Kramer's apology opens the door for others

[n4sva]

Here's my holiday wish list:


Dear Revs. Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton,


Please accept my apology for launching into a racist tirade against two black hecklers at my comedy show. Because I attacked two blacks in particular, I know this means I harbor deep-seated racist feelings about all blacks. While, in return, I heard words like "f — -ing white boy" and "cracker-ass motherf — -er," I know those epithets were directed toward me, as an individual, and not at the entire white race.


Again, please accept my deepest apologies.

Michael Richards, aka "Kramer" of "Seinfeld"


Dear Anti-Defamation League, Once again, please accept my apology for calling Jews "Hymies" and referring to New York City as "Hymie-town." As I said at the time, "Charge it to my head . . . not to my heart."

Sincerely, Rev. Jesse Jackson


Dear NAACP, Urban League and Congress of Racial Equality, Please accept my apology for, during concerts in which I sang my song "Gold Digger," giving whites permission to sing along and use the "n-word." Perhaps Michael Richards attended one of my concerts and left not realizing his license had expired.

Kanye West, hip-hop artist/rapper


Dear Jewish Defense League, Korean-American Grocer Association and Council on American-Islamic Relations,


Please accept my apology for, while serving as a Wal-Mart spokesperson, condemning Jewish, Korean and Arab inner-city merchants for "overcharging" blacks. I also inexcusably said that these merchants sell "stale bread and bad meat and wilted vegetables." Charge that to my head, not my heart.

Sincerely yours, Andrew Young, former U.N. ambassador for the United States, former mayor of Atlanta and former colleague of Martin Luther King, Jr.


Dear Democratic National Committee,


During the recent election cycle, the Republican Party ran a number of blacks — among them Maryland Lieutenant Governor Michael Steele for Senate, Ohio Secretary of State Ken Blackwell for governor, and Lynn Swann for governor in Pennsylvania. So please accept my apology for saying Republicans have a "white-boy attitude," which means "I must exclude, denigrate and leave behind."

Sincerely yours, Donna Brazile, former Al Gore 2000 campaign manager


Dear White Community,


Please accept my apology for my statement during the 2002 "Millions for Reparations" rally: "I just might walk up to the nearest white man and say, 'You don't understand this, this is a black thing,' and slap 'em, just for my mental health. If they don't pay us reparations now, we're talking about scorched earth." There goes my head!

Sincerely yours, Charles Barron, New York City councilman


Dear Anti-Defamation League,


Please accept my apology. I lost my temper during my husband's unsuccessful 1974 congressional campaign. Bill's campaign adviser, Paul Fray, and his wife publicly claim that I called Fray a "f — -ing Jew bastard." I don't recall this, but assuming I did, what was I thinking? It wasn't my heart.

Sincerely yours, Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton


Dear Jesse Jackson and local Little Rock, Ark., black activist Robert "Say" McIntosh,


Former Arkansas State Trooper Larry Patterson publicly claimed I referred to the two of you as "n — gers." Ditto what Hillary just said.

Sincerely, Former President of the United States Bill Clinton


Dear Ward Connerly and anyone in an interracial relationship,


When you led the successful campaign in California to end race-based preferences, I criticized you, a black man, saying, "He's married a white woman. He wants to be white. He wants a colorless society. He has no ethnic pride. He doesn't want to be black." My bad.

Sincerely, Rep. Diane Watson, D-Calif.


Dear Republican National Committee, Please accept my apology for saying, after the Republicans took over Congress in 1994, "It's not 'spic' or 'n — ger' anymore. They say 'let's cut taxes.'" Also, I apologize for, following Katrina, publicly saying, "George Bush is our Bull Connor" — referring to the former Birmingham, Ala., police commissioner, who turned water hoses and dogs on civil rights workers. My head and heart were clashing.

Rep. Charlie Rangel, D-N.Y., incoming House Ways and Means Committee chairman


Dear Anti-Defamation League and White Community,


Please accept my apologies for calling whites "interlopers" and referring to Jews as "diamond merchants," and, during a conflict between Jews and blacks, saying, "If the Jews want to get it on, tell them to pin their yarmulkes back and come over to my house." They were mistakes of the head, not the heart.

Rev. Al Sharpton, civil rights activist and former host of "Saturday Night Live"


Dear Colin Powell, Condoleezza Rice and other minority members of the Bush administration, Please accept my apology for, while co-hosting a radio show in 2001, calling Bush's minority appointees "Uncle Tom types." I made a mistake of the head, not of the heart.

Sincerely yours, Gloria Allred, attorney at law, currently representing the black "victims" of Michael Richards' racist rant


Now, don't we all feel better?

[W2ILP]

Yes and please accept the apologies of W2ILP for anything I may have said that is considered raciest, politically incorrect, religiously intolerant, nationally unloyal, silly, sexist, or inconsiderate of the mentally or physically handicapped. I may have said it but I'm sorry. I must be more democratic (small d) with my comments in the future.

So let me say in the words of the late Jean P. Shepherd...
EXCELSIOR ALL YOU FAT HEADS...and I hope that can insult you all with due equality.

w2ilp (I Like People)...of all kinds...except for the fat heads.

[AE6IP]

Ladies, I'm sorry you're all a bunch of whores.
-- Judge Roy Bean

[kf4vgx]

Quote[/b] (AE6IP @ Nov. 29 2006,22:54)]Ladies, I'm sorry you're all a bunch of whores.
-- Judge Roy Bean
MARTY !
http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif .

Leave #judge Roy Bean out of this !



http://www.leverguns.com/desktop/Judge_Roy_Bean.jpg


It was a different era . I've noticed no one is smiling in the background or this subject. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif

[G8ADD]

Dear cringing brain cells, do accept my sincere apology for reading this thread, we all make mistakes, even me!

73

Brian G8ADD

[ac4ut]

I will not apologize for my prejudice for I hate stupid people and think they are dumb.
"Dumb" in the accepted slang of being far less than smart and not the lack of ability to speak..

[w5klb]

Dear ABC Executives,

Please except my apologies for coming on the set of "The View" and calling The President of the United States "Numb @%#". I would attribute this to my head, but it was numb from all the drinks I had at a bar before my interview. Please except my sincere apology for this oversight. <*hick*>

Signed,

Danny DeVito.

[wa4ilh]

Quote[/b] (W2ILP @ Nov. 30 2006,20:14)]... So let me say in the words of the late Jean P. Shepherd...
EXCELSIOR ALL YOU FAT HEADS...and I hope that can insult you all with due equality.

w2ilp (I Like People)...of all kinds...except for the fat heads.
I listened to "The Shep" for years. Now that you call it to my attention, I am HIGHLY OFFENDED... He also referred to bad drivers as "Jersey Drivers" I should demand an apology.... Oh yeah, I can't...he's dead. Maybe I can sue his descendants......
Tom WA4ILH

[K1OU]

I'd like to apologize for others on this board who are angry that the Republicans lost the election and look foolish by using race-baiting tactics as threads, thinking they are engaging in intellectual discourse.

[W8EFA]

Quote[/b] (K1OU @ Dec. 01 2006,14:10)]I'd like to apologize for others on this board who are angry that the Republicans lost the election and look foolish by using race-baiting tactics as threads, thinking they are engaging in intellectual discourse.
Maybe "Intellectually Challenged" would be a better description.

[kc7jty]

I ain't sorry for nothin. I might kiss a little ### from time to time for personal gain, but if something I may have said has ruined you or a loved one...tough sh*t.

[K1OU]

Quote[/b] (kc7jty @ Dec. 01 2006,11:48)]I ain't sorry for nothin. I might kiss a little ### from time to time for personal gain, but if something I may have said has ruined you or a loved one...tough sh*t.
Dave, get in touch with your feelings!

