December 15th Band-Warming Party

[g4tut]

December 15th band-warming party

Vintage radio hobbyists in the United States will celebrate the federal goverment's expansion of the 75 meter phone band with a 'bandwarming' party from 3600-3800Kc starting at 0500 GMT Dec. 15, 2006.

The festivities are slated to begin Thursday evening December 14th, when vintage radio enthusiasts in Canada will gather around several frequencies between 3700-3800, where they already enjoy phone privileges.

The Federal Communications Commission, as part of a decision to enlarge and more closely match the size of the 75 meter phone band with levels of activity, has specified enactment at midnight, Eastern time.

A number of U.S. stations have been granted the use of Special Event 1x1 Call Signs to help commemorate the regulatory upgrade.

By coincidence, December 2006 marks 100 years since radio pioneer experimenter Reginald Fesseden's celebrated Amplitude Modulation broadcasts, considered by many to be the first voice and music signals to be heard by the public audience for wireless.

The 'bandwarming' of 2006 will again feature the AM mode, as vintage radio enthusiasts warm up their vacuum tube gear on a December night a century later.


For more information:
http://amfone.net


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[n5pjy]

http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif Don't move too fast to the dial that night. The ARRL has already petitioned the FCC to reconsider the bandplan for 75 meters due to digital and CW privileges for the General and higher license classes.. They are petitioning the voice portion to start at 3.635 mhz. Looks like they would have considered that before all of this other hooplah started. Sounds like someone can't make up their mind, doesn't it. Or they don't know what they are doing. You can get the details of all places (what a suprise) at http://www.arrl.org/

[KB4YKJ]

We are talking ARRL what else can you expect?

[ac3p]

Regardless of what the ARRL wants, the FCC rules are the rules until they (FCC) say otherwise.

It will probably take another NPRM before anything changes and we know how fast those things are processed.

[n0jaa]

Why couldn't ARRL petition that BEFORE they petitioned the band changes?? ARRL's brain must be in neutral!

[N8OHU]

Does anyone know what the ARRL proposed during the comments phase?

[N1BHH]

I bet the reason for this big reversal from the ARRL is because they are being inundated by all kinds on hams calling them, who operate CW who don't want to move their net. I say to those, you don't have to move your net, just keep it where it is. CW is authorized on all of the frequencies that phone priviledges are expanding into. Besides CW doesn't take up as much bandwidth as phone anyway, so I say the trade-off is sweet for the phone operators. The best thing these CW net hams can do is to shift your net to the new exclusivity below where the phone band will move to. What is so hard about that? Oh I bet they got a number of telephone calls and emails complaining that their RTTY activities have to move, too.

Come on, let's try to see the good about this, maybe when you get on the phone portion and want to talk with your buddies, you won't have to fight against the nit-wits who insist that 2 kilohertz spacing is fine by them. Gosh, the last time I knew a single sideband signal bandwidth was somewhere around 2.8 kilohertz. Isn't that interesting? Or is it that they all have the new super rigs that allow all kinds of filtering so you can operate right on top of someone else's frequency? I'm hoping the added bandwidth will give everybody some more elbow room so people aren't annoying each other so much. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif

Let's enjoy this hobby!

[kb5elv]

Jeez...did anyone actually bother to read the new rules and the FCC's
filing document before doing the traditional (and fashionable) let's
pile on the ARRL, because they're a bunch of idiots who don't
represent anyone but themselves and are pretty useless besides
bandwagon? If you'd bothered to read the FCC's document, you'd know
that the original proposal by the ARRL requesting the so-called band
refarming requested the phone band start at 3700, not 3600, presumably
to accommodate existing digital users and ensure that no one loses
privileges and all that. The FCC, on its own, decided the phone band
needed to be even bigger; bigger even than anyone proposed (i.e. some
proposals asked for the lower edge of the phone band to be at
3650). Seems to me that the ARRL's actually trying to ensure
everyone's accommodated here. Of course, one might ask why it took
them so long to file. This must have been something in the works,
because before it was even published in the Federal REgister, the ARRL
noted some inconsistencies and net loss of privileges for General and
Advanced licensees.

So...while you've got the right to pile on the ARRL and take them to
task if you so desire, it might be a good idea to actually have your
facts in order first.

BTW, while it's a good point that we can operate cw anywhere, the same
isn't true of the automatic digital modes that the ARRL is asking to
be accommodated.

Vy 73, de KB5ELV (a cw op, ARRL member, and proud ham)

[N8OHU]

Thanks, what you've said is pretty much what I thought.

[k2ors]

Quote[/b] (n5pjy @ Dec. 12 2006,11:22)]http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif Don't move too fast to the dial that night. The ARRL has already petitioned the FCC to reconsider the bandplan for 75 meters due to digital and CW privileges for the General and higher license classes.. They are petitioning the voice portion to start at 3.635 mhz.

The bandwarming as I understand it is for phone operation between 3700-3800. Even if the FCC grants the ARRL petition to start voice at 3635, the bandwarming between 3700-3800 can go on!
73 Warren K2ORS
WD2XGJ
WD2XSH/23 http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif

[w2pl]

Quote[/b] (N1BHH @ Dec. 12 2006,15:21)]I say to those, you don't have to move your net, just keep it where it is. CW is authorized on all of the frequencies that phone priviledges are expanding into. Besides CW doesn't take up as much bandwidth as phone anyway, so I say the trade-off is sweet for the phone operators. The best thing these CW net hams can do is to shift your net to the new exclusivity below where the phone band will move to. What is so hard about that?
Quote[/b] ] say to those, you don't have to move your net, just keep it where it is. CW is authorized on all of the frequencies that phone priviledges are expanding into. Besides CW doesn't take up as much bandwidth as phone anyway, so I say the trade-off is sweet for the phone operators. The best thing these CW net hams can do is to shift your net to the new exclusivity below where the phone band will move to. What is so hard about that?

