SFH @ Dec. 17 2006,18:56)]I wonder if it really ever occured to anyone what the real reason might be that the fcc dropped the code?

My hunch is that they really want to get everyone on the hf bands with the intention of once again trying to sell our vhf-uhf to commercial interests, just some food for thought here.
Great point! That is why we should still utilize every bit of spectrum we have. don't forsake the UHF/VHF for HF here in the middle USA 2m/70cm bands a re heavily used but 1.25m is almost totally unused. I expect that band to be the first to go.

[w1buz]

Quote (ab5st @ Dec. 16 2006,19:58)

Well I gues I will forget morse and start learning cb 10 codes. Should I install a roger beep in my ic 718? # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # ## # # # # # # # # # # # # # # #
Yep you and all other selfish hams like you probably ought to find another hobby if all of you are so selfish and discontent with what has happened and you are tired of change, sell me your ham gear for 10 bucks, leave out the roger beep in 718, take it with you to 11 meter, I will pay for the shipping on your gear. #I passed elements 1,2,3,4 #and I am not being so selfish and saying just because I took and passed all elements that everyone else has to . I did what was required of me at that time , and at this time soon to be others will do what is required of them and if they upgrade all the way up to no code extra they will be just as much an extra as myself and all others regardless of what anyone thinks, so all of you saying 10-4 good buddy which some of you are obviously very familiar with and all this other cb slang, ( HIT THE ROAD ). ham radio dont need your selfishness. If you dont want to help the new hams and the ones that upgrade, there are lots of folks waiting for you to sell your gear cheap , which it should sell cheap because as lots of folks here have already said that it is a sad day and that ham radio dont mean that much to them anymore. (HIT THE ROAD ) the no code techs did not make the changes the FCC did, as for all of you no code techs or anyone I can help just e-mail me and I will gladly help any way that I can , #God bless you all even the selfish folks and Merry Christmas, #73

[k7nys]

Quote[/b] (Guest @ Dec. 16 2006,08:58)]Quote[/b] (KB2SFH @ Dec. 16 2006,03:20)]Quote[/b] (kc2jga @ Dec. 16 2006,10:02)]I have to say, I am very DISGUSTED at the admins of this forum for allowing some of these posts to go on.

For those that have an EXTREME negative attitude about this new change, why don't you go and put your radio where the sun does not shine.

If others can say it, why not, maybe I can get away with it. OF's! GO XXXX YOURSELVES!!
Your post and CB trucker mouth offends me and you are a disgrace to the hobby if you go on the air with that mouth. My only prayer for you is to stay off repeaters i frequent, and that I never encounter you by unfortunate chance on any other repeater.
For those I may have offended with my "CB trucker" mouth, I apologize. But I am not apologizing to the ones that have a negative attitude towards this change.

KB2SFH, I do NOT use, nor intend to use language like that on the air. Just so you know.

Just like radio's, if you don't like what you hear, or see... you can always do this click the little X in the upper right hand corner.
Try apologizing to the truckers whlo do not own or use cb.


If you bought it, a trucker bought it. and we're not all foul mouthed!!

[WA4RYW]

Quote[/b] (kc8vwm @ Dec. 17 2006,14:10)]The above comment futher demostrates a license is only the starting point.
Absolutely. That's what the Novice license was all about. And as one advanced their skill set and operational proficiency, they advanced in license class and privilege. The Novice license was very basic; 5 WPM characters only, and a very basic rules and regs exam. It seems like I had to identify a schematic symbol or two as well. The General (exact same exam as the Technician) was more technical and covered subject matter at a deeper level. At the time I got my FCC Radiotelephone, the Advanced class exam was very much on par with the Radiotelephone license technically, and was very through and detailed, although it was slightly dated material for the time. The Extra was at that time mostly about the code, but the written element covered advanced and specialized communications modes such as satellite modes and techniques, digital and fast/slow scan video modes. These technologies were difficult and complicated to implement in 1974. The idea was that by the time you graduated to Extra, you were a well-rounded and well-exposed member of the service. Some graduated faster, some slower, some used the Bash method (early W5YI tactics to beat the system), but the great majority followed a path of steady progress. But just because one achieves the top level certificate in the service doesn't mean the education stops. Technologies change almost daily (unless it's RF, then maybe a little slower), and one may choose to be an antenna enthusiast for years, then change interests toward integration and interfacing. There are thousands of things one can do as an amateur, and surprisingly enough, 99% of those are done above 30Mhz with a Technician’s ticket. HF is a very small part of #the available options, but it’s also the smallest allocation we have. The 220 Mhz band that we so casually ignore and will soon loose to commercial interests is almost as large as our entire allocation below 30 Mhz.