[kc7jty]

Quote[/b] (K1OU @ Dec. 01 2006,11:50)]Dave, get in touch with your feelings!
http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif

[K1OU]

Quote[/b] (kc7jty @ Dec. 01 2006,11:59)]Quote[/b] (K1OU @ Dec. 01 2006,11:50)]Dave, get in touch with your feelings!
http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif
I meant Bill. So many Libertarians, so little time.

[n4sva]

I like apologize on behalf of all the DemoKrauts, who play the race card from the bottom of the pile.

[K1OU]

Quote[/b] (n4sva @ Dec. 02 2006,13:26)]I like apologize on behalf of all the DemoKrauts, who play the race card from the bottom of the pile.
I'd like to apologize for Republicans who can't speak properly and ARE a pile.

[n4sva]

I like to apologize for those QRZ posters who post nonsense while having the external cranial features of Colonel Klink.

[KI4ITV]

I'm sorry you guy's feel that way. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[n2ize]

The realityof this whole episode is that "Kramer" (M. Richards) has not apologized to anyone and certainly not to the individuals who he visiously offended when he launched his angry racist tirade against them. The bahavior of thios man was appalling and goes far beyond any possible provocation to which he may claim. If he is to ever be regarded with any degree of credibility he needs to at the very least

1) Directly and sincerely apologize to those that he wrongly and visciously attacked.

2) Pay any monetary compensation to the individuals who he attacked as forfeit and recognition for the damages he caused. Additionally a monetary forfeiture paid in repairation will send a clear message that this type of verbatim assault, be it racist, sexist, etc.. will not be condoned or ignored.

A verbal assault is damaging, perhaps not as acute but just as is a physical assault. People entering a club for an evening of entertainment should not have to endure being subjugated in such a violent, vile and derogatory manner as these individuals were. Nor should the rest of the audience have to accept such rudeness. This was evident by the numerous people, both black, white, etc. who filed out of the club during and after the tirade.

[K1OU]

Quote[/b] (n4sva @ Dec. 02 2006,14:17)]I like to apologize for those QRZ posters who post nonsense while having the external cranial features of Colonel Klink.
And I apologize for the QRZ zealots who think like Nazis.

[al2i]

Quote[/b] (K1OU @ Dec. 02 2006,19:23)]Quote[/b] (n4sva @ Dec. 02 2006,14:17)]I like to apologize for those QRZ posters who post nonsense while having the external cranial features of Colonel Klink.
And I apologize for the QRZ zealots who think like Nazis.
Your apology for n2ize's desire for fascist control of public speech is accepted.

[al2i]

These apologies are a good thing, because I can feel a positive surge of genuine comradery!

[n2ize]

Quote[/b] (al2i @ Dec. 03 2006,02:10)]Quote[/b] (K1OU @ Dec. 02 2006,19:23)]Quote[/b] (n4sva @ Dec. 02 2006,14:17)]I like to apologize for those QRZ posters who post nonsense while having the external cranial features of Colonel Klink.
And I apologize for the QRZ zealots who think like Nazis.
Your apology for n2ize's desire for fascist control of public speech is accepted.
It's not about fascist control of public speech. I saw the video of this imbecile carrying on like a psychotic. I was shocked at his behavior. He wouldn't stop. Members of the audience both Black and White were appalled by his rude, caustic and offensive screaming. Many members of the audience got up and walked out of the club. He pointed directly at the people he was referring to and racially assaulted them, visciously slandering them in front of a live audience. It doesn't matter if they were Blacks, Jews, Christians, Italians, Moslems, or any other nationality, race, or religion.

Public speech doesn't give anyone a right to single someone out and assault them verbally or physically. Simply because he attacked them verbally rather than physically doesn't make his actions any less damaging. And since he hasn't apologized then he should be sued for damages and forced to pay reparations to those he attacked.

[w2amr]

Quote[/b] (n2ize @ Dec. 02 2006,14:27)]The realityof this whole episode is that "Kramer" (M. Richards) has not apologized to anyone and certainly not to the individuals who he visiously offended when he launched his angry racist tirade against them. #The bahavior of thios man was appalling and goes far beyond any possible provocation to which he may claim. If he is to ever be regarded with any degree of credibility he needs to at the very least

1) Directly and sincerely apologize to those that he wrongly and visciously #attacked.

2) Pay any monetary compensation to the individuals who he attacked as forfeit and recognition for the damages he caused. Additionally a #monetary #forfeiture paid in repairation will send a clear message that this type #of verbatim assault, be it racist, sexist, etc.. will not be condoned or ignored.

A verbal assault is damaging, perhaps not as acute but just as is a physical assault. #People entering a club for an evening of entertainment should not have to endure being subjugated in such a violent, vile and derogatory manner as these individuals were. Nor should the rest of the audience have to accept such rudeness. This was evident by the numerous people, both black, white, etc. who filed out of the club during and after the tirade.
He has been apologizing almost non stop since this thing started. #He even went on Jesse Jackson's show and apologized . Then after the show, Jesse being the stand up guy he is , called for a boycott of all dvd's of the #Steinfeld show. #The ironic part of all of this is , the vast majority of people in the entertainment business who use the N word #are black. Shouldn't Jesse be calling for a boycott of their products, and asking for monetary compensation #as well?

[al2i]

Quote[/b] (n2ize @ Dec. 03 2006,02:00)]Quote[/b] (al2i @ Dec. 03 2006,02:10)]Quote[/b] (K1OU @ Dec. 02 2006,19:23)]Quote[/b] (n4sva @ Dec. 02 2006,14:17)]I like to apologize for those QRZ posters who post nonsense while having the external cranial features of Colonel Klink.
And I apologize for the QRZ zealots who think like Nazis.
Your apology for n2ize's desire for fascist control of public speech is accepted.
It's not about fascist control of public speech. I saw the video of this imbecile carrying on like a psychotic. I was shocked at his behavior. He wouldn't stop. Members of the audience both Black and White were appalled by his rude, caustic and offensive screaming. Many members of the audience got up and walked out of the club. He pointed directly at the people he was referring to and racially assaulted them, visciously slandering them in front of a live audience. It doesn't matter if they were Blacks, Jews, Christians, Italians, Moslems, or any other nationality, race, or religion.

Public speech doesn't give anyone a right to single someone out and assault them verbally or physically. Simply because he attacked them verbally rather than physically doesn't make his actions any less damaging. And since he hasn't apologized then he should be sued for damages and forced to pay reparations to those he attacked.
You simply stun me with your blindness to the tenets of a free society. You want him to be forced to pay somebody for calling them names? Every kid in my elementary school would owe the others a fortune.

Richards will not be doing stand-up comedy anymore because some complete jerks heckled him to the snapping point. He has lost everything and I feel bad for him. I hope he finds a way to recover, because the man is going through all kinds of hell, and I think he needs help anyway.

It would have been big of the so-called "victims" to have gone public with Richards, put their arms around him, and tell him all is forgiven. Then they would not be what he was calling them. Their actions to increase racial tensions since the event confirms that he called them the right name.

Sorry OM, but I see Richards as the victim of a racist, hostile, immoral, hypocritical society.

[n2ize]

Quote[/b] (al2i @ Dec. 03 2006,04:22)]Quote[/b] (n2ize @ Dec. 03 2006,02:00)]Quote[/b] (al2i @ Dec. 03 2006,02:10)]Quote[/b] (K1OU @ Dec. 02 2006,19:23)]Quote[/b] (n4sva @ Dec. 02 2006,14:17)]I like to apologize for those QRZ posters who post nonsense while having the external cranial features of Colonel Klink.
And I apologize for the QRZ zealots who think like Nazis.
Your apology for n2ize's desire for fascist control of public speech is accepted.
It's not about fascist control of public speech. I saw the video of this imbecile carrying on like a psychotic. I was shocked at his behavior. He wouldn't stop. Members of the audience both Black and White were appalled by his rude, caustic and offensive screaming. Many members of the audience got up and walked out of the club. He pointed directly at the people he was referring to and racially assaulted them, visciously slandering them in front of a live audience. It doesn't matter if they were Blacks, Jews, Christians, Italians, Moslems, or any other nationality, race, or religion.