Clyde,
Before you get too happy, you don't have that entirely right. You can operate CW everywhere IF YOU HAVE THE RIGHT CLASS LICENSE. I see you are a General class, right NOW you can operate CW from 3600 to 3750, but after Friday YOU can't go there (in fact you can't go from 3600 to 3800 kHZ -- You LOST 150kHZ of spectrum) for phone, SSB OR CW. That is one of the BIG problems.

73,
Phil

[K4JF]

Sad, really sad.

[KC2PFV]

Quote[/b] (w2pl @ Dec. 12 2006,18:46)]Quote[/b] (N1BHH @ Dec. 12 2006,15:21)]I say to those, you don't have to move your net, just keep it where it is. CW is authorized on all of the frequencies that phone priviledges are expanding into. Besides CW doesn't take up as much bandwidth as phone anyway, so I say the trade-off is sweet for the phone operators. The best thing these CW net hams can do is to shift your net to the new exclusivity below where the phone band will move to. What is so hard about that?
Quote[/b] ] say to those, you don't have to move your net, just keep it where it is. CW is authorized on all of the frequencies that phone privileges are expanding into. Besides CW doesn't take up as much bandwidth as phone anyway, so I say the trade-off is sweet for the phone operators. The best thing these CW net hams can do is to shift your net to the new exclusivity below where the phone band will move to. What is so hard about that?

Clyde,
Before you get too happy, you don't have that entirely right. You can operate CW everywhere IF YOU HAVE THE RIGHT CLASS LICENSE. I see you are a General class, right NOW you can operate CW from 3600 to 3750, but after Friday YOU can't go there (in fact you can't go from 3600 to 3800 kHZ -- You LOST 150kHZ of spectrum) for phone, SSB OR CW. That is one of the BIG problems.

73,
Phil
Well, yes that is a loss of 50khz. For hams who mainly use SSB, the new bandplan is a plus. For hams who operate CW and are Generals, it is a major loss. The only thing they are going to have to do is hit the books and pass the Extra test.

In a way, it isn't the end of the world. We lost spectrum, as Generals, but it will hopefully bring in more skilled ops. Hopefully they don't drop the 5 WPM code test. In my honest opinion, the majority of the bands should have SSB allowed. The majority of ops. use SSB, therefore it only makes sense to "open" it up a little for them. For those ops. who use CW, don't forget you can operate anywhere within the legal spectrum allowed to you. Yes, you lose spectrum if you are a General, but just upgrade and you'll gain it back.

I guess I can say I'm lucky that I only upgraded on November 15th, one month to the day before the "restructuring." I wouldn't mind a little more phone bandwidth since that is where I will probably be operating besides PSK31 once I get this RF problem in my shack solved. Hopefully soon. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

Before you all pounce on me, I didn't forget my promise to speed up on CW and start operating that mode also. I "practice" my code a little each day just sending random text to myself as fast as I can. Does it work? I don't know. But I'm very comfortable with it now, and I plan on getting on the airwaves using CW after the New Year. CW is a great mode, it just requires thorough preparation prior to using it.

73 de TOM KC2PFV

[K4JF]

Quote[/b] (N1BHH @ Dec. 11 2006,16:21)]CW is authorized on all of the frequencies that phone priviledges are expanding into.
Yes, it is authorized. But you are doing a GRAVE disservice to your fellow CW ops if you go there with CW.

Stay in the recognized and authorized frequencies, guys. We have lost enough already.

[WB4FDT]

Ah yes...nothing like taking frequencies from efficient communications systems like cw whose signals take up virtually no bandspace, and giving it to inefficient SSB'ers and the AM crowd whose signals are 3-10 KHZ wide. Doesn't sound like technological progress to me...Pip wb4fdt

[N5FOG]

Quote[/b] (WB4FDT @ Dec. 12 2006,00:19)]Ah yes...nothing like taking frequencies from efficient communications systems like cw whose signals take up virtually no bandspace, and giving it to inefficient SSB'ers and the AM crowd whose signals are 3-10 KHZ wide. Doesn't sound like technological progress to me...Pip wb4fdt

Well since CW is so efficient and needs so little band space, the cw ops won't miss the part of the spectrum they lost. Expanding the voice potions of the band makes very good logic when you consider that voice operations are the majority of the communications on HF. IF the cw hounds would have kept allot of CW activity on that portion of the band the FCC probably wouldn’t have re-allocated it to voice. If a study shows that a portion of spectrum is underutilized with its current assignment its use will be reassigned that’s just a fact.

This is no different than when we lost part of the 220mhz band due to lack of activity. If a ham wants to justify keeping hold of a certain piece of spectrum or a certain mode assigned to that spectrum then they should show justification, be means of activity. And having a 30 min CW net a 2-3 times a week isn’t justification to “own” a frequency. If having a weekly CW is truly the goal, plenty of frequencies could be shared, but the only problem is the egos wouldn’t allow it.


I’m sure I’m going to get blasted about being a “no-code” but I do monitor the CW portions of several HF bands. Yes I do use my computer to decode most but I’m trying to lean and no better way to lean than by listening to CW QSO’s


ERIC KC5FOG

[K4SFC]

Ahhhh yes, the race is on....to fill up the new frequency allocation with claim jumpers. S.O.S., different frequencies. Within a week there will be a "Frequency Guard" just waiting to say; "yes, the frequency is in use" even when it is not. On all the new allocation.

[WA3KYY]

Quote[/b] (N8OHU @ Dec. 12 2006,16:33)]Does anyone know what the ARRL proposed during the comments phase?
The FCC greatly expanded the 75M Phone/image portion beyond what was in the ARRL original petition (3.675 if I recall correctly). The NPRM had no hint that 75M expansion was going to be this large. It caught the ARRL and everyone else by surprise.

Unfortunately, it seems they only want to get back the automatic control subband which will not do much at all to relieve the congestion in the remainder of the CW/RTTY/data segment.