[kc0ybg]

The more and more I read about the concerns of the NCT the more I see two distinct groups from the code forever camp. The first group sees people that know code as the only people that know anything about following rules and discipline. They also seem to think that us no code techies run around 2 meters and 70 centimeters with complete disregard for others and have absolutely no manners. Well here is a news flash. Some of the rudest operators I have met in my travels are the general and extra class that act like they belong to some secret club because they know code. Yes being a code operator is a very very good thing but it is not the measure of ones existance. The other group from what I have seen have this view of how things were and that they would like to see the traditions they have grown up with stay. I personally don't hold that against them. However, times do eventually change and we need to learn to except them. As I mentioned in an earlier posting, code is a useful tool. I am not looking forward to it dissappearing into the dust of history. What I want to see is equal footing for all involved. And for all of you "old timers" worried about new operators not following the rules, why not take these new people under your wings and mentor them instead of crying about how they do their own thing so to speak?

[W5TJZ]

Does the ARRL really have the best interests of Hams at heart? Or is the love of money their primary concern ? A non-profit organization? Yeah right. They give all of those ads away to manufacturers, yeah right. More Hams, more ads, ala Madison Avenue marketing strategy. They can manipulate their proposals to their advantage, not necessarily for the good of Ham radio, but rather, "will it make more money for us ?" Its a Fairy Tale to believe they do it for the betterment of Ham radio. They are a commercial enterprise at this point.

[k4hb]

Certainly a sad day for amateur radio. That little bald-headed beady-eyed fellow at No Code International (W5YI) must still be rejoicing about this decision. After all, it's all about money. Now there will be more exams and more hams. This equates to...

Mo money for W5YI (Mr. NCI)
Mo money for Icom, Kenwood, Yaesu, etc.

Wouldn't be surprised to learn that money changed hands to influence this decision by the FCC.

73, Hal K4HB
http://www.k4hb.com
http://www.Hi-TechRedneck.com
http://www.k4hb.com/postage.html
(\____/)
/ ¤ _ ¤ \
( (oo) )
\-..~~.-/

[n1zle]

Quote[/b] (WA4RYW @ Dec. 16 2006,23:17)]Quote[/b] (KC2QHE @ Dec. 17 2006,00:53)]i just can't believe some of the posts. many a long nights here have been spent on the cb radio. right now in fact, speaking on sideband, with some of my locals, and yes, most of us have our tickets, but there are close friends on the radio who don't have their tickets. should we dismiss these people as friends?

KC2QHE

-HAM RADIO OPERATOR, AND DAMN PROUD OF IT-
73'S
The critical question you didn't address in your post is; are you talking on sideband on a legal crystal-controlled channel, or are you breaking the law and using ham gear, or even out of the allocated citizens-band frequency spectrum? That's the difference that I believe most object to. If you aren't using a crystal controlled radio type accepted for citizens band radio service and compliant with part 95, with 3.5 watts out and within the 40 channels, then you are a criminal breaking the law. That's not what we want for recruits. If you ARE meeting the law, then ham radio is for you. Welcome.
Breaker 19, how about it ham radio land??
CB part 95 (http://a257.g.akamaitech.net/7/257/2422/09nov20051500/edocket.access.gpo.gov/cfr_2005/octqtr/47cfr95.410.htm)

"Recruits" may notice that as per part 95, CB is allowed 4 watts am, 12 watts ssb.

Seems to me that the internet "killed" ham radio, not the removal of the cw testing requirement.

I'm sure that the "top three" Yaesu, Icom, and Kenwood will continue to offer new models with CW on the mode switch for many yrs to come. Supply and demand would indicate that they will profit from this rule change, with all the "cb" operators impinging upon the almighty HF spectrum.........

Good thing the FCC doesn't include a typing test to get our beloved licenses. I for one am happy to see the test go.