Public speech doesn't give anyone a right to single someone out and assault them verbally or physically. Simply because he attacked them verbally rather than physically doesn't make his actions any less damaging. And since he hasn't apologized then he should be sued for damages and forced to pay reparations to those he attacked.
You simply stun me with your blindness to the tenets of a free society. You want him to be forced to pay somebody for calling them names? Every kid in my elementary school would owe the others a fortune.

Richards will not be doing stand-up comedy anymore because some complete jerks heckled him to the snapping point. He has lost everything and I feel bad for him. I hope he finds a way to recover, because the man is going through all kinds of hell, and I think he needs help anyway.

It would have been big of the so-called "victims" to have gone public with Richards, put their arms around him, and tell him all is forgiven. Then they would not be what he was calling them. Their actions to increase racial tensions since the event confirms that he called them the right name.

Sorry OM, but I see Richards as the victim of a racist, hostile, immoral, hypocritical society.
Quote[/b] ]
You simply stun me with your blindness to the tenets of a free society.


"Free Society" does not give someone carte blanch to single someone out and verbally assault them and assassinate their character with racial remarks.

Quote[/b] ]
You want him to be forced to pay somebody for calling them names?


No, not for calling names. For damages that occur when you verbally subjugate an individual in a public venue in front of a crowd. What Richards did was inexcusable and totally uncalled for.

Quote[/b] ]
Every kid in my elementary school would owe the others a fortune.


There is a difference between an immature child calling someone a name in a school versus an adult professional entertainer singling out and verbally assaulting members of his audience with a lengthy tirade of racial and ethnic slurs and offensive depictions.

Quote[/b] ]
Richards will not be doing stand-up comedy anymore


Thank goodness for that.

Quote[/b] ]
because some complete jerks heckled him to the snapping point.


No, they did not heckle him to the snapping point. They came into the club late. Richards was already onstage. Then Richards started making racist remarks to which one of the individuals responded back to Richards which Richards went on his psychotic, violent and extremely offensive screaming tirade shouting obscenities at the individuals and severe racial slurs. There was absolutely no excuse for his abominable behavior. Even if he was heckled there was no excuse for the insulting and vulgar and highly unprofessional tirade. If it were true that he was heckled first then at the very least he could have pulled a Barbara Streisand and simply said, "shut the *&*^* up"and went on with the show. There was no excuse for his lengthy and vicious raging tirade.

Quote[/b] ]
He has lost everything and I feel bad for him. I hope he finds a way to recover, because the man is going through all kinds of hell, and I think he needs help anyway.


He hasn't lost everything.I am sure he made plenty of money in show biz and probably has plenty. He'll do fine even if he gets sued. Nobody is taking his money away, except perhaps monetary award he may end up paying to the victims of his assault at a future date. Richards made his bed, now he has to sleep in it. Lot's of people screw up in life and have problems. Nobody feels sorry for them. Having problems doesn't give a person the right to verbally or physically subjugate others.

Quote[/b] ]
t would have been big of the so-called "victims" to have gone public with Richards, put their arms around him, and tell him all is forgiven.


Why should they put their arms around him and forgive him when he has yet to apologize to them or seek forgiveness. Let Richards contact the victims ofn his assault and explain to them that he is truly sorry for what he did. Perhaps they will forgive him is return. If Richards wants their forgiveness then it'sup to Richards to seek it and come to them. They are not obligated to run to him.

Quote[/b] ]
Then they would not be what he was calling them. Their actions to increase racial tensions since the event confirms that he called them the right name.


This is like saying that if someone approaches a group of people entering a synagogue and screams obscenities and anti semitic remarks at the people and they answer him back then they proved the guy making the anti semitic remarks was right and also the victim. Sorry, it doesn't work that way. If I punch someone and they punch me back the person I punched is the victim and I am the aggressor. The fact that they punched me back doesn't make it right that I punched them first nor does it make me the victim. I in this case Richards is the one who chose to increase racial tensions. After all he was the one who screamed obscenities inter dispersed with the word n---ger along with demeaning and derogatory and extremely insulting depictions.


Quote[/b] ]
Sorry OM, but I see Richards as the victim of a racist, hostile, immoral, hypocritical society.


Sorry, but I see Richards as the perpetrator of hostile racism and I see the victims as the people he launched his tirade against. They were the victims of a racist, hostile and extremely rude individual. I was skeptical at first but after seeing the video of Richards tirade and reading further into the case I can only conclude that Richards was very wrong.

[w2amr]

Quote[/b] (al2i @ Dec. 03 2006,04:22)]Quote[/b] (n2ize @ Dec. 03 2006,02:00)]Quote[/b] (al2i @ Dec. 03 2006,02:10)]Quote[/b] (K1OU @ Dec. 02 2006,19:23)]Quote[/b] (n4sva @ Dec. 02 2006,14:17)]I like to apologize for those QRZ posters who post nonsense while having the external cranial features of Colonel Klink.
And I apologize for the QRZ zealots who think like Nazis.
Your apology for n2ize's desire for fascist control of public speech is accepted.
It's not about fascist control of public speech. #I saw the video of this imbecile carrying on like a psychotic. I was shocked at his behavior. He wouldn't stop. Members of the audience both Black and White were appalled by his rude, caustic and offensive screaming. Many members of the audience got up and walked out of the club. #He pointed directly at the people he was referring to and racially assaulted them, visciously slandering them in front of a live audience. It doesn't #matter if they were Blacks, Jews, Christians, Italians, Moslems, or any other nationality, race, or religion.

Public speech doesn't give anyone a right to single someone out and assault them verbally or physically. Simply because he attacked them verbally rather #than physically doesn't make his actions any less damaging. And since he hasn't apologized then he should be sued for damages and forced to pay reparations to those he attacked.
You simply stun me with your blindness to the tenets of a free society. #You want him to be forced to pay somebody for calling them names? #Every kid in my elementary school would owe the others a fortune.

Richards will not be doing stand-up comedy anymore because some complete jerks heckled him to the snapping point. #He has lost everything and I feel bad for him. #I hope he finds a way to recover, because the man is going through all kinds of hell, and I think he needs help anyway.

It would have been big of the so-called "victims" to have gone public with Richards, put their arms around him, and tell him all is forgiven. #Then they would not be what he was calling them. #Their actions to increase racial tensions since the event confirms that he called them the right name.

Sorry OM, but I see Richards as the victim of a racist, hostile, immoral, hypocritical society.
I wouldn't go so far as to call him a victim, after all he brought this on himself. I do however #think this thing has been blown out of proportion , and at the same time has put a shining light on the hypocrisy and double standards surrounding this issue.

[w2amr]

And then you have this which stays under the radar.
link (http://football.about.com/b/a/257912.htm)

[n4sva]

I remember vividly the "Jimmy the Greek" firing. He was put on the spot asking why African Americans were better athletes. CBS fired him for speaking the truth.

[al2i]

Quote[/b] (n2ize @ Dec. 03 2006,04:20)]Quote[/b] ]
Sorry OM, but I see Richards as the victim of a racist, hostile, immoral, hypocritical society.


Sorry, but I see Richards as the perpetrator of hostile racism and I see the victims as the people he launched his tirade against. They were the victims of a racist, hostile and extremely rude individual. I was skeptical at first but after seeing the video of Richards tirade and reading further into the case I can only conclude that Richards was very wrong.
I have actually lived to see the day when grown men are "victims" because someone blows a gasket and calls them names. Amazing.

They are completely unhurt and now have celebrity status along with an opportunity to hit a little financial windfall, but they only get that by playing their "victim" status.

Meanwhile, Richards is destroyed because he had a temper tantrum with some rude guys who turned out to be ruthless as well.

I think the BS on this little episode is neck deep.