Mike WA3KYY

[WA3KYY]

Quote[/b] (N1BHH @ Dec. 12 2006,17:21)]I bet the reason for this big reversal from the ARRL is because they are being inundated by all kinds on hams calling them, who operate CW who don't want to move their net. I say to those, you don't have to move your net, just keep it where it is. CW is authorized on all of the frequencies that phone priviledges are expanding into. Besides CW doesn't take up as much bandwidth as phone anyway, so I say the trade-off is sweet for the phone operators. The best thing these CW net hams can do is to shift your net to the new exclusivity below where the phone band will move to. What is so hard about that? Oh I bet they got a number of telephone calls and emails complaining that their RTTY activities have to move, too.

!
Generals and advanced have NO access of any kind in the segment 3.6 -3.7 MHz which is where bulk of the displaced CW nets operate. The nets would lose most of their members if they continued to operate in that segment. Only Extra class is authorized to use those frequencies.

Mike WA3KYY

[wa3vjb]

This latest shift for underclass licensees who won't be able to stay in the revised frequency zones on 75 meters reminds me of what happened to Novice Class licensees.

Once Upon A Time, 3700-3750kc was the Novice sub-band, if I remember correctly, and this was during a substantial amount of Novice/CW activity.

Remind me, but wasn't there a sub-band shift in the 1970s that was accompanied by the newly-authorized use of VFOs for Novice licensees instead of being limited to crystal control?

Today we do not have to address such a practical constraint against any license class. Turn the damn knob and relocate. It is NOT a big deal. Part of emergency preparedness, which I presume is the basis of the disgruntled traffic nets, is understanding the tactic of frequency agility when needed.

And yes, to answer Pip's concerns posted here, the FCC, in the Rules taking effect Dec. 15, has been receptive to the predominant use of phone modes. The agency has reapportioned three HF bands appropriately.

Ahead of the FCC's decision and during several Public Comment intervals, the CW lobby was unable to substantiate why we should continue full-time, mandatory protection for the vast zones they held for, what, 50 years or so ?

I submit that the word "efficiency" applies to the fact we will now see signals in those portions of the bands rather than space reserved for operators who seldom showed up.

Paul/VJB

[w8cbc]

The ARRL's choice of 3635 kc looks rather blatantly to me as though they're only doing it for the winlinkers. If they'd asked for 3650 or 3675 as the dividing line I would be more inclined to support it.

Anyway. If I'm up that late, I'll warm up the Apache.

[W0FS]

Here is another case where the ARRL bashers couldn't wait to pile on and blame them for changing their minds, when they don't seem to know what the ARRL proposed in the first place. I think this says something about the credibility of some of the usual troll posters on these threads.
I agree 100% with the petition to reconsider. The FCC made an ill-advised change of their own. I operate mostly phone on 75/80M and can usually find open spots in the 25 khz exclusive allocation we extras have now. But 100 khz? Idiotic. The FCC needs to let some of the lawyers and other word spinners go and get some expertise back on their staff. Just my 2 cents worth.
Clay, #WØFS

[wa3vjb]

Clay the group in Newington failed to keep up with how much sentiment there is to reapportion the phone bands, and the ARRL "proposal" was trumped by people who are less spineless in calling for change.

The FCC has responded in a more progressive manner to this sentiment, and the Report and Order now suitably goes well beyond the pitches Rinaldo, Sumner and a few others at the League made years ago.

Paul/VJB

[AF9J]

Quote[/b] (wa3vjb @ Dec. 13 2006,07:28)]Once Upon A Time, 3700-3750kc was the Novice sub-band, if I remember correctly, and this was during a substantial amount of Novice/CW activity. #

Remind me, but wasn't there a sub-band shift in the 1970s that was accompanied by the newly-authorized use of VFOs for Novice licensees instead of being limited to crystal control?

Paul/VJB
Hi Paul,

Yes that was true. #I got my Novice license in 1978 (but due to a lack of funds, and parental prohibition, didn't get on the air until 1982). #Until about 1983 or 84, Novices had 3700-3750 as their allocation, with 250W output power & VFO control allowed . #After that time, the 80m Novice band was changed to 3675-3725 kHz.

73,
Ellen - AF9J

[WD8AQS]

Quote[/b] (k2ors @ Dec. 12 2006,17:12)]Quote[/b] (n5pjy @ Dec. 12 2006,11:22)]http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif Don't move too fast to the dial that night. The ARRL has already petitioned the FCC to reconsider the bandplan for 75 meters due to digital and CW privileges for the General and higher license classes.. They are petitioning the voice portion to start at 3.635 mhz.

The bandwarming as I understand it is for phone operation between 3700-3800. Even if the FCC grants the ARRL petition to start voice at 3635, the bandwarming between 3700-3800 can go on!
73 Warren K2ORS
WD2XGJ
WD2XSH/23 http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif
Now, don't forget to read the fine print "No Generals Allowed!" http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif

Just Kidding, generals can still listen, so fire up them there receivers and join the fun! http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

[n0jaa]

I wonder if I can get on there with my measely 25 watts of AM...

[kr4ey]

Quote[/b] (K4JF @ Dec. 12 2006,21:06)]Quote[/b] (N1BHH @ Dec. 11 2006,16:21)]CW is authorized on all of the frequencies that phone priviledges are expanding into.
Yes, it is authorized. #But you are doing a GRAVE disservice to your fellow CW ops if you go there with CW.

Stay in the recognized and authorized frequencies, guys. #We have lost enough already.
Yes it is Authorized. CW, Phone, Image

Extra - 3600-4000 -CW,Phone, Image
Advanced - 3700-4000 - CW, Phone, Image
General - 3800-4000 -CW, Phone, Image

It is just not for Phone (SSB, AM). If there is a clear frequency between my band limits I will operate CW, Image!!!
Nobody OWNS a frequency it is for all of us too SHARE.
There are no FCC rules that say I can't operate CW within the Phone Band. As long as the frequency is not being used.
There is way way too much allocated on 80 Meters for Phone priviledges after December 15.
Do you think everybody is just going to operate Phone in those portions? I don't think so.