"thanks for the break"
73

stock up
load up
stand by

[k7nys]

Quote[/b] (n9ltv @ Dec. 16 2006,09:57)]WOW. The people who are against this are just SO negative. Hopefully, they'll make good on their threats to get out of the hobby, etc. Maybe ham radio will be better off without those kind of attitudes. Lets face it, we've all run across people like that on the air and they're just jerks. Listen, I work CW 90 percent of the time. I also work PSK and SSTV, but I didn't have to pass a test to work those modes. So it seems kinda stupid to make people pass a CW test. A written test is still required, so I do think any new operator will be serious about the hobby. The demise of ham radio is not at hand. Only the demise of close minded people who just can't accept the fact that the world is a changing place.
Well said!

[KB3LIX]

I really enjoy watching a group of
intelligent
articulate
mild-mannered
level headed
educated
fun loving
helpful

individuals get together and discuss a topic
near and dear to their hearts in a gentle and caring way.

SARCASM OFF

I see the feces slinging match is still in full swing.........
I had to check.

The next truck load of crap has just arrived.
Please get your refills and resume the foray.

Too bad amateurs don't fit into the adjectives listed above. I've known hams for over 40 years, and they had those qualities in the past, but those qualities have dissappeared.

That's the most sad thing demonstrated here.

It has nothing to do with the elimination of a #testing requirement, it has to do with the gross loss of dignity, respect for others, and self respect.

That loss is what will kill amateur radio in the long run. Not a bunch of new operators with out morse code proficiency, the loss of respect and the spewing of blatent hatred.

Let the games continue. # http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif

[K8MHZ]

Quote[/b] ]To all the people who think people are going to memorize the questions just so they can pass the license test...I'd really like to meet someone who can memorize 486 (or however many questions are in the Tech pool) questions and answers, word for word and letter for letter.


You only have to memorize a majority of them. A passing grade can be had by getting only 26 questions correct. Also, many questions are just re-stated in a different way to make a new question.

Word for word, letter for letter is also not needed as the test is multiple guess. Some of the answers are so obvious the question is not even needed to be read to get the answer correct.

It is a matter of opinion as to whether the tests are too hard or too easy. Personally, I do NOT think the Tech test should be so easy it can be taught and passed in a single day. It seems to be the consensus of many that the written tests are way easier than the Morse test so much so that many won't even attempt to study Morse Code.

I have already heard that many NCT's are now studying for their General written exams that have not done so due to the Morse requirement.

Best of luck to them all.

[KC8VWM]

Quote[/b] (k7nys @ Dec. 17 2006,12:51)]Quote[/b] (n9ltv @ Dec. 16 2006,09:57)]WOW. The people who are against this are just SO negative. #Hopefully, they'll make good on their threats to get out of the hobby, etc. #Maybe ham radio will be better off without those kind of attitudes. #Lets face it, we've all run across people like that on the air and they're just jerks. #Listen, I work CW 90 percent of the time. #I also work PSK and SSTV, but I didn't have to pass a test to work those modes. #So it seems kinda stupid to make people pass a CW test. #A written test is still required, so I do think any new operator will be serious about the hobby. #The demise of ham radio is not at hand. #Only the demise of close minded people who just can't accept the fact that the world is a changing place.
Well said!
The so called "demise" of amateur radio has been occurring long before they decided to drop a CW test.

Let's consider that current testing only demonstrates that we can memorize and regurgitate answers to questions.

Learning and using CW doesn't exactly demonstrate
we are any more technically proficient either.

What amazes me are the many people who learned and passed a CW test, but yet I find it amazing that these same individuals have no technical knowledge to speak of.

You know what I mean. These are the individuals you talk to on the air about very basic electronic circuits or theory and they have absolutely no idea what your talking about.

I found out many times and concluded by talking with these individuals that passing a CW test doesn't necessarily mean they understand how a full wave rectifier works in a power supply, they know the difference between an PNP and NPN transistor, how TOA works when using an NVIS antenna, how a DPST switch functions, how to measure basic circuits using a VOM, or how to program a PL tone into their radio.

Advancing amateur radio should include the idea of advancing our **technical proficiency** and not just the idea of babbling about your favorite rifle used for deer hunting into the backside of a microphone every Saturday night. That's just "CB'ish" in my opinion and who are we really kidding when that fact has already been going on for ma