[K1OU]

Quote[/b] (n4sva @ Dec. 03 2006,06:46)]I remember vividly the "Jimmy the Greek" firing. He was put on the spot asking why African Americans were better athletes. CBS fired him for speaking the truth.
You can't be serious. If you are, I feel sorry for you.

[al2i]

Quote[/b] (K1OU @ Dec. 04 2006,04:14)]Quote[/b] (n4sva @ Dec. 03 2006,06:46)]I remember vividly the "Jimmy the Greek" firing. He was put on the spot asking why African Americans were better athletes. CBS fired him for speaking the truth.
You can't be serious. If you are, I feel sorry for you.
More precisely, it did not matter if he spoke the truth or not. He got in trouble for vocalizing an opinion. You just cannot do that any more gents. Where do you think you live?

[K1OU]

Quote[/b] (al2i @ Dec. 04 2006,05:16)]Quote[/b] (K1OU @ Dec. 04 2006,04:14)]Quote[/b] (n4sva @ Dec. 03 2006,06:46)]I remember vividly the "Jimmy the Greek" firing. He was put on the spot asking why African Americans were better athletes. CBS fired him for speaking the truth.
You can't be serious. #If you are, I feel sorry for you.
More precisely, it did not matter if he spoke the truth or not. #He got in trouble for vocalizing an opinion. #You just cannot do that any more gents. #Where do you think you live?
Sometimes, opinions are best kept to self, regardless of where one lives.














But, on QRZ, it's okay!!! http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[al2i]

Quote[/b] (K1OU @ Dec. 04 2006,04:24)]But, on QRZ, it's okay!!! http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif
N4SVA's thoughts are proscribed by the new order. How could he end himself honorably?

Before we rush to judgement against N4SVA, we need the results of a skin-pigment test, or better yet, a careful DNA test of his racial-mixture.

[K1OU]

Quote[/b] (al2i @ Dec. 04 2006,05:38)]Quote[/b] (K1OU @ Dec. 04 2006,04:24)]But, on QRZ, it's okay!!! http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif
N4SVA's thoughts are proscribed by the new order. #How could he end himself honorably?
By eating a tailpipe.

[W8EFA]

How anybody can defend Richards is truly beyond my understanding.

[w2amr]

Quote[/b] (K1OU @ Dec. 04 2006,05:40)]Quote[/b] (al2i @ Dec. 04 2006,05:38)]Quote[/b] (K1OU @ Dec. 04 2006,04:24)]But, on QRZ, it's okay!!! http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif
N4SVA's thoughts are proscribed by the new order. #How could he end himself honorably?
By eating a tailpipe.
Ummmmmm. Taillllllll Piiiiiiiiiiipe

[K1OU]

Quote[/b] (w2amr @ Dec. 04 2006,10:57)]Quote[/b] (K1OU @ Dec. 04 2006,05:40)]Quote[/b] (al2i @ Dec. 04 2006,05:38)]Quote[/b] (K1OU @ Dec. 04 2006,04:24)]But, on QRZ, it's okay!!! http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif
N4SVA's thoughts are proscribed by the new order. #How could he end himself honorably?
By eating a tailpipe.
Ummmmmm. Taillllllll Piiiiiiiiiiipe
http://www.rln-yh.com/images/news/2006/homer.gif

[AC0H]

Quote[/b] ]I have actually lived to see the day when grown men are "victims" because someone blows a gasket and calls them names. Amazing.

We started down that slope a long time ago.

[KD6NIG]

Actually this lawsuit opens oppurtunities for others.

The next time you go to a comedy club and you feel offended in any way, sue. I'm sure there are plenty of words used by all races towards all other races that are offensive.

We shouldn't have any problem with these now, as its obvious that a lawsuit is possible for any kind of offense, right?

I can see the lawyers rubbing their hands together gleefully.

Sure, this one is a bit over the edge, but you KNOW its coming. Money talks http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif People are already seeing dollar signs. Comedians are going to have to actually have to be funny instead of using curse words or slurs to make comedy.

Its a win-win for all of us, in the long run http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[n2ize]

Quote[/b] (al2i @ Dec. 04 2006,04:58)]Quote[/b] (n2ize @ Dec. 03 2006,04:20)]Quote[/b] ]
Sorry OM, but I see Richards as the victim of a racist, hostile, immoral, hypocritical society.


Sorry, but I see Richards as the perpetrator of hostile racism and I see the victims as the people he launched his tirade against. They were the victims of a racist, hostile and extremely rude individual. I was skeptical at first but after seeing the video of Richards tirade and reading further into the case I can only conclude that Richards was very wrong.
I have actually lived to see the day when grown men are "victims" because someone blows a gasket and calls them names. Amazing.

They are completely unhurt and now have celebrity status along with an opportunity to hit a little financial windfall, but they only get that by playing their "victim" status.

Meanwhile, Richards is destroyed because he had a temper tantrum with some rude guys who turned out to be ruthless as well.

I think the BS on this little episode is neck deep.
Quote[/b] ]
have actually lived to see the day when grown men are "victims" because someone blows a gasket and calls them names. Amazing.


Yes they are victims. . It's no different than anti-semitic defamation. You don;t single someone out of a crowd and humilate and embarrass them with vulgar racism and obscenties. Nobody should have to tolerate that. This is why we have established a categoryog hate crimes,to protect people from intolerable abuse.

Quote[/b] ]
They are completely unhurt and now have celebrity status along with an opportunity to hit a little financial windfall, but they only get that by playing their "victim" status.


How do you know they are unhurt ? True they weren't given a physical beating but they were given a severe verbal beating that was totally undeserved and uncalled for. That can be very hurtfull and the realization of the hurtful nature of racist, anti Black and anti-semitic attacks is becoming more and more recognized over time. They are not playing victim status, they are victims of a blind, an extremely viscious racist that was launched against them.

If I walk into my job and I start hollaring and insulting and making racist or anti-semitic comments and remarks to another employee then why should the company take action against me ? I didn't hurt the other person. All I did was insult and humiliate them and trash their race or religion. After all,that person should simply learn to accept my verbal abuse.
If the company fires me then I am the victim, not the employee I verbally abused. Would that be right or true?? Sorry, the company would have every right to take action against me.

Quote[/b] ]
Meanwhile, Richards is destroyed because he had a temper tantrum with some rude guys who turned out to be ruthless as well.


How are they rude ? Richards attacked them. They didn't attack Richards or say anything to Richards. The only thing they did was walk into the club late and attract Richards attention as they moved to their seats. Then Richards took off like a racist moron.

Sorry, the only one who was rude and ruthless in this case was Richards. I don;t care what happened in that theatre the way he acted was totally inexcusable. There is absolutely no justification for what he did. If Richards career is destroyed too bad. He is the only one responsible for destroying it. Now he might even have to pay for his arrogance and inability to control himself and/or respect people.

[AC0H]

Quote[/b] ]Yes they are victims. . It's no different than anti-semitic defamation. You don;t single someone out of a crowd and humilate and embarrass them with vulgar racism and obscenties. Nobody should have to tolerate that. This is why we have established a categoryog hate crimes,to protect people from intolerable abuse.

I wonder if you'd be so verbose with your angst if the races were reversed? Somehow I doubt it.

[KD6NIG]

Quote[/b] (AC0H @ Dec. 04 2006,11:50)]Quote[/b] ]Yes they are victims. . It's no different than anti-semitic defamation. You don;t single someone out of a crowd and humilate and embarrass them with vulgar racism and obscenties. Nobody should have to tolerate that. This is why we have established a categoryog #hate #crimes,to protect people from intolerable #abuse.

I wonder if you'd be so verbose with your angst if the races were reversed? Somehow I doubt it.
I figure within 90 days it will happen. This precedent being set will cause other lawsuits to sprout.

Its just a matter of time.

Then we'll see how equal equality really is, across the board http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[al2i]

Since I had the terrific experience of being beset upon by 5 racists who accosted me while I was going about my business and beat me up simply because I was alone, I have a little insight to what it means to be a victim. The jerks who would not shut up during Richard's comedy routine are not victims.