[wc4r]

Quote[/b] (N1BHH @ Dec. 12 2006,18:21)]I bet the reason for this big reversal from the ARRL is because they are being inundated by all kinds on hams calling them, who operate CW who don't want to move their net. I say to those, you don't have to move your net, just keep it where it is. CW is authorized on all of the frequencies that phone priviledges are expanding into. Besides CW doesn't take up as much bandwidth as phone anyway, so I say the trade-off is sweet for the phone operators. The best thing these CW net hams can do is to shift your net to the new exclusivity below where the phone band will move to. What is so hard about that? Oh I bet they got a number of telephone calls and emails complaining that their RTTY activities have to move, too.

Come on, let's try to see the good about this, maybe when you get on the phone portion and want to talk with your buddies, you won't have to fight against the nit-wits who insist that 2 kilohertz spacing is fine by them. Gosh, the last time I knew a single sideband signal bandwidth was somewhere around 2.8 kilohertz. Isn't that interesting? Or is it that they all have the new super rigs that allow all kinds of filtering so you can operate right on top of someone else's frequency? I'm hoping the added bandwidth will give everybody some more elbow room so people aren't annoying each other so much. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif

Let's enjoy this hobby!
Ditto.
Well said.
As a member, I wrote the ARRL and told them I did not support the petition and requested they withdraw it; whatever good that will do.

[wc4r]

Quote[/b] (w2pl @ Dec. 12 2006,21:46)]Quote[/b] (N1BHH @ Dec. 12 2006,15:21)]I say to those, you don't have to move your net, just keep it where it is. CW is authorized on all of the frequencies that phone priviledges are expanding into. Besides CW doesn't take up as much bandwidth as phone anyway, so I say the trade-off is sweet for the phone operators. The best thing these CW net hams can do is to shift your net to the new exclusivity below where the phone band will move to. What is so hard about that?
Quote[/b] ] say to those, you don't have to move your net, just keep it where it is. CW is authorized on all of the frequencies that phone priviledges are expanding into. Besides CW doesn't take up as much bandwidth as phone anyway, so I say the trade-off is sweet for the phone operators. The best thing these CW net hams can do is to shift your net to the new exclusivity below where the phone band will move to. What is so hard about that?

Clyde,
Before you get too happy, you don't have that entirely right. You can operate CW everywhere IF YOU HAVE THE RIGHT CLASS LICENSE. I see you are a General class, right NOW you can operate CW from 3600 to 3750, but after Friday YOU can't go there (in fact you can't go from 3600 to 3800 kHZ -- You LOST 150kHZ of spectrum) for phone, SSB OR CW. That is one of the BIG problems.

73,
Phil
If it's THAT important to you as a CW operator, then upgrade you license class. There's your incentive.

[n7ru]

Quote[/b] (kr4ey @ Dec. 13 2006,10:06)]Quote[/b] (K4JF @ Dec. 12 2006,21:06)]Quote[/b] (N1BHH @ Dec. 11 2006,16:21)]CW is authorized on all of the frequencies that phone priviledges are expanding into.
Yes, it is authorized. #But you are doing a GRAVE disservice to your fellow CW ops if you go there with CW.

Stay in the recognized and authorized frequencies, guys. #We have lost enough already.
Yes it is Authorized. CW, Phone, Image

Extra - 3600-4000 -CW,Phone, Image
Advanced - 3700-4000 - CW, Phone, Image
General - 3800-4000 -CW, Phone, Image

It is just not for Phone (SSB, AM). If there is a clear frequency between my band limits I will operate CW, Image!!!
Nobody OWNS a frequency it is for all of us too SHARE.
There are no FCC rules that say I can't operate CW within the Phone Band. As long as the frequency is not being used.
There is way way too much allocated on 80 Meters for Phone priviledges after December 15.
Do you think everybody is just going to operate Phone in those portions? I don't think so.
True statements! Amen!

[n7uqa]

You know I don't really see what the big deal is. As far as I'm concerned, the CW, RTTY and digital guys can stay right where they are. If anything the FCC could amend the expanded area to include digital, RTTY, CW, image and phone. Look at 160 meters, there are no sub bands and everyone seems to get along just fine; why not do the same thing with 3600 – 3750 kHz. I think the ARRL is making an mountain out of a mole hill on this one.


Craig - N7UQA

[k1rfd]

Quote[/b] (n7uqa @ Dec. 13 2006,14:35)]As far as I'm concerned, the CW, RTTY and digital guys can stay right where they are.
They cannot stay there unless they hold an Extra Class license, since Advanced and General are losing access to that band segment, regardless of mode.

One issue here is that there are a great many daily NTS CW nets that meet between 3600-3700. #Many of these nets actually use multiple frequencies to pass traffic, such as EAN. #In theory there is enough space below 3600 to accomodate them, but in practice the coordination of frequencies might be a challenge.

[n7uqa]

Quote[/b] (k1rfd @ Dec. 13 2006,12:15)]Quote[/b] (n7uqa @ Dec. 13 2006,14:35)]As far as I'm concerned, the CW, RTTY and digital guys can stay right where they are.
They cannot stay there unless they hold an Extra Class license, since Advanced and General are losing access to that band segment, regardless of mode.

One issue here is that there are a great many daily NTS CW nets that meet between 3600-3700. Many of these nets actually use multiple frequencies to pass traffic, such as EAN. In theory there is enough space below 3600 to accomodate them, but in practice the coordination of frequencies might be a challenge.
Ok, a slight oversight on my part. However I do believe the FCC should amend this ruling so these folks can stay where they are. I don't think the FCC purposely intended to alienate these folks, just like the J2D error I hope they fix this oversight as well.


Craig - N7UQA

[kr6dj]

Quote[/b] (K4JF @ Dec. 12 2006,21:06)]Quote[/b] (N1BHH @ Dec. 11 2006,16:21)]CW is authorized on all of the frequencies that phone priviledges are expanding into.
Yes, it is authorized. #But you are doing a GRAVE disservice to your fellow CW ops if you go there with CW.

