O on both ends, hi in the middle

[WB2WIK]

Wow.

Springfield, OH has the most affordable housing in the country according to this report...

http://www.dailynews.com/business/ci_4222440

...which also unfortunately says L.A. has the least affordable housing, based on the same data points.

Are there CC&R-free tracts for ham towers and antennas there? Anybody know?

Looks like a good opportunity for investment.

WB2WIK/6

[w8cbc]

Maybe Ohio is cheap because nobody wants to live here. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

I recall that Toronto and its surroundings a few years ago had rather extreme housing prices. I wouldn't want to live anywhere in that yuppie-infested suburban sprawl unless I had a damn' good reason.

[WB2WIK]

Quote[/b] (kd8bsr @ Aug. 23 2006,14:13)]Maybe Ohio is cheap because nobody wants to live here. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif
Real estate cost is directly proportional to desirability of the area or region, for sure.

Just that since nobody's making any more land these days, eventually everyplace will be more expensive than it is now, and the low-cost places today might make good investments for tomorrow.

I've been to Ohio lots of times. Been to the Dayton Hamvention 18 times. Heck, I spent a month in Ohio one night.

http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

[w8cbc]

Quote[/b] ]Heck, I spent a month in Ohio one night. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

Says it all. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

Aye, our population keeps rising. It was a rather unpleasant revelation to me a month or so back that the population of the U.S. is now some three hundred million. The crowding and sprawl will just continue to grow until we get responsible about limiting our numbers.

[WB2WIK]

Quote[/b] (kd8bsr @ Aug. 23 2006,14:40)]Aye, our population keeps rising. It was a rather unpleasant revelation to me a month or so back that the population of the U.S. is now some three hundred million. The crowding and sprawl will just continue to grow until we get responsible about limiting our numbers.
I'm neutered, myself (voluntarily after four kids). My dog is, also.

But the world population is rising much faster than America's. Americans are more responsible than many other large groups of people. I think the average family has only 2.2 kids.

I'm pretty sure I've come across the 0.2 kid, and he's ugly. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif

[w8cbc]

I compare it to other modern, industrialised countries. Most of those in Europe are flat or slightly declining. Japan is also from what I can recall. Granted, they're also on average more crowded than we are. I would prefer that we don't fill the continent to the density of Britain or Japan before we flatten out.

Everywhere I go around here I get the feeling of too-damn-many. Suburbs suck.

[al2i]

Quote[/b] (kd8bsr @ Aug. 23 2006,13:55)]I compare it to other modern, industrialised countries. Most of those in Europe are flat or slightly declining. Japan is also from what I can recall. Granted, they're also on average more crowded than we are. I would prefer that we don't fill the continent to the density of Britain or Japan before we flatten out.

Everywhere I go around here I get the feeling of too-damn-many. Suburbs suck.
I couln't agree more completely. More people has led to less enjoyable public spaces, less freedom, and less value appreciated in an individual life. Still, El Presidente Bush has been all in favor of allowing other nations to export their over-population problem to the USA.

I am sure that many of the open border liberals will be attempting to initiate government force against my grandkids (if I ever have any) to restrict their reproductive rights.

[WB2WIK]

Quote[/b] (kd8bsr @ Aug. 23 2006,14:55)]Everywhere I go around here I get the feeling of too-damn-many. Suburbs suck.
Oh, I don't know...

...I was thinking about the crowding issue as I was sitting in bumper-to-bumper traffic the other day, and it's not so bad. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif

[WB2WIK]

Other interesting stats...

Nothing surprising here. Just interesting.

http://www.nytimes.com/imagepa....IC.html (http://www.nytimes.com/imagepages/2006/03/28/business/20060328_RICH_GRAPHIC.html)

WB2WIK/6

[KF0RT]

Quote[/b] (al2i @ Aug. 23 2006,16:05)]Quote[/b] (kd8bsr @ Aug. 23 2006,13:55)]I compare it to other modern, industrialised countries. Most of those in Europe are flat or slightly declining. Japan is also from what I can recall. Granted, they're also on average more crowded than we are. I would prefer that we don't fill the continent to the density of Britain or Japan before we flatten out.

Everywhere I go around here I get the feeling of too-damn-many. Suburbs suck.
I couln't agree more completely. More people has led to less enjoyable public spaces, less freedom, and less value appreciated in an individual life. Still, El Presidente Bush has been all in favor of allowing other nations to export their over-population problem to the USA.