[WF7A]

If I'm correct (which would be novel), you can't win a slander suit unless you've suffered some kind of financial or other tangible loss due to your character assassination; I just don't see that in this case.

What's interesting is that many blacks have called for a ban of the "N-word" since it's so derogatory--as is the "C-word" against women--but there's no such word for a WASP male. What, cracker? Honkie? Whitie? We laugh that off--it's hardly insulting. Would we feel the same way if there were such a word against white males?

(Okay, I'll save the effort of you political-types from posting an answer to that one: the word, Republican. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[kc9jqt]

hes a idiot in character, and the way i seee it a idiot in real life. cant handle the heat get out of the kitchen dumb shat like this is a waste of time drop the code and lets move on.:angry:

[al2i]

Quote[/b] (kc9jqt @ Dec. 04 2006,11:48)]hes a idiot in character, and the way i seee it a idiot in real life. cant handle the heat get out of the kitchen dumb shat like this is a waste of time drop the code and lets move on.:angry:
But sir, Morris' Code is the backbone of our society.

[KD6NIG]

Quote[/b] (WF7A @ Dec. 04 2006,12:40)]If I'm correct (which would be novel), you can't win a slander suit unless you've suffered some kind of financial or other tangible loss due to your character assassination; I just don't see that in this case.

What's interesting is that many blacks have called for a ban of the "N-word" since it's so derogatory--as is the "C-word" against women--but there's no such word for a WASP male. What, cracker? Honkie? Whitie? We laugh that off--it's hardly insulting. Would we feel the same way if there were such a word against white males?

(Okay, I'll save the effort of you political-types from posting an answer to that one: the word, Republican. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif
Yeah, but you can bet because of this, someone will file a suit based on what you just said.

Probably not for the right reasons, but some black comic will likely see it. Some hispanic comic too.

In the end, you'll have to be PC lest you have deep pockets, or some kind of disclaimer will have to be posted at the door.

You wait, just like an accident site, there will be lawyers outside the doors of comedy clubs handing out cards.

[WA8IHW]

Quote[/b] (kc7jty @ Nov. 30 2006,12:48)]I ain't sorry for nothin. I might kiss a little ### from time to time for personal gain, but if something I may have said has ruined you or a loved one...tough sh*t.
Amen brother lol

[K8ERV]

Hey ILP, you forgot to include fattening.

I am waiting for someone to apologize to me for something.

Tom K8ERV Montrose Colo

[al2i]

Quote[/b] (AC0H @ Dec. 04 2006,10:50)]Quote[/b] ]Yes they are victims. . It's no different than anti-semitic defamation. You don;t single someone out of a crowd and humilate and embarrass them with vulgar racism and obscenties. Nobody should have to tolerate that. This is why we have established a categoryog hate crimes,to protect people from intolerable abuse.

I wonder if you'd be so verbose with your angst if the races were reversed? Somehow I doubt it.
We live in a very racist time, with unofficial and official racial discrimination running rampant. We are unequal before and beyond the Law according to our genes.

[n2ize]

Quote[/b] (al2i @ Dec. 04 2006,12:35)]Since I had the terrific experience of being beset upon by 5 racists who accosted me while I was going about my business and beat me up simply because I was alone, I have a little insight to what it means to be a victim. The jerks who would not shut up during Richard's comedy routine are not victims.
Thats the whole point. THEY DIDN'T BOTHER RICHARDS. What is iot you don't understand about that ?? They walked into the club AFTER Richards was onstage and Richards proceeded to launch a sewer mouthed racist tirade against them. The only said "you're not funny" AFTER Richard went nuts. And they were not the first to throw comments out at Richards. Others in the audience were annoyed at his stupidity and commented about it.

And besides, even if were true and they did interrupt Richards it would have still been innapropriate. I cannot see any justification for such behavior whatsoever.

If what Richards did is okay then it should be perfectly within my rights to walk up to anyone whom I feel like anywhere I feel like and launch into a foul mouthed and offensive tirade against them for as long as I want and as often as I want and the target of my attack should simply be required to tolerate my behavior.

Sorry, Richards was wrong and he knows it. He should be required to pay some sort of retribution to the victims of his assault. If not for any other reason than to make it clear that such behavior will not be tolerated. Free speech does noit mean freedom to verbally harrass and subjugate anyone you feellike.

[AC0H]

Quote[/b] ]Sorry, Richards was wrong and he knows it. He should be required to pay some sort of retribution to the victims of his assault.
ASSAULT!!!!!!!!!!!!
You've got to be kidding!

[n2ize]

Quote[/b] (AC0H @ Dec. 04 2006,13:54)]Quote[/b] ]Sorry, Richards was wrong and he knows it. He should be required to pay some sort of retribution to the victims of his assault.
ASSAULT!!!!!!!!!!!!
You've got to be kidding!
No, not kidding at all. Richards tirade was indeed an assault. For clarification I provide the following quotation from Websters of the definition of "assault"pertaining to verbal action...


2. To attack with moral means, or with a view of producing
moral effects; to attack by words, arguments, or
unfriendly measures; to assail; as, to assault a
reputation or an administration.
[1913 Webster]

Before the gates, the cries of babes newborn, . . .
Assault his ears. --Dryden.
[1913 Webster]


The gentlemen in the audience were assaulted by Richards who used racism and profanity against them.

Trust me, at first I was on Richard's side. I was under the impression that he pulled a Streisand and said something to the effect of "shut the &*&%^ up" in response to some unprovoked and rude heckling. But when I saw the video of what Richards actually did and what he said, and I learned that he wasn't heckled it became clear to me that what Richards did was completely wrong

[n4sva]

Quote[/b] (al2i @ Dec. 04 2006,05:38)]Quote[/b] (K1OU @ Dec. 04 2006,04:24)]But, on QRZ, it's okay!!! http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif
N4SVA's thoughts are proscribed by the new order. #How could he end himself honorably?

Before we rush to judgement against N4SVA, we need the results of a skin-pigment test, or better yet, a careful DNA test of his racial-mixture.
I think we might be of a similar tribe, OM.

About 10 gallons of Scots-Irish with a cup of Cherokee Indian.

Uhhh Ohhh Edit: I mean "Native American"

http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif

[AC0H]

Well, if Websters dictionary says it was an assault it MUST have been an assault.

We're turning into a society of politically correct candy asses.

It was insulting.
Pray tell, where in the constitution does it say you have the right to expect not to be insulted?

[al2i]

Quote[/b] (n4sva @ Dec. 04 2006,13:48)]Quote[/b] (al2i @ Dec. 04 2006,05:38)]Quote[/b] (K1OU @ Dec. 04 2006,04:24)]But, on QRZ, it's okay!!! http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif
N4SVA's thoughts are proscribed by the new order. How could he end himself honorably?

Before we rush to judgement against N4SVA, we need the results of a skin-pigment test, or better yet, a careful DNA test of his racial-mixture.
I think we might be of a similar tribe, OM.

About 10 gallons of Scots-Irish with a cup of Cherokee Indian.

Uhhh Ohhh Edit: I mean "Native American"

http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif
Interestingly enough, it appears that I may have 100% bona-fide Cherokee mitochondrial DNA. If true, I might make a Supreme Court case of it someday. After all, free medical care is promised my people "...as long as the wind blows and the grass grows."

http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif

[n4sva]

Quote[/b] (al2i @ Dec. 04 2006,16:12)]Quote[/b] (n4sva @ Dec. 04 2006,13:48)]Quote[/b] (al2i @ Dec. 04 2006,05:38)]Quote[/b] (K1OU @ Dec. 04 2006,04:24)]But, on QRZ, it's okay!!! http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif
N4SVA's thoughts are proscribed by the new order. #How could he end himself honorably?