Stay in the recognized and authorized frequencies, guys. #We have lost enough already.
[QUOTE]

A "grave" disservice? Please. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif #CW is allowed anywhere on the bands. #Any of us are authorized to operate CW in the CW/Phone areas within our licence class.

[KC9ECI]

Quote[/b] (kr6dj @ Dec. 13 2006,15:21)]A "grave" disservice? Please. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif #CW is allowed anywhere on the bands. #Any of us are authorized to operate CW in the CW/Phone areas within our licence class.
Unless that band happens to be 60M and then CW is not permitted.

[K3VR]

Leave it to ECI to be calm and logical when there's a fight brewin'!

http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[K8HUR]

Quote[/b] (n7uqa @ Dec. 13 2006,13:00)]Quote[/b] (k1rfd @ Dec. 13 2006,12:15)]Quote[/b] (n7uqa @ Dec. 13 2006,14:35)]As far as I'm concerned, the CW, RTTY and digital guys can stay right where they are.
They cannot stay there unless they hold an Extra Class license, since Advanced and General are losing access to that band segment, regardless of mode.

One issue here is that there are a great many daily NTS CW nets that meet between 3600-3700. #Many of these nets actually use multiple frequencies to pass traffic, such as EAN. #In theory there is enough space below 3600 to accomodate them, but in practice the coordination of frequencies might be a challenge.
Ok, a slight oversight on my part. However I do believe the FCC should amend this ruling so these folks can stay where they are. I don't think the FCC purposely intended to alienate these folks, just like the J2D error I hope they fix this oversight as well.


Craig - N7UQA
Wait a minute! Would somebody explain what he just said? Did I lose CW privelages in "Regardless of mode, Generals and Advanced will lose access to those frequencies"? I've been looking frantically for some chart on the ARRL site and the QRZ site to see how this affected the Advanced privelages. So would someone that knows please type this out and post it?

[K8HUR]

I just went into the FCC site and still can't find the (updated) band plan (for the various license classes) for the HF bands. So would someone that knows where to find it please copy and post it?

[kr4ey]

Quote[/b] (K8HUR @ Dec. 13 2006,21:13)]I just went into the FCC site and still can't find the (updated) band plan (for the various license classes) for the HF bands. So would someone that knows where to find it please copy and post it?
Here is the new bandplan from ARRL site.

http://www.arrl.org/announce/regulatory/wt04-140/Hambands3_color.pdf

You can find other details here.

http://ac6v.com/new.htm

EDIT: The author of the above site must think there will be ONLY SSB between 3600 and 4000. That will be hard for me to believe.

[K4JF]

Quote[/b] (wa3vjb @ Dec. 12 2006,08:28)]the CW lobby was unable to substantiate why we should continue full-time, mandatory protection for the vast zones they held for, what, 50 years or so ?
WHAT "vast zones"? CW was squeezed basically into the bottom 50 or 60 of each band while SSB has 150-200 and more! Who knows how much will be there once the data modes are forced down by SSB?

Check out the bands sometimes before making such ridiculous comments.

[K4JF]

Quote[/b] (kr4ey @ Dec. 12 2006,11:06)]Do you think everybody is just going to operate Phone in those portions? I don't think so.
They had bloody well better. Come ON, guys. Give it up. You/we lost. Get over it, and don't keep making it worse!

Stay in your allocations, or suffer even worse from FCC! We are supposed to be a self-regulating service. I know there isn't much left of that, but at least the CW ops should continue their past self-regulation.

[K4JF]

Quote[/b] (wc4r @ Dec. 12 2006,11:25)]If it's THAT important to you as a CW operator, then upgrade you license class. There's your incentive.
And just exactly how would that help?

[K4JF]

Quote[/b] (kr4ey @ Dec. 12 2006,22:19)]EDIT: The author of the above site must think there will be ONLY SSB between 3600 and 4000. That will be hard for me to believe.
Well, yes, there will still be some AM guys......

[kr4ey]

Quote[/b] (K4JF @ Dec. 13 2006,21:48)]Quote[/b] (kr4ey @ Dec. 12 2006,11:06)]Do you think everybody is just going to operate Phone in those portions? I don't think so.
They had bloody well better. #Come ON, guys. #Give it up. #You/we lost. #Get over it, and don't keep making it worse!

Stay in your allocations, or suffer even worse from FCC! #We are supposed to be a self-regulating service. #I know there isn't much left of that, but at least the CW ops should continue their past self-regulation.
My allocation as I see it on 80 meters for me is.

CW: 3525-3600
CW, Phone, Image: 3700-4000

That is the way the FCC has allocated it.
I will NOT suffer anything from the FCC.

[WA3KYY]

Quote[/b] (kr4ey @ Dec. 13 2006,23:58)]Quote[/b] (K4JF @ Dec. 13 2006,21:48)]Quote[/b] (kr4ey @ Dec. 12 2006,11:06)]Do you think everybody is just going to operate Phone in those portions? I don't think so.
They had bloody well better. #Come ON, guys. #Give it up. #You/we lost. #Get over it, and don't keep making it worse!

Stay in your allocations, or suffer even worse from FCC! #We are supposed to be a self-regulating service. #I know there isn't much left of that, but at least the CW ops should continue their past self-regulation.
My allocation as I see it on 80 meters for me is.

CW: 3525-3600
CW, Phone, Image: 3700-4000

That is the way the FCC has allocated it.
I will NOT suffer anything from the FCC.
Only if you never operated in the 3.6-3.7 MHz segment previously.

BTW, good luck trying to find an open spot between 3.25-3.60 most evenings. The various NTS nets have pretty much taken up all the space. They are trying to avoid traditional calling frequencies but it is about to get very crowded down there.

[K4JF]

Although I mostly operate fone these days, I will NOT get on there and gloat over my fellow hams misfortune.

[kr4ey]

Quote[/b] (K4JF @ Dec. 14 2006,08:07)]Although I mostly operate fone these days, I will NOT get on there and gloat over my fellow hams misfortune.
By your previous comments, I already figured that!!
There is way to much phone allocated on 80 meters after December 15.