I am sure that many of the open border liberals will be attempting to initiate government force against my grandkids (if I ever have any) to restrict their reproductive rights.
I agree as well. Steve is obviously a "people person" -- nuthin' wrong with that -- in fact, I'm mildly envious. More and more, I find myself adjusting my schedule for minimal contact.

I work early hours to avoid traffic, do any shopping on Sunday mornings because the lines are shorter, and in fact, if it isn't food, I usually get UPS to deliver it.

Seems like anywhere we go these days involves hoardes of people and waiting in lines. Ugh.

73, Rob

[W0LPQ]

Yes Rob, and a lot of them hoardes are swinging axes and chains ... just like the Capital One commecial..!

The only reason I miss southern Idaho.

Bill, W0LPQ

[w8cbc]

It's why I miss northeastern Ontario. Once I was off highway 69 (the main route from Toronto to Sudz), I could drive around without being stuck behind some frightened fool going all of 20 km/hr while some self-centred dipswitch in a fashion truck (you know, the 4WD Chevy pickup that's never had the bed cover off) with the high-beams permanently on is attempting to catch a free ride on my trailer hitch. That's my usual ride home down here at 2100 local. It's worse during the day.

[KF0RT]

Quote[/b] (W0LPQ @ Aug. 23 2006,18:13)]Yes Rob, and a lot of them hoardes are swinging axes and chains ... just like the Capital One commecial..!

The only reason I miss southern Idaho.

Bill, W0LPQ
Well, I've noticed a lot of them can't drive very well, Bill. My defensive driving skills are being sharpened daily. If they're not doing 40 in a 55 zone, they're running red lights.

Ah, but yesterday, Denver officially finished the $1.75 billion T-Rex (TRansportation EXpansion - get it?) project. Five lanes in each direction on I-25 through town, plus HOV lanes and a new electric train. All to handle the ever increasing hoards, and none of it goes from here to work. It took 5 years to complete and by some projections, would be obsolete the day it was completed. It might cut two minutes off my yearly trip to HRO.

(Due apologies to Mr. Webster for my misuse of "hoard.")

73, Rob
DriveItLikeYouMeanIt, CO

[w8cbc]

There was a light rail proposal in Cincinnati a few years back. I was all for it though I would probably never ride the thing, as it would cut traffic congestion by a fair amount and maybe help to ease the summer smog. It was voted down of course. Nobody around here can think beyond the end of his nose.

[KI4ITV]

I agree with you guys on the defensive driving, but the U.S. is still a largely unpopulated country. I really don't think we feel the pressure that most of the modern world feels.
A whole lot of what we are worried about could be socialization, and not necessarily control of population.
Granted, Globally, we have a problem. Socially we have many problems.
But, under the right circumstances this Earth is good for many more people... it is the people here that are the problem.

[KF0RT]

Quote[/b] (KI4ITV @ Aug. 23 2006,18:49)]I agree with you guys on the defensive driving, but the U.S. is still a largely unpopulated country. I really don't think we feel the pressure that most of the modern world feels.
A whole lot of what we are worried about could be socialization, and not necessarily control of population.
Granted, Globally, we have a problem. Socially we have many problems.
But, under the right circumstances this Earth is good for many more people... it is the people here that are the problem.
We used to turn down these projects with some regularity. No more, though -- it's the face of the voter that has changed. One of the pet projects that comes up all the time is a light rail system along the I-70 corridor into "ski country." The folks paying a mint for lift tickets are tired of the traffic jams on the way back to town. So far, that one is a "no sale." But it will happen eventually.

Of course, all the politicians are pro-growth and salivate at the idea of anything that will bring more people, thus enriching the tax coffers. What blows me away more than anything is the number of McMansion housing developments that have sprung up. HUGE houses on tiny pieces of land.

I was actually looking at Springfield housing earlier, based on this thread. Man, a lot of cheap stuff out there, even with decent tower-sized lots.

73, Rob

[KI4PEQ]

Quote[/b] (KF0RT @ Aug. 23 2006,19:33)]Bill, W0LPQ
Ah, but yesterday, Denver officially finished the $1.75 billion T-Rex (TRansportation EXpansion - get it?) project. #Five lanes in each direction on I-25 through town, plus HOV lanes and a new electric train.
73, Rob
DriveItLikeYouMeanIt, CO[/quote]
It probably would have been cheaper to go to the toy store and get each of the politicians their OWN electric train to play with. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[W0LPQ]

Rob, I cannot imagine 5 lanes on I-25. When I used to cover the old Stapelton Airport and the corporate flight operations there, it was kinda nice ... before lots of traffic. The drive to Cheyenne from Denver was not bad, except when it was blinding snow. Left Cheyenne and it was 45 degrees. By the time I had driven an hour, it was 32 and blinding snow. Still, I-25 was fine and trucks were actually using common sense. Guess that is out the window now!