Before we rush to judgement against N4SVA, we need the results of a skin-pigment test, or better yet, a careful DNA test of his racial-mixture.
I think we might be of a similar tribe, OM.

About 10 gallons of Scots-Irish with a cup of Cherokee Indian.

Uhhh Ohhh Edit: I mean "Native American"

http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif
Interestingly enough, it appears that I may have 100% bona-fide Cherokee mitochondrial DNA. #If true, I might make a Supreme Court case of it someday. #After all, free medical care is promised my people "...as long as the wind blows and the grass grows."

http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif
Don't forget free beer.

[al2i]

Quote[/b] (n4sva @ Dec. 04 2006,15:13)]Don't forget free beer.
That is why I promote my Irish heritage on St. Patrick's Day. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif

[WF7A]

Quote[/b] (n2ize @ Dec. 04 2006,06:05)][1913 Webster]
1913?? *psst! Dude! It's 2006.*

Words' meanings change over time: how about something a little more recent and/or definitive like the OED?

[n2ize]

Quote[/b] (AC0H @ Dec. 04 2006,14:52)]Well, if Websters dictionary says it was an assault it MUST have been an assault.

We're turning into a society of politically correct candy asses.

It was insulting.
Pray tell, where in the constitution does it say you have the right to expect not to be insulted?
Would you feel it would be okay for me to berate and insult a female co-worker with obscenities and hard hitting sexist remarks ? After all the constitution doesn't state that she has a right to be protected from my vulgarity and subjugation. Would you feel it would be okay for me to subjugate a Jewish co-worker with blatant anti-semitic remarks, insulting commentary and strong obscenities ? Would you feel it okay for me to assault a Black co worker with racist remarks and extreme obscenities ? After all, the constitution doesn't state that any of these people have a right not to be cussed and subjugated. Would you feel it okay for me to walk into a crowded theater and start screaming "FIRE EVERYBODY GET THE ^&&^ OUT...FIRE FIRE FIRE!!". After all I am only excersizing my right to free speech if I just happen to be in the mood to shout those words at that particular moment.

Common sense indicates that we use discretionary reasoning when it comes to such matters. True, it may not be black and white, clear as day written into the constitution. But that doesn;t make it okay.

[w2amr]

It was only a matter of time.
link (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5r0nnFn48VM)

[k0ews]

Quote[/b] (n2ize @ Dec. 04 2006,18:57)]Quote[/b] (AC0H @ Dec. 04 2006,14:52)]Well, if Websters dictionary says it was an assault it MUST have been an assault.

We're turning into a society of politically correct candy asses.

It was insulting.
Pray tell, where in the constitution does it say you have the right to expect not to be insulted?
Would you feel it would be okay for me to berate and insult a female co-worker with obscenities and hard hitting sexist remarks ? After all the constitution doesn't state that she has a right to be protected from my vulgarity and subjugation. Would you feel it would be okay for me to subjugate a Jewish co-worker with blatant anti-semitic remarks, insulting commentary and strong obscenities ? Would you feel it okay for me to assault a Black co worker with racist remarks and extreme obscenities ? After all, the constitution doesn't state that any of these people have a right not to be cussed and subjugated. Would you feel it okay for me to walk into a crowded theater and start screaming "FIRE EVERYBODY GET THE ^&&^ OUT...FIRE FIRE FIRE!!". After all I am only excersizing my right to free speech if I just happen to be in the mood to shout those words at that particular moment.

Common sense indicates that we use discretionary reasoning when it comes to such matters. True, it may not be black and white, clear as day written into the constitution. But that doesn;t make it okay.
It doesn't matter whether you feel it's OK or not. The law says they can do it. Does it make it in good taste? Nope. However, expressing one's opinion about race, gender, religion, etc., ad nauseum is one of the things we get to do, whether we agree with it or not. Certain hate organizations still hold rallies, and are free to do so, as is any other organization.
We have the right to insult one another in this country until we are blue in the face. People do it on this board all of the time, and the only thing making it not totally get out of hand isn't the long arm of the law, but rather the wrath of Glenn, other moderators, and Fred.
I think what the comedian in question did is moronic, stupid, and just in bad taste and I wonder about his mental condition. However, none of it was illegal. Should the public spurn him and he have to live with it like Mel Gibson, etc., that's fine, but we don't jail people in this country for spewing any garbage like that, and we shouldn't.

[n4sva]

Quote[/b] (w2amr @ Dec. 04 2006,17:37)]It was only a matter of time.
link (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5r0nnFn48VM)
I am afraid I have to admit that was funny

[n2ize]

Quote[/b] (k0ews @ Dec. 04 2006,17:48)]Quote[/b] (n2ize @ Dec. 04 2006,18:57)]Quote[/b] (AC0H @ Dec. 04 2006,14:52)]Well, if Websters dictionary says it was an assault it MUST have been an assault.

We're turning into a society of politically correct candy asses.

It was insulting.
Pray tell, where in the constitution does it say you have the right to expect not to be insulted?
Would you feel it would be okay for me to berate and insult a female co-worker with obscenities and hard hitting sexist remarks ? After all the constitution doesn't state that she has a right to be protected from my vulgarity and subjugation. Would you feel it would be okay for me to subjugate a Jewish co-worker with blatant anti-semitic remarks, insulting commentary and strong obscenities ? Would you feel it okay for me to assault a Black co worker with racist remarks and extreme obscenities ? After all, the constitution doesn't state that any of these people have a right not to be cussed and subjugated. Would you feel it okay for me to walk into a crowded theater and start screaming "FIRE EVERYBODY GET THE ^&&^ OUT...FIRE FIRE FIRE!!". After all I am only excersizing my right to free speech if I just happen to be in the mood to shout those words at that particular moment.

Common sense indicates that we use discretionary reasoning when it comes to such matters. True, it may not be black and white, clear as day written into the constitution. But that doesn;t make it okay.
It doesn't matter whether you feel it's OK or not. The law says they can do it. Does it make it in good taste? Nope. However, expressing one's opinion about race, gender, religion, etc., ad nauseum is one of the things we get to do, whether we agree with it or not. Certain hate organizations still hold rallies, and are free to do so, as is any other organization.
We have the right to insult one another in this country until we are blue in the face. People do it on this board all of the time, and the only thing making it not totally get out of hand isn't the long arm of the law, but rather the wrath of Glenn, other moderators, and Fred.
I think what the comedian in question did is moronic, stupid, and just in bad taste and I wonder about his mental condition. However, none of it was illegal. Should the public spurn him and he have to live with it like Mel Gibson, etc., that's fine, but we don't jail people in this country for spewing any garbage like that, and we shouldn't.
Quote[/b] ]
t doesn't matter whether you feel it's OK or not. The law says they can do it. Does it make it in good taste? Nope. However, expressing one's opinion about race, gender, religion, etc., ad nauseum is one of the things we get to do, whether we agree with it or not.


There is a difference between expressiong your opinions versus assaulting someone with your opinion. Yes, you do have a right to say that you hate Blacks, Jews, or any ethnic group and /or minority. But that doesn't give you carte blanche to carryon a verbal tirade against 2 audience members the way Richards did. It does not give you the priveledge to go into work and harrass a co-worker with racist, sexist, remarks and obscenities. Nobody is required to tolerate that kind of abuse and there are numerous ways to have it stopped within the bounds of the law. Richards was well within his rights to scream and yell obscenities and racist remarks but the club in which he was venting and the audience are not required to have to listen to and tolerate it. They would have been well within their rights to have him removed. And the individuals he verbally assaulted are well within their rights to take up litigation against him.

[k0ews]

You are correct in what you are saying; it's called harassment, and it has been successfully prosecuted in a civil court, however, it isn't against the law to yell things at people you don't like. Yes, the club owner could have, and probably should have removed Richards from the premises immediately, but no laws were broken.
Would a civil suit for what he did fly? Probably not. It was a one time thing. He apologized and I think it will pretty much die out over time. If there had been a repeated pattern of this kind of harassment, I could see where a civil suit would have some merit. As it stands, the guy made some idiotic statements and made himself an ass for sure, but I don't think any charges would stick for a one time thing.
I for the life of me still cannot figure out what Richards was thinking when he did what he did. Very disappointing.