[kr4ey]

Quote[/b] (WA3KYY @ Dec. 14 2006,07:51)]BTW, good luck trying to find an open spot between 3.25-3.60 most evenings. #The various NTS nets have pretty much taken up all the space. They are trying to avoid traditional calling frequencies but it is about to get very crowded down there.
That is what I mean. The cw ops will have no alternative but to go above 3600, 3700 or 3800 depending on there license class.
And the new FCC bandplan and rules will allow it.

[ne3j]

Quote[/b] ]... [take] frequencies from efficient communications systems like cw whose signals take up virtually no bandspace, and giving it to inefficient SSB'ers and the AM crowd whose signals are 3-10 KHZ wide. Doesn't sound like technological progress to me...

... relieve the congestion in the remainder of the CW/RTTY/data segment...

<span style='color:000050'>Congestion? : >

The rest of the story is that the CW/data bands are usually empty, and the phone bands are overcrowded. At least, that's what I hear about the phone bands, since I spend most of my time on CW [talking to myself]. Seems to me that 100 kHz of 80-mtr-CW frequencies is still generous, even if data is thrown in. Losing frequencies that were underutilized -- especially when re-farmed to a different subset of your own service -- is not a burden.

Don't worry -- be happy -- and keep enjoying CW.</span>

[VE7NOT]

Not to sound harsh. But anyone living near the can/us border that tries to come down below 3750 on the 15th will be met with powerhouses of canadians running 2kw amps.

Amps for 80m has been selling up here like crazy for the last month as hams get ready for the big congestion.

MOST of the 3700-3750 portian we use for nets.

On the plus side you guys now have 3600-3700 which by gentlemen's agreement we don't use.

Sim

[wd8bil]

Quote[/b] ]WHAT "vast zones"? #CW was squeezed basically into the bottom 50 or 60 of each band while SSB has 150-200 and more!

On the band in question (80/75), CW had 50% of the band (3500 - 3750). 75% of the average daily activity was phone. Again, on 40 meters they had HALF the band (7000 - 7150). Same operating habits !! So yes... they had a "vast zone" when normal daily usage is considered.

Quote[/b] ]Check out the bands sometimes before making such ridiculous comments.

Many have AND have documented the LACK of usage by CW ops above 3600Khz. There is documented evidence that VJBs comments are far from ridiculous.
But you wouldn't accept it so I'll not waste anymore time.

[k4kyv]

The FCC is presently accepting public comments in opposition to the League's petition.

Section 1.429(e) of the FCC rules provides that when a petition for reconsideration is timely filed in proper form, public notice of its filing is published in the FEDERAL REGISTER. Section 1.429(f) provides that oppositions to a
petition for reconsideration may be filed within 15 days after public notice of the petition’s filing in the FEDERAL REGISTER.

All persons filing oppositions to the ARRL's Petiton for Reconsideration regarding the phone band expansion should be aware that Section 1.429 requires a printed copy of the opposition to be served on the petitioner. In the case of the League, this would be Christopher D. Imlay, General Counsel for the ARRL, at Booth, Freret, Imlay & Tepper, P.C. in Silver Spring, MD.

To view comments already on file, visit the FCC website at

http://www.fcc.gov/cgb/ecfs/

Just to the upper right of the page, under "ECFS Main Links"
click on "Search for filed comments."

At the top of the new page, copy and paste, or type into the "1. Proceeding" box the following: 04-140

At the bottom of the page, click on the button "Retrieve Document List", and the filings should appear in order, most recently filed at the top of the list.


Here is the complete text of Section 1.429:

§1.429 Petition for reconsideration.

(a) Any interested person may petition for reconsideration of a final action in a proceeding conducted under this subpart (see §§1.407 and 1.425). Where the action was taken by the Commission, the petition will be acted on by the Commission. Where action was taken by a staff official under delegated authority, the petition may be acted on by the staff official or referred to the Commission for action.

Note:

The staff has been authorized to act on rulemaking proceedings described in §1.420 and is authorized to make editorial changes in the rules (see §0.231(d)).

(b) A petition for reconsideration which relies on facts which have not previously been presented to the Commission will be granted only under the following circumstances:

(1) The facts relied on relate to events which have occurred or circumstances which have changed since the last opportunity to present them to the Commission;

(2) The facts relied on were unknown to petitioner until after his last opportunity to present them to the Commission, and he could not through the exercise of ordinary diligence have learned of the facts in question prior to such opportunity; or

(3) The Commission determines that consideration of the facts relied on is required in the public interest.

© The petition for reconsideration shall state with particularity the respects in which petitioner believes the action taken should be changed.

(d) The petition for reconsideration and any supplement thereto shall be filed within 30 days from the date of public notice of such action, as that date is defined in §1.4(b). No supplement to a petition for reconsideration filed after expiration of the 30 day period will be considered, except upon leave granted pursuant to a separate pleading stating the grounds for acceptance of the supplement. The petition for reconsideration shall not exceed 25 double-spaced typewritten pages. See also §1.49(f).

(e) Except as provided in §1.420(f), petitions for reconsideration need not be served on parties to the proceeding. (However, where the number of parties is relatively small, the Commission encourages the service of petitions for reconsideration and other pleadings, and agreements among parties to exchange copies of pleadings. See also §1.47(d) regarding electronic service of documents.) When a petition for reconsideration is timely filed in proper form, public notice of its filing is published in the Federal Register. The time for filing oppositions to the petition runs from the date of public notice. See §1.4(b).

(f) Oppositions to a petition for reconsideration shall be filed within 15 days after the date of public notice of the petition's filing and need be served only on the person who filed the petition. <span style='color:Red'>(emphasis mine)</span> See also §1.49(d). Oppositions shall not exceed 25 double-spaced typewritten pages. See §1.49(f).

(g) Replies to an opposition shall be filed within 10 days after the time for filing oppositions has expired and need be served only on the person who filed the opposition. Replies shall not exceed 10 double-spaced typewritten pages. See also §§1.49(d) and 1.49(f).