Think then 25 was only 3 lanes...! Been a couple of years (more like 10!)..

I don't think Mr. Webster would care anymore, given the way "the Hoardes" are getting these days..!

Bill, W0LPQ

[KI4ITV]

http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif

[WB2WIK]

Quote[/b] (W0LPQ @ Aug. 23 2006,18:22)]Rob, I cannot imagine 5 lanes on I-25. #
Five lanes? Geesh, that's my driveway.

405 has 14 lanes at this point and talk is it will be expanded to 18 lanes by 2008.

Golly, if I could drive on 5-lane freeways I'd feel like Andy Griffith, taking Opie out fishin'.

http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[KF0RT]

Quote[/b] (W0LPQ @ Aug. 23 2006,19:22)]Rob, I cannot imagine 5 lanes on I-25. When I used to cover the old Stapelton Airport and the corporate flight operations there, it was kinda nice ... before lots of traffic. The drive to Cheyenne from Denver was not bad, except when it was blinding snow. Left Cheyenne and it was 45 degrees. By the time I had driven an hour, it was 32 and blinding snow. Still, I-25 was fine and trucks were actually using common sense. Guess that is out the window now!

Think then 25 was only 3 lanes...! Been a couple of years (more like 10!)..

I don't think Mr. Webster would care anymore, given the way "the Hoardes" are getting these days..!

Bill, W0LPQ
Bill- You should see Stapleton these days. I grew up about 3 miles south of the old airport and my Dad still lives in the old house, so I get out there farily regularly. Since the DIA move, Stapleton is hot new "urban renewal" property. They're finally getting smart and mixing housing with light retail, so you don't have to get in your car to go out to dinner. Very upscale -- expensive condos and townhomes. They did the same thing with a big part of the old Lowry property. I'm seeing more and more of this, but it's all designed for dense population (and I'll let you use your own definition of "dense" http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif ).

Denver is still a good place to be from.

73, Rob

[KF0RT]

Quote[/b] (WB2WIK @ Aug. 23 2006,21:49)]Quote[/b] (W0LPQ @ Aug. 23 2006,18:22)]Rob, I cannot imagine 5 lanes on I-25.
Five lanes? Geesh, that's my driveway.

405 has 14 lanes at this point and talk is it will be expanded to 18 lanes by 2008.

Golly, if I could drive on 5-lane freeways I'd feel like Andy Griffith, taking Opie out fishin'.

http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif
Is that 14 lanes in each direction, Steve?

I-25 is 10-12 lanes if you count both directions and really, I have no desire to catch up to SoCal. In my twisted mind, if we quit making it so easy, maybe fewer people will move here. I voted against the project. Shoot- I'd be out drilling potholes if it were legal. http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif http://www.qrz.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

You don't have to go TOO far north or south of Denver on I-25 before you're back to plain-Jane 2-lane interstate, and the big T-Rex project was on the south end where there's more traffic.

73, Rob

[W0LPQ]

Rob, I just remembered something ... wasn't 25 north to Broomfield either 3 or 4 lanes each way..? Spent quite a bit of time at the airport working with Piper Aircraft on a project and seem to remember that it was wider north to Broomfield and then came down to 2-3 lanes! That has been 15 years ago.

One of the aircraft owners who owned a Cheese group (for pizzas) had his airplane at Jeffco along with an older sports car (Aston or Maseratti) who once a month or so would pay the CSP to shut down the road for a couple miles so he could "hot rod it..!

Bill, W0LPQ

[WB2WIK]

Quote[/b] (KF0RT @ Aug. 24 2006,05:18)]Is that 14 lanes in each direction, Steve?
Nope, it's 14 total.

Sad part is, they've gone from 10 to 12 to 14 and are planning for 18 (9 each way) and the traffic doesn't get any better.

Flying over the freeways during rush hour (which here is from 6 AM to 7 PM, sometimes a bit later) in a helicopter it's easy to spot the problems, and for the most part, it ain't the road, it's the drivers.

If all cars were driven by robots and set to space a fixed distance from each other and never change their minds, we wouldn't need so many lanes and traffic could zip along at 90.

WB2WIK/6