[w2amr]

Quote[/b] (n4sva @ Dec. 04 2006,19:11)]Quote[/b] (w2amr @ Dec. 04 2006,17:37)]It was only a matter of time.
link (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5r0nnFn48VM)
I am afraid I have to admit that was funny
Me to #http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[al2i]

Quote[/b] (k0ews @ Dec. 04 2006,20:30)]I for the life of me still cannot figure out what Richards was thinking when he did what he did. Very disappointing.
Richards wasn't thinking, but rather, exploding. Obviously he carries at least some resentment/fear/hatred towards at least one other race.

It is a cathartic for our society and I am glad that Richards did it, but only if everyone gets over it and grows a little. There are an enormous number of people who gain profit, power and promote other agendas by playing the racism card, so we know there is a cancer in the body politic.

I do not wish Richards any ill will, and I hope and expect he will be forgiven by the Black community for his tirade. It looks like that will happen, at least there are signs of it from the adults. If he is hounded to the ends of the Earth, all that will happen is that racist feelings will grow in many dark places. If Richards' situation can be healed, maybe everyone can grow another baby step beyond the racism as a result of this incident.

Remarkably enough, through a little human kindness and grace, most Jewish leaders cut Mel some slack, so I saw that as positive. If Mel does not appreciate the kindness and wisdom of Jewish-Americans from their measured and adult response, then I really fear for our species.

Perhaps if we are wise enough, we would know if our society is going forwards or backwards on the color blindness scale from this incident. I certainly cannot say, so I have watched the Richards incident with interest.

[n2ize]

Quote[/b] (al2i @ Dec. 05 2006,03:02)]
Quote[/b] ]
Richards wasn't thinking, but rather, exploding. Obviously he carries at least some resentment/fear/hatred towards at least one other race.


When you are a professional entertainer you are supposed to be capable of treating your audience with a little courtesy, respect and you are supposed to have some self control. Obviously Mr. Richards is not a professional entertainer. He made that abundantly clear.
At the very least Mr. Richards could have met with the people he rudly insulted and given them a direct apology. I belive he was asked to meet with them but he declined. Clearly Mr. Richards has absolutely no remorse for his behavior and would likely, given the opportunity, do the same thing again. I know one thing for sure. If I owned a club I certainly would never hire Richards as an entertainer. It wouldn't be worth the risk. His antics could end up getting me sued. I think a civil suit against Richards is in order, primarilly due to his failure to apologize to those that he wronged. It may be too late to make Richards understand the magnitude of his hate crime. But it is not too late to send the message that such behavior is not to be tolerated.

Quote[/b] ]
t is a cathartic for our society and I am glad that Richards did it, but only if everyone gets over it and grows a little.


So, you are telling us that you feel that accepting blatant racism is "growth" ?

Quote[/b] ]
There are an enormous number of people who gain profit, power and promote other agendas by playing the racism card, so we know there is a cancer in the body politic.


And in addition you are saying that when someone takes action against such abuse it's "playing the race card" ?

So then we should all simply accept racism, hatred and vulgarity with a smile. How dare anyone work within the confines of the law to challenge such disgraceful vulgarity.

Quote[/b] ]
It is a cathartic for our society and I am glad that Richards did it, but only if everyone gets over it and grows a little. There are an enormous number of people who gain profit, power and promote other agendas by playing the racism card, so we know there is a cancer in the body politic.


The cancer is racism, anti-semitism, etc. and by sitting back and accepting it we only let the cancer grow and grow until it consumes everything in it's path.

Quote[/b] ]
Remarkably enough, through a little human kindness and grace, most Jewish leaders cut Mel some slack, so I saw that as positive. If Mel does not appreciate the kindness and wisdom of Jewish-Americans from their measured and adult response, then I really fear for our species.


Mel Gibson is a blatant anti-semite. Most Jews are well aware of this fact. At the same time Mel made some general anti-semitic remarks aimed at Jews in general which, although anti-semitic is well within his right. Had Mel attacked a specific Jewish individual or specific Jewish institution the way Riichards blatantly targeted specific individuals rest assuredthe Jewish community would have taken some action against him.

Quote[/b] ]
Perhaps if we are wise enough, we would know if our society is going forwards or backwards on the color blindness scale from this incident. I certainly cannot say, so I have watched the Richards incident with interest.


If you wake up and smell smoke and see a small fire burning in the corner of your room you get out of bed and you put it out. You don't smile and say , "oh well, that fire has a right to consume some of my home, forgive the fire" and then roll over and go back to sleep. If you do rest assured, you'll be barbecued in your sleep. It's a similar thing with racism and hatred. If we are going to allow racist incidents to go unchecked and uncorrected it is like going to sleep and letting that fire burn. Eventually it will grow and consume everything in it's path. That is why it is critical that we fight these incidents in every way possible.
In this case the victims of Richards racist assault are demanding an apology.Since they have failed to secure a sincere apology they are moving forward with the next phase of fighting racist oppression.

[n2ize]

Quote[/b] (k0ews @ Dec. 04 2006,21:30)]You are correct in what you are saying; it's called harassment, and it has been successfully prosecuted in a civil court, however, it isn't against the law to yell things at people you don't like. Yes, the club owner could have, and probably should have removed Richards from the premises immediately, but no laws were broken.
Would a civil suit for what he did fly? Probably not. It was a one time thing. He apologized and I think it will pretty much die out over time. If there had been a repeated pattern of this kind of harassment, I could see where a civil suit would have some merit. As it stands, the guy made some idiotic statements and made himself an ass for sure, but I don't think any charges would stick for a one time thing.
I for the life of me still cannot figure out what Richards was thinking when he did what he did. Very disappointing.
Quote[/b] ]
Would a civil suit for what he did fly? Probably not. It was a one time thing. He apologized and I think it will pretty much die out over time.


The thing is he didn't apologize. Maybe a law suit won't fly but it is still the right thing to do. It is a legitimate way to work within the law to send the clear message that such behavior is intolerable.

[al2i]

I know you mean well N2IZE, but I believe you couldn't be more mistaken. Only bad comes from race warrior attitudes.

[k0ews]

Quote[/b] ]I think a civil suit against Richards is in order, primarilly due to his failure to apologize to those that he wronged. It may be too late to make Richards understand the magnitude of his hate crime. But it is not too late to send the message that such behavior is not to be tolerated.

I thought that he had apologized, but I guess I'm not in keeping up with the news on these things. He didn't apologize? I hadn't heard that part.
As for your wording it a hate crime, it's not. Call it anything else, but it's not a crime. I've seen the KKK use much worse language than Richards while marching on TV all under the protection of local police, with a permit to do so, as revolting as it looks.
What would be the grounds for lawsuit had Mr. Richards gone up there and not had one hint of any racism in his tirade? This opens up an interesting can of worms. Had he gone after someone who appeared to be gay, or a woman, or gone into some very sexually explicit tirade (I've heard Sam Kinison do this to hecklers) would that still be grounds for a suit? After all, could he not claim that it was part or his act? This poses some interesting questions on the whole.

Racism in this country exists by the very nature of the idea that anyone is different than anyone else due to the part of the world their ancestry may be. We are a nation of hyphenated Americans. Native-Americans, Asian-Americans, African-Americans, Arab-Americans. Part of the racism is self perpetuated by the very idea that we are different than others. Why not refer to themselves as just Americans? Part of the answer to that lies within the ethnic groups in question. For whatever reason, some folks are comfortable around their ethnic group. Isn't there still a Chinatown in several American cities? My hometown in Iowa has a very strong and close-knit Mexican community. I taught on an Indian Reservation for 4 years, and Native Americans definitely feel like they need to be true to their heritage.
All of that is fine, but when do we join the "American" race? That one is much better than 50 years ago for sure, but it will take a few more generations to solve it.
Back on point, Mr. Richards behavior was, while not a crime, terrible to say the least. Lets hope that he does apologize soon if he hasn't done so yet. I had thought that he did, however. I guess I need to keep up with the news a bit more.