(h) Petitions for reconsideration, oppositions and replies shall conform to the requirements of §§1.49 and 1.52, except that they need not be verified. Except as provided in §1.420(e), an original and 11 copies shall be submitted to the Secretary, Federal Communications Commission, Washington, D.C. 20554. Parties filing in electronic form need only submit one copy.

(i) The Commission may grant the petition for reconsideration in whole or in part or may deny the petition. Its order will contain a concise statement of the reasons for the action taken. Any order disposing of a petition for reconsideration which modifies rules adopted by the original order is, to the extent of such modification, subject to reconsideration in the same manner as the original order. Except in such circumstance, a second petition for reconsideration may be dismissed by the staff as repetitious.

(j) The filing of a petition for reconsideration is not a condition precedent to judicial review of any action taken by the Commission, except where the person seeking such review was not a party to the proceeding resulting in the action or relies on questions of fact or law upon which the Commission has been afforded no opportunity to pass. Subject to the provisions of paragraph (b) of this section, such a person may qualify to seek judicial review by filing a petition for reconsideration.

(k) Without special order of the Commission, the filing of a petition for reconsideration shall not excuse any person from complying with any rule or operate in any manner to stay or postpone its enforcement. However, upon good cause shown, the Commission will stay the effective date of a rule pending a decision on a petition for reconsideration <span style='color:Red'>(emphasis mine)</span>. See, however, §1.420(f).

(Secs. 4, 303, 307, 48 Stat., as amended, 1066, 1082, 1083; 47 U.S.C. 154, 303, 307)

[41 FR 1287, Jan. 7, 1976, as amended at 44 FR 5436, Jan. 26, 1979; 46 FR 18556, Mar. 25, 1981; 52 FR 49161, Dec. 30, 1987; 63 FR 24126, May 1, 1998]

Link to Section 1.429 (http://www.washingtonwatchdog.org/documents/cfr/title47/part1.html#1.429)


Use the link below to view the entire text of all FCC regulations.

http://www.washingtonwatchdog.org/documents/cfr/title47/index.html

[N1BHH]

I knew a few people would pile on my reply. That's what I was looking for. What I really want to know is, why did the ARRL wait until after the comment period was over and the R&O was posted in the Federal Register? They missed the boat, that's why they got so many complaints. They didn't read anything through. Yup there is a seperation of license classes, so why didn't they push the NTS and net and digital guys with an effort to move their nets well in advance? They dropped the ball. That's just another reason the ARRL represents a smaller and smaller amount of radio amateurs by the day. When something like this happens like comments sent to the FCC, people should send a copy to Newington to see if they know how to handle it. Things aren't all rosey at 225 Main Street.

[w8cbc]

Well.

I've spent the last hour plus operating CW in the vicinity of 3720 kc. As most nights, there were quick answers to all CQs. The old novice sub is, and was, not "empty". I've always considered that argument rather spurious.

Be that as it may, anyone want to play FM with me around 3660 kc when the new rules go into effect? Go for broke, what the hell. Just remember to keep the mic gain down so your modulation index is 1 or less.

[K4JF]

Quote[/b] (w8cbc @ Dec. 13 2006,22:13)]Be that as it may, anyone want to play FM with me around 3660 kc when the new rules go into effect? #Go for broke, what the hell. #Just remember to keep the mic gain down so your modulation index is 1 or less.
I don't believe FM is authorized below 10 meters.

[K4JF]

Quote[/b] (wd8bil @ Dec. 13 2006,11:49)]Quote[/b] ]WHAT "vast zones"? #CW was squeezed basically into the bottom 50 or 60 of each band while SSB has 150-200 and more!

On the band in question (80/75), CW had 50% of the band (3500 - 3750). 75% of the average daily activity was phone. Again, on 40 meters they had HALF the band (7000 - 7150). Same operating habits !! So yes... they had a "vast zone" when normal daily usage is consideredtime.
Sorry, wrong. CW did NOT have all you quote. CW and Data had that, and data ran generally from about .060 up to fone on most bands.

You cannot attribute all of CW and data to CW any more than you can attribute all CW and fone to CW. There are other modes than CW below the fone allocations, and they are using spectrum space. They will move down when fone is expanded. Cannot help it. Only thing is, CW cannot move down, as there is a band edge there.

Simple math, guys, simple math.

[w8cbc]

Quote[/b] (K4JF @ Dec. 15 2006,04:34)]I don't believe FM is authorized below 10 meters.
Keep your modulation index below 1 for the highest modulating frequency and it most assuredly is.

It can be wider than that above 29000 kc. That's what the dividing line is about.

[wa3vjb]

Excellent time tonight the past four hours, then 75 meters collapsed stateside and very few stations audible from top to bottom.

The following stations are the first in the K3V logbook. Thanks for the nice chat, gentlemen:

<span style='font-size:21pt;line-height:100%'>K3V</span>
<span style='font-size:19pt;line-height:100%'>AM Bandwarming Party</span>
Logbook
[hr]
All times GMT
0517 W1VD Jay outside of Hartford <span style='font-size:19pt;line-height:100%'><span style='color:Maroon'>All are on 3725Kc</span></span>
[hr]
W1DSN Len
[hr]
KD2XA Chris at White Plains
[hr]
0522 W2Z Mike 833sX833s
[hr]
WA2PJP Joe on the KW-1 "Is this the new AM Calling frequency?"
[hr]
0526 KC4CMR Chris on the 32V3 "Antenna must have stretched, loads good ! "
[hr]
0529 W1UJR Bruce on the 30K and 75A1
[hr]
W3GL Ralph New Castle Delaware
[hr]
W2DTC Ken
[hr]
0537 K8R Dave in the Cave (Rock Cave)
[hr]
0543 W2XR Bruce in NY Orban 9100A, RCA 77D, pair 4-400s mod. pr. 4-400s
[hr]
0549 W9AD Dave near Chicago, with Skype appearance by Larry W8ER
[hr]
0550 W3JN Johnny Novice Mt. Airy MD "I woke up for this and now I'm going back to bed!"
[hr]
0604 KW1I Dale on the KW-1
[hr]
0606 K2VH Herb (what are you doing up this late?)
[hr]
0620 K1Q Todd on the KW-1
[hr]
0631 W8A Buddly on the ICOM then the Valiant (ah !)
[hr]
0708 WB4WCJ Paul, Hardeeville, SC (rare appearance on 75, usu 40m)
[hr]
0731 W8ER Larry, fired up directly with the SDR1000
[hr]
0735 W4RT ?? Incomplete contact, band crapping out
[hr]
0757 W8DRZ incomplete, signals down
[hr]
0803 VE3AJM Al, Ontario, fell asleep after being on in the evening, waiting for us
[hr]
0809 K2DK / 4 Dave, Haymarket VA
[hr]
Band is crapped out !! QRT 0852

[N5FOG]

THE SKY IS FALLING

FCC MODIFIES AMATEUR RADIO SERVICE RULES,
ELIMINATING MORSE CODE EXAM REQUIREMENTS AND
ADDRESSING ARRL PETITION FOR RECONSIDERATION

Washington, D.C. – Today, the Federal Communications Commission (FCC) adopted a Report and Order and Order on Reconsideration (Order) that modifies the rules for the Amateur Radio Service by revising the examination requirements for obtaining a General Class or Amateur Extra Class amateur radio operator license and revising the operating privileges for Technician Class licensees. In addition, the Order resolves a petition filed by the American Radio Relay League, Inc. (ARRL) for partial reconsideration of an FCC Order on amateur service rules released on October 10, 2006.

The current amateur service operator license structure contains three classes of amateur radio operator licenses: Technician Class, General Class, and Amateur Extra Class. General Class and Amateur Extra Class licensees are permitted to operate in Amateur bands below 30 MHz, while the introductory Technician Class licensees are only permitted to operate in bands above 30 MHz. Prior to today’s action, the FCC, in accordance with international radio regulations, required applicants for General Class and Amateur Extra Class operator licenses to pass a five words-per-minute Morse code examination. Today’s Order eliminates that requirement for General and Amateur Extra licensees. This change reflects revisions to international radio regulations made at the International Telecommunication Union’s 2003 World Radio Conference (WRC-03), which authorized each country to determine whether to require that individuals demonstrate Morse code proficiency in order to qualify for an amateur radio license with transmitting privileges on frequencies below 30 MHz. This change eliminates an unnecessary regulatory burden that may discourage current amateur radio operators from advancing their skills and participating more fully in the benefits of amateur radio.

Today’s Order also revises the operating privileges for Technician Class licensees by eliminating a disparity in the operating privileges for the Technician Class and Technician Plus Class licensees. Technician Class licensees are authorized operating privileges on all amateur frequencies above 30 MHz. The Technician Plus Class license, which is an operator license class that existed prior the FCC’s simplification of the amateur license structure in 1999 and was grandfathered after that time, authorized operating privileges on all amateur frequencies above 30 MHz, as well as frequency segments in four HF bands (below 30 MHz) after the successful completion of a Morse code examination. With today’s elimination of the Morse code exam requirements, the FCC concluded that the disparity between the operating privileges of Technician Class licensees and Technician Plus Class licensees should not be retained. Therefore, the FCC, in today’s action, afforded Technician and Technician Plus licensees identical operating privileges.

Finally, today’s Order resolved a petition filed by the ARRL for partial reconsideration of an FCC Order released on October 10, 2006 (FCC 06-149). In this Order, the FCC authorized amateur stations to transmit voice communications on additional frequencies in certain amateur service bands, including the 75 meter (m) band, which is authorized only for certain wideband voice and image communications. The ARRL argued that the 75 m band should not have been expanded below 3635 kHz, in order to protect automatically controlled digital stations operating in the 3620-3635 kHz portion of the 80 m band. The FCC concluded that these stations can be protected by providing alternate spectrum in the 3585-3600 kHz frequency segment.

Action by the Commission on December 15, 2006, by Report and Order and Order on Reconsideration. Chairman Martin and Commissioners Copps, Adelstein, Tate, and McDowell.

For additional information, contact William Cross at (202) 418-0691 or William.Cross@fcc.gov.

WT Docket Nos. 04-140 and 05-235.


WELL BOYS THE WAR IS OVER

Eric KC5FOG

[KC2ESD]

No morse code requierment? My BS detector is going off. Need Mythbusters to prove if true.

[KC2ESD]

OMG I just check the ARRL site. Its true, Morse code has been dropped. The FCC just dropped the Bomb from a B-52. I am in SHOCK. I have to get more wine.

[N5FOG]

Quote[/b] (KC2ESD @ Dec. 14 2006,23:47)]OMG I just check the ARRL site. Its true, Morse code has been dropped. The FCC just dropped the Bomb from a B-52. I am in SHOCK. I have to get more wine.


All I can say is congratulations to my fellow no-code operators who helped fight this battle. Can't wait to see all of you giving the old timers a run for their money in those contests and chasing that rare DX.

I truly wish I could see the looks on each and every one of those old timers faces who said this would never happen when they read the news.

I look forward to seeing all of my fellow no-code ops down on HF very soon.



Eric Kc5Fog (soon to be EXTRA Fog)

And who said Christmas miracles never happen

[K4JF]

Quote[/b] (Kc5fog @ Dec. 14 2006,22:51)]Can't wait to see all of you giving the old timers a run for their money in those contests and chasing that rare DX.

Eric Kc5Fog (soon to be EXTRA Fog)
Not gonna happen, Eric. Most of the really rare DX is on CW.

[K4JF]

Quote[/b] (kr4ey @ Dec. 13 2006,10:01)]The cw ops will have no alternative but to go above 3600, 3700 or 3800 depending on their license class.
Do that, and they will lose what little bandspace they have. Count on it!