[al2i]

Quote[/b] (n2ize @ Dec. 05 2006,03:14)]Mel Gibson is a blatant anti-semite. Most Jews are well aware of this fact. At the same time Mel made some general anti-semitic remarks aimed at Jews in general which, although anti-semitic is well within his right.
Do you hate Mel Gibson?

[ac4ut]

Quote[/b] (al2i @ Dec. 04 2006,16:17)]Quote[/b] (n4sva @ Dec. 04 2006,15:13)]Don't forget free beer.
That is why I promote my Irish heritage on St. Patrick's Day. # http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif
I am Scot-Irish and Cherokee. I love the firewater but can't hold and would be an alcoholic if I wern't so cheap.
What was this thread about again...oh yeah racist rhetoric.

[al2i]

Quote[/b] (k0ews @ Dec. 05 2006,04:32)]Why not refer to themselves as just Americans? Part of the answer to that lies within the ethnic groups in question. For whatever reason, some folks are comfortable around their ethnic group.
Actually it is a financial boon as well. An acquaintance of mine is Polish and his wife is Cambodian. On their birth certificates, he had his kids marked as "Pacific Islanders". That way, his kids and his grandkids will have access to free prescription drugs and free medical care when they are no longer covered by his insurance plan.

Is he evil for giving this advantage to his kids?

[AC0H]

Quote[/b] ]I thought that he had apologized, but I guess I'm not in keeping up with the news on these things. #He didn't apologize? #I hadn't heard that part.

He did apologize, just not to the degree that IZE wanted. There wasn't any bloodletting involved.

[k0ews]

Quote[/b] (al2i @ Dec. 05 2006,07:40)]Quote[/b] (k0ews @ Dec. 05 2006,04:32)]Why not refer to themselves as just Americans? Part of the answer to that lies within the ethnic groups in question. For whatever reason, some folks are comfortable around their ethnic group.
Actually it is a financial boon as well. An acquaintance of mine is Polish and his wife is Cambodian. On their birth certificates, he had his kids marked as "Pacific Islanders". That way, his kids and his grandkids will have access to free prescription drugs and free medical care when they are no longer covered by his insurance plan.

Is he evil for giving this advantage to his kids?
No, not evil at all. If they are making concessions to give help to people, I say if the advantage is there, take it. However, the very idea of giving someone a financial break due to race is at its very heart, racist. So is affirmative action. Noble as it may seem, it also by its very nature and definition is racist. It makes a determination and grants something based on race. That makes it racist.

[n2ize]

Quote[/b] (al2i @ Dec. 05 2006,05:34)]Quote[/b] (n2ize @ Dec. 05 2006,03:14)]Mel Gibson is a blatant anti-semite. Most Jews are well aware of this fact. At the same time Mel made some general anti-semitic remarks aimed at Jews in general which, although anti-semitic is well within his right.
Do you hate Mel Gibson?
I don't hate him. But I am not afraid to recognize the fact that he is an anti-semite.

[n2ize]

Quote[/b] (AC0H @ Dec. 05 2006,05:54)]Quote[/b] ]I thought that he had apologized, but I guess I'm not in keeping up with the news on these things. He didn't apologize? I hadn't heard that part.

He did apologize, just not to the degree that IZE wanted. There wasn't any bloodletting involved.
He needs to apologize directly to the individuals he offended. Appearing on the Letterman show is not an apology. An apology is calling or meeting with the people you offended and offering a sincere apology. Richards has not done that. Thus he is not sorry and he has not apologized.

[n4sva]

Quote[/b] (n2ize @ Dec. 05 2006,07:14)]Quote[/b] (AC0H @ Dec. 05 2006,05:54)]Quote[/b] ]I thought that he had apologized, but I guess I'm not in keeping up with the news on these things. #He didn't apologize? #I hadn't heard that part.

He did apologize, just not to the degree that IZE wanted. There wasn't any bloodletting involved.
He needs to apologize directly to the individuals he offended. Appearing on the #Letterman show is not an apology. An apology is calling or meeting with the people you #offended and offering a sincere apology. Richards has not done that. Thus he is not sorry and he has not apologized.
He has met with Jessie Jackson and is planning a settlement with the offendees. What more do you want?

[n2ize]

Quote[/b] (n4sva @ Dec. 05 2006,07:42)]Quote[/b] (n2ize @ Dec. 05 2006,07:14)]Quote[/b] (AC0H @ Dec. 05 2006,05:54)]Quote[/b] ]I thought that he had apologized, but I guess I'm not in keeping up with the news on these things. He didn't apologize? I hadn't heard that part.

He did apologize, just not to the degree that IZE wanted. There wasn't any bloodletting involved.
He needs to apologize directly to the individuals he offended. Appearing on the Letterman show is not an apology. An apology is calling or meeting with the people you offended and offering a sincere apology. Richards has not done that. Thus he is not sorry and he has not apologized.
He has met with Jessie Jackson and is planning a settlement with the offendees. What more do you want?

Well,maybe he has finally come to his senses.. I hope he does meet with the victims of his assault. I hope after meeting with him they will drop the litigation. I would much rather see this settled on a man to man level than in a court. I wish both parties the best in coming to a reconciliation. Hopefully this will be a "healing" time for both Richards and those who were offended.

[al2i]

Quote[/b] (n2ize @ Dec. 05 2006,06:12)]Quote[/b] (al2i @ Dec. 05 2006,05:34)]Quote[/b] (n2ize @ Dec. 05 2006,03:14)]Mel Gibson is a blatant anti-semite. Most Jews are well aware of this fact. At the same time Mel made some general anti-semitic remarks aimed at Jews in general which, although anti-semitic is well within his right.
Do you hate Mel Gibson?
I don't hate him. But I am not afraid to recognize the fact that he is an anti-semite.
I am unable to assume a lot about Mel's character from his one episode. One reason I do not drink beyond moderation is that I find myself saying things that I really do not mean.

[al2i]

Quote[/b] (k0ews @ Dec. 05 2006,05:12)]However, the very idea of giving someone a financial break due to race is at its very heart, racist. So is affirmative action. Noble as it may seem, it also by its very nature and definition is racist. It makes a determination and grants something based on race. That makes it racist.
That is something that is becoming interesting with new technologies. Obviously my friend's kids would be "outed" under genuine DNA scrutiny, but they could pass muster as genuine Pacific Islanders by any non-expert on looks alone.

Our system has to be reaching a breaking point on this and numerous less incendiary issues. A really large "Jericho style" event would either clean the BS from the books or we would be lost as a civilization.

[n2ize]

Quote[/b] (k0ews @ Dec. 05 2006,06:12)]Quote[/b] (al2i @ Dec. 05 2006,07:40)]Quote[/b] (k0ews @ Dec. 05 2006,04:32)]Why not refer to themselves as just Americans? Part of the answer to that lies within the ethnic groups in question. For whatever reason, some folks are comfortable around their ethnic group.
Actually it is a financial boon as well. An acquaintance of mine is Polish and his wife is Cambodian. On their birth certificates, he had his kids marked as "Pacific Islanders". That way, his kids and his grandkids will have access to free prescription drugs and free medical care when they are no longer covered by his insurance plan.

Is he evil for giving this advantage to his kids?
No, not evil at all. If they are making concessions to give help to people, I say if the advantage is there, take it. However, the very idea of giving someone a financial break due to race is at its very heart, racist. So is affirmative action. Noble as it may seem, it also by its very nature and definition is racist. It makes a determination and grants something based on race. That makes it racist.
It's racist not to be racist and it's not racist to be